All Discussion PAGE 531

Did anyone watch the Asbury outpouring/revival in Kentucky? I saw many people receive the Holy Ghost w utterance. I sure did. The utterance most certainly is real. You will then walk in Gods power.

The men were preaching Acts 2:38. These were the men surrounded by groups of people outside, preaching them the gospel & the people were hungry for Gods truth. They are feeding the hungry for the Holy Ghost.

I pray that people open their minds & hearts to this truth. If you do not want this truth then it will be hidden from you.

There are so many false preachers out there, & they are the ones on the radio & on the tv, & most people are believing these false teaching.

No one can live for the Lord without the Holy Ghost.

Crucify the flesh daily.

If you want more truth, then fast & pray.

Bible says that we must know who God is & obey the gospel to be saved

We must always be seeking more. Never stop.

Please wait for my friend Angela she's an ICU Help her to overcome the alcohol addiction help And to come out healthy and strong give the doctor's wisdom to know how to take care of her and just be with her and her family and Jesus naming in Into grow in the Lord Jesus Christ If she's not a born again believer she becomes a born again believer and her husband too and the rest of her family

testimony 4 Christ

Well 1st I want to say God is sooo good! He does work all things for our good and his Glory!

I can gratefully say after years of smoking cigarettes and addiction to Opioids God has delivered me from both in the same year!

I've made many many mistakes on my life.... sexual immorality, drug use, smoking, cussing, even thought I was hearing from angels... wow Was I wrong! Nope it was demons acting as such! Before I realized that I got into new age stuff that didnt know was witchcraft and was in that for about 5 years. Crystal's, giving messages, sage, ouija board once, chakra and reiki work, angel cards.. you name it I tried it...

As of right now I am dealing with the aftermath of my horrible poor choices but I also see alot of good that has come out of it. Both my husband and I are walking with Lord Jesus and this situation has made us hold on to him even tighter!

See I didn't realize that when I was channeling what I thought was spirits ... I invited demons in me.... I currently feel them moving and even see them in my reflection in my eyes and smell them also... I have lots of paranormal movement in my house still.

I have been thru 8 deliverances so far and will be attending another one on Saturday and then the following Thursday.

I used to be very afraid of what I would see or the thoughts and voices etc.

Now I am standing in my faith and learning more and more every day how to do that.

However I KNOW that the Good Lord is helping me and thru this my husband and I can help others!

I post this to testify to God goodness... he has sustained me and my husband thru this... thank you Jesus

Its also important to KNOW THE WORD! please anyone that's reading this KNOW that it IS REAL! you have to be very careful what you get into...

I stopped absolutely everything I ever used to do... no music or tv or immorality, no cussing, no drugs, no smoking, cut out all movies and the list continues. I believe 1000 percent God will

Awesome and good

Hi Marty ...Tell your friend that Jesus has died for him at Calvary making a new covenant in his blood for all men....I was found of them that sought me not and made manifest unto them that asked not after me.... Romans 10:20...And this Jesus wants to know him, sowing a good seed in his heart...That is gonna result in a birth of a Baby Christ in him...which is the Child of Promise the H.G...Thats y he has to know us, even in the spiritual realm a birth requires a spritual seed....An intimacy

......Thats y Peter said being bornagain of an incorruptible seed even by the word of God that liveth and abideth forever...The living word which is spirit and life...Thus there is a new heart and a new spirit in our near future...Which is true Holiness....Thats y the woman in Rev 12 :5...is giving birth to the manchild the H.G. that Child of Promise...Which is the regeneration and multiplication of Christ Jesus via his seed the word...ok....That was the great Promise when God swore by himself Gen 22:17...That Christ wd be multiplied as the stars of heaven....Thus the sower and his precious seed...An Israel of God... Gal 6:16....And the Children of PROMISE....The Kingdom....Unless you receive the Kingdom as a lil Child impling that new birth you will in no wise enter there in...There is not a day that goes by that i don't thank GOD for what he did at Calvary...That N.C. by his blood....That all inclusive Covenant....I will know them all from the least to the greatest....And they shall all be taught of God... Jeremiah 31:34....If i be lifted up i will draw all men unto me...Even as Moses lifted up a serpent in the wilderness even so must the Son of man be lifted up... John 3 :14....Every one who beheld that bronze Serpent lived, their snake bite was not fatal...The spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made us free from the law of sin and death... Romans 8 :2....sometimes we get bit but our snake bite is not fatal if we behold the lamb of God that taketh away the sins of the world. gb

Please pray that the Lord Jesus give me more power to restrain my lips and tongue.

As Proverbs 21:23.

The Lord guide you all I pray.

REVELATION IS SYMBOLIC

Revelation 16:21 And there fell upon man a great HAIL out of heaven, each stone about the weight of a talent (a talent weighs about 57 pounds): and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the HAIL; for the plague thereof was very great.

Since Revelation is symbolic, what is this a symbol of:

We have to go to the prophets:

Isaiah 28:2 Behold, the Lord hath a mighty and strong one ....who is this MIGHTY and STRONG ONE? ..... it is JESUS, the WORD OF GOD ......which as a tempest of HAIL and a DESTROYING STORM ......the HAIL in Revelation is symbolic of the WORD OF GOD, and his words are going to DESTROY ALL DECEPTION FROM THE CARNAL MIND of his people.

Revelation 9:17 And I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat upon them, having breastplates of FIRE, and of JACINTH, and BRIMSTONE, and the heads of the horses were as heads of lions; and out of their mouths ISSUED FIRE and smoke and BRIMSTONE.

Revelation 9:18 And by these three were a THRID PART OF MAN KILLED, by the FIRE, and by the SMOKE, and by the BRIMSTONE, which issued out of their mouth.

This is symbolic, you can contain PHYSICAL fire and brimstone in ones mouth.

Isaiah 30:33 ...for the king it is prepared; he hath made it deep and large; the pile thereof is FIRE and much wood; the BREATH OF THE LORD, like a stream of BRIMSTONE, doth kindle it.

Ezekiel 5:2 ...though shall burn a THIRD PART .....

Ezekiel 5:3 Thou shall take thereof a FEW ......

Ezekiel 5:4 .....and cast them into the midst of the fire, and burn them in the fire: for thereof (those destroyed in the fire) SHALL A FIRE COME FORTH ino all the house of Israel.

Zechariah 13:9 And I will bring the THIRD PART through the FIRE ......

Revelation 8:7 And the third part of the trees were burnt up .....

Isaiah 9:5 For every battle of the warrior is with confused noise, and garments rolled in blood, but this (battle) shall be with BURNING and fuel of fire.

Isaiah 9:19 .... people shall be the fuel of the fire

Dear Samantha, I have prayed for Nicole and baby.

I will continue to do so. I experienced pre-term labor at 29 weeks with my third child. We made it to 39 weeks! So, hopefully, there will be such an outcome of Nicole and baby.

Dear Heavenly Father, I know of Your faithfulness in my life and that of my son during my pregnancy with him. I ask in the name of Jesus that You will reach to Nicole in this situation and keep the babe from being born so early. We ask that her stay in the hospital will bring the treatment needed to stop the labor and stabilize Nicole's body, especially her uterus. We ask that You protect this babe from any harm and bring this precious baby to term healthy and strong. Amen.

Dear Mel8,

I have prayed for Stephen and will continue to do so. Thank you for bringing this request for him to us.

Dear DDGC

I am praying for you today.

Dear Heavenly Father, we pray to You today in the name of Jesus for DDGC.

We ask that You will clear his mind of all confusing thoughts and from focusing on numbers and words that do to give him true understanding of Your word. Cause DDGC to be guided by the Holy Spirit in all things and enlighten his soul with that which is able to bring Him to truth and salvation in you. We ask that DDGC be drawn to You by faith and that You will bring to him deliverance from that which has such a hold on him and from what distresses him. Amen.

Dear Osadiaye,

So thankful for

god's answer to your prayers. He is good and He is faithful to us.

REVELATION IS SYMBOLIC

When studying revelation we have to constantly ask ourselves what is the a SYMBOL OF"

The Lamb of God

The firstfruits

The scorpions

The Locust

The horses

The two edged sword

The church

The Book

The sea

The ships

The frogs

The hail

The Plagues

The vials

The heavens

The earth

The temple

The city

The streets

The Gates

The brimstone

The lake of fire

The second death

The fountain

The seals

Revelation has to be taken in the context of this symbols.

Amos 3:7 Surly the Lord God will do NOTHING, but he REVEALETH his secret to his servants the prophets.

The answers are in Mosses and the Prophets.

Luke 16:31 And he said unto them, If they HEAR NOT Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

God Bless You

Thank you lord.

P.2 Thanks again Chris for your reply. The rapture of the church would have to be a resurrection Chris. You even said "The rapture of the Church (i.e. which includes the resurrection of the dead in Christ) The word (resurrection) is #386; it means a standing up again, a resurrection from death, a (moral) recovery (of spiritual truth) raised to life again, rise from the dead, that should rise, rising again. In 1 Thes.4:16-17, These verses are telling us of that resurrection, Right? (16) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (This verse tells us the dead in Christ shall rise first, so they are resurrected from their grave, from death, it also tells us its not going to be a (secret) rapture! The Lord descends with ((a shout)), with ((the voice of the archangel)), and ((with the trump of God)). That could not be a secret rapture. Also in Rev.1:7 We are told "Behold, he cometh with clouds; and ((every eye shall see him)),. . Then v.(17) Then we which are alive and remain shall be ((caught up together with them in the clouds)), to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (This is the resurrection, and (our bodies will be changed) in the twinkling of an eye. Our bodies will have to change, in 1.Cor.15:50 we are told "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God;. . This is the return of Jesus Christ in the clouds to gather together His elect, the church. Truth is what matters Chris, the more we study and seek His truth the more holes we will find in the pre-tribulation rapture theory. Jesus said in Jn.8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. The word (truth) is #226; it means to be true (in doctrine and profession) speak (tell) the truth. If we allow scripture to interpret scripture it proves there is no pre-tribulation rapture. Thank you again Chris.

OUR MARRIAGE TO CHRIST

If we are MADE ONE by the marriage of ourselves to Christ; wouldn't that marriage have happen when we were resurrected with Christ a NEW CREATION.

Revelation is SYMBOLIC, the revealing of Jesus Christ.

Colossians 1:27 ... THIS MYSTERY ......Christ in you ......

Just a thought to consider.

God Bless You

Thank you lord for had my prayer and have answered me .

in Jesus Name AMEN...

Please Lord bring comfort to Stephen as he is suffering much and the doctors aren't talking hope for his condition. I know you God are the master physician and You never intended in anyone to suffer as much as Our Savior Lord Jesus Christ. Please help Stephen Holy Spirit have have peace and love to let his spirit and soul that he has purpose pass this physical affliction I pray in the Jesus Christ name!

P.1 Chris I thank you again for responding. Please understand I mean no disrespect Chris but if we loose the context then we loose the truth. You said of Rev.19:7-9, "Was the supper to take place forthwith, since the Bride was there and ready and waiting? If I had to analyse it, I would say No. The Bride was not altogether there- there were yet more to join them so that the marriage supper could take place". This is adding something that the Word does not say. Rev.19:7-9 is the only place in the Bible that tells us of the marriage supper of the Lamb, so when it says "the marriage of the Lamb IS COME, and his wife hath made herself ready." We have to take it for what it says to keep these verses in context! The word (marriage) is #1062 it means nupials, marriage, wedding. The wedding has taken place and the Bride is now called the "wife". Then you said, "Then in Rev.19:11-21, we see the Lamb, not enjoying this time with His Bride, the Church, but going out to war against the beast, false prophet and those having the beasts mark on them" (This is showing us the return of Christ riding a white horse to judge and make war. In Rev.19:8 speaking of the "wife" "And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in ((fine linen, clean and white)), for the fine linen (is the righteousness of saints). Now lets look at the army that follows Jesus riding white horses in Rev.19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in ((fine linen, white and clean)). The marriage supper of the Lamb is over, Jesus returns (to the earth) riding a white horse with His church, the bride of Christ, His wife to reign for a 1000 years. Then you said "Here is the "first resurrection" of those living in the tribulation days, who rejected the beast and his mark." The word (first) is #4413; it means foremost (in time, place, order or importance) before, beginning, best, chief(-est) first (of all) former. This resurrection is the beginning, the first of all.

WE humanity as all men have been born by the will of some man....Its only our new innerman which is the H.G. The Spirit of Christ that is born by the will of God in us via his good seed....Conception takes place when we hear and understand his voice a spritual pregnancy results....My Lil Children of whom travail in birth again Gal 4 :19...till Christ is formed in you.. Thats what faith is a spritual pregnancy....Thus there is a child on the horizon ...Which is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen....The fetus is the H.G. The Child of Promise...Thats y he always refers to himself as the Son of Man...Mankind has to bring forth fruit unto God... Romans 7:4...Thus there is a baby Christ in our near future....And its this baby Christ the N.C. in his blood that is the Elect and the Church is the Elect lady...Its a bride and bridegroom scenario...Which is gonna result in an Israel of God that is gonna be as the stars of heaven...That was the great Promise that Christ wd be multiplied as the stars of heaven...Thats y Jesus was saying blessed are them that follow me in the Regeneration the multiplication of his seed...Thus the sower and his precious seed...The contents of that book of life in the fathers right hand...The book of life of the lamb...( his blood etc )..That N.C.

Remember Jesus said the good seed are the Children of the Kingdom....Which are the babes and sucklings...Thats y Jesus said a lil Child is gonna lead them which is the H.G....And thats y the spirit of truth cannot speak of himself he is just a spritual infant....Thats y Isaiah tells us of the women with Child and she that travail with Child a great company... Isaiah 11... ... Jeremiah 30:6 Why do i see all men in travail and birth pains...Remember Jeremiah told God he was just a lil Child he cd not speak... Jeremiah 30 :6....Symbolic of the manchild in Rev 12 that is gonna rule all nations....One is neva outa of context when lifting up that N.C.at Calvary in his Blood..

Brother Chris:

In Revelation it is necessary to understand who the THIRD are, they are also killed in the lake of fire.

Revelation 8

Ezekiel 5:1-5

Ezekiel 5:12

Zechariah 13:8-9

Isaiah is full of a destroying fire, that you don't sit before to keep warm.

God Bless YOU

Hiya Jimbob love ya but i disagree a bit...Gods favorite is the seed of Jesus the H.G..Jesus cd not tell us the gift of God is the H.G. IF THE H.G was not his favorite his Chosen..That new Creature which is the H.G is the only thing that availeth any thing in Christ Jesus...Which is our new inner man the H.G.... As Jesus said that which is born of the spirt is spirit which is the H.G. that Child of Promise...Gods Elect....We the Church are the Elect lady the bride...But the H.G. is the Elect bridegroom....As John said he that has the bride is the bridegroom..

There is only 1 promise seed which is the H.G. the good seed ,the living word of Jesus...My words are spirit and life much greater then paper and ink the written word that O.C.

...The written word can be molested and has been molested by many Religions and bibles....But the living word cannot be molested as the living word is God himself... John 1..Its only the living word that Jesus refered to as the Promise seed...

And Jim the scripture cannot always interpret the Scripture..Remember Jesus told Peter that flesh and blood did not reveal it unto you but by my father in Heaven...Which is the spirit...The deep things are hidden from the wise and prudent but only revealed unto the babes...That New Born in our lives the H.G.

If the scripture cd interpret the scripture the High Priest who knew the scripture wd not have instructed the ppl to cry crucify him..In so doing the whole of the levitical Priest hood wd be done away with...The curtain was rent from the top to the bottom....The deep things are hidden from the wise and prudent...They knew the scripture by heart but did not understand that a new covenant was on the horizon....And this N.C.was by his blood...Thus the book of life ( the blood ).... Jeremiah 31:31 I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and Judah...A N.C...And this N.C. is a birthing covenant...We are gona have a baby Christ which is the H.G. the Child of Promise. The son of man.

please remember me and my family

A seed has to be sown in our hearts for salvation to be born in us... Mat 13 : 18...And that incorruptible seed is the gift of the H.G....Unless the lord of the sabbath had left us a seed....Which is the contents of the book in the fathers right hand...The living word...The book of life ( The O.C. HAD NO SUCH SEED) we wd have been made like unto Sodom and Gomarrah....Thats y Jesus said that which is born of the spirit is spirit which is the H.G. that has to be born in us via his seed the living word...There is a Child in our near future which is the H.G. that Child of Promise....Unless you receive the kingdom of God as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in...There is a child involved in this N.C....Which is a baby Christ the H.G. The only Child of promise...Which is the multiplication and regeneration of Christ Jesus via his seed in humanity...The field being the world, humanity....But mans carnal mind cannot comprehend these things... They are hid from the wise and prudent only revealed unto the babes and sucklings....Which are the Children of PROMISE...The H.G. The Anointing....That Child of Promise...An Israel of God which is the seed of Christ that is gonna be as the stars of Heaven in multitude...That was the great Promise.

.....The last 2 k yrs have been a time of darkness... Mat 9:4....Jesus said i am the light of the world ( the living word ) but the nite comes when no man can work...And Isaiah says that darkness will cover the earth and gross darkness the ppl....Thats y there is a different Church on every corner....Not 1 of them sees the same Gospel.

.....Thats y God has to send an angel to preach the everlasting gospel to all that dwell on the earth.... Rev 14:6...To every kindred ppl and nation...Which is the Living word the N.C....We are in that time of the great abomination of desolation....your house is left unto you desolate...Mat.24:15...There is a Child on the Horizon which is the H.G.. The gift of God.. our new hearts and spirits..

thank you LORD for your words peace be in Jerusalem and peace in the world

may JESUE CHRIST be praise,

Page 2.

Mark 13:20 'elect', I believe applies to the elect among Israel, in its context of the chapter. But of course, after the Gospel is brought to the Gentiles, we too join the elect of God ( Colossians 3:12; Titus 1:1; 1 Peter 1:2), but Jesus directed His message to the Jews of His day.

Revelation 13:7,8: are these saints the ones living at the time of revelation of the beast on Earth, or are they the 'new believers' who have turned to Christ, rejecting the beast? And the Lamb's Book of Life, does it record all believers now & into the future, or only adds to the record those who are being saved by the Blood of the Lamb? Moot questions for sure.

Revelation 20:4-6: "This is the first resurrection". The Rapture of the Church (i.e. which includes the resurrection of the dead in Christ) & the resurrection of the tribulation saints are not the same. The Rapture is not a part of the First Resurrection (some have included them together, referring to it as two phases of the one). The Rapture is the catching away of believers to be with the Lord in Glory. The First Resurrection is for the tribulation saints who have died for Christ & will reign with Him through the Millennium. The scenarios are different hence cannot be the same. So, should not the Rapture then be called the First Resurrection? Apparently not, as that is the secret coming of Jesus to take away His Church from the Wrath to come. Blessings.

Page 1.

Hi Jimbob & thank you for sharing this. I'll leave the matter of who the 'saints' are; I brought this up earlier. But to Revelation 19:7-9: in the context of the whole chapter, I read those verses differently to you. There was great praise going on in Heaven, with the words, "for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready (v7)". Christ, the Lamb, was being made ready for His Wife (the Church) & the Voice from God's Throne told John to write, "Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb." Was this supper to take place forthwith, since the Bride was there & ready & waiting?

If I had to analyse it, I would say, No. The Bride was not altogether there - there were yet more to join them so that the marriage supper could take place. The announcement at verse 9, was the imminency of this marriage supper: the bride was already there (raptured saints?), but not the full number (tribulation saints?). Then in Revelation 19:11-21, we see the Lamb, not enjoying this time with His Bride, the Church, but going out to war against the beast, false prophet & those having the beast's mark on them - all being killed & consigned to the Lake of Fire. Then John was given the vision, "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years ( Revelation 20:4). Here is the 'first resurrection' of those living in the tribulation days, who rejected the beast & his mark, & were beheaded for their love for Jesus & together with the saints from Heaven, share in that great Supper time.

Blessings DDGC,

It sounds as if you are in a state of mind in which you cannot experience peace and God's Love. This need not be. You can be sure it is NOT the Holy Spirit Who hides truth when God's Will is that we receive and accept it. Neither is it He Who forces His Will upon us, as that would be a violation of our free will to choose to listen to Him. The Voice of the Holy Spirit does not command because It is incapable of arrogance. It does not demand, because It does not seek control. To "force" is to overcome which is a form of attack, which is also something He is incapable of. All of these actions and qualities are not the effects of Love which is What and Who God is. Rather, they result from the part of a split mind who believes fear and love are the same.

Another voice who does NOT love you is attempting to steer you away from MEANING, by focusing on letters and numbers in words.

God is Spirit, and only God is ONLY Holy. He created us in His Own Likeness. Therefore, in reality you are holy because your mind is part of God's. And because you are holy, your sight must be holy as well. "Sinless" means without sin. You cannot be without sin a little. You are sinless or not. If your mind is part of God's you must be sinless, or part of His Mind would be sinful. Your real sight is related to His Holiness, therefore not to your body's eyes.

Our holiness reverses all the laws of this world. It is beyond every restriction of time, space, distance and limits of any kind. Our holiness is totally unlimited in its power because it establishes you as a Son of God, at one with the Mind of his Creator. You are holy because all things God created are holy; and eternal.

There is no second to God. there cannot, therefore, be anyone without His Holiness, nor anyone unworthy of His Perfect Love.

I thank you Father for Your perfect son. And in his glory will I see my own. Amen.

Peace

God Is

Thank you David0920, I agree again with what you've shared here. And the examples you gave of Ruth & Lazarus do clearly illustrate the Gospel message or of our release of sin's deathly grip on our lives. Indeed, to other folk, there may be elements within those accounts that will leap out & speak to them in other ways, such as: faithfulness, devotion, singlemindedness, etc. To each one, the Spirit will speak & touch on those points from the Word that are most necessary for HIS Work to be carried out in their lives.

But also what interested me from your comment was your point 2, "We are to interpret Scripture with Scripture." Looking at that statement, who could disagree with you, as that is one of the primary ways of really understanding the biblical accounts, getting them in correct perspective & that which gives a fuller understanding of the Truth. But at the risk of offending some here, we often read comments such as a recent one: stating that the Lake of Fire "as being God Himself since God is a consuming fire" (here we get two Scriptures that reveal Truth: one referenced to Revelation 20:14 & the other to Hebrews 12:29). So now we get another example of someone showing his version of 'Scripture interpreting Scripture'. Is this then a case of Scripture interpreting Scripture? It is true, 'Fire' is common to both verses, but isn't the promise of an eternal Lake of Fire given to all "not found written in the book of life", rather than Fire being God Himself & by extension, God ridding the filth of all found there & finally saving them, as going through fire for cleansing? How we interpret this Truth can give totally opposite meanings which not only distorts the Word but leads the unlearned into confusion & a false understanding.

So this was the point I was making: that there is a correct method of comparing Scripture to Scripture, and I couldn't discern your position on this, or was it just a general post to all of us to correctly interpret the Bible?

Great lesson for bible study

Chris thanks again, I'm sorry but I should have added a p.2 to that last one. Rev.13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, .. Now to look at Rev.13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, ((whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb)) slain from the foundation of the world. Everybody on earth will worship the antichrist ((except those whose names are written in the Lambs book of life)) If your name is written in the Lambs book of life wouldn't you have been taken, or caught up before this happens, if there were a pre-tribulation rapture? There would have to be a separation of people who have their names written in the Lambs book of life, if there's a pre-tribulation rapture. That would also mean there's more than one resurrection wouldn't it? Rev.20:4-6 Verse 4 tells us those who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had NOT WORSHIPPED THE BEAST, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands. This would be the same time period the antichrist makes war with the saints, they will reign with Christ for a 1000 years. Verse 5 tells us ((This is the first resurrection)) If there was a pre-tribulation rapture then wouldn't that rapture be the first resurrection? I'm sorry Chris I really do appreciate you responding as much as you have but I just see to many holes in the pre-tribulation rapture, there are to many scriptures that contradict it. These are pretty straight forward verses and I believe they are used in context, if you see it differently then please show me what was taken out of context. Again I do thank you Chris.