1 John Chapter 1 Discussion Page 5

And Richard, respectfully, I made mention that angels were men or women delivering messages in the 2 and only those 2 verses you mentioned specifically. If you want to talk of angels in the recount of events at Sodom and Gomorrah, then it's a case where different subjects, different people, and different angels were present and were involved. Those were angels, heavenly beings God sent to bring Lot and his family out of the city. They also delivered a message from God. These are 2 totally different uses of the word angel.

In Rev. 12:7-9 you refer to heaven in this use and meaning is high and lifted up spiritual place, not the Heaven God dwells. Heaven has various uses and meanings. There is no way possible that God has enemies in His Heaven, meaning where He dwells.

Remember you're trying to correct me, believing that I don't understand the Bible, yet you argue for having sin in your life. Jesus plainly states we must sin no more. Paul stated his God given purpose in Acts 26:18 "To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me." How can one be in the light but still living in darkness?

Jeremiah 23:21-22 "I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied. But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings." Ministry that God did not send teaches falsely that we will sin more or less until Heaven. Jeremiah tells us that marks them as false teachers.

Ask yourself this "If sinners go to Heaven who ends up in Hell and the Lake of Fire?" Just to be clear, all have need to be saved, and all can be set free from sin here now by Jesus' power to save from sin. Those that reject Christ and His teachings will be rejected by Him.

Well. To me angels of the Lord are more than just men, or women, preachers. What about the "angels" of Sodom and Gomorrah who smote men with blindness? As they stated "the Lord hath sent us here to destroy it." What about the "angel" of the Lord who killed 185,000 Assyrians? Revelation 10:1 is clearly not talking about a human being. Also Revelation 12:7-9 speaks of "angels" fighting satan in Heaven. David seeing an "angel" of the Lord standing between earth and heaven. I could go on and on.

If you don't believe in angels and have your own assumption of the things in the Bible. That's fine. I myself believe in angels, Heaven, miracles, etc. Also believing in demons and satan. Having actually experienced things that most people would not believe. But that's ok.

Again I understand we are all different and can have our own views. This isn't to argue. Just to finish, my part, on angels.

God Bless you David.

The use of the word angel in the 2 verses you'd referred to is in reference to messengers, as in men or women that were used by God to preach. If they sin after their calling then you get the warning in the verses you mentioned. There are those that preached and backslid. They sinned and died spiritually. Just like Adam died spiritually in the beginning. Eve was deceived to believe she could sin and not die. The lie is still alive and deceiving many today.

Matthew 7:17-23

Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Here we see there's either good trees & good fruit or evil trees & evil fruit. Man is the trees & we're either good or evil not both. If you are guilty of sin, you're evil, working iniquity and Jesus will say depart from Me. If you won't obey God by being saved FROM sin, that's His response, depart.

This isn't personal between myself or anyone reading, but a friendly reminder sinners cannot enter Heaven nor be part of His kingdom now.

Hello David,

Seeing your post just made me wonder. You know satan was not ever in Heaven? So what do you take of say 2 Peter 2:4 or Jude 1:6? Which are pretty straight forward. About angels sinning. I'll just state this. God our Eternal Father is so much higher than us. As His ways, and thoughts, also are so high above us.

So as I believe things between angels and "us" are two different categories. One thing I believe our Father gives all is "free will". I myself would never condemn anyone(person) who was say "touched" by the Lord. Say they repented well and dropped many sinful things of this world. Then say they made a mistake and did something "sinful". Would you say that person is no longer saved? Even if they knew they made a mistake, confessed to the Lord, and tried to learn from it and keep on repenting and living for the Lord?

We are still here in earth. I know there are some people who say they are "perfect" and "sin free" after being saved by the Lord. I myself could never say that. Keeping a humble state of mind. I only see my Lord Jesus Christ, and my Holy Father, as perfect. I try my best to follow in the footsteps of the Lord and live for the Will of our Father. As I don't condemn people this does not mean I say it's ok, or right, to "sin". I guess I just have more "mercy" and "forgiveness" in me than "judgement" or "condemnation".

I know we're all different and have our own views. This is not to start an argument. I just felt to post from the heart.

God Bless you.

Didn't you take on the name of Christ when you were saved? If the answer is yes, then why would you not also take on the attribute to be sinless, to sin no more? In John 5:14 and John 8:11 Jesus tells man and woman to go and sin no more. Also note that Jesus taught that we will be known by our fruit, which is either good or evil. Matthew 7:16-20 here Jesus tells us that the tree will either be good or evil not both. Which are you, good or evil? If you still sin, you are evil.

Satan was not in Heaven. He was not cast out of Heaven anywhere in the Bible. He was not an angel of God ever. This presents us with a God that cannot control His angels, nor can He actually save us from sin if you still commit sin after being saved. Let's consider something here. A person knows he's sinned, he feels convicted of it. He then repents and asks God to forgive his sins. By faith it is done. The sins he used to do is forgiven and forgotten. Now since God is more than fair to us all, let's reverse things. The man that was saved commits sin. He is no longer saved because he repented, changed his mind is part of repentance. His life of salvation is now forgotten. That is how this works. You are not saved and sin too. Yes I know there is the 2nd work to be done called sanctification that a person that is currently saved from sin can ask God to remove his carnal nature and clean his spiritual heart and to fill it with the Holy Ghost. Now that person is truly free from all committed and inherited sins. But he does not go about still committing sin or he is lost still.

Question: if you are saved and yet commit sin, when do you stop sinning? When you enter the Kingdom of God? If yes, then the Kingdom of God is here now for you to enter. Come to the Church Of God, a church building where the saved do not say they're saved and yet sin.

So again the question, do you claim salvation and still sin? You as the tree are either good or evil not both. Saved or sinner. Only two choices.

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>nothing to do with what you did or didnt do

Hi Jackie, I believe salvation absolutely has to do with what we do or don't do. The reason I believe that is the entire gospel is based on someone taking action. People who do nothing by default will go to hell. Jesus says you must believe. That is an action. He calls people to follow Him- that's an action. He calls people to repent and confess of their sin- that's an action. Loving is an action. Acting like a Christian is an action. God gave us the gift of freewill to choose, which is an action. He loved us enough to give us a choice to follow Him. Good works are not bad. I hear some people saying it's bad to be good and that seems to have the stamp of the devil on it. While it's true we're saved by grace and not by works, we don't have grace if we don't believe or follow Jesus in the first place.

It's possible you meant good works only by your comment, but my point is that our actions absolutely determine where we're going. If it didn't, Jesus would not have spent so much time telling parables about how most people will go to hell and how to avoid that, and to avoid sin, and don't be of this world. There's been false teachings spread around lately among Christians who are saying it's totally ok to sin and be in the world and that's the opposite of what the Bible says.

God bless...

James 2:17

Romans 6:15

Hebrews 10:26

Rom 7:22

Matthew 7:21

John 14:15

Matt 5:13

Matthew 7:26-27

Eph 5:5-6

Rom 11:19-23

Faith comes by hearing the word of God and believing to the point of trust: Jesus is the Word, made flesh; He is alive today by the word ( the Bible).He not a man that he should lie!! - He is the Truth at all times. He fullfilled the plan of God for everyone JOHN 3:16. Oh! ,what a Gift - Life and being reconciled to our Father. (please read Romans chapter 5) Joy will cause jumping .,skipping and crying, but this joy ALSO gives peace ,down on the inside because of the truth (He gave us his Word ) So when the devil come in the middle of the night to accuse you, He(the devil) is doing what he got put out of heaven for.(Revelation12:10 ). It's not knowing in your intelligence what Jesus has done for you, but in your spirit by the word of God; then receive it, into your heart that it may grow in your born-again spirit

And if you believe and know by how your life has changed from within (your desires has changed) Just think Born Again-Old things passed away- a babe in Christ- seek the word like a baby seeks milk - eat it!!!!!!! the word..A new baby dont try to figure it out He/she is just happy to be alive...in your case alive in Christ ;because without Christ there is no Life....I thank God and His son, Jesus for you, The Angel rejoice at your salvation ,Me too...rejoice with us..for the gift you have received you are saved by graced..that not of yourself. It had

nothing to do with what you did or didnt do...Its not your righteousnes that makes us acceptable but the imputed righteousness of our Savior Jesus The Christ..It was by faith in the word...and the work of Jesus on the Cross. The devil is Lying again !!!

Read: Romans 5:8 - St John 17 chapt. Ephesian 2:8 Ephesian2:5..Jesus knows our end back to the beginning.....REJOICE! .REJOICE !

LET US ALL HEAR WHAT THE SPIRIT SAYS..IT'S ONLY ONE CHURCH- FIND YOURSELF IN THE 7; REVELATION 1-3 Lets Pay special attention to the church in Sardis

I'll address your questions in order:

Hello, I see you say you believe in once saved, always saved.

Definitely:

Eph_1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Eph_4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

We are sealed until the day we die or are taken up at the rapture ie. for ever.

If so, how do you explain Jesus's warning to Christians to avoid sin? If Christians are already saved then why try to avoid sin anymore?

This is something we should always be doing. We have a choice when confronted with temptation. Avoid sin. This has nothing to do with our salvation - we are justified by faith, not works. Actively committing or avoiding sin is a work.

And how do you explain Jesus clearly saying that blasphemy of the Holy Ghost won't be forgiven in Matthew 12:31?

Define 'blasphemy of the Holy Spirit'.

And do you think Christians are robbed of their free will to sin when they become a Christian. If so, how do you explain even angels in heaven having freewill to sin, like satan, but human beings don't on earth?

Our free will is not affected by our salvation, otherwise there would be no warnings against sinning. We are free to do as we please, or as God pleases. Choose wisely.

Hello, I see you say you believe in once saved, always saved.

If so, how do you explain Jesus's warning to Christians to avoid sin? If Christians are already saved then why try to avoid sin anymore?

And how do you explain Jesus clearly saying that blasphemy of the Holy Ghost won't be forgiven in Matthew 12:31?

And do you think Christians are robbed of their free will to sin when they become a Christian. If so, how do you explain even angels in heaven having freewill to sin, like satan, but human beings don't on earth?

We are saved the moment that we believe that Jesus died for our sins and rose again. See 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. This is all that is required to be reconciled to God. We are at that moment sealed by the Holy Spirit 'until the day of redemption' ie. once saved always saved. Repentance is a change of mind, which we enacted when we believed.

Your past sins are past, and washed away. The accuser will try and remind you of them, just rebuke him. He has nothing to say to you that you cannot ignore.

God bless you 1

To add to the suggestions already made... Remember that there is only Life or Death. Life is the Holy Spirit. Death is not having the Holy Spirit. So my question for you is: Have you received the Holy Ghost since you believed?

Just repentance is NOT enough. You must be baptized in the Name of Jesus Christ, and receive the Holy Spirit. Then you have Life. Then you are free. Then you have the seal of God. Then you belong to God.

Peace & Love in Christ

If you have truly repented of your sins and have laid them at the foot of the cross then know this, that God is faithful and will keep Hs promises. Rebuke Satan when he brings these sins back into your thoughts. He wants you to dwell in your past sins but God your Father has a better life for you. A life of freedom, freedom from the burden of sin. You are no longer bound by the law but free from the law. You are secure in the hand of the Father, free from condemnation ( John 5:24, Romans 8:1), and NO one can remove you from His grasp. As soon as your past sins come to mind turn to Jesus in prayer and take Him on His promise. Leave it at the cross. Find a list of God's promises and when you read them know that He made those promises to you and that God cannot break a promise.

Proverbs 16:7, "When a man's ways please the LORD, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him."

Maddie, even though this Proverb may not seem relevant, I think it shows us that if we please the Lord by doing his Will & exuding Christ-likeness, then even our enemies will not be able to deny our position & of those who can rationalize this new behaviour, will confess that it is the Lord Who hath done this.

I'm sure your parents never thought ill of you, rather it was your desire to present yourself in the best light to them. What matters, as you say, is how God sees you - His precious child, & this is all that matters - He will take care of the rest - even using your life & words to testify of His goodness.

Just to add to the other good comments given. When you have truly repented (deep contrition for our sins against a Holy God & against man) & found forgiveness that is promised from God's Word ( 1 John 1:9), then you are indeed in a right standing in God's Eyes ( Ephesians 1:3-6). If after what you have done & God has promised to do for you & in you, you still feel guilt over those sins & have no joy or peace, it seems that you have not left those sins at the foot of the cross (i.e. laid your sins upon Jesus Who came for this very purpose).

You need to determine in your heart & mind to leave them behind at the Cross & trust God for doing this & accepting you. Do you have a real sense of the Holy Spirit in you working in some ways to confirm the holy transaction that has been done? Or is this teaching of the Spirit still a mystery & an absence in your experience? Are you prepared to stand on God's Word, believing in what it says to you, or rather wanting your mind to believe & dwell on things that are past, that which was forgiven & forgotten? Sometimes the memory of our past sins can remain with us, but they shouldn't cause us to doubt God anymore, thus losing our joy & peace.

One also needs to be conscious of the lion that prowls, Satan, the enemy of God & of your soul. He not only blinds & deceives the world to disbelieve in God, but more so, attacks God's children in many ways. And one way is to create doubt (as he did with Adam & Eve) & fear. It may be that he is reaching out to you in this way to keep you bound, restless, & removing the peace that you should be enjoying. At those times at night, call out to your Heavenly Father, claim His promises to you & command the spirit of fear to depart. In your waking hours, stay alert by attending to the Word of God & prayer - Satan hates it when we do that & the Spirit of God will minister to you.

1 John 3 v 20, 21

God looks upon our hearts , and tries them and knows them better than we do .

The heart is the very depth of our soul and spirit and mind .

If our mind is unsettled or restless we need to trust the Lord .

Yes the devil can condemn us in our thoughts and unsettle us if permitted to do so .

Get your heart right with God , it's the heart where all starts .

We can not do anything about the past unless we are able to right a wrong . For example if I stole a sweater from my neighbor I would return it , if that's impossible then that's understood by God . He knows everything. Confessions of sin sometimes requires righting a wrong .

I'm not saying this is your case but consider it .

If our heart condemn us not then we are good with God !

And we can then stand on the word , and trust in the name of the Lord Jesus ....

When guilt attacks, counter it with what Jesus Christ has done for us:

For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. ( 2Corinthians 5:21)

John chapter 15 is a valuable resource for revival and renewal. In particular, our continually abiding in Jesus Christ will keep us from becoming withered branches.

The letter to the Ephesians gives us a glorious inventory of what we have been blessed with in Jesus Christ and how to make good use of our inheritance.

1 Peter chapter 1 shows us that by faith we can rejoice even in the heaviness put on us by manifold temptations.

I lived thinking about my parents and how they thought of me, but now I try to think about how God sees me, and be pure in his eyes and in the eyes of my parents.

Greg, that expression essentially refers to the Sodomites, or as we would say, homosexuals.

What does it mean by, "...abusers of themselves with mankind?"

I would rather speak 10 words of understanding than 1000 words that they will not understand.

Are you born again? Did they pray with you to receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit? With the evidence of speaking in tongues?

I didn't know who the Holy Spirit was. I had to read New Testament books to know who He is and what He is all about. I knew someone was helping me with deliverance issues. I just didn't really know it was the Holy Spirit helping me. Read the Book of John and underline Holy Spirit verses.

Read 1 Corinthians chapters 12-14 which speak about tongues. Ask the Holy Spirit to Teach you about who He is, and who Jesus is. Pray for a Teachable spirit (inside of you).

Tongues is a heavenly language. It's not going to be in English. It edifies you're born again spirit. You'll hear it in your innermost being. Repeat what you hear. Ask the Holy Spirit to help you pray. Sometimes I just groan.

Certainly, pray with understanding in your human language; with understanding. Pray for people to come to Jesus and be saved. In no time at all your prayer life will bloom and produce fruits. Be assured that the Holy Spirit is undertaking your growing up in Jesus.

Get some place quiet and listen for the still small voice.

Anything the Holy Spirit speaks will be a healing salve on your heart. If a "voice' speaks and it scares you badly.... that was Satanic. Just say, it is written: get thee behind me, Satan! In Jesus Name!!

Gods blessings on you in your search for all He has purposed for you. Stand strong in the power of His might. Find wisdom in Proverbs.

Mishael

How does one start to pray in tongues I would love to experience that.

Very good fortum posts. Thank you!

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Homosexuality is one result of the darkness that comes on people that reject God and follow their own imaginations (See Romans chapter 1).

Repentance and faith in Jesus Christ is the remedy :

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God. ( 1 Corinthians 6:9-11)

The LORD calls such practices abomination, which means disgusting. ( Leviticus 18:22)

In Genesis 18 and 19, the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah were judged to be so wicked that the LORD rained brimstone and fire upon them, utterly destroying them. The name sodomite comes from their example. Their destruction is an example to any that would consider living ungodly ( 2 Peter 2:6).

I have Claire, it's incredible and moved my spirit in a very deep way!

Hi Everyone,

Just wondering if anybody has seen the video on youtube on Truteevee about Ron Wyatt and his sons finding the Ark of the Covenant in Jerusalem in 1982. It was located directly underneath the place where Jesus was crucified.

God bless Everyone.

Kind Regards

Claire

How many Lords are there ?

We know The LORD GOD is one always has been and HE never changes .

a Lord is a title of authority,

Even a husband is Lord over his wife and children , we have land lords , so how many Lords are there ?

Does LORD GOD have an order of Lords ?