It has been tried tested and proved in the fires of great trials and tests and proved to be strong enough to withstand all the forces of hell bent on destroying it and flexible enough to rule and govern an empires covering a 1/3 of the globe .
Therevis but one part still needed to ' perfect it" or make it completed . Parliament needs to learn what Kings of zEngland had to learn that european rulers never learnt teligious and political . That she cannot do what Kings of a England cannot do nor hope to achieve what they fought a Kingnof over.
She can learn it in peace at the point of a sword or in bloodshed . But learn she must and learn she will . For a Parliament is less than a King and if a King of England was not able nor tyen a Parliament .
For the truth is not democratic nor is it a tyrant but it does have fits own imperative .
Democracy has a fatal flaw in it and a hidden snar to the unwary . It's the idea that if you can get a majority by any means fair or foul get a good grip on the legislative process and keep it . You can delude yourself into thinking the truth is whatever your ' majority' says it is and you can impise yiyr very subjective opinions on everybody else by your corriot and perverted laws .
You cannot establish a lie you can on,y impisebit .First by corrupt and perverted law and when that does not work by tyranny and oppression .
I can see God working in this nations Constitution for "He can take those things that are not and bring to nought those things that are "
It has been said ' They who forget history are doomed to repeat it ' I'll extend the thought . If history has to repeat itself because of lessons not learnt it is never exactly as before but it is always worse than the last time .
Great Britain beyond all dispute has enjoyed more liberty in law religion and politic progresively and for longer than any other nation on earth . It has on at least 4 major occasions bern the bulwark against every rising autocratic dictatorial tyrants religious and political that has ever arisen in Europe and by the grace of God defeated each in their turn first alone then with others .
Despite our many sins some very great despite our many failures too many to mention we must have got something right . ThatvEurope never has and it wouid be profitable to any to stop and consider why these islands on the edge of the western world have enjoyed so much liberty and Europe so little and the world then as now even less and worse .
'If we don't study and consider history we lose a great deal expecialy if we don't recognise Gods workings and yes God works in all history and among all nations but not always the same.
Moreover the Bible is as much as an historical record of the children of Isreal as it is a revelation of God for how else can we know Him who is the same yesterday today and forever? For if we know Him who worked in the past we can be encouraged that given the same conditions He is the same today.
This nations liberties have deep foundations but were not established till much later . ' Democracy has its limitations and we are not a democracy though many assert otherwise for their own reasons.
The Constitution was not written by men nor on partchment but on the indelible history of this nation . It cannot be unwritten or undone and those who think otherwise often pay a terrible price for doing so.
Biology does not transfer a fallen nature " The body is dead because of sin "
The fallen nature is spiritual not biological . The body dies because it is cut off at its roots from God .
The heart of man is desperately wicked deceitful above all else and who can know it " Is not the biological heart that pumps blood around the body but the ' main spring ' of a persons ' life' .
In truth though we say ' we give our life to Christ " we actually don't. We give our death and He gives us His life .
Outside of Christ we live in the flesh the body and function in the realm of this body and physical realm .
Seeing tasting touching reasoning perceiving only the " outward appearance "
We are more homeless than the homeless . Lost .
When we are truly born again the " old man" is crucified with Christ and buried with Christ " and we by the grace of God "become partakers of His nature"
" For the body is dead because of sin ,but if the same Spirit dwells in us thst raised up Jesus from the dead ,He shall quicken our mortal bodies".
Paul was praying for us Christian's in Ephesians that " the eyes of our understanding msy be opened thst we might see and comprehend what is the exceeding greatness of His power that is towards us who believe that raises Christ Jesus from the dead "
He himself said he wanted to know (more) the power of his resurrection" you can't know the power of a resurrection unless you are dead! But in this also he wrote " that I might be made conformable to his death" Clearly there is much more to " His death" than we realise but as the cross and His death is so little preached on is it any wonder?
For having reduced the gospel to being just BORN again there is very little exposition on anything else that will produce growth and development of the Christian .
" Little children "Praise the Lord!But what of " young men" ye have overcome the wicked one " Now there is a message I'd ,Ike to hear! But it goes onto maturity " Ye fathers..
Thanks for sharing your perspective on this subject and now I know more of your upbringing.
I think in every believer's life there are specific things and practices that remind us of spiritual truths. These things I have mentioned do just that.
In reading the OT God instituted many practices and utilized objects within the tabernacle that were reminders of truths to the Israelites. I think of the golden lampstand, the table with show bread on it, the mercy seat, the priestly garments, etc. that reminded them of God's holiness and also pointed forward to Jesus so that the Jews of His day and all who read the New Testament, especially the book of Hebrews, can come to understand how these objects and practices were a foreshadowing of Who the Messiah is and what He will do/did.
And at the Last Supper, Jesus used bread and wine to symbolize the New Covenant that advented with His death and resurrection. Whenever we celebrate the Lord's Supper we commemorate this covenant and remember His saving work for us.
Just wanted to share this with everyone here as well as those who hear about this site.
I only have been here a few years. The reason that I joined this group is because of the genuine spirit of Christ Jesus I enjoyed as I read the comments discussing God and God's SON
and His Spirit that dwells in mankind. Do we still share that SPIRIT?
I am glad I was raised from a child to believe in Jesus.
I am glad he was born.
I am glad he saved me.
I am glad a day has been set aside to celebrate His Birth.
I am glad to honor God, the Father,
for giving his son's life for me.
I am not ashamed to say so. "Let the redeemed of the Lord so."
From the way I hear the discussion going is this way. Some are celebrating because of a personal relationship. Some according to traditions. Some for other reasons also. Let us be careful to not confuse the Spiritual with the Carnal. " We worship God in Spirit and TRUTH." The World has a different concept.
It seems like the question is this.
Do you think he deserves to be celebrated at all?
I'm trying to
"see" with my eyes.
"Hear" with my ears and "understand" with my heart,
"Let the words
of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in thy sight oh Lord, my strength and my redeemer."
We are at Rev. 1:5, which is the center of the Verse 4, 5, 6 series. Here is the verse in its chiasmus form:
a) And from Jesus Christ,
...b) who is the faithful witness,
......c) and the first begotten of the dead,
.........d) and the prince of the kings of the earth.
......c) Unto him that loved us,
...b) and washed us from our sins
a) in his own blood,
Previously, I explained that chiasmi read from left to right to the center, and then right to left to the end. But, they also read from top to bottom in the series, a, b, c, d, etc.
And it is that center which is the focus of the chiasmus. It follows that the center and focus of Rev. 1:5 is that Jesus is the prince of the kings of the earth.
There is much more to this verse. Especially, where the first verse of this series, Rev. 1:4, references a connection coming from the hereafter chapter, Chapter Four. But it is that center which highlights the metaphorical phrase "kings of the earth."
And that these "kings of the earth" are in that position "unto him that loved us." That is, they are kings unto their King, Lord Jesus ( Rev. 17:14), who loved them and washed them from their sins in his blood.
Rev. 1:5 is powerful and well deserving of holding the central position in the 3, 4, 5 series. The highlight of which is that the Savior is the prince (King) over "the kings of the earth." A metaphorical phrase used throughout The Book of Revelation to reference the Savior's servants.
-- Jas 3:10-11 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be. 11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
I have judged no one; i have set before you all something that each must judge for himself. the saints (those that believe jesus was the virgin-born son of god, that he died for the sins of the world, was buried, and rose again the third day) are to judge all things by god's word. i have thus judged xmas.
-- 1co 2:15 but he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
- 1co 6:3 know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?-
-- 1co 6:2 do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
-- 1co 6:5 i speak to your shame. is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
-- 1co 5:3 for i verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though i were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
-- 1co 14:29 let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
-- luk 12:57 yea, and why even of yourselves judge ye not what is right?
-- mat 7:1-2 judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 for with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
---- joh 7:24 judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
judge righteously and you will be righteously judged.
-- 1co 11:31 for if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
-- 1co 10:15 i speak as to wise men; judge ye what i say.
judge what i say, but judge it according to and by god's word.
"And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in my wrath I smote thee, but in my favour have I had mercy on thee. Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought." Isaiah 60:10-11
Thank you Gigi for sharing your thoughts on this subject. From what I glean from it, your observance of this season, setting up a tree, etc., stems from a long-standing practise, even from your childhood. So, I can understand why it would seem natural and proper to continue the tradition in remembrance of our Lord.
So, your perspective would be different to mine, in that I had no such upbringing, where the traditions of a decorated tree, Father Christmas, gifts, etc. were totally absent. This was largely due to our strict Christian Brethren upbringing, one of the branches of Christianity that does not hold to observance of such events. So, I guess it would stand to reason that our understanding from the Scriptures, of history, and what is appropriate Christian application would vary, sometimes a great deal. Some might say, that I have softened in my understanding and acceptance of those who do celebrate the season; but I would think that that 'softening' is more to do with learning how God's Word specifically directs us to understand & apply matters that are not disclosed to us in the Word. Or, as one aged pastor often said, "Let us major on the majors and minor on the minors", as far enforcing teaching or being critical of others.
Anyway, I hope your family will enjoy a precious time together, which might even be a catalyst for a spiritual awakening or renewal for those not truly embracing our Lord in their lives. Blessings.
Dpaulw. I believe that Jeremiah 10:1-5 does speak about idolatry, which indicates that they worshiped the work of their hands. The idolaters deck out their tree with silver and gold, but verse 5 tells us that these trees cannot speak, must be carried & cannot move; neither can they do good or evil. Why would a tree be set up and decorated and then the prophet speaks about the inabilities of the tree? Simply because the idol (the tree) is set up for a purpose - an idol to be worshiped - all of man's doing. We also get information on this type of behavior in Psalms 115:4-8 and Isaiah 44:13-17. What we read in these verses do not describe those who set up a Xmas tree; i.e. this tree is not idolized nor worshiped.
Their origins might appear dubious, and the reasons or need for such a tree to remember our Lord's Birth mystifying, but can one truly find any Scripture to show such an act as sinful? As mentioned earlier, I don't recognize or celebrate Xmas (or Easter) as I don't see any biblical warrant to do so, and participating at the Lord's Table is sufficient for me for a corporate remembrance of His Coming & Work of Salvation. Yet, for those who do recognize the day, I do not find any biblical authority to condemn them and they will have to judge for themselves the correct understanding and practise of this occasion. As well, I don't believe that Romans 12:2 and 2 Corinthians 6:17 can be applied here. What was in the apostle's mind seems to be of greater import than a Xmas tree being set up.
We are at Rev. 1:4, which begins the formal introduction and greetings to the seven churches. In fact, this is the first verse in a series of three verses (4, 5, and 6).
Let's say that a chiasmus has three main parts. The first part is the leg that reads from left to right to the center, and I call this leg the thesis. The second part is the center. And the third part is the leg that goes from the center, reading from right to left to the end, and I call this leg the antithesis. Thus, Verse 1:4 is the thesis, Verse 1:5 is the center, and Verse 1:6 is the antithesis, as follows:
Rev. 1:4, the thesis of this three-verse series
..... Rev. 1:5, the center of the three-verse series
Rev. 1:6, the antithesis of the three-verse series
Next, we look at Rev. 1:4 in chiasmus form.
a) John to the seven churches which are in Asia:
.....b) Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come;
a) and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
This verse is complex, and rather than explaining it, let's just say that it continues from Rev. 1:3 and comes from Rev. 4:5.
It seems that many church leaders at that time in history thought that many holy persons were conceived and died on the same day of the year only years apart. This was Hippolytus' thinking. If there was a tradition that came from Mary as to the date of Jesus birth, that may have played into this, too. But I am not aware of anything that was recorded of Mary's contribution to the knowledge concerning Jesus' birth day, childhood, etc. I would think that there was most likely an oral tradition known by the apostles and disciples in those early times.
We do have Mary's contribution to the Gospel writers Luke and Matthew as each of these begin with the annunciation and birth of Jesus. Regardless of whether Hippolytus was correct or not in setting Dec. 25 as Jesus' birth day, His birth is worthy of being celebrated and we have no prohibition in Scripture to not celebrate it. It does seem that historically the pagan celebrations in December came later than what Hippolytus introduced as the day of Jesus' birth.
With all this said, I do know that Paul instructs us to utilize the liberty we have in Christ whether to celebrate certain holy days, events, etc. or not to do so. He says each believer is to act according to their own conscience which the Holy Spirit renews in believers, and not let our exercise of Christian liberty bring another believer to stumble. These directives from Paul in Scripture should be our guide in matters such as this topic of celebrating Jesus' birth. Let us all be charitable with one another as we each allow the Holy Spirit to work His will in us.
And to end this, I will say that I wish everyone here a very blessed and joyful celebration of the coming of Jesus' as a babe and the astounding truth that at His birth He was "God with us" and will always be "God with us."
Just as God was faithful to fulfill His promises and prophecies concerning Jesus in His first advent, we can be sure He will fulfill all of His promises and prophecies concerning His future second advent to bring all things to completion and eternal fulfillment. Whereas those who lived before Jesus' first advent and were waiting for the Messiah to arrive, we, who live after His first coming, await His second advent with enlightened by the good news we find in the Scriptures and are filled with hope that He will do just as He said He would do and we are know how we can prepare ourselves to be ready for His return. Those in the Old Testament did not have these helps. We are very blessed to live after Jesus' birth, life, death and resurrection. We today have the witness of all of those who have gone before us who kept the faith in severe trials, tribulations, deprivation, and even martyrdom to teach us to persevere in faith until the end.
So, yes, I celebrate Christmas. I was reading up on the history of the celebration of Jesus' birth in the Church. Although many people seem to think that Christmas is based on pagan rituals of the 4th century, the reality is that the church did have Mary wit them in the 1st century to inform the apostles of Jesus' birth and childhood and the miracles associated with Him. Hippolytus, I believe, lived in the 2nd century into 3rd. In the the 220's Hippolytus taught that Jesus' birthday was December 25th based on Scripture and historical data he had at the time. This was not based on the celebration of Sol Invictus, or Saturnalia as these festivals were not celebrated in the Roman world at this early time. Therefore, it seems that the date of December 25th was calculated on the known fact that Jesus was killed on March 25th and Hippolytus believed that Jesus was most likely conceived at this time of year 30 or so years earlier and was born 9 months later, near December 25th.
These Israelites were in the dark as much as the Gentiles. All the nations were covered in darkness and even when Jesus arrived and brought the light of life into the world, many drew back from His light preferring the darkness of sin to the exposure of their sin to lead them to desire salvation. I think it is very hard for us to truly imagine what the world was like then with all the generations of man going back to Adam and Eve, and at the time of the flood, and after the flood when those who followed God did so because God called them (Noah, Enoch, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, the prophets). The rest of humanity was turned away from God completely.
Ever since Jesus was born, lived, died and rose for us, the light that comes from God, that is spiritually rather than physically, has shone out into this sin ravaged, sin enslaved world transforming the elect one by one through the work of the Holy Spirit in regenerating, giving the us the ability to believe and the desire to believe in Jesus as we hear the Gospel truth. All these 20 centuries since Jesus' birth, the world has been enlightened by the truth and hope of the Gospel ever-increasingly to the point that at this time we probably live in the most Christianized humanity of all the prior centuries combined. The impact of the believing Church in our own microcosm of our family and friends, community, city and out into the macrocosm of the entire world.
I was thinking about the wisdom of God's choice to elect before all time every person He would bring to faith. These elect are from every tribe, tongue, people, and nation in all generations. How important it is to spread the Good News of the coming of our Savior and King so that we can reach every one of our brothers and sisters to-be.
I come from a tradition that celebrates advent season which not only focuses on the birth of Jesus in His first advent, but looks forward to His second advent at the end of this age. see Pt. 4
He knew ALL that would happen to Himself ahead of time (since before creation). He knew all that would be said to Him, about Him, and all the actions that would be taken against Him. He knew that death would be so very painful and that taking upon Himself the wrath of God for us when He took our sins upon Himself. But knowing all of this, He steadfastly stepped out of the garden knowing He would be arrested right away and then the sequence of events leading to His death was began in real time.
The gold and silver ornaments remind of how worthy He is above all that is considered physically precious and valuable in this world to receive all glory honor and praise. These also remind me that He is my treasure in this life and in the life to come and that He has laid up an incorruptible inheritance for me in heaven that will be above and beyond what I could ever ask for or imagine.
Last week as I was listening to Christmas hymns and songs on the radio as I was traveling I was rejoicing that so many who have not yet come to Jesus in faith will hear the gospel truths in these songs and hear the singers praising the Lord over and over again. How wonderful is that? I love singing these songs and worshipping the Lord through them. They are a great unifier of believers in the church.
And at that time I also thought about what the world was like prior to His birth. It was dark with evil and the shroud of sin that blinded all the nations to the glory and promise of God. Even the Jews were on the whole not right with God. There were a few who were ready and looking for the Messiah, knowing the promises and prophecies that pointed them to their lifetime for the Messiah to come into the world to bring salvation. I think of Mary and Joseph, their parents, Elizabeth and Zechariah, John the Baptist, Anna and Simeon in the temple. I am sure there were many others in Judea. But the other tribes of Israel were estranged from God, having been scattered among the nations.
Just wanted to chime in on the discussion on Christmas,
I agree with T-Rex, that Christmas offers and excellent window for the truth of Jesus' miraculous birth and His incarnation into humanity. His birth is the most important, glorious, world changing, profound birthday of all history. His birth is the fulfillment of God's promises and prophecies given in the Old Testament since Adam and Eve sinned. I love to celebrate Him at this time of year and the marvel of His birth.
I can remember way back to when I was very young how much I loved Christmas mostly because it tells of Jesus. I remember the readings of His birth in Luke and Matthew in church every year at Christmas. I remember the church bells ringing throughout the day reminding us of the joy of His birth. I remember re-enacting the Nativity with my siblings that we performed for our grandparents each year. My childhood was steeped in focusing on Jesus for the Christmas (Advent) season every year.
Not every Christian abandons the proclamation and celebration of the birth of our Savior at Christmas. My husband and I made a conscious effort every year to steep our sons in the Scriptural truth of "God with us" in Jesus. We downplayed all the trappings without eliminating all of it. We tried to make the time a time of celebration for our family. We do have a tree and my sons still come over to pick one out and decorate it. The tree has so much meaning for me. It is not an idol by any means. I do not bow down to it or worship it or think of it as any type of 'god".
But it reminds me of so many aspects of Jesus. The evergreen reminds me of eternal life we receive from Jesus. The lights remind me of how Jesus is the light of the world that shown into a dark, dark world filled with sin and despair. I have red glass ornaments in the shape of a teardrop and these remind me of the blood Jesus shed for me and the drops of blood He sweat in Gethsemane when He was facing the crucifixion. see Pt. 2
I did want to come back and state that some things are good about Christmas even with all the aforementioned issues.
It is sad that Charles Shultz the originator of cartoons depicting Christ later on became a humanist (his most memorable scene was Linus dropping his security blanket when he read the scriptures about Christ's birth realizing it brought comfort beyond this world). There are some rather generic movies about Christmas; either classic or new versions which at least mention the Scriptures on the birth of Christ.
My point is that in some ways this is the most difficult time of year to get a clear Gospel message through when there are family expectations; obligations and overall distractions. The kids are home from school and of course are conditioned to expect some material item for Christmas; while adults often in limbo vacillating between asking not to receive anything to promote some sort of humility and giving something out a sense of obligation. Maybe that's just my experience...
It would seem that someone going to a church service who currently is a family member that is a nonbeliever would have less chance than a normal Sunday to hear a message of conviction; and the usual narrative of Christ's birth although it sometimes is prefaced or followed by a brief mention of His atoning sacrifice usually is comfortably predictable for those who come on this rare once a year occasion (perhaps coming back Easter).
I certainly don't want to be too much of a downer here. Even if I don't feel the need to celebrate in this manner; I want to be thankful for any gifts and pray that I send cards to those He would have me send them to as well as some extra money for those He would have me support as a common courtesy. That being said; I often do things other times of the year in that regard when these funds tend to be depleted.
In conclusion; if He comes to take us out before year's end I won't complain even if it ruins someone's plans.
...b) and they that hear the words of this prophecy,
...b) and keep those things which are written therein:
a) for the time is at hand.
In this chiasmus, the central feature "b" has two parts. 1) That those who hear the prophecy, 2) have the option to keep those things written therein. Naturally, those who do not keep the things written in the prophecy are not blessed by the prophecy.
So, Verse 1:3 is a simple affirmation for those who intend to keep the prophecy. And of course, the prophecy is the revelation. So it is a matter of necessity that the hearer of the prophecy hear the prophecy. Or rather, the hearer of the revelation hear the revelation.
In the Savior's testimony, he states, "Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book ( Rev. 22:7).
Again, it follows that the blessing of The Book of Revelation comes from keeping the sayings of the prophecy. And to do that, the individual must know the saying of the prophecy. That is, the individual must know the sayings of The Book of Revelation, and keep them.
It is through keeping the prophecy that the blessing comes. These sayings are given in the seven seals that are repeated throughout the book. That is, the seven seals are the prophecy. To know the seven seals is to know the prophecy.
Again, the seven seals, which are the prophecy, are repeated throughout the book, and that is the revelation, and vice versa.
Shall we continue? Previously, I explained Verse 1:1, and now we go to Verse 1:2.
It is in Rev. 1:2 that John explains that he wrote The Gospel According to John. Here is verse 1:2 in chiasmus form:
Who bare record of the word of God,
.....and of the testimony of Jesus Christ,
and of all things that he saw.
The verse structure reveals:
The Word of God, John 1:1-5
.....The Testimony of Jesus Christ, John 21:21-24
Everything between Verses 1:1-5 and Verses 21:21-24
The "testimony of Jesus Christ" is a phrase which is used metaphorically twice in The Book of Revelation, as I recall; once at Rev. 1:9, and secondly at Rev. 19:10. Also, the Savior's literal testimony for The Book of Revelation is stated in the last chapter at Rev. 22:7-20.
So the phrase has both the metaphorical and literal applications.
Additonally, Rev. 1:2 not only establishes the structure of The Gospel According to John, but also that of The Book of Revelation, as follows:
Chapter One shows The Word of God in the vision of the Savior at Rev. 1:12-17
.....Chapter Twenty-Two shows The Testimony of Jesus Christ in Rev. 22:7-20
And Chapters Two through Twenty-One shows all the things that John saw.
Thank you for your comment, and I will try to explain my interpretation more carefully.
In the introduction of The Book of Revelation, the Father gave the revelation to Jesus as stated in Rev. 1:1.
In the storyline of The Book of Revelation, the Father gave the book with the seven seals attached, to the Savior in Rev. 5:7.
The Father giving the revelation to Jesus ( Rev. 1:1) and the Father giving the book with the seven seals attached to Jesus ( Rev. 5:7) are the same event.
In the first case, the event is summarized in the "thesis of the book". And in the second case, the event is stated in the "first storyline" that I call the seals storyline.
Secondly, as stated in the thesis of the book, Chapter One, the Savior gave the revelation to the angel to show to John ( Rev. 1:1).
Next, in the first storyline of the book, John begins to view the seven seals at Rev. 6:1-2, where he views the first seal. Since the angel is tasked with showing John the revelation ( Rev. 1:1), and the beast shows the first seal to John ( Rev. 6:1-2), then the angel is called the beast in Rev. 6:1.
Since the first event is, that the Father gives power and authority to Jesus over the book and the seven seals ( Rev. 5:7). And, the seals were opened before this event in Rev. 5:5. Then, the opening of the seals is included in the revelation that is the seals. Therefore, the first event of the seven seals is the Father giving power and authority to Jesus as metaphorically shown in Rev. 6:2, where the Savior rides upon the power and authority of the Father.
I realize that this is not a traditional interpretation of The Book of Revelation, but it is correct.
Christmas has Christ literally in the holiday name and it's the only Christian holiday but a few seem so upset about it. Conflating Jesus's birth with negative stuff you watch on TV while assuming that's everyone's experience is a false assumption. Assuming it is one hundred percent bad for everyone in all aspects is a fallacy. People are singing songs and worshipping Jesus in a rare moment around the world and you seem focused on the bad instead of the good. Isn't that role like the Grinch or Scrooge character in one of those movies. Some want to take what little celebration we have about Jesus away and hidden, but is that truly what Jesus would do? No. Remember how Judas complained about the woman wasting the perfume on Jesus's feet and Jesus's response? Jesus did other radical things too like dining at a 'sinners' house while people in the same manner made negative accusations about it. These are related and the cynical Pharisee mindset is related.
Maybe where you live one of your neighbors is bad and did bad things so should you burn your house down and denounce that neighborhood, city, or country, because bad things were done. Then people can say things like your neighborhood never was good and you can't put good back into such an evil house or negative place. Evil sins probably even occurred where you live so how can it ever be safe to live there ever again.
Jeremiah does not say they were worshiping the tree, just putting it up constituted that fact. It is not what we think we are doing, but what God does. Being ignorant of the reason or meaning of is no excuse for not obeying the Scriptures.
The saints are directed to be of one mind. Hence, those who observe Xmas need to stop, or those who do not need to start. Which has the more evidence on their side? God must be worship in spirit and truth; do you celebrate Xmas because it is the truth, that you are willfully ignorant of the truth, or that you are lukewarm and do not care if it is the truth or not?
If it is cultural, we are in sin for following a sinful culture. Rom 12:2.
.-- 2Co 6:17 Wherefore COME OUT FROM AMONG THEM, AND BE YE SEPARATE, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,understand your position. God gave us the Bible to help and direct us; if we do not listen to that, we are disregarding Him.
It is the word of God that we submit to or neglect that shall judge us.
-- 2Co 10:5 ... bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
What each saint does is between them and God, I merely obey my induction as an elder to feed the flock, 1Pet 5:1-3. Following the crowd will not be an excuse at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
Proverbs 1:7 "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction."
Exodus 20:10 "But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates"
John 14:21"He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him."
John 15:10 "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Fathers commandments, and abide in his love."
Matthew 19:17 "And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments."
"For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it."
The most obvious logic error made in regard to the season celebrating Christ's birth of course is the fact that He ever more lives in heaven and is coming again to judge the earth. This fact is acknowledged by some but certainly not embraced-as we see in regard to attitudes about Him coming (especially if that were to wreck our holiday plans).
We can read passages like Psalm 8:2 describing children having great power in the Kingdom and certainly the Lord Himself shows victory over His enemies.
Should we take a frank investigation of the narrative of the Gospels regarding Christ's appearance on earth we see the persecution prophesied of ( Matthew 2:18 referring to Jeremiah 31 on the persecution of Herod). This shows the extermination of all the males under two in a fanatical attempt inspired no doubt from Satan to eliminate the One who would bring defeat to the enemy of our souls. We can extend this further to the event when Christ was 12 and "talked back" to his parents; as well as other things that rock our world with someone we assume came to bring peace without a price. Indeed He IS the Prince of Peace but also warned that He didn't come specifically and only for that reason ( Matt. 10:34).
Of course in terms of rife materialism we see that Christ chose to live as what we would call a nomadic existence and called for the same of His Disciples. We CAN say that the wise men sent expensive gifts and this no doubt was due to the worship due to the King which His own people by and large failed to grasp.
In general things are rapidly accelerating on the world scene to the stage set in Daniel and Revelation for the final 10 Kings in the Beast system. The earth trembles in ever increasing earthquakes and violence of war and other disputes. May our hearts not be divided between love for this world and treasures in heaven we are to seek above anything else.
Let us redeem the time because the days are evil; and testify the reason for the season.
I have changed my profile slightly as I don't see a need for my last name on this site.
Seeing the latest postings regarding Christmas; and figuring this could be the last season we celebrate this before the return of Christ at the Rapture (if He doesn't come beforehand) I thought I would expound on some thoughts related to this time of year.
It has been mentioned the Christmas that society tolerates; which involves songs that are familiar to some that are at times related to the birth of our Savior such as Silent Night (and all the modern newfangled renditions). Now as to proper beliefs no doubt the concept of a tender child born in humble circumstances appeals to the humanist and those of other "faith traditions" as well. As to being God in the flesh which is clearly indicated in the Gospel in Luke 2:11 and stemming back to prophecy from the book of Isaiah it ain't so much embraced (not sure how many professing believers themselves believe that these days).
Perhaps a more subtle but most prescient issue related to all the decorations and holiday "cheer" is the materialism that has pervaded our culture in particular really for the last century. As bad as the bratty kids we have trained to expect "things" to magically appear by delivery from some questionable fat bearded old man down the chimney or some other innovate technique we have the lingering faux image of the whole period of time of family gathering together where women get a power trip from their kitchen creations and endless "bargains" where they can save a few bucks and family often sees other members who they don't deal with the rest of the year; etc. Men of course can get into grandiose descriptions of the latest power tool they bought or whatever sports teams are on TV.
When "good deeds" are done of course it can assuage a guilty conscience temporarily with this sort of Santa Claus mentality for adults; such as volunteering in a soup kitchen.
It has been tried tested and proved in the fires of great trials and tests and proved to be strong enough to withstand all the forces of hell bent on destroying it and flexible enough to rule and govern an empires covering a 1/3 of the globe .
Therevis but one part still needed to ' perfect it" or make it completed . Parliament needs to learn what Kings of zEngland had to learn that european rulers never learnt teligious and political . That she cannot do what Kings of a England cannot do nor hope to achieve what they fought a Kingnof over.
She can learn it in peace at the point of a sword or in bloodshed . But learn she must and learn she will . For a Parliament is less than a King and if a King of England was not able nor tyen a Parliament .
For the truth is not democratic nor is it a tyrant but it does have fits own imperative .
Democracy has a fatal flaw in it and a hidden snar to the unwary . It's the idea that if you can get a majority by any means fair or foul get a good grip on the legislative process and keep it . You can delude yourself into thinking the truth is whatever your ' majority' says it is and you can impise yiyr very subjective opinions on everybody else by your corriot and perverted laws .
You cannot establish a lie you can on,y impisebit .First by corrupt and perverted law and when that does not work by tyranny and oppression .
I can see God working in this nations Constitution for "He can take those things that are not and bring to nought those things that are "
Great Britain beyond all dispute has enjoyed more liberty in law religion and politic progresively and for longer than any other nation on earth . It has on at least 4 major occasions bern the bulwark against every rising autocratic dictatorial tyrants religious and political that has ever arisen in Europe and by the grace of God defeated each in their turn first alone then with others .
Despite our many sins some very great despite our many failures too many to mention we must have got something right . ThatvEurope never has and it wouid be profitable to any to stop and consider why these islands on the edge of the western world have enjoyed so much liberty and Europe so little and the world then as now even less and worse .
'If we don't study and consider history we lose a great deal expecialy if we don't recognise Gods workings and yes God works in all history and among all nations but not always the same.
Moreover the Bible is as much as an historical record of the children of Isreal as it is a revelation of God for how else can we know Him who is the same yesterday today and forever? For if we know Him who worked in the past we can be encouraged that given the same conditions He is the same today.
This nations liberties have deep foundations but were not established till much later . ' Democracy has its limitations and we are not a democracy though many assert otherwise for their own reasons.
The Constitution was not written by men nor on partchment but on the indelible history of this nation . It cannot be unwritten or undone and those who think otherwise often pay a terrible price for doing so.
To be continued :
The fallen nature is spiritual not biological . The body dies because it is cut off at its roots from God .
The heart of man is desperately wicked deceitful above all else and who can know it " Is not the biological heart that pumps blood around the body but the ' main spring ' of a persons ' life' .
In truth though we say ' we give our life to Christ " we actually don't. We give our death and He gives us His life .
Outside of Christ we live in the flesh the body and function in the realm of this body and physical realm .
Seeing tasting touching reasoning perceiving only the " outward appearance "
We are more homeless than the homeless . Lost .
When we are truly born again the " old man" is crucified with Christ and buried with Christ " and we by the grace of God "become partakers of His nature"
" For the body is dead because of sin ,but if the same Spirit dwells in us thst raised up Jesus from the dead ,He shall quicken our mortal bodies".
Paul was praying for us Christian's in Ephesians that " the eyes of our understanding msy be opened thst we might see and comprehend what is the exceeding greatness of His power that is towards us who believe that raises Christ Jesus from the dead "
He himself said he wanted to know (more) the power of his resurrection" you can't know the power of a resurrection unless you are dead! But in this also he wrote " that I might be made conformable to his death" Clearly there is much more to " His death" than we realise but as the cross and His death is so little preached on is it any wonder?
For having reduced the gospel to being just BORN again there is very little exposition on anything else that will produce growth and development of the Christian .
" Little children "Praise the Lord!But what of " young men" ye have overcome the wicked one " Now there is a message I'd ,Ike to hear! But it goes onto maturity " Ye fathers..
My reasons, are honourable.
Please! do not be offended?
I have asked? the World Wide Web! Is it possible? To know, how many religions, exist in the world today?
The answer I received was approxomatly 4200!
We have ONE GOD!
We have ONE GOSPEL!
WHY? Do We Have So! Many Flavours?
What? Is required?
In 1 Samuel 13:14. The LORD states, the LORD hath sought him a man after his own heart, and The LORD hath
Commanded Him To Be Captain Over His People!
Why? Did Saul Lose His Appointment?
Why? Did THE LORD, Choose David? A Boy!
Please! Think deeply, on these.
You are at liberty, to express your replies, howsoever you choose?
May the LORD of All GRACE Bless those who seek, those who ask, and those who knock? Amen!
Thankyou! One and all.
Thanks for sharing your perspective on this subject and now I know more of your upbringing.
I think in every believer's life there are specific things and practices that remind us of spiritual truths. These things I have mentioned do just that.
In reading the OT God instituted many practices and utilized objects within the tabernacle that were reminders of truths to the Israelites. I think of the golden lampstand, the table with show bread on it, the mercy seat, the priestly garments, etc. that reminded them of God's holiness and also pointed forward to Jesus so that the Jews of His day and all who read the New Testament, especially the book of Hebrews, can come to understand how these objects and practices were a foreshadowing of Who the Messiah is and what He will do/did.
And at the Last Supper, Jesus used bread and wine to symbolize the New Covenant that advented with His death and resurrection. Whenever we celebrate the Lord's Supper we commemorate this covenant and remember His saving work for us.
Got to go. Rosie is up and running.
"Birth of Jesus" discussion?
Just wanted to share this with everyone here as well as those who hear about this site.
I only have been here a few years. The reason that I joined this group is because of the genuine spirit of Christ Jesus I enjoyed as I read the comments discussing God and God's SON
and His Spirit that dwells in mankind. Do we still share that SPIRIT?
I am glad I was raised from a child to believe in Jesus.
I am glad he was born.
I am glad he saved me.
I am glad a day has been set aside to celebrate His Birth.
I am glad to honor God, the Father,
for giving his son's life for me.
I am not ashamed to say so. "Let the redeemed of the Lord so."
From the way I hear the discussion going is this way. Some are celebrating because of a personal relationship. Some according to traditions. Some for other reasons also. Let us be careful to not confuse the Spiritual with the Carnal. " We worship God in Spirit and TRUTH." The World has a different concept.
It seems like the question is this.
Do you think he deserves to be celebrated at all?
I'm trying to
"see" with my eyes.
"Hear" with my ears and "understand" with my heart,
"Let the words
of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in thy sight oh Lord, my strength and my redeemer."
God bless us all.
Here is Rev. 1:6 in chiasmus form:
"And hath made us kings and priests
.....unto God and his Father;
to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
This verse is easy to see and follows that:
Jesus has made his servants kings and priests that reign on the earth ( Rev. 5:10) as "kings of the earth" ( Rev. 1:5).
.....Jesus has made these servants kings and priests to God his Father.
To Jesus be glory and dominion for ever and ever Amen.
As you can see, Verse 1:6 is a great closing verse for the 3, 4, 5 verse series.
For me, the KJV is perfect for reading the metaphors and metaphorical phrases.
We are at Rev. 1:5, which is the center of the Verse 4, 5, 6 series. Here is the verse in its chiasmus form:
a) And from Jesus Christ,
...b) who is the faithful witness,
......c) and the first begotten of the dead,
.........d) and the prince of the kings of the earth.
......c) Unto him that loved us,
...b) and washed us from our sins
a) in his own blood,
Previously, I explained that chiasmi read from left to right to the center, and then right to left to the end. But, they also read from top to bottom in the series, a, b, c, d, etc.
And it is that center which is the focus of the chiasmus. It follows that the center and focus of Rev. 1:5 is that Jesus is the prince of the kings of the earth.
There is much more to this verse. Especially, where the first verse of this series, Rev. 1:4, references a connection coming from the hereafter chapter, Chapter Four. But it is that center which highlights the metaphorical phrase "kings of the earth."
And that these "kings of the earth" are in that position "unto him that loved us." That is, they are kings unto their King, Lord Jesus ( Rev. 17:14), who loved them and washed them from their sins in his blood.
Rev. 1:5 is powerful and well deserving of holding the central position in the 3, 4, 5 series. The highlight of which is that the Savior is the prince (King) over "the kings of the earth." A metaphorical phrase used throughout The Book of Revelation to reference the Savior's servants.
-- Jas 3:10-11 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be. 11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
-- 1co 2:15 but he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
- 1co 6:3 know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?-
-- 1co 6:2 do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
-- 1co 6:5 i speak to your shame. is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
-- 1co 5:3 for i verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though i were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
-- 1co 14:29 let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
-- luk 12:57 yea, and why even of yourselves judge ye not what is right?
-- mat 7:1-2 judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 for with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
---- joh 7:24 judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
judge righteously and you will be righteously judged.
-- 1co 11:31 for if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
-- 1co 10:15 i speak as to wise men; judge ye what i say.
judge what i say, but judge it according to and by god's word.
So, your perspective would be different to mine, in that I had no such upbringing, where the traditions of a decorated tree, Father Christmas, gifts, etc. were totally absent. This was largely due to our strict Christian Brethren upbringing, one of the branches of Christianity that does not hold to observance of such events. So, I guess it would stand to reason that our understanding from the Scriptures, of history, and what is appropriate Christian application would vary, sometimes a great deal. Some might say, that I have softened in my understanding and acceptance of those who do celebrate the season; but I would think that that 'softening' is more to do with learning how God's Word specifically directs us to understand & apply matters that are not disclosed to us in the Word. Or, as one aged pastor often said, "Let us major on the majors and minor on the minors", as far enforcing teaching or being critical of others.
Anyway, I hope your family will enjoy a precious time together, which might even be a catalyst for a spiritual awakening or renewal for those not truly embracing our Lord in their lives. Blessings.
Their origins might appear dubious, and the reasons or need for such a tree to remember our Lord's Birth mystifying, but can one truly find any Scripture to show such an act as sinful? As mentioned earlier, I don't recognize or celebrate Xmas (or Easter) as I don't see any biblical warrant to do so, and participating at the Lord's Table is sufficient for me for a corporate remembrance of His Coming & Work of Salvation. Yet, for those who do recognize the day, I do not find any biblical authority to condemn them and they will have to judge for themselves the correct understanding and practise of this occasion. As well, I don't believe that Romans 12:2 and 2 Corinthians 6:17 can be applied here. What was in the apostle's mind seems to be of greater import than a Xmas tree being set up.
Continuing with Chapter One.
We are at Rev. 1:4, which begins the formal introduction and greetings to the seven churches. In fact, this is the first verse in a series of three verses (4, 5, and 6).
Let's say that a chiasmus has three main parts. The first part is the leg that reads from left to right to the center, and I call this leg the thesis. The second part is the center. And the third part is the leg that goes from the center, reading from right to left to the end, and I call this leg the antithesis. Thus, Verse 1:4 is the thesis, Verse 1:5 is the center, and Verse 1:6 is the antithesis, as follows:
Rev. 1:4, the thesis of this three-verse series
..... Rev. 1:5, the center of the three-verse series
Rev. 1:6, the antithesis of the three-verse series
Next, we look at Rev. 1:4 in chiasmus form.
a) John to the seven churches which are in Asia:
.....b) Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come;
a) and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
This verse is complex, and rather than explaining it, let's just say that it continues from Rev. 1:3 and comes from Rev. 4:5.
It seems that many church leaders at that time in history thought that many holy persons were conceived and died on the same day of the year only years apart. This was Hippolytus' thinking. If there was a tradition that came from Mary as to the date of Jesus birth, that may have played into this, too. But I am not aware of anything that was recorded of Mary's contribution to the knowledge concerning Jesus' birth day, childhood, etc. I would think that there was most likely an oral tradition known by the apostles and disciples in those early times.
We do have Mary's contribution to the Gospel writers Luke and Matthew as each of these begin with the annunciation and birth of Jesus. Regardless of whether Hippolytus was correct or not in setting Dec. 25 as Jesus' birth day, His birth is worthy of being celebrated and we have no prohibition in Scripture to not celebrate it. It does seem that historically the pagan celebrations in December came later than what Hippolytus introduced as the day of Jesus' birth.
With all this said, I do know that Paul instructs us to utilize the liberty we have in Christ whether to celebrate certain holy days, events, etc. or not to do so. He says each believer is to act according to their own conscience which the Holy Spirit renews in believers, and not let our exercise of Christian liberty bring another believer to stumble. These directives from Paul in Scripture should be our guide in matters such as this topic of celebrating Jesus' birth. Let us all be charitable with one another as we each allow the Holy Spirit to work His will in us.
And to end this, I will say that I wish everyone here a very blessed and joyful celebration of the coming of Jesus' as a babe and the astounding truth that at His birth He was "God with us" and will always be "God with us."
Just as God was faithful to fulfill His promises and prophecies concerning Jesus in His first advent, we can be sure He will fulfill all of His promises and prophecies concerning His future second advent to bring all things to completion and eternal fulfillment. Whereas those who lived before Jesus' first advent and were waiting for the Messiah to arrive, we, who live after His first coming, await His second advent with enlightened by the good news we find in the Scriptures and are filled with hope that He will do just as He said He would do and we are know how we can prepare ourselves to be ready for His return. Those in the Old Testament did not have these helps. We are very blessed to live after Jesus' birth, life, death and resurrection. We today have the witness of all of those who have gone before us who kept the faith in severe trials, tribulations, deprivation, and even martyrdom to teach us to persevere in faith until the end.
So, yes, I celebrate Christmas. I was reading up on the history of the celebration of Jesus' birth in the Church. Although many people seem to think that Christmas is based on pagan rituals of the 4th century, the reality is that the church did have Mary wit them in the 1st century to inform the apostles of Jesus' birth and childhood and the miracles associated with Him. Hippolytus, I believe, lived in the 2nd century into 3rd. In the the 220's Hippolytus taught that Jesus' birthday was December 25th based on Scripture and historical data he had at the time. This was not based on the celebration of Sol Invictus, or Saturnalia as these festivals were not celebrated in the Roman world at this early time. Therefore, it seems that the date of December 25th was calculated on the known fact that Jesus was killed on March 25th and Hippolytus believed that Jesus was most likely conceived at this time of year 30 or so years earlier and was born 9 months later, near December 25th.
see Pt. 5
These Israelites were in the dark as much as the Gentiles. All the nations were covered in darkness and even when Jesus arrived and brought the light of life into the world, many drew back from His light preferring the darkness of sin to the exposure of their sin to lead them to desire salvation. I think it is very hard for us to truly imagine what the world was like then with all the generations of man going back to Adam and Eve, and at the time of the flood, and after the flood when those who followed God did so because God called them (Noah, Enoch, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, the prophets). The rest of humanity was turned away from God completely.
Ever since Jesus was born, lived, died and rose for us, the light that comes from God, that is spiritually rather than physically, has shone out into this sin ravaged, sin enslaved world transforming the elect one by one through the work of the Holy Spirit in regenerating, giving the us the ability to believe and the desire to believe in Jesus as we hear the Gospel truth. All these 20 centuries since Jesus' birth, the world has been enlightened by the truth and hope of the Gospel ever-increasingly to the point that at this time we probably live in the most Christianized humanity of all the prior centuries combined. The impact of the believing Church in our own microcosm of our family and friends, community, city and out into the macrocosm of the entire world.
I was thinking about the wisdom of God's choice to elect before all time every person He would bring to faith. These elect are from every tribe, tongue, people, and nation in all generations. How important it is to spread the Good News of the coming of our Savior and King so that we can reach every one of our brothers and sisters to-be.
I come from a tradition that celebrates advent season which not only focuses on the birth of Jesus in His first advent, but looks forward to His second advent at the end of this age. see Pt. 4
He knew ALL that would happen to Himself ahead of time (since before creation). He knew all that would be said to Him, about Him, and all the actions that would be taken against Him. He knew that death would be so very painful and that taking upon Himself the wrath of God for us when He took our sins upon Himself. But knowing all of this, He steadfastly stepped out of the garden knowing He would be arrested right away and then the sequence of events leading to His death was began in real time.
The gold and silver ornaments remind of how worthy He is above all that is considered physically precious and valuable in this world to receive all glory honor and praise. These also remind me that He is my treasure in this life and in the life to come and that He has laid up an incorruptible inheritance for me in heaven that will be above and beyond what I could ever ask for or imagine.
Last week as I was listening to Christmas hymns and songs on the radio as I was traveling I was rejoicing that so many who have not yet come to Jesus in faith will hear the gospel truths in these songs and hear the singers praising the Lord over and over again. How wonderful is that? I love singing these songs and worshipping the Lord through them. They are a great unifier of believers in the church.
And at that time I also thought about what the world was like prior to His birth. It was dark with evil and the shroud of sin that blinded all the nations to the glory and promise of God. Even the Jews were on the whole not right with God. There were a few who were ready and looking for the Messiah, knowing the promises and prophecies that pointed them to their lifetime for the Messiah to come into the world to bring salvation. I think of Mary and Joseph, their parents, Elizabeth and Zechariah, John the Baptist, Anna and Simeon in the temple. I am sure there were many others in Judea. But the other tribes of Israel were estranged from God, having been scattered among the nations.
I agree with T-Rex, that Christmas offers and excellent window for the truth of Jesus' miraculous birth and His incarnation into humanity. His birth is the most important, glorious, world changing, profound birthday of all history. His birth is the fulfillment of God's promises and prophecies given in the Old Testament since Adam and Eve sinned. I love to celebrate Him at this time of year and the marvel of His birth.
I can remember way back to when I was very young how much I loved Christmas mostly because it tells of Jesus. I remember the readings of His birth in Luke and Matthew in church every year at Christmas. I remember the church bells ringing throughout the day reminding us of the joy of His birth. I remember re-enacting the Nativity with my siblings that we performed for our grandparents each year. My childhood was steeped in focusing on Jesus for the Christmas (Advent) season every year.
Not every Christian abandons the proclamation and celebration of the birth of our Savior at Christmas. My husband and I made a conscious effort every year to steep our sons in the Scriptural truth of "God with us" in Jesus. We downplayed all the trappings without eliminating all of it. We tried to make the time a time of celebration for our family. We do have a tree and my sons still come over to pick one out and decorate it. The tree has so much meaning for me. It is not an idol by any means. I do not bow down to it or worship it or think of it as any type of 'god".
But it reminds me of so many aspects of Jesus. The evergreen reminds me of eternal life we receive from Jesus. The lights remind me of how Jesus is the light of the world that shown into a dark, dark world filled with sin and despair. I have red glass ornaments in the shape of a teardrop and these remind me of the blood Jesus shed for me and the drops of blood He sweat in Gethsemane when He was facing the crucifixion. see Pt. 2
It is sad that Charles Shultz the originator of cartoons depicting Christ later on became a humanist (his most memorable scene was Linus dropping his security blanket when he read the scriptures about Christ's birth realizing it brought comfort beyond this world). There are some rather generic movies about Christmas; either classic or new versions which at least mention the Scriptures on the birth of Christ.
My point is that in some ways this is the most difficult time of year to get a clear Gospel message through when there are family expectations; obligations and overall distractions. The kids are home from school and of course are conditioned to expect some material item for Christmas; while adults often in limbo vacillating between asking not to receive anything to promote some sort of humility and giving something out a sense of obligation. Maybe that's just my experience...
It would seem that someone going to a church service who currently is a family member that is a nonbeliever would have less chance than a normal Sunday to hear a message of conviction; and the usual narrative of Christ's birth although it sometimes is prefaced or followed by a brief mention of His atoning sacrifice usually is comfortably predictable for those who come on this rare once a year occasion (perhaps coming back Easter).
I certainly don't want to be too much of a downer here. Even if I don't feel the need to celebrate in this manner; I want to be thankful for any gifts and pray that I send cards to those He would have me send them to as well as some extra money for those He would have me support as a common courtesy. That being said; I often do things other times of the year in that regard when these funds tend to be depleted.
In conclusion; if He comes to take us out before year's end I won't complain even if it ruins someone's plans.
Agape.
Moving on to Rev. 1:3, as follows:
a) Blessed is he that readeth,
...b) and they that hear the words of this prophecy,
...b) and keep those things which are written therein:
a) for the time is at hand.
In this chiasmus, the central feature "b" has two parts. 1) That those who hear the prophecy, 2) have the option to keep those things written therein. Naturally, those who do not keep the things written in the prophecy are not blessed by the prophecy.
So, Verse 1:3 is a simple affirmation for those who intend to keep the prophecy. And of course, the prophecy is the revelation. So it is a matter of necessity that the hearer of the prophecy hear the prophecy. Or rather, the hearer of the revelation hear the revelation.
In the Savior's testimony, he states, "Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book ( Rev. 22:7).
Again, it follows that the blessing of The Book of Revelation comes from keeping the sayings of the prophecy. And to do that, the individual must know the saying of the prophecy. That is, the individual must know the sayings of The Book of Revelation, and keep them.
It is through keeping the prophecy that the blessing comes. These sayings are given in the seven seals that are repeated throughout the book. That is, the seven seals are the prophecy. To know the seven seals is to know the prophecy.
Again, the seven seals, which are the prophecy, are repeated throughout the book, and that is the revelation, and vice versa.
"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts."
Luke 6:37
"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:"
Blessings
Shall we continue? Previously, I explained Verse 1:1, and now we go to Verse 1:2.
It is in Rev. 1:2 that John explains that he wrote The Gospel According to John. Here is verse 1:2 in chiasmus form:
Who bare record of the word of God,
.....and of the testimony of Jesus Christ,
and of all things that he saw.
The verse structure reveals:
The Word of God, John 1:1-5
.....The Testimony of Jesus Christ, John 21:21-24
Everything between Verses 1:1-5 and Verses 21:21-24
The "testimony of Jesus Christ" is a phrase which is used metaphorically twice in The Book of Revelation, as I recall; once at Rev. 1:9, and secondly at Rev. 19:10. Also, the Savior's literal testimony for The Book of Revelation is stated in the last chapter at Rev. 22:7-20.
So the phrase has both the metaphorical and literal applications.
Additonally, Rev. 1:2 not only establishes the structure of The Gospel According to John, but also that of The Book of Revelation, as follows:
Chapter One shows The Word of God in the vision of the Savior at Rev. 1:12-17
.....Chapter Twenty-Two shows The Testimony of Jesus Christ in Rev. 22:7-20
And Chapters Two through Twenty-One shows all the things that John saw.
Thank you for your comment, and I will try to explain my interpretation more carefully.
In the introduction of The Book of Revelation, the Father gave the revelation to Jesus as stated in Rev. 1:1.
In the storyline of The Book of Revelation, the Father gave the book with the seven seals attached, to the Savior in Rev. 5:7.
The Father giving the revelation to Jesus ( Rev. 1:1) and the Father giving the book with the seven seals attached to Jesus ( Rev. 5:7) are the same event.
In the first case, the event is summarized in the "thesis of the book". And in the second case, the event is stated in the "first storyline" that I call the seals storyline.
Secondly, as stated in the thesis of the book, Chapter One, the Savior gave the revelation to the angel to show to John ( Rev. 1:1).
Next, in the first storyline of the book, John begins to view the seven seals at Rev. 6:1-2, where he views the first seal. Since the angel is tasked with showing John the revelation ( Rev. 1:1), and the beast shows the first seal to John ( Rev. 6:1-2), then the angel is called the beast in Rev. 6:1.
Since the first event is, that the Father gives power and authority to Jesus over the book and the seven seals ( Rev. 5:7). And, the seals were opened before this event in Rev. 5:5. Then, the opening of the seals is included in the revelation that is the seals. Therefore, the first event of the seven seals is the Father giving power and authority to Jesus as metaphorically shown in Rev. 6:2, where the Savior rides upon the power and authority of the Father.
I realize that this is not a traditional interpretation of The Book of Revelation, but it is correct.
Maybe where you live one of your neighbors is bad and did bad things so should you burn your house down and denounce that neighborhood, city, or country, because bad things were done. Then people can say things like your neighborhood never was good and you can't put good back into such an evil house or negative place. Evil sins probably even occurred where you live so how can it ever be safe to live there ever again.
The saints are directed to be of one mind. Hence, those who observe Xmas need to stop, or those who do not need to start. Which has the more evidence on their side? God must be worship in spirit and truth; do you celebrate Xmas because it is the truth, that you are willfully ignorant of the truth, or that you are lukewarm and do not care if it is the truth or not?
If it is cultural, we are in sin for following a sinful culture. Rom 12:2.
.-- 2Co 6:17 Wherefore COME OUT FROM AMONG THEM, AND BE YE SEPARATE, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,understand your position. God gave us the Bible to help and direct us; if we do not listen to that, we are disregarding Him.
It is the word of God that we submit to or neglect that shall judge us.
-- 2Co 10:5 ... bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
What each saint does is between them and God, I merely obey my induction as an elder to feed the flock, 1Pet 5:1-3. Following the crowd will not be an excuse at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
Proverbs 1:7 "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction."
Exodus 20:10 "But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates"
John 14:21"He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him."
John 15:10 "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Fathers commandments, and abide in his love."
Matthew 19:17 "And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments."
Blessings
Jeremiah 30:3
"For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it."
Blessings
We can read passages like Psalm 8:2 describing children having great power in the Kingdom and certainly the Lord Himself shows victory over His enemies.
Should we take a frank investigation of the narrative of the Gospels regarding Christ's appearance on earth we see the persecution prophesied of ( Matthew 2:18 referring to Jeremiah 31 on the persecution of Herod). This shows the extermination of all the males under two in a fanatical attempt inspired no doubt from Satan to eliminate the One who would bring defeat to the enemy of our souls. We can extend this further to the event when Christ was 12 and "talked back" to his parents; as well as other things that rock our world with someone we assume came to bring peace without a price. Indeed He IS the Prince of Peace but also warned that He didn't come specifically and only for that reason ( Matt. 10:34).
Of course in terms of rife materialism we see that Christ chose to live as what we would call a nomadic existence and called for the same of His Disciples. We CAN say that the wise men sent expensive gifts and this no doubt was due to the worship due to the King which His own people by and large failed to grasp.
In general things are rapidly accelerating on the world scene to the stage set in Daniel and Revelation for the final 10 Kings in the Beast system. The earth trembles in ever increasing earthquakes and violence of war and other disputes. May our hearts not be divided between love for this world and treasures in heaven we are to seek above anything else.
Let us redeem the time because the days are evil; and testify the reason for the season.
Seeing the latest postings regarding Christmas; and figuring this could be the last season we celebrate this before the return of Christ at the Rapture (if He doesn't come beforehand) I thought I would expound on some thoughts related to this time of year.
It has been mentioned the Christmas that society tolerates; which involves songs that are familiar to some that are at times related to the birth of our Savior such as Silent Night (and all the modern newfangled renditions). Now as to proper beliefs no doubt the concept of a tender child born in humble circumstances appeals to the humanist and those of other "faith traditions" as well. As to being God in the flesh which is clearly indicated in the Gospel in Luke 2:11 and stemming back to prophecy from the book of Isaiah it ain't so much embraced (not sure how many professing believers themselves believe that these days).
Perhaps a more subtle but most prescient issue related to all the decorations and holiday "cheer" is the materialism that has pervaded our culture in particular really for the last century. As bad as the bratty kids we have trained to expect "things" to magically appear by delivery from some questionable fat bearded old man down the chimney or some other innovate technique we have the lingering faux image of the whole period of time of family gathering together where women get a power trip from their kitchen creations and endless "bargains" where they can save a few bucks and family often sees other members who they don't deal with the rest of the year; etc. Men of course can get into grandiose descriptions of the latest power tool they bought or whatever sports teams are on TV.
When "good deeds" are done of course it can assuage a guilty conscience temporarily with this sort of Santa Claus mentality for adults; such as volunteering in a soup kitchen.
With this backdrop I'll begin part 2.