All Discussion PAGE 551

Jimbob:

What is the soul?

At the second resurrection everyone that did not take part in the first resurrection, will be resurrected back to their flesh and blood bodies. The grave is the prison.

Ezekiel 38, Revelation 20:7-8

God Bless You!

Matthew 6:12,14,15, Mark 11:25,26, Luke 11:4, Psalms 37, Psalms 73:3-28,

Hopefully these are helpful too as we pray.

The Elect are ALL those whom God chose from before the foundation of the world to save and for whose sins Christ has paid in full; not only those from National Israel.

I do not understand how anyone can read the entire Bible and conclude that the Elect are only those of National Israel.

Ruby,

If you do a word study in the Bible, regarding the fig tree, you will find that the fig tree is a figure of national Israel.

In Matthew 24 the fig tree being in leaf is a reference to the nation of Israel, once again, becoming a sovereign nation among the nations of the world. But notice it is the fig tree in "leaf". Not the fig tree bearing "fruit". And since 1948 until the end of the church age, which I believe can be shown to be 1988, the nation of Israel is bearing no fruit. They do not recognize Christ as their Messiah. And never will.

Matthew 24 is all about the Great tribulation. Which is the time in which I believe we are living. And during this time, neither not the nation of Israel, nor the churches are bringing the true gospel. In fact, God's judgment is upon both national Israel, and the churches.

However, God is still saving his elect as the gospel goes forth from individual believers or ministries not associated with a church. And this will continue until Christ returns at the time of the resurrection and the rapture, and the beginning of the day of judgment.

I understand that this is a difficult pill to swallow for those that are in the churches today. But God's commandment in these days is to flee the churches, because the abomination of desolation is standing in what was the holy place, that is the churches.

Jimbob:

You have to come to TRUTH that YOU, sinful flesh DIED on the cross, YOU no longer exist, Christ; ONLY, the BODY of the spirit of our Father, was RAISED; BY INHERITANCE YOU, also became the BODY (MANKIND is that BODY) of the Spirit.

1 Timothy 6:16 Who ONLY hath IMMORTALITY, dwelling in the light, which NO MAN can approach unto ...

1 Corinthians 12:27 ....you are the body of Christ .....

Are YOU the TEMPLE OF GOD, or is the Lord God Almighty, and the Lamb the TEMPLE OF IT, and YOU become ONE by HIS RESURRECTION and Christ GAVE YOU an inheritance, by sharing the SAME BODY: Revelation 21:22?

Ephesians 4:4 .....ONE body .... ONE spirit .....

1 Corinthians 15:53 ...this mortal MUST put on IMMORTALITY (Christ ONLY hath immortality)

1 Corinthians 15:38 But God giveth it (the NEW creation) a BODY as it hath pleased him, and to every SEED his (the Father's) OWN BODY (Christ is the BODY of the FATHER).

God BlessYOU!

David:

Matthew 24, The fig tree in leaf: is speaking of the NEW ISRAEL, the born again, Christ is the TREE, we are the leaves, NOT national Israel.

PROPHECY:

Isaiah 6:13 But ye in it (the land) shall be a TENTH (the tithe to God, the FIRSTBORNE of the flock), and it (the Priest and Judges of the earth) SHALL RETURN, and shall be eaten; as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance is IN THEM (Christ IN YOU), when they cast their leaves: so the HOLY SEED (the word of God, Christ IN YOU) shall be the substance thereof.

Revelation 22:2 And in the midst of the street of it (new Jerusalem), and on either side of the river (of LIFE: Christ), was there the tree of LIFE (Christ), which bear twelve manner of fruit (new Israel), and yielded her fruit every month (continual rebirth into new Israel): and the LEAVES were for the HEALING OF THE NATIONS.

Isaiah 59:21 And this is my covenant with them (the firstborne), saith the Lord, MY SPIRIT (the SEED) that is poured out on THEE (Christ, the firstborne SEED, of many SEED), and my words which I PUT in your mouth, shall not depart out of your mouth, nor out of the mouth of THY SEED, or out of the mouth of THY SEED'S SEED, from henceforth and evermore.

The fruit of the TREE (CHRIST) is the children of Christ; and are HIS IMAGE, the NEW Israel.

God Bless YOU!

Jachin,

Luke wrote both Luke and Acts. They originally traveled together as Luke Volume 1 and Volume 2.

Ruby Lea Read When one dies the spirit goes to be with God who gave it, yes that is where the life is. The soul goes to the grave with the flesh, the body. Do you think the corruptible flesh will raise from the grave at the return of Christ, or will the soul raise to meet the spirit which will return with Christ? 1.Cor.15:42-44 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption. The word (incorruption) is #861; it means incorruptibility, unending existence, genuineness, immortality, incorruption, undecaying, immortal. ((Undecaying)) Flesh decays! (43. It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power. (44. It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. The flesh is the natural body. It is raised, (the dead in Christ rise first) a spiritual body, which is undecaying, it is immortal. I Believe that every Word of God is True. These verses go against what you are saying. Also 1 Cor,15:50 again says "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God,. . You say we are those clouds that Christ will appear in! Acts.1:9-11 we are told "this same Jesus which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. (A cloud received Him, so He will return in the clouds) Rev,:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so. Amen. Jesus Christ comes back IN THE CLOUDS to gather together His elect, (Mt.24:29-31) We are CAUGHT UP TO MEET HIM IN THE AIR, (1.Thes.4:17-18) We are CHANGED to spiritual bodies, (1 Cor.15:51-54) The flesh will not pop out of the graves, but the soul will. We must keep scripture in context for those puzzle pieces to fit together. Thanks for your reply Ruby.

Okay Jimbob,

You began this thread by ending your post with "Any thoughts, anybody?"

Well, I shared my thoughts and your first reply was to tell me I was wrong. And now you are implying that my eyes are blinded to the truth?

You say that none of us have all the answers and that is true. But why is it that if we disagree with each other, I am the one that's wrong, and I am the one who is blind to the truth?

How would you feel if I were to tell you that I would pray that God would open your eyes to the truth? So, we are in disagreement, and God has opened your eyes to the truth but blinded mine, and you feel the need to pray that He will open mine?

I do appreciate prayer, but in this case I don't see it as being necessary. It's not because I believe I am right and you are wrong. I just don't see a need for another believer to ask God to open my eyes to the truth of His word. That should be the responsibility of each and every believer before they approach God's word. It is the individual believer that should open up in prayer, prior to the study of God's word, by asking Him to open their own eyes to the truth.

I think we can both agree that this conversation is not going to change what either of us believe, so I don't have any more "thoughts" that I wish to share.

I will pass on that thank you. Not familiar with this individual. But Satan does not come with a red suit and a forked tail. Be very careful to whom you listenread the Bible instead!

2 Corinthians 11:13-15

For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Also, the Bible is not concerned with political nations of our day, with the possible exception of National Israel which did become a nation again in 1948 and is the "fig tree in leaf" of Matt 24. God uses various nations spoken of in the Bible as types and figures of the kingdom of God, the kingdom of Satan, the Churches and Congregations, and also True Believers, and those that are not true believers, depending on the context.

Again, God is speaking in parables using specific words and phrases to teach some aspect of the Gospel. Exe 38 is an exceptionally difficult passage and we need to compare scripture with scripture, praying to God for understanding. Also recognizing that there are truths that God is only reveling in our day that have been in the Bible all along but have been sealed up until we approach the end. (read Daniel). We should not be using political activity of our day as a basis to interpret scripture.

I do not profess to fully understand Eze 38. But I'm quite certain that it is not talking about any political nations of our day; it is likely addressing some aspect of God's salvation and judgement plan.

Who wrote the book of Acts

If you would spend as much time studying the Bible as you do watching you tube and other sources of man's teaching; you would come to TRUTH much quicker.

Please pray for my friend (David) and his family, he just lost a younger brother.

Thanks

Richard:

All of Daniel; as will as all other books, is a Prophecy of CHRIST, none of Daniel or other books is a prophecy of a single anti-christ.

Daniel 8:25 is speaking of Christ.

Daniel 8:23 And in the latter time of their kingdom (man's kingdom), when the transgressors are come to full, a king (Christ) of fierce countenance, and UNDERSTANDING DARK SENTENCES, shall stand up.

Psalms 778:2 I (Christ) will open my mouth in a parable: I (Christ) will utter DARK SAYINGS of old:

Psalms 49:4 I (Christ) will incline my ear to a parable: I (Christ) will open my DARK SAYINGS upon the harp (a symbol of man).

Proverbs 1:6 To UNDERSTAND a proverb, and the INTERPRETATION; the words of the wise (God's words); and their DARK SAYINGS.

God Bless YOU!

Please Lord open the doors of opportunity for Frank to be relieved of his financial circumstances and be brought in to opportunities to be a blessing to others I pray in the name of Jesus Christ.

Please consider reflecting on 1 Chronicles 4:9-10 and John 16:33/ John 14:14-17.

What clothes does the Bible say should women wear

If you really want to be on fire for Jesus Christ, listen on YouTube to "John Todd Illuminati" audio(tapes 1-6). He was a very high-ranking male witch into human sacrifice; he accepted Christ as Lord and Savior, then sought to expose the darkness. Some say later he backslid, but on these tapes (on these audio tracks) he is very pro-Christ.

Please pray for my fiance (Mythiah) and me (Gene Vincent). The enemy is coming for us and we have no idea what the attack looks like yet. The enemy is threatened by our union and we need a covering of prayer this week.

Jimbob:

I agree with GiGi; Christ was raised a body of flesh and bone, no longer needing blood to be the LIFE, but SPIRIT to be THE LIFE.

We will be given that same BODY,: at the death of this body, flesh and bone, and SPIRIT being the LIFE of that body.

We have to come to TRUTH, we exist NOW by that LIFE, we are just the BODY of that LIFE, and that LIFE is Christ.

WE DIED with Christ, we were RAISED with Christ, we just haven't gotten our NEW BODY yet.

This is a hard saying and most want agree with it, the multiplication of SEED, the word of God (Christ) is the SEED: Luke 8:11

Many are called, few find THE WAY.

John 14:6 I AM THE WAY and THE TRUTH and THE LIFE.

When Christ ascended into heaven he had a body, heaven is symbolic of MANKIND, Christ ascended into YOU and I, we are that BODY, the temple of God, the OLD was a shadow of the NEW, the CLOUD (God) was over and in the tabernacle, the CLOUD is now over and in the tabernacle (MANKIND, You and I and all others), Christ said he would appear in THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN, we are those clouds of heaven, Christ said his words are HIDDEN in symbols and PARABLES.

Just as you said: a puzzle within a puzzle.

God Bless YOU!

Are you in balance? Being in balance requires the understanding and the signigance of the law. Paul says the law is a schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ. A balancing of the human nature, and the redemption that we have through faith in the death and resurection of Christ!

This is, perhaps why God chose Paul, He had a tremendous understanding of the law, but saw only one side of it while He torchered and killed believeing children of God!

It would be His sight restored, seeing Jesus in His true Light , that He would be stood up, and begin His ministry!

Satan has been thwarted {thrown off Balance} in His desire to decieve man.

While alive in this body, we may or may not be subject unto the laws of God. It is a freedom that we have. If we are not subjected unto the law, then Christ could not serve us, for we would have no need for His redemption! If we are subject unto the law, our new balance will be found in the death and ressurection of Christ. No longer subjected unto the law, but clothed in the righteousness of Christ!

This was Gods plan from the beginning! This inherited righteousness will keep Satan and all His works off balance. While we live and move in this body, covered in the blessedness of the savior, satan will never predict our next move!

Satan's last chance , trying once again until before His final demise into hell for eternity!

Repent and be Baptized

Chris The mystery Paul taught about in 1 Cor.15:51, it says "Behold, I shew you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed. The mystery is that ((we are all changed)). That mystery has nothing to do with a pre-tribulation rapture. The great tribulation period is the time of the antichrist, the mark of the beast will be during this time period and it will be a time of great testing of one's faith. The tribulation? Acts.14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that ((we must through much tribulation)) enter into the kingdom of God. Paul said in 1.Thes.3:3-4 That no man should be moved by these afflictions: for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto. (4. For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know. The words (afflictions) and (tribulation) have the same meaning #2347; they mean pressure, afflicted (-tion) anguish, burdened, persecution, trouble. In v4 Paul says we are ((appointed)) to suffer afflictions, which is tribulation! The wrath of God? 1 Thes.5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. True Believers are not going to face the wrath of God, they will be caught up to meet the Lord Jesus Christ in the air, in the clouds. Jn.3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. God pours out His wrath on the disobedient non-believers left on the earth when True Believers are caught up to meet Jesus in the clouds. Eph.5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh ((the wrath of God on the children of disobedience)). Col.3:6 For which things sake ((the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience)). While Believers are at the marriage supper of the Lamb, the wrath of God is being poured out on those left on the earth.

We must remember that Christ spoke in parables and without a parable spoke He not. And Christ is the WORD of God. Much of the language in the Bible is parabolic language teaching some spiritual truth. That includes language describing actual historical events as well as future prophecies. I think that is the case here.

Psalm 83

Psalm 83 is referred to by some as a prophetic war among 10 nations that may occur at the very start of the Tribulation. Careful analysis doesn't indicate any of the outer nations which are in the Ezekiel 38 war from Israel as a center. Technically; there is no mention of an offensive battle strategy either. We certainly can see the attitude of many of the nations who have attempted to wipe out Israel since its inception in 1948; specifically as verse 4 indicates removing them as a nation. This would also differentiate the economic incentives in Ezekiel 38 for the move which signifies a plunder; and also we note at that time Israel is said to have unwalled villages ( Ezekiel 38:11). Verse 12 is perhaps the clearest indication for these nations who have the Dome of the Rock as a focal point of contention to get ownership.

The names that are listed are surrounding areas; of which I will not elaborate on here. It does seem that the end of the Psalm shows that the Lord will be known after the event as is the same concept with the Ezekiel 38 destruction. Overall; the whole thing may be different campaigns in the whole scope of world war that leads to Armageddon. We need to keep in mind that there will be certain things which Antichrist uses to galvanize nations; and initially he will form alliances that will start to fight each other; and in the end of course will turn to fight against Christ himself; as well as turning on themselves. This is all of course in God's hands and he will accomplish His purposes.

The crafty counsel in verse 3 reminds us of Daniel 8:25 as to the policy of "craft" that the Antichrist uses; and indeed it is likely that these confederate of nations (v. 5) will be involved in that with both "dividing the land for gain" with economic incentives ( Daniel 11:39) as well as the involvement in the occult whith Antichrist practices ( Dan. 8:23) which could perhaps be one of the mystical forms of Islam or New Age religion.

please pray for me and my family today

who is pagani peopl?

who is told joshua sent two man home of Ahab?

question

who is angel follwing israel was in desert?

2. who is told you?

3.who is Judah?

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The apostle revealed to the Corinthians a Mystery (that which was unknown to men before - now revealed: 1 Corinthians 15:51). As was the mystery in Romans 11:25 (that Israel's blindness in part was for the fullness of the Gentiles salvation); in Ephesians 1:9,10 (God's Will that He would bring together to be one, all who are in Christ); Ephesians 5:32 (as husband & wife are one flesh, so is the union of Christ & His Church); Colossians 1:26,27; & many other examples. All indicating that what was revealed to the Corinthians in 1 Corinthians 15:51 was unknown before, which Paul was revealing now: that the believer's death was not a requirement for the resurrection (which was once believed), but that those who are alive at Jesus' Coming will also rise with the dead, to be with Him.

The one in Christ won't face the Wrath of God that was meant for those who spurned His Love shown in Christ, and that both those who have died in Christ & are alive in Him will together be taken away, it seems clear that the Rapture must happen before the Great Tribulation. But if one believes that the Great Tribulation is not God's Anger poured out, then it could well be believed that Christians living at that time will suffer (or, in some way protected) from the devastation that is to take place. If I take the Scriptures together, I cannot subscribe to a post-tribulation Rapture.

Page 1.

Thanks Jimbob for sharing what you did, and yes, I do believe in a pre-trib Rapture. I would ascertain from your comments that you too believe that there will be a 'catching away', a rapture if you will, but you find it taking place after the (Great) Tribulation ( Matthew 24:21) from the verses you cited in the same chapter.

If I had only this discourse in Matthew to go on, then I could well agree with you, as it clearly shows the sequence of events in answer to the disciples questions (with an emphasis on the tribulation the Jews would go through when Rome ransacked Jerusalem in 70 AD). The matters that indicate to me that the rapture & the second coming of Jesus are two events, are found in the meaning of the 'Great Tribulation & the Mystery'.

The Great Tribulation does not only mean that Israel, & by extension the world, will suffer greatly ("as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, nor ever shall be"), but the reason for it is because of the great Judgement of God against sinful men at the Day of the Lord. Just as what happened to the world in Noah's day, & to Sodom & Gomorrah, so God's Anger will also be poured out at His appointed time. And yet, His people 'are not appointed to His Wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ'; Paul had just finished writing about the Rapture in the previous chapter ( 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 & wrote this in 1 Thessalonians 5:9). The Great Tribulation (of God's Wrath) is judgement against unbelievers - the believers' sins were judged at the Cross & those in Christ are declared "not guilty", or 'justified'. Should we then be judged again? For what purpose?