All Discussion PAGE 1201

The Bible is clear that ONLY those walking in the spirit will inherit eternal life, but, nowhere do you see this is a guarantee. Jn 10: 28 and 29 there is a condition that is found in v. 27; following Jesus. This is in the present continual tense. Even Christ said in John 8:51 that IF a man obeys His commands they will never see death. This is not a guarantee. Take the parable of the 10 virgins. 5 had the oil (holy spirit) but it burned out. that doesn't mean they never had the oil. There's no Bible verse that says one who's filled with the Spirit can't willfully forfeit their salvation by apostacy ( Heb. 3: 12-19). From Genesis to Revelation God's consistent and clear that there are conditions to eternal life. I read your post to Erich & you quoted "Jesus in Jn 8:30-31 tells us that to those Jews who have believed in Him, He says my genuine disciples continue in my word." that is not what Christ said! Christ said "IF you continue in my word then truly you are my disciple." We see Christ in Jh 15: 3 say that his disciples are "now clean through the word" meaning they're saved. It can't mean anything else. Yet, he continues to tell them they must remain in Him. If not, they'd be cast out and burned, clearly symbolizing hell. We can't let our oil (holy Spirit) burn out.

Rom. 11: 17-23 highlights that Jews were broken off & gentiles graffed into Christ (saved) because of faith. Paul then warns them about apostacy, and highlights in v. 23 that if the unbeliever abides not in unbelief they can be graffed in (saved) AGAIN.

Rom. 2: Who will render to every man according to his deeds:To them who by PATIENT CONTINUANCE in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, ETERNAL LIFE

1 Jn 2:24-15 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. IF that which ye have heard from the beginning shall REMAIN in you, ye also shall CONTINUE in the Son, and in the Father. And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even ETERNAL LIFE.

Hello Alex,

I hope you are doing well. I am doing better each day recovering from my surgeries, but my Mom is in the hospital since last Friday for sepsis. She is 88 and very, very ill. I have 9 siblings, so we are taking turns being there with her during visiting hours. So, my mind and prayers are on her. I was with her all day Monday.

In reading your post, I wondered, if the elect is the Holy Ghost, then that would mean that He needed redemption, which I think is impossible. So, I guess I just cannot concur with your idea here. Maybe I have misunderstood you.

Have a good day, Alex.

No offense taken.

I'm not a scholar by any means . I've only started reading verses and passages with an open mind in the last couple of years. From the time I was a teen (35 or so yrs ago) I've read the passages that I was told backed up the pre-trib rapture and believed every word the pastors and teachers taught me.

Questions came up that I had to get answered. The question of who the elect that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24 and the connection to the elect that Paul spoke of so many times in his letters. Romans 11 seems to speak to that subject very clearly.

I've said to my brother that if you asked 10 different preachers what a certain passage or verse means you'd get more than a few different interpretations.

I have found that so many passages are clearer to me now than what they were years ago. Each person needs to read and understand for himself. With an open mind to what the scripture has for us to learn. That's what I have done and I have been able to see the connections myself without outside help or influences.

Erich:

What is DISOBEDIENCE:

Is it not, not believing what God says.

Not believing is disobedience.

Philippians 2:13 For it is GOD that WORKETH in you TO WILL and TO DO his good pleasure.

Most DON'T BELIEVE these WORD'S of God.

Do you believe that everything being done, IN YOU and BY YOU, is God's will and is God's work.

Isaiah 10:5 O Assyrian, the rod of my anger, and the staff in their hand is my indignation.

Isaiah 10:6 And I WILL send him against a hypocritical nation, and against the people of my wrath WILL I give him a charge, to take the spoil, and to take the prey, and tread them down like the mire in the streets.

Isaiah 10:12 Wherefore it shall come to pass, that when the Lord hath performed HIS WHOLE WORK upon mount Zion and on Jerusalem, I WILL punish the fruit of the stout heart of the king of Assyria, and the glory of his high looks.

Isaiah 10:13 For he saith, by the strength of MY HAND I HAVE DONE IT .......

God didn't punish the king for stealing, raping the women, dashing the children against the streets, and killing men:

He punished him because he thought HE DID IT instead of UNDERSTANDING it was THE WORK'S of GOD through his hand.

TRUTH:

We are the vessel; Christ is the LIFE, TO WILL and TO DO his good pleasure.

Not believing these words causes us to walk in disobedience.

The sins of the flesh are covered by the blood of Christ; NOT BELIEVING his WORDS keeps us from being ONE.

Ephesians 4:4 There is ONE BODY (man) and ONE SPIRIT (Life and Truth).

God Bless You!

Doug,

From what I gather, you believe you can walk away from Jesus Christ. Let me ask you this: will Jesus ever walk away from you? You referenced Jude 1:21, but that verse does not have anything to do with God forcing us or not forcing us to remain in Him. I am going to assume that you are saved? If so, once God saved you, are you now in control of your salvation (keeping yourself saved), or are you being kept by God's power?



You say that "He will not force us to remain in Him," and my response to that would be that God does not have to force any believer to remain in Him. A true believer remains in Him, not because they are forced to, but because they have God's Spirit in them, and it is His Spirit that causes them to remain (MENO) permanently in Him.

Now, I belong to Christ. I have been born of His Spirit. However, I still have choice and I still have free will. What does that mean? Does that mean I can be disobedient to Christ because I have free choice? Well, I can put it to the test and exercise my free choice or free will, but if I truly belong to Christ, He's going to deal with me. And if I truly belong to Christ and one day I decide I don't want to be saved anymore and that I'm going to just denounce the whole thing and walk away, then I was never saved to begin with.

For me personally, I have to differentiate between my flesh and the Spirit of Christ that lives in me. My flesh will never submit to the things of the Lord and will always want to get away. But the Spirit of Christ who lives in me, He is the one who energizes me and causes me to never "walk away." A person who professes to belong to Christ but later on walks away is a person who never belonged to Christ to begin with.

OK dear James if that is the case, can I ask you to interpret Romans 11:25-27 for me please? Paul talks about the salvation of Israel.

"25 - For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 - And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 - For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins

According to these verses Israel will believe in Christ " after the fulness of gentiles be come in", that means that no other gentile is left to be saved and after Israel will believe in Crist.

When is that? If rapture occurs after the tribulation at the very end of this world, when will Israel believe? It doesn't make sense, does it? But if rapture occurs before the tribulation then it makes sence, doesn't it?

GBU

David was a man after Gods own heart and he was of the tribe of Judah..But David was preaching Replacement Theology when he said that Christ wd be a priest after the order of Melchisedek...Not after the Levitical Priesthood... Psalms 110 : 4 ...The LORD has SWORN and will not repent that thou shall be a priest FOREVER after the order of Melechizdek.

...When the viel was rent from the top to the bottom that was really the end of the Levitical Priesthood...Christ Jesus is a hy Priest after the order of this Melchizedek ....impling an endless Priesthood.

....Its very evident that God wants not only a New Covenant but a New Priesthood....And you know what, this is Replacement Theology...The Levtical Priesthood is gona be REPLACED by the Melchizedek Priesthood....And its all for the better, the results of the levitical priesthood was Flesh/sin/death...But the results of that Melchizedek Priesthood is gonna be Gods...life ..To whom the Word came That New Covenant it made them Gods and the scripture cannot be broken. Remember we are gona be married to God....And you know what a marriage is, its when 2 are made 1...We are gonna be made 1 with God/Christ...Thus we are gona be Gods.

A few interesting observations on how God preserved people through Tribulations .

Noah was taken through the flood , not spared the flood . yes He was righteous and obeyed God and built the ark .

Daniel was taken through the Lions den , not spared the loins den , Yes he was righteous and trusted God . survived it unharmed .

Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego , they where righteous and chose to Honor God and would not bow to the Nebuchadnezzar image , they where thrown into the fiery furnace , where not spared the furnace but where preserved through it .

I can say I have had a few experiences like these because I trusted the Lord Jesus at the time . Not quite as dramatic as these examples , but just as deadly they could have been. So yes God works this way today and in the future .

Trust Him the only sure way ...

Matthew 21:21-22,

GOD's WORD says seek & you shall find, knock & it shall be opened, Matthew 7:7, Luke 11:9, Luke 1:37, Luke 18:27, Mark 10:27,

Ask & you shall receive, say with your mouth believe with your heart & it will happen. Mark 9:23, John 16:23,24, John 14:13,14, John 15:16,

Mark 11:22-26,

That doesn't just apply to believers GOD even gives people over Romans 1:18-32,

Matthew 17:20, Hebrews 11:6,

Mark 14:36,

James 4:3,

James 4,

Please stay within scripture, write it upon your heart. Proverbs 7:1-3, Deuteronomy 11:18, Proverbs 3:3,

Mark 7:9, Mark 7:13, Colossians 2:8,

Hopefully these are helpful & insightful

Verse 51- "Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death". This is such a powerful verse. there are so many people out there who are falsely claiming that once a person is saved they are always saved. They will say that disobedience to Christ will lead to chastisement or physical death, but, they are eternally secure. However, this could not be further from the truth and makes Christ out to be a liar. Very interesting that Christ says IF a man keeps his sayings they shall never see death, which is spiritual death. I just had a guy yesterday try telling me that all "true believers" will keep his sayings. However, my question is why did Christ not say that? And, why did Paul write in Romans 2:6-9 "Who will render to every man according to his deeds:To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:"? Paul knew there would be those in the church who would use their liberty in Christ as a license to sin, which is why he specifically warned BELIEVERS against walking away from Christ. He is 100% clear that salvation is conditional. He further highlights this in Gal. 5: 1-4 "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free (true believers), and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace." Notice, we as (true) believers can be SEVERED from Christ and fallen from grace. If Christ is the only way to Heaven, how can think we are eternally secure if God's very word warns against it? The OSAS crowd can't prove the Bible teaches "true" believers will automatically endure to the end. We must follow the spirit and never walk away of an evil heart of unbelief!!

Hi Gigi , I hope that your mom is doing better , mine is in hospital but I'm optimistic for her recovery . However when some one has a lot of serious ailments things can change quickly . If there are any smokers reading this , let me tell you that dying slowly of a smoking related illness is not at all fun . If I could introduce you to my mom and stepdad you would never smoke again . Please try very hard to stop , it's hard to watch people you care about slowly suffocate . Thanks for your kindness Gigi and love to all my family in Christ .

you mentioned the parable of the ten virgins , Id like to mention after much reflection on this parable ;All believed that The Lord was coming and went out to meet him . But wisdom is not knowledge , but rather How you live or do not live , in other words your WORKS . So the wise lived well and had the fruit that remained . Apostle Paul mentioned about laying up in store a foundation to endue the coming day . My real point is as the Bible says often , BE A DOER , NOT A HEARER ONLY .

Thanks may we all go on by Gods Grace

MATTHEW 19:28

Matthew 19:28 ....in the regeneration when the son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory ......

What does this mean:

The regeneration is when you are BORN AGAIN OF SPIRIT (TRUTH).

Colossians 1:27 ...this mystery .....Christ in you .... the Holy Ghost in you ......

The Body is a vessel that ONLY HOLDS; the Holy Ghost, the LIFE of the vessel (our body).

.....When the son of man (the Holy Ghost) shall sit in his THRONE OF GLORY.

Our Body is the THRONE OF (his) GLORY, when we agree with THE WORD, that the LIFE that we now live is the LIFE OF THE HOLY GHOST, that we are ONLY the vessel that hold THE LIFE ( Philippians 2:13).

As Christ, in the form, of the Holy Ghost is IN US, judging us, and bring us to truth.

We will be the likeness of Christ, in the form of a ministering spirit (the Holy Ghost), judging the world (the twelve tribes of the Israel of God), bring them to truth (grafting them into the root; THE LIFE).

Ephesians 4:4 There is ONE BODY and ONE SPIRIT.

1 Corinthians 15:28 .....and GOD SHALL BE ALL IN ALL.

God Bless You!

You have an incorrect view on this. Salvation is conditional on one's continued walk with Christ, like it or not. To say that one can wilfully walk away from Christ and live Disobedience to God will go to heaven is a direct violation of Hebrews 5:9 where we are told that Christ is the author of eternal life for all those who obey him. Also, your response is in direct conflict with Romans 2:9 where Paul says only those who continue walking with Christ will have eternal life. Notice the condition there. This is also in direct line with 1st John 2: 24-25. John clearly says that only those who abide and remain in Christ will receive the promise of eternal life. There is no guarantee there, unless one remains s in Christ. Again, I ask you to show me the Bible verse that states specifically that one will remain in Christ automatically if they are saved. The early church did not teach once saved always saved and specifically highlighted that if one walks away from priced and does not return to Christ will end up in hell. Justin Martyr, for example, addresses this and specifically highlights True Believers that walk away from Christ. The promise of eternal life has conditions and doesn't make it any less of a promise. There is always an if/then connection when it comes to Salvation. Again, you can't show me a Bible verse that so shows True Believers are automatically saved. Everything is based on our continued faith. If what you're saying is true, and it's not, then who can ever really know that they are a True Believer? And, if you are saying that one can be disobedient and end up in heaven makes God a liar and an accessory to sin. Lastly, Rev. 3:5 says those who walk with Christ will not have their name blotted out of The Book of Life. How do we get our names in The Book of Life? Only by accepting Christ gift of Salvation and walking in the light! If we can't have our names blotted out of the book of life that would make Christ a liar and the author of confusion.

So let me ask you a simple question is Once saved always saved; yes or no ?

If yes ; just Get saved and God will do the rest , no need to do any thing , a common response . No fear or concerns .

If no : then be careful how you live , it could be fatal . Yes with faith and Gods help we can do it , common response , its worth it considering the option.

This must be the biggest question of all time in my Opinion . My belief is Only the Bible has the truth , and it must convince any one , or they just my get deceived . Jesus said Beware lest any man deceive you . Our eternity is at stake .

We are all to be messengers of Christ spreading his gospel. We are however are not apostles. We are disciples of Christ. There are no living apostles today. An apostle would have had to seen Christ physically, observed miracles, the resurrection, and assention into heaven.

Where I stated "every spirit " it should have been stated "every evil spirit ".

Unfortunately, you have an incorrect view on this. Salvation is conditional on one's continued walk with Christ, like it or not. To say that one can wilfully walk away from Christ and live Disobedience to God will go to heaven is a direct violation of Hebrews 5:9 where we are told that Christ is the author of eternal life for all those who obey him. Also, your response is in direct conflict with Romans 2:9 where Paul says only those who continue walking with Christ will have eternal life. Notice the condition there. This is also in direct line with 1st John 2: 24-25. John clearly says that only those who abide and remain in Christ will receive the promise of eternal life. There is no guarantee there, unless one remains s in Christ. Again, I ask you to show me the Bible verse that states specifically that one will remain in Christ automatically if they are saved. The early church did not teach once saved always saved and specifically highlighted that if one walks away from priced and does not return to Christ will end up in hell. Justin Martyr, for example, addresses this and specifically highlights True Believers that walk away from Christ. The promise of eternal life has conditions and doesn't make it any less of a promise. There is always an if/then connection when it comes to Salvation. Again, you can't show me a Bible verse that so shows True Believers are automatically saved. Everything is based on our continued faith. If what you're saying is true, and it's not, then who can ever really know that they are a True Believer? And, if you are saying that one can be disobedient and end up in heaven makes God a liar and an accessory to sin.

They are 2 different battles ( in which they think it is a battle against the Almighty God, but Our God destroys them). Armageddon is a place where all men of flesh is gathered and are destroyed. Gog and Magog is Satan and the fallen angels and every spirit descending upon the saints of the thousand year reign with our Almighty Saviour Christ Jesus and fire comes down out of heaven from God and devours them.

I joined this page as I wished to read about the blessed King James Bible from a basic fundamental perspective. I don't use social media and avoid any "Christian" websites due to the diverse false doctrines. As many have written great words of inspiration and wisdom. I see an equal amount who contribute doctrines which cause discord and a feeling of loss for new believers (denial of pre-tribulation rapture, denial of Heaven after death, denial of permanent Salvation/eternal security, etc). I'd ask this to those here in all transparency and understanding: are we making this a safe place for the newly born again to learn about the Holy Bible with the simple sound doctrines which are taught? Or are we complicating the Word of God?

2 Corinthians 11:1-6

Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me. For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him. For I suppose I was not a whit behind the very chiefest apostles. But though I be rude in speech, yet not in knowledge; but we have been throughly made manifest among you in all things.

If you're newly born again, the greatest truths you need to know in this Bible are:

Galatians 2:21 - I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Romans 10:9 - That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

God bless you all.

God loves Israel...but.

Replacement theology in short denies the Spiritual deity of events that have come and are to come. It's the disdain for the Spiritual Jewish heritage in the Bible. To the longwinded posts I've seen here which to me only say to me how close we are to the end times that anyone could believe this.

2 Corinthians 11:3

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ

This is the King James Bible Online...why are there groups here that feel like this is a platform for promoting apostasy. This is shameful.

What does replacement theology hope to accomplish (why so many through history have believed it so strongly; they made it foundational doctrines of their religion (not Christianity):

- They believe God revoked His promises to Israel because they rejected Jesus the Messiah

- They believe the Jews are no longer God's chosen people (which is why they deny the rapture, tribulation and often the 2nd coming stating they've already happened and were metaphorical)

- They believe God has no future plans for Israel

- Deep down, they blame all Jews (past and present) for the death of Jesus the Messiah

Now, I call apostasy on anything Messianic as it goes against the New Covenant of Christ. But replacement theology is a dangerous doctrine and doesn't belong on this site or anywhere. Some very terrible events in history were led by those who used replacement theology as reason to kill Jews.

Back to what I said in the beginning; if you stick to the fundamental basic Truth of the Gospel in the King James Bible...you won't be erred in doctrine. Christ made His Gospel understandable to children but I can just imagine new Christians reading this and feeling like they were cheated. God hasn't cheated anyone. Man has with these heretical doctrines.

ISRAEL

The Jews in the land of Israel today cannot prove which tribe they are from. There is no priest of the tribe of Levi.

The Old Testament Israel, that died in UNBELIEF, are dead and in their graves.

They CANNOT be grafted into the kingdom of God until the SECOND RESURRECTION.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, that ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye shall also sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of ISRAEL.

This cannot happen until the SECOND RESURRECTION.

Hebrews 4:2 For unto us the GOSPEL was preached, as well as unto them: but THE WORD preached did not prophet them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

God Bless God!

I am 75 and have expected Jesus to return soon for most of my life. He will be here soon in Gods time not mine. I have seen so many miracles in my life last year I became partially paralized, I had nine discs fused,

had to learn to walk again etc. but after 2 and one half months in the hospital I am home and healing nicely.

I made many friends during the last year, but Jesus is the only one of these who is essential.Praise him. bless him

Hi Marke,

Thank you for your response. It is much appreciated. Just as I was saying in my other posts, it is nice to get feedback from others. However, I must say that the Bible is very clear in it's warning to all believers about falling away. There is no such thing in the Bible that says true believers will never fall away. If that was the case the Bible would be clear about that. However, the Bible is clear, like it or not, that salvation is conditional on our continued faith and walk with Christ. It is very easy for one to say "true believers" will never fall away. However, the only believers in the Bible are "true" believers that the writers are writing to. This idea that once someone is saved they are just automatically always saved, even if they live in disobedience, conflicts with the Word of God that says in Heb. 5:9 that Christ is the author of eternal life for those who obey him. Now, you mention physical death for those who are disobedient, but, James 5:19-20 mentions the spiritual death from "brethren" who err from the truth. Brethren are believers. So, as you can see Christians are not just automatically saved. Paul even knew this and address this many times over. Lastly, don't misrepresent 1 Cor. 11:30 as all encompassing. While there are some who were disobedient and it led to sickness and death, that does not account for those who willfully walk away from Christ. Those are 2 different things. The problem with those who believe in OSAS is that they always need to slightly twist verses out of context to fit their agenda, whereas I just let the Bible speak for itself in it's proper context. Whether you like it or not, the Bible is clear that salvation is conditional on our continued faith in Christ. No endurance to the end, no salvation.

I was raised a Mormon, but their beliefs never satisfied my soul, and i left the church and eventually became a Christian. My husbands sisters were instrumental in my salvation. I thank God for them. there have been so many times that God saved me from death, he kept me alive for his purpose, until I was saved. I love him so. To God be the glory.

Please reference the Bible verse that says saved Christians cannot walk away from Christ and be lost. The Bible does not say that true Christians cannot be lost. The Bible was written by true Christians to true Christians and warned true Christians not to fall away. This idea that "true" Christians are immune to sin is complete nonsense and a dangerous doctrine. The KJV Bible is extremely clear in what it says. God is consistent from Genesis to Revelation and those who do not remain faithful to God will end up in hell. That is the only truth, like it or not.

Can anyone be in the presence of the Arc of the Covenant

Giannis...You are so right but look what happened, Catholicism came in which was of the devil imo...Jesus forwarned us saying I am the light of the world but the NIGHT comes ( darkness ) when no man can work...The Church had fragmented as Paul said i hear there are divisions among you...The Deacons Evangelist teachers Pastors etc did not further the cause of Christianity...God gave them up till the woman IS IN Childbirth as says Micah 5 says He wd give them up...That Image in Dan. 2 was given up even tho the head was of gold which is to me is the Bible...That Image in Daniel 2 was a perfect picture CHRISTIANITY...The gold silver and brass and iron was all parts...But there was no life in the image even tho its head was of gold...The gold silver brass iron is just symbolic of Evangelists teachers preachers apostles etc we know in parts as Paul says but when that which is perfect is come that New Covenant the BOOK in the Fathers right hand then they ALL SANG A NEW SONG...We are not gonna sing this Churchanity song much longer after the book is opened...Then the woman goes into Child birth after the book is opened...then comes the Kingdom..In Rev 12 : 10 ...That Image in Dan. 2 was ALL IN PARTS from the head to the foot...That stone cut without hands is the new Covenant the seed of the sower that is gonna destroy this image...Churchanity...Its the stone cut without hands which is the new covenant the book in the Fathers right hand that is gona destroy this Churchanity image.

....Giannis Jesus warned them saying when ya see the ABOMINATION of Desolation spoken by Daniel the Prophet run to the mountains...The Church became desolate...As Jesus said your house is left unto you Desolate...And is still desolate today even the big megga Churches are desolate ...Satan is now standing in the Holy Places..the Pulpits

....Churchanity is the Image in Dan. 2...That is gona be done away with.. When that which is perfect is come that which is done in parts will be done away with.

please remember me and my family in your prayers today

Pray to God in the name of Jesus Christ for what you need Amen