All Discussion PAGE 1193

How do we declare the Sabbath? Referring to 7th day? There are calendars where Monday is first and also where Sunday is first. Thank you. Ev. Sr. Henning

Thank you LW for your thoughts and suggestions. I always want to know better how to minister to my sisters. We are all seniors now, so it has been their lifestyle for decades.

Hello

part 3

These verses in Ephesians stressed the unity of God and the body of Christ. A very great privilege we receive by God's gracious mercy and eternal pleasure. It speaks to the various things we share in common as believers:

unity (vs. 3)

peace (vs. 3)

one body (vs. 4) we are a communion of saints

one Spirit (vs. 4) we all have the Holy Spirit living within use due to His regenerative work and indwelling

one hope (vs. 4) we all have the hope of the resurrection of our bodies and the total redemption of our being at the second coming of Jesus

one Lord (vs. 5) our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (eternal God and perfect Man in one Person by the Incarnation)

one faith (vs.5) we profess that Jesus is the Lord as described above and that He is the promised Savior and Messiah who lived a perfect life, died a sacrificial death of crucifixion, was buried, and arose from the dead after three days, and ascended into heaven, and sits at the right hand of the Father in heaven as our Priest and King.

one baptism (vs. 5) that we all have repented and been baptized in water and the Spirit in the name of the Father, in the name of the Son, and in the name of the Holy Spirit as Jesus directed in Mtt. 28:18-19 for the forgiveness of sins ( Acts 2:38)

one God (vs. 6) we confess that there is only one God in all creation-a Godhead that is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( Rom. 1:29; Col. 2:9)

So to answer your questions as to whether I think I will continue as I am in this earthly way or that I will bear the image of the heavenly.

I believe believers will be conformed to the image of the perfect humanity of Jesus, both spiritually and bodily in the resurrection. Just as Jesus rose from the dead in the same perfect human body as He died in and that the Father glorified His human body after His Ascencion, so will our earthly bodies be raised and be perfected and glorified like Jesus' heavenly human body, but not His divinity. We will never be divine

Sister GiGI:

You said, Jesus took back his divine glory, which we will never have.

John 17:22 And the glory which thou hast given me I have given THEM; that they MAY BE ONE as WE ARE ON.

God Bless YOU.

Hi Marke,

I've seen your posts before and agreed with many other of your views and felt they were grounded in Biblical truth. So, this is one area we have a difference in how we interpret the scriptures. To me it's 100% clear what the Bible says, and to you I'm sure you're 100% confident also. But our views are very different and are consequential as we're basically discussing the main aspect of Christianity.

So, let me only address just 1 of your points you wrote: "All born-again believers bring forth good fruit and cannot bring forth evil fruit."

Ok, I can see you took that idea from scripture which is great, but I just don't believe your interpretation as I see you're conflating sin with fruit to the point where you are possibly denying a Christian's ability to sin, is that correct?

Paul was a Christian and spoke about his struggles with fleshly desires and temptation to sin. Romans 7:13-25. So, he was a Christian who bore good fruit, yet still talked about his struggle with sin. He had to fight against it. He talked about having on the armor of God and being prepared for spiritual battles: Ephesians 6:10-18. He didn't say, we'll I'm "saved" and my fruit is good so I can do whatever I want. Quite the opposite.

1 John 2:4-6 - this indicates that we Christians continue to have a choice on whether to keep commandments or not. I'm sure you know that Paul's letters were to Christians.

Let me make a clear point. I'm a Christian and read the Bible daily and try to follow Jesus to the best of my ability, but I am imperfect and have temptations to sin just like any other human being. Sin can be fun by nature and I think most people admit to that. If you're so sure that it's impossible for a Christian to sin or do wrong or that we somehow don't have the freewill to, and is impossible to do wrong or to not follow Jesus, does that mean tonight I can choose to go out on the town and commit all kinds of sin that my flesh desires and you think I'll have no consequence?

Hello again,

Part 2

Colossians 1:15-18 says: "He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the Firstborn over all creation. For by Him (Jesus) all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him (Jesus) and for Him (Jesus). And He (Jesus) is before all things and in Him (Jesus) all things consist. And He (Jesus) is the Head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He (Jesus) might have pre-eminence. For it pleased the Father that in Him (Jesus) all the fullness should dwell, and by Him (Jesus) to reconcile all things to Himself (Father), by Him (Jesus), whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His (Jesus;) cross." (NIV)

This verse speaks to the deity of Christ. He has always been the Son of God, the spiritual divine eternal Image of the Father in Whom all of the fullness of God dwells. The Son of God (the Father's Image) was with the Father and the Holy Spirit in the beginning ( Genesis 1:1-2) when ALL things (other than the Godhead) were created. The Godhead created all that is invisible and visible, spiritual and material through the Son.

Also, within the Godhead, that Father willed that the Son would be the Person of the Godhead to redeem mankind from sin and reconcile us to God through the shedding of His (Jesus') blood in the sacrifice of death on the cross.

This verse does not say that believers are changed from human into the divine image of the Son of God (Who has always been divine). We are changed into the glorified, perfect image of the Son of Man (Jesus' humanity)

Ephesians 4:- 4-6 says "There is one body, and one Spirit, just as you are called in one hope of your calling' one Lord, one faith. one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all." (NIV)

... continued in Part 3

As someone who was once enslaved by this deception, you're both right! If you have loved ones bound up in this lie, i can recommend a documentary to you about the subject. I found this about 5 months AFTER the Lord delivered me, but I believe if i had saw this many years ago, my time in the pit of habitual sin and identity deception would have been over a lot faster. It's on YouTube. it's called, "And Such Were Some of You". These testimonials put a very biblical perspective on the subject. basically they shine the light of compassion on the darkness and you can see it for what it actually is. it's just a stronghold cultivated by a lie from Hell.

Bless you both.

Good Morning Earl,

Thank you for your prayers. My Mom is hanging in there, but very ill.

Here are my responses to the Scriptures you gave me. (Part 1)

In reading Romans 8:29-30 it says, "For whom He (God) foreknew, he predestined to be conformed to the image of His

Son (Jesus), that He might be firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He justified; these He also glorified." (NIV)

I understand this to mean that we are being conformed into the image of Christ in His perfect humanity, but not His deity, because Scripture is clear that God said that there is no other God but Him and He will not share His glory with another. When we are glorified in the resurrection, we will have glorified human bodies like Jesus' glorified human body. But Jesus also received back His divine glory after His ascension. So, He now possesses both a glorified human body and glorified divinity as He had before He was conceived in human form. Jesus, though He is a glorified human being, will always be markedly different from us, because He is also divine along with the Father and the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 15 speaks about our resurrected bodies. verses 46-49: "However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural (earthly body), and afterward, the spiritual (resurrection body). The first man (Adam) was of the earth, made of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as the heavenly Man (Jesus) , so also are those who are heavenly. And as we have borne the image of the man of dust (Adam); we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man (Jesus)." (NIV)

This verse speaks of the humanity of Jesus that was resurrected bodily but in a glorified way. In His ascension, Jesus then took back his divine glory, which we will never have. Our resurrected bodies will be like Jesus' glorified human body.

Reply to Adam.

You quote from 1 Corinthians 9.

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Paul likens the Christian life after salvation to that of running a race. He is talking about receiving rewards and commendations at the judgment seat of Christ. He is not talking about running to finally obtain long-sought-after salvation offered in Christ but never vouched by Christ until the race is audited by Christ, in the end, to see if the race was run well enough.

Reply to Adam.

You quote from Hebrews 10.

24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:

25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

We read in Matthew that the Lord shall judge His people and those who claim to be Christians will be rejected for never having been saved, not for having been saved at one time and then forsaking the things of God, returning to the world and sin in rejection of Christ.

The warnings are to all professing Christians to walk with God and keep themselves un spotted from the world. Those who heed the warnings give evidence they are truly saved. Those who ignore the warnings and forsake God prove they were never saved and Jesus never knew them. John speaks of these temporary fake Christians in 1 John.

1 John 2:19

They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

They departed, like Judas, because they were not really with us, to begin with.

Doug:

Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believe do enter into his rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although THE WORKS were FINISHED from the foundation of the world.

Matthew 13:35 That it might be FULFILLED (the works finished before the foundation of the world) which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth IN PARABLES; I will utter things that have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

Matthew 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of the Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have CHOSEN YOU (from the foundation of the world) .....

Man is a vessel, he has no say IN THE WORKS OF GOD.

Philippians 2:13 For it is GOD that WORKETH IN YOU both TO WILL and TO DO his good pleasure.

Man is FULFILLING the WORDS and WORKS FINISHED before the foundation of the world.

If you were CHOSEN from the foundation, you will be a FIRST FRUIT

If you were not CHOSEN to be a FIRST FRUIT, you will be brought into the kingdom at the feast if the Ingathering.

God Bless You!

Reply to Adam.

You quote Matthew 7.

16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Things I see:

1. All born-again believers bring forth good fruit and cannot bring forth evil fruit.

2. All unregenerate sinners bring forth evil fruit and cannot bring forth good fruit.

3. Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is really a Christian. Those who show evidence of the indwelling Holy Spirit give evidence they are saved, while those showing evidence of a corrupt spirit without the Holy Spirit give evidence they are not saved.

4. In the judgment many lost sinners will point to their good works as evidence they were saved but they still have no evidence of having been born again by the Holy Spirit of God. Jesus rejects their good works and condemns them to the lake of fire, stating emphatically that He never knew them. He says to none of them that He once knew them before they turned back away from Him and lost their salvation.

Dear Don,

What you have said is very true. We need to speak the truth in love ( Eph. 4:15) to those ensnared in evil practices or mind frames. However, we do this knowing that many will not wish to hear the truth and may be hostile to it. I have 3 sisters in this lifestyle and only one was willing to speak with me about it long enough to hear me speak the truth in love. She said "for me to follow Jesus I will have to give up my relationship with --- (her partner) and I am not willing to do that." At least she was honest and I know how better how to pray for her. My other two sisters are resistant to even speaking to me of spiritual matters. But we were all brought up in the Christian faith, so they all know the truth. They just can't find harmony with the gospel and their lifestyle. This is one of the most difficult sinful lifestyle and mindset to turn from as it entails a total reboot of their sense of self-identity. But with God, it is possible. We can continue in intercessory prayer for those we know are in this lifestyle and use every opportunity to show forth the grace of God in our lives through our speech, demeanor, and actions with and towards them.

Reply to Adam. You quoted 1 Peter:

1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,

5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

I see that Peter is addressing Christians only. I also see that those Christians have already been begotten again unto a lively hope. I also see that those Christians are kept by the power of God, not by their own power. I see that those Christians were elect and chosen in Christ from the foundation of the world and that their inheritance is reserved in heaven and shall never fade away.

Peter is encouraging Christians to keep themselves unspotted from the world so that when they are given their new bodies in the end and stand before Jesus at His judgment seat they will not be ashamed for any unrepentant disobedience.

Jesus does not condemn Christians to the lake of fire from the Judgment seat of Christ. Lost sinners are condemned to the lake of fire from the Great White Throne Judgment of God.

Hello Udodirim,

The text does not say why Jacob did this, but it may be that Jacob did this under the direction of the Holy Spirit Who gave Jacob a word from God concerning this-perhaps in a time of prayer, in a dream, in a vision, or in an appearance of the "Angel of the Lord" that was not recorded. But I believe it was God's will for Jacob to do this.

Reply to Adam.

You correctly point out in Matt 12:32 that "the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men."

Jesus also said in Mark 3:28 that all other sins "shall be forgiven."

All sinners shall be forgiven all sins except for the sin of willfully and knowingly rejecting the witness of the Holy Ghost pointing the sinner to Jesus for salvation. It is impossible for a lost sinner to blaspheme against the Holy Ghost before the Holy Ghost speaks to that sinner pointing him to his need to come to Jesus for salvation. It is also impossible for a Christian who is saved because he yielded to the witness of the Holy Ghost to come to Jesus for salvation to then refuse to do that after he has already done it. Christians get saved once, not over and over again.

John 15:22

If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin.

John 15:24

If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father.

2 Corinthians 5:10 - "For we must ALL appear..."

ALL. All means all.

1 Peter 1:5 - "...salvation ready to be revealed in the last time."

In the LAST TIME. It doesn't salvation is given on Earth.

1 Cor 9:24-27 "run the race", not the 'race was already won.'

1 Peter 1:13 "...hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;"

HOPE to the END. It doesn't say NOW. Grace that IS TO BE brought. It doesn't say NOW.

Joshua 24:15 "choose you this day whom ye will serve"

CHOOSE. It's a daily decision. Freewill is not stripped away.

Matthew 7:21-23

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."

Not all believers are saved and not all who claim to be followers.

Matthew 12:32 "...but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come."

SHALL NOT BE FORGIVEN. I read this and know what it says.

James 2:19 "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble."

Believing alone isn't enough according to this verse.

Hebrews 10:26 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"

This is a warning, it is clear, and I understand it. I don't want to test God.

James 2:14-26 "...faith, if it hath not works, is dead..."

John 14:15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

Jude 1:21 "KEEP YOURSELVES IN THE LOVE OF GOD, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life."

These verses are the Words of God.

I read, pray for understanding, and know in my heart what these verses say and mean. If another believer says "No, that's not the truth, believe ME instead" then that is a huge red flag of something that doesn't come from God. God bless.

I believe that Jesus always listen to my prayer. When I read this verse of the day , I know this is his answer.

Please agree with me that the spirit of depression, suicide , and confusion would leave Albert in Jesus name and that the body of Christ would flock around him and minister to him and that God may give him peace and love in these moments and that he would be saved if he has not. In the mighty name of Jesus Amen.

Marke, I am very confused by what you are saying. You are implying that one remaining faithful to Christ is somehow comparable to being late to work? You're saying murderers & adulterers can still be assured of salvation? This is free grace heresy.

Galatians 6: 7-9 "7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of THE SPIRIT REAP LIFE EVERLASTING. 9 And let US not be weary in well doing: for in due season WE shall reap, IF WE faint not." It's safe to say Paul was saved & writing to fellow believers. Notice how he says "we". If eternal security was unconditional I just wonder why he said we reap "life everlasting", including himself, if it can't be lost.

And, is murder and adultery sewing to the flesh or the spirit? The flesh! So, you just said we are still secure in salvation if we murder or commit adultery. Yet, the Bible says only those who sew to the spirit and don't quit will inherit eternal life. I just find this logic completely un-biblical and foreign to the church before the reformation.

Just because God's word teaches we must remain faithful to Christ doesn't make us "Legalists". That's a cop-out from the OSAS crowd who don't want to acknowledge we play a role in our relationship w/ Christ. Let's also not mistake "faith" and "works". You can try to twist faith to be a "work" but faith will always be faith. If remaining faithful to Christ is somehow a "work" then one could logically say that one's initial profession of faith is also a "work". Because, after all, to the OSAS crowd they appear to be more focused on their own one time profession than the relationship w/ Christ. Scripture always talking of us "walking" with Christ, and receiving the end of our faith, eternal life ( 1 Jn 2: 24-25; Rom. 6:22). Biblically speaking, only those who endure to the end in faith will inherit eternal life.

Ronnette:

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the saviour of ALL MEN, specially those that believe.

What do you think is going to happen when Christ resurrects those in the graves back to their bodies of flesh the second time; UNTO JUDGEMENT.

Romans 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature (creation) WAITETH for the MANIFESTATION of the SONS OF GOD (those that believe in this age of grace).

Romans 8:21 Because the creature (creation) ITSELF also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption (the grave) into the glorious liberty of the children of God (when they are judged).

Psalms 149:9 To execute upon them (those that died in unbelief) the judgement written, this HONOUR hath all his saints (those that believed).

Isaiah 26:9 ....an when thy judgements (of the saints) are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world SHALL LEARN RIGHTEOUSNESS.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things have been SUBDUED to him ...... GOD WILL BE ALL IN ALL.

God Bless YOU!

If we die before the Rapture when our bodies are changed, do we have any kind of visible body when we're "present with the Lord," as Paul said? If so, where is that found?

Do people that have died see us here on earth. Whether they be in heaven or hell?

Thanks, Carol

In addition to my post I just added, I wanted to clarify on what you said when you said "rue Christians are not in danger of losing their salvation because of sin but false religionists are still in sin and will never be saved if they fail to seek the Lord for forgiveness. Lost sinners do not 'lose their salvation' because they never had salvation to begin with"

You are only painting half a picture. Yes, there are many out there who won;t genuinely have the Godl'y sorrow that Paul refers to in 2 Corinthians that leads to true repentance, but, many will. As such, even when we are filled with God's Spirit we MUST remain on guard. If not, then everything Jesus warned about in His Earthly ministry was a lie. Since God does not lie, we have to take Jesus at His word. And, just to set the record straight, while Jesus' ministry on Earth was to "save the house of Israel" ALL of his teaching were for all people, including gentiles who would convert. If one is going to quote John 3:16 then they also need to quote all of Jesus' warning, including remaining steadfast.

So, you only painted half a picture. The other half, which paints a full picture, is that even us who are saved MUST endure in faith. This is very clearly spoken of by Paul, Peter, Jude and James in the NT. 2 Peter 2: 14 says "Wherefore, beloved (true believers), seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, WITHOUT SPOT, AND BLAMELESS." Compare what to Col. 1: 22-23 "yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you (true believer) holy and UNBLAMEABLE and unreproveable in his sight: IF ye CONTINUE in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel". Jude says Christ is able to "keep us from falling and present us faultless, but, also says we need to keep ourselves in the love of Christ!

Failure to remain in Christ only leads to hell. No exceptions!!

Yes for sure, Use every chance to try and save someone, there u are home, not home, ect. Holding on to Jesus Christ. Love u all

It's so confusing for believers today to find the simple truths of the Bible such as: Salvation, eternal security, eternal life after death, the Bible as the Living Word of God (not a book of metaphors as some believe) and the great commission. I keep things simple because I started in the Catholic church very involved for nearly 2 decades, many years in religion and agnosticism. Religions complicated things and although I believed in a god then; I didn't know the God of the Bible because no one took the time to show me the simple Gospel of Salvation.

When I got saved, it seems like there weren't various differing opinions amongst fundamental ministries. But in 11-years...I just can't believe the change. I blacklisted social media and other medium where diverse doctrines are preached (YouTube is another place teething with apostate preachers). I believe the most fundamental truths of the Bible can be understood by anyone will to read the KJV and believe.

Second, the readers must know that the Bible reveals the history of the world-The dispensation of time. About people in different times. Plenty of examples about people in different times, and in the end God reveals Himself to the readers to prepare themselves for what is coming in the near future. Readers must understand that after Jesus Christ died on the cross, He selected Paul to be the 12th Apostle for us Gentiles. Apostle Paul also is a Jew and would love to see the Jewish Nation to be saved as much as saving all Gentiles. You will find that the Bible is hard to understand. But trust the Lord and not men. God will guide you to the truth. Jesus Christ is the ONLY Priest alive seated in Heaven with God, The Father; and through the epistles of the Apostle Paul (I.e. The Book of Romans to The Book of Philemon) he told us how to be saved for 2,000 years. A grace period given by God because God loves us ALL. My question to you is How do you know you are saved?

Please God help Joleen and her family as they suffering the attacks of devil. Please guide them Holy Spirit to put on their spiritual armor daily and they spend quality time in prayer together as a family. Please God heal Joleen's mom of her back issue that she will be a testimony for Your Glory I pray in the name of Jesus Christ

Please consider reflecting on Ephesians 6:10-20, Psalms 23, 40, 91, and 2 Timothy 2:1.

Goodmorning1 i have never quite understood how satan fell from heaven and how he thought he was better than God or how he was able to take some angels with him.i am trying to come back to Jesus and learn His word and understand it I Pray for God to bless all of you in the name of Jesus

Thanks Suze for the Scriptures....Very revealing Gbu.. Love ya in Jesus name....Have a nice week end Suze....