Bible Questions & Discussion PAGE 262

Hammer63:

You said we have to read the bible correctly:

Jesus SAID he spoke to the multitude in PARABLES.

He literally placed a physical child in the midst of them them; BUT the TEACHING was not about a physical child, but the fact that HIS RESURRECTION was going to make YOU a new creation, a new birth, being raised with Christ.

And whosoever receiveth one such little child (the Holy Ghost) RECEIVETH ME (Christ in you).

Colossians 1:27 .... this mystery ..... CHRIST IN YOU ..... the Holy Ghost IN YOU .... the Spirit of God IN YOU .... the LIFE in YOU ..... the TRUTH in YOU ..... you are the BODY OF CHRIST.....

The glory that thou hast given me, I have given them, that as we are ONE, that they may be ONE in us.

The is ONLY one CHILD; but HE dwells, and is the LIFE and TRUTH in all bodies.

You are the body of CHRIST.

Not many understand what the resurrection accomplished.

All men died with Christ on the cross, all men were made alive by being resurrected with Christ.

At each man's appointed time, Christ will CAUSE them to come to TRUTH.

I WILL put my Spirit in YOU and CAUSE YOU to walk in my statues and keep my judgements, and do them.

For it is God that worketh IN YOU both to will and to do his good pleasure.

God bless you as his truth is revealed IN YOU.

For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will. Colossians 1:9

And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him. And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son. But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet: And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry: For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. Luke 15:20-24

Rejoice evermore. Pray without ceasing. In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. 1 Thessalonians 5:16

O give thanks unto the Lord; for he is good: for his mercy endureth for ever. O give thanks unto the God of gods: for his mercy endureth for ever. Psalm 136:1,2

For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Philippians 2:13

For there is no restraint to the LORD to save by many or by few. 1 Samuel 14:6

Hiya Hammer63....There is gonna be more then one H.G.....When he breathe on them they all received the H.G.....He was propagating very God with his precious seed the living word....His breath was his words and his words are his seeds to Multiply himself in humanity.....Ya gotta keep in mind that Jesus is the bridegroom....Thats y he is saying to whom the word( his seed ) came it made them Gods and the scripture cannot be broken....As the gift of God is the H.G....That are gonna be as the stars of heaven in multitudes....Thats y he always refers to himself as the son of man.....Mankind is gonna birth a Baby Christ which is the H.G.....Thats y he is saying that which is born of the spirit is spirit....Thats the H.G. that Children of Promise....Remember God almighty swore by his very self when he made that Promise of multiplication of Christ Seed.... thats y Jesus is saying to whom the word (The good seed came it made them Gods ) which is the H.G. the Children of Promise....I will pour out of my spirit (THE H.G.) on all flesh....Which is the gift of God that is gonna be as the stars of heaven....Bro. Hammer i am trying to help you....But this multiplication of Christ doctrine is hid from the wise and prudent and only revealed unto Babes and Sucklings....The H.G. are gonna be many, they are the Israel of God.....The babes and sucklings... behold me and the Children the lord has given ME.....That New Born babe desiring the sincere milk of the word is the gift of God the H.G.....The Children of PROMISE....Unless ya receive the Kingdom of God as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in...Even in the natural a birth always implies a Child...We are gonna have a baby...The H.G. OK GBU

Hell testimonies part 3

I would be sadly remiss if I didn't emphasize how we should fear the Lord who can send both body and soul to hell ( Matt. 10:28).

This; in my opinion should elicit a response in the souls of all true believers; as we should be ever greatful for what He did for us on the cross; taking the punishment of God the Father on Himself for our benefit.

What we can do now; however is be ambassadors for the truth; and allow God to make us vessels of reconciliation ( 2 Cor. 5:19).

We cannot save anyone; but are held responsible for the death of others if we don't sound the alarm (see Ezekiel 33). Notice there that they may or may not heed the warning.

One cannot separate the love of God for fear of the Lord; and one cannot appreciate the joys of heaven without realizing the horrors of hell they have been delivered from.

We also have to understand predestination in that regard; if we disagree on certain aspects it is clear that in the end a certain number are saved and sadly it is only "few" according to Christ Himself. ( Luke 13:23 among other verses).

Another thing which needs consideration is the reports of children being in hell. Matthew 18:10; as well as Matthew 21:16 tied to Psalm 8:2; and the testimony of David in 2 Samuel 12:23 should dispel this; there are other verses as well which I may elaborate on in a future posting. Those scenes where people seem baffled or confused as to what is happening to them isn't scriptural; and we also must ponder Hebrews 9:27; and understand that judgment comes first immediately after death (although before the Great White Throne one at the end of the Millennium). The punishment is justly given in different levels depending on the crime. I need to be careful here; but will say that punishment will be no more or less than deserved; more "tolerable" for some as in Matthew 11:22.

In conclusion; God's Word should make us tremble; the subject matter should never be looked at as entertaining.

MOre on hell testimonies

My last conversation got stuck on another thread. Here is a summary of what is often spurious evidences in hell testimonies.

1. Satan being in hell. Revelation 20 and 21 should make it clear (the latter case even with Post Millennialists) that Satan is not in hell now; clearly he will be tormented before anyone else and as well as anyone else. Certain entities currently under the earth are in their own realm in Tartarus. Therefore; although it is possible that certain creatures are under the earth presently; it is hard to differentiate at times (unless clinical death is proven) that something isn't a demonic attack of torment.

2. Lack of proper reverential fear of the Lord. There are a few testimonies like this in regard to heaven and hell testimonies; but too many that only have a mushy love for Christ; or just desperate clinging to Him. No genuine experience in God's presence can come without being on our faces; see Daniel; Isaiah and John for 3 scriptural examples of the same thing. See Deuteronomy as well when Moses "shook exceedingly" ( Heb. 12:21). See David's example when the destroying angel appeared in 1 Chron. 21:15. If an Archangel can bring such a reaction (see Daniel 10:5 and following); surely the Lord Himself even more so.

3. Lack of testimony regarding the sin nature and our need to be saved from that. There also tends to be a doctrine of "losing your salvation" if we have besetting sins; as well as teachings that we must go through much of the Tribulation. More seem to be heading towards that mindset probably because Christ didn't return when they thought He would.

4. Idea that true repentance would occur in hell but it would be too late. Or love for God and His Name. I stated in my last posting that in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man no one would be convinced if someone came back from the dead.

( Isaiah 38:18).

5. God is grieving for lost souls in hell. ( Isaiah 66:24).

Some clarity on hell testimonies

There seems to be; as with any other issue two extremes among the professing church today. Hell is taken as a figurative place; or not eternal in one extreme and the other end of the spectrum is a belief in every testimony of an afterlife experience on such matters that can be found without a critical examination of the message being delivered (is it scriptural?); the fruit of the life of such an individual (are they clearly out for self promotion and greedy gain); or is it something that should be considered taken seriously?

The first issue should; along with other core doctrines that have been assumed up until recently to be foundational for us to be a Christian not even have to be discussed; in my opinion. We can't naively believe that most churches in even what were solid doctrinally a generation ago have anything correct now; I am not even sure which pole was taken but apparently belief in Christ being God in the flesh; being the only way to salvation; and other issues have succumbed to today's popular agendas. I'd place a bet that most who don't believe in a literal hell somehow still hold out hope for a real; eternal heaven (as misguided as their view of what it is like and such may be).

On the other side; I will state if I can on this site the testimony of Bill Weise. He himself says that he isn't concerned about us believing him but the Word; and in the speaking engagement I saw him in he must have had two or three hundred scriptures memorized from the O.T. and N.T. on the subject. There may be others like this; but I am not aware of them.

A common thing is lack of reverential fear of the Lord in these testimonies; only clinging on to Him when rescued from what they claim was hell. We see assumptions that go against verses such as Luke 16:31 where we think that those even if they had a real NDE or out of body experience that it would convince someone to repent. 2 Tim. 2:25 says the Lord grants repentance

Women preaching (part 2).

As in my last posting; I would say we are remiss and probably pretty ignorant if we ignore gifted women and think we can't gain scriptural knowledge there. Any true woman of God will attribute their successes to the Lord and not attempt to usurp such roles. A woman of course through chaste behavior can win her husband over as well; so to speak to being amenable to receiving the Lord.

Such matters also don't relegate women to second class status in terms of spiritual rewards. We also don't ultimately see in the next life any such restrictions ( Gal. 3:28). The text being as it on a surface level makes it seem that men will rule as kings and priests but again it would seem women also can receive great reward as per the woman of great faith ( Matt. 15:28).

There are; of course despite the restrictions of not speaking in a service and wearing head coverings that women prophesy and pray in public worship ( 1 Cor. 11:5). Some argue if that is the context of the verse but it certainly implies speaking so the Word must be divided correctly. The Lord certainly used women in the O.T. to Propnesy; during the time of Judges no doubt men were scarce; but the women who did such things were not rebuked for doing it by the Lord. We can argue what gifts exist today; but we all need to exercize the authority in Ephesians 6; and often women are the most persistant prayers in churches today both numerically and time wise.

These principles in regard to Covenants such as sacraments in communion; marriages; and Baptisms scripturally use men as the ones to administer such practices. There was never an attempt in the O.T. times for a woman to attempt the role in the Temple; except of course for those in prayer such as Hannah and the woman who was the widow who lived until Christ the Redeemer came ( Luke 2:37 and Anna). Hannah's virtue put to shame the Priest at the time; and his sons later would be destroyed as Samuel's prophetic insight stated.

A woman is said not to have authority over a man ( 1 Timothy 2:12) and that verse also mentions that women shouldn't teach as well. Women are to teach their children however; mentioned just a few verses earlier in 1 Timothy 1:5. There are other verses in Titus and other scriptures where the wisdom of God are to be instructed as well.

It gets fuzzy when we get into such things as a small group. What is considered an informal conversation often morphs with "teaching" in some respect. Certainly there is benefit to women teaching other women ( Titus 2:4-6) which involves bringing up responsible young women and men as well in their domestic duties. Certainly we are all part of God's family so it could extend to other families as well.

The theoretical conundrum is when a woman wishes to Pastor if there is "no man available" for such a role. If it is truly the case and no men are in a congregation; I don't see anything wrong with a woman taking up that role as it were; but as soon as a believing male is present there should be some oversight and transferrance of authority ASAP in that regard.

Also; I have read female authors (one in particular on Bible Prophecy) who is in my opinion uneqalled in the scriptural detail about the end times. She goes to church with her husband and doesn't attempt to have lectures and such on tour; just a website. Such conferences that women have are often sold as a sort of motivational talk but often are more like women taking over preaching as s Pastor role. Most of the time there appears to be egregious error in such cases; as to when wives and husbands have a "co-ministry".

The authority of a Pastor also is an elder role; which carries with it a supervisory role protecting the flock; exercising authority for church discipline and other matters. That does NOT mean that women shouldn't report an erring sister or brother although when do you hear about that? Matthew 18:15-20 should proceed from there with men.

Good morning Adrue1,

I'm not going to get into specifics, but what I can tell you is that each and every one of the Old Testament Ceremonial Laws, as well as Water Baptism and the Lord's Supper during the Church Age were types and figures teaching some aspect of the Gospel. There was no efficacy or spiritual substance in these; they were signs and shadows to be observed focusing on the very substantive Nature of God's Judgment and Salvation plan.

I think it was a little human child that Jesus sat in the midst of them. (not the Holy Spirit). We can become off in our thinking if we don't read the Bible accurately. I don't think Jesus was referring to humbling himself like the Holy Spirit. And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, 3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. 4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me. He also goes on the say that whosoever offends one of these little ones. (that is plural meaning more than one). There is only one Holy Spirit.

Hello Adrue1. A Heave Offering was a part of the other types of offerings that God had appointed for the children of Israel. The heave offering was not really a separate offering but the portion of another offering, given as a present, that was reserved for the use of the priests.

Exodus 29:27,28: And thou shalt sanctify the breast of the wave offering, and the shoulder of the heave offering, which is waved, and which is heaved up, of the ram of the consecration, even of that which is for Aaron, and of that which is for his sons: And it shall be Aaron's and his sons' by a statute for ever from the children of Israel: for it is an heave offering: and it shall be an heave offering from the children of Israel of the sacrifice of their peace offerings, even their heave offering unto the LORD."

It seems that it was similar to the Wave Offering, where instead of the offering being waved (moved from side-to-side) before the LORD, the Heave Offering was lifted in an up and down motion before God.

The heave offering was often given in conjunction with tithes ( Leviticus 7:14,34) as a provision for the Levites, the priestly tribe who did not have land of their own and therefore could not grow their own food. They depended on the LORD's provision through tithes and heave offerings ( Numbers 18:24,29).

The fall of Babylon?

( Jer. 51:1,2,11) v2 "And will send unto Babylon (fanners), that shall fan her, and shall empty her land: for in the day of trouble they shall be against her round about". The word (fanners) is #2114; it means to turn aside (especially for lodging) hence, to be a foreign, strange, profane, to commit adultery (come from) another (man, place).

((foreigners, strangers)) the border?

v11 "the LORD hath (raised) up the spirit of the kings of the Medes: for his (device) is against Babylon to destroy it; because it is the vengeance of the LORD, the vengeance of his temple"

The word (raised) is #5782; it means through the idea of ((opening the eyes)), to wake, (a-) wake (-n, up) raise (up) stir up (self). Do people being awake, or stirred up sound like the times we live in today?

The word (device) is #4209; it means a plan, usually evil (machination) (wicked) device, witty invention, lewdness, mischievous (device) thought, wickedly. That would mean there's a evil, wicked plan against this nation, NOW!

Do you see it?

1st Babylon is corrupted by fanners that are sent by God.

Then

( Jer. 50:9) "For, lo, I will raise and cause to come up against Babylon an assembly of great nations from the north country: and they shall set themselves array against her; from thence she shall be taken: their arrows shall be as a mighty expert man; none shall return in vain".

2nd God sends an assembly of great nations against Babylon to destroy her and she shall be taken.



God is in complete control of Babylon falling in the Lastdays, God raises up the spirit of the kings of the Medes whose device is against Babylon to destroy her, God sends the fanners who will be against her in the day of trouble, then God sends the assembly of great nations from the north country whose arrows will be as a mighty expert man, none shall return in vain.

Is the USA mystery Babylon? Is this the present, and the future for this nation?

Many say Yes, but some do say No!

Blessings.

Where in the Bible does it say that it's okay for women to be preachers

Richard,

I am unaware of any verse or passage in the Bible that speaks of an "age of accountability".

The Bible does say some very ugly things about our condition from the moment of conception apart from salvation. And that we are spiritually DEAD.

Psalms 58:3

The wicked are estranged from the WOMB: they go astray as soon as they BE BORN, speaking lies.

Romans 3:10-18

As it is written, There is NONE righteous, no, not one: There is NONE that understandeth, there is NONE that seeketh after God. They are ALL gone out of the way, they are TOGETHER become unprofitable; there is NONE that doeth good, no, NOT ONE. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes.

Ephesians 2:1

And you hath he quickened, who were DEAD in trespasses and sins;

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness that we have done,..but acccording to his mercy and the washing and regeneration ( multiplication) of his Seed HE SAVED US....He wants to sow his precious seed in our hearts so as to multiply himself in humanity. the field is the world....Being bornagain of an incorruptible seed even by the word of God that liveth and abideth forever....The living word that new covenant, That book that he wrote with his own blood at Calvary the words of life....There is only 1 yardstick and thats the fruit that comes from his precious seed sown in our hearts which is a baby Christ the H.G. .That which is born of the spirit is spirit which is the H.G. our new heart and new spirit....Nothin availeth any thing in Christ Jesus but that new creature which is the H.G. That Child of Promise....Which is our fruit unto God via his good seed....The seed of the sower.....1st the Child the H.G. Then the son the H.G....Then the fulness of the Godhead in us the H.G....The Kingdom....3 MEASURES The woman in Rev. 12:10 Does not receive the Kingdom till she births the manchild....As Jesus said unless ya receive the Kingdom of God as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there n..Indicative of a heavenly Birth of a baby Christ in us which is the H.G. THE CHILD OF PROMISE....Thats y he has to know us....He wants to regenerate himself in humanity....Thats y he is saying whosoever receiveth one such child in my name RECEIVETH ME..The Child is the H.G. As that which is born of the spirit is spirit thats the H.G. the Child of Promise....The H.G. is that Child of Promise....As the great promise was i will multiply thy seed as the stars of heaven....Thus the babes and sucklings that can worship God with a perfect Praise that are gonna be born in us....Our new heart and new spirit via his good seed the living word....They don't call him the bridegroom for nothin....He has a seed to sow in humanity....Thats y Jeremiah saw all men in travail and birth pains....Jere 30:6

Leoj

Pr. 2

We began with this sinful corruption and it manifested in our lives in active sin by choice. There is no one who does not sin in some way. All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. So it is our sinful nature that leads us into sin, making us a sinner.

But every time we sin, we choose to, so our active sinning proves that we are a sinner. We have no excuse because our will is always free to sin, but without regeneration, we have no freedom to do what is truly good before God. Thank God that God's work in us to save us and make us new brings the desire and the power to obey God, though our obedience is never perfect like that of Jesus' obedience. He alone is and always has been perfectly righteous.

Hello Leoj

This is a good question to ponder.

My thoughts go immediately to Romans chapter 7 where Paul is describing the Christian struggle of the newness of being regenerated and revived spiritually by the Holy Spirit with the sinful nature in ourselves that is still at work in us. As a new creation in Christ, Paul desires to do that which is good and righteous, but he is not able to perform these good things in a perfect way because the sinful nature is always there to taint whatever we do. In verse 17-23, Paul says that he knows that nothing good resides in his old nature which he calls the flesh. He speaks at the law of sin and death that is right there when he would do what is good even though he delights in the law of God in his inward regenerated spiritual man. He says that the law of sin brings his members into captivity to do evil.

We all have this same struggle in us as Paul had. When we were not redeemed, we did not have a regenerated inward man who wished to do what was righteous, but our corrupted inward man desired to do what sinful. We were enemies of God, but due to the regenerative work of the Holy Spirit, we desire to live holy and godly lives (which we did not want to do prior to conversion). Even so, we now have this struggle that did not exist when we were unredeemed. The sin nature and the new inner nature created anew by God war against each other. This will continue all of our life until death separates us from our sinful nature. When we are resurrected, we will be completely whole in all aspects of our being-from our physical bodies to our minds, soul, will, and spirit. There will be total harmony within us as the Holy Spirit continues to indwell us throughout eternity to keep us holy.

So, in regards to your question, as Richard said, it is both that we sin because we are a sinner and we are a sinner because we sin.

Everyone is conceived as a sinner corrupted by sin passed on to us from Adam to all persons. We had no choice in this.

Both. Man was created upright; and Lucifer perfect in his ways before they sinned. Therefore; there was within their nature the potential for sin. Things always start in the mind; and are related to the state of our souls. In both cases self decided based on their own understanding that God (their Creator) was somehow holding out on what was best for them; and they pursued what seemed the best path to elevate their status and consequently put God as second in their lives. The final decision to act on these impulses caused the chain reactions leading to destruction. For Adam it was immediate separation from fellowship with God (or spiritual death) shame and distancing himself from God (along with Eve); then the delayed results of the fallen earth; toiling with sweat; pain in childbirth and eventual physical death and for later generations a reduced life span.

If we step back to Paul's statement in Romans 7:9 there was a time before the law when he didn't know sin. Hence; we see some sort of age of accountability for actions. If we are not conscious of deliberate acts of rebellion against God then it seems scriptural that before that age we are saved by grace and can't be punished for something we don't understand. Once we do reach that age; then we are also judged more harshly for certain sins than others according to what is considered an abomination; or where a death penalty is declared for murder and such with the religious and associated civil laws society still has today. When we learn how to repeat acts of rebellion; then we are increasing our judgment; but clearly since all men are in Adam we are all sinners by nature as another result of the fall affecting all of mankind (Adam's progeny).

God judges us for outward manifestations of breaking His Divine decrees as well as for the thoughts and imaginations which in reality are doing these things in our heart. The fate of Lazarus and the rich man is said to result from actions not nature

Jimbob,

It really comes down to this (part 2).

There are many commandments in the Bible related to Salvation. Some of these are "Repent", "Believe", "Endure", etc. And our obedience to ANY commandment of God, i.e. the Law of God, is a WORK that we do. But our Repentance, our Belief, our Endurance does NOT save us. No obedience to the Law of God can save us. Our Repentance, our Belief, our Endurance in a way that is pleasing to God is the RESULT of our Salvation, not the CAUSE of our Salvation. It is the EVIDENCE of our Salvation as God "works within us to will and to do of His good pleasure".

These WORKS are also a yardstick to help us determine whether or not we have truly become "saved". "Examine yourself to see if you be in the faith", "Make your calling and election sure", etc. All warnings and admonitions given to us by God's Mercy so that if we do not see these things in our life, we may still cry out to God in the very real Hope that He might save us. And if we do see these characteristics in our life with an earnest and ongoing desire to be obedient to His Commandments, it gives us assurance that God has indeed "saved" us and we are safe and secure in His everlasting arms. Despite the fact that we do fall into sin again and again when we take our eyes off of Christ; and God may need to chastise us, as a father does his son, to cause us grow in grace. Praise God for so great salvation!

David0921 thank you for your response.

I really don't think I'm isolating verses in the Bible to come to this belief.

You did not answer my question David, Do you think repenting of our sins is works?

In Revelation Chapters 2 and 3 Jesus says to 6 of the 7 churches "I know (thy works)"

To the other one He says "for I have not found (thy works) perfect before God".

To the church of Ephesus He says in ( Rev. 2:5) "((except thou repent))."

to the church of Pergamos He says in ( Rev. 2:16) "((Repent or else)) I will come upon thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth".

To the church of Thyatira He says in ( Rev. 2:22) "Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, ((except they repent)) of their deeds".

To the church of Sardis He says in ( Rev. 3:3) "Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, ((and repent))".

To the church of Laodicea He says in ( Rev. 2:19) "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, ((and repent)).

We are told in ( Acts. 17:30) "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where ((to repent)).

These verses are very clear Jesus is speaking of ((their works)), and also ((repentance for their sins)).

( Rev. 2:16) Jesus tells them Repent or else He will fight against them with the sword of His mouth.

Do you believe (repenting) of our sins is works David?

Blessings.

Romans 3:10-31

As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full

of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes.

Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ {Christ's faith, not our faith} unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also: Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith...

Chris thank you for your comment.

I agree that many today are departing from the Word of God, we are told that will happen in ( 2 Tim. 4:3-4).

You said "Unfortunately the ( 2 Thess. 2:2-5) passage is not explicit to show us how Paul was applying this "apostasy".

This I do respectfully disagree with Chris, if we look at the True meaning of the words (falling away) in the Greek language it is #646; it means defection from truth, (properly the state) ["apostasy"] forsake, divorce, (writing of) divorcement.

((a (writing of) divorcement from what?))

A departure from the (Christian faith) would be rejecting Jesus Christ not the Word of God.

We see the marriage supper of the Lamb taking place in ( Rev. 19:7-9) Those who fall away receive the (writing of) divorcement after the Abandonment of their ((Christian faith)) a total desertion or departure ((from their faith))

Those who fall away (depart from or desert their Christian faith) will not be present at this marriage supper of the Lamb.

( 1 Tim. 4:1) "that in the latter times" (This is speaking of the Lastdays) "some shall (depart) from the (faith)"

The word (depart) is #868; it means to remove, i.e. actively instigate to revolt, to desist, desert, depart, draw (fall) away, refrain, withdraw self.

The word (faith) is #4102; persuasion, i.e. credence; morally conviction (of religious truth, or the truthfulness of God or a religious teacher, especially ((reliance upon Christ for salvation)).

This has to be True Believers in Jesus Christ (1st) to desert or abandon their Christian faith. And (2nd) to receive a (writing of) divorcement from Jesus Christ for their departure of their faith. And it is written this happens in the (latter times) which would be today.

Again thank you Chris. God Bless.

Hello everyone, Had an interesting question asked at our men's Bible group. " Our we sinners because we sin, or do we sin because where're sinners". Would like to hear your comments based from the Bible . Thank you

what is a heave offering

Thanks 'Jimbob'

No it doesn't

But it does give them the image of the Angels since we too as man was given the image of God.

As an angel worships God and obeys so shall your wife worship and obey you.

To whom do your hands belong and what do you have in you r hands?

In your hands I lay my spirit Jesus said at the cross, Oho God of Israel rather I fall into your hands rather than the hands of human beings, To whom do your hands belong and what do you have in your hands? Is what we have in our hands that can open the doors, Moses had a rod to open the door to Isreal the promise land, David had a stone to defeat the great gaint threat, Jesus Christ had scars in his hands scar's of the old sin and path to salvation, Feel my scars put your hands in them Thomas and believe it's me, What do you have in those hands that proves your worth in Christ, in his hands he healed many, in those very hands he blessed many, in those hands he changed a many. In our hand's how many have died spiritual and physical? In our hands how many are lost today? Because of the works of our hands how many today can't even come to church? Praise God? Worship him? Are we really appreciating or depreciating the works of God in our hands? Our hand's can't turn water into wine but can turn water into blood, laughter into tears, joy into pain, happiness into misery, love into hate and peace and harmony into chaos and war, turn sanity into confusion, To whom do your hands belong and what do you have in those hands? Are they hand's that opens or closes? Do they build or destroy? Do they carry success of failure? Can they hold or break? It's our hand's built within us and in God we want to understand the Why do they see the opposite, why can't I get it right, is it my hands or me? Is it how I touch or how I push? The hands

Jimbob,

It really comes down to this.

Is the Gospel of the Bible a gospel of Grace Alone or is it a gospel of Grace plus Works?

We can find many verses in the Bible that if isolated from the rest of the Bible could lead us down a path of believing that we must DO something to become saved. And if that is the case, then we can certainly DO something, or fail to DO something to lose our salvation. But when we look at everything in the Bible that teaches us about the Nature of Salvation, we find that is not true.

Many people use the term ACCEPTING CHRIST or DECIDING FOR CHRIST. These are things that WE DO. Just like obedience to any commandment of God is a WORK that WE DO. And no WORK that WE DO can save us. That is a gospel of grace plus works. It is not the gospel of the Bible.

Read Galatians very carefully. Read Romans very carefully. Read the entire chapter.

Galatians 1:6-9

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

The True Gospel of the Bible is a gospel where God does ALL THE WORK in saving us and KEEPING US. This must be the case because we BY NATURE are DEAD spiritually. It is when GOD SAVES US that he raises us to spiritual life. A life that CANNOT be lost. A life that is ETERNAL LIFE. And there will be a "want to" in our life to keep the Law, but it is NOT our obedience to the Law that saves or keeps us. We must make that distinction.

In coming to an understanding of what it means to be "saved" we must compare scripture with scripture and not isolate verses form the rest of the Bible.

Pg 2.

These haven't rejected (apostatized from) Christ but have perverted God's Word by their apostatizing from revealed & accepted Truth (the Word of God as given by Jesus & His apostles), and promoted their own beliefs & interpretations, thereby causing many to err & turn to unrighteous beliefs & practises. And I have not shared this here to bring on 'a KJB vs other translation' argument (though there is evidence that any grave corruption of the Word can lead to much error in belief as well).

But maybe we should consider that in light of the many Scriptures that show that a true child of God is sealed, secured, & ministered to by the Holy Spirit, and could never leave nor desire to depart from such a great abundant salvation, that the possibility of what Paul was presenting, is that this 'falling away' could well be that God's Word would increasingly be mishandled in the days after he left this Earth, giving over to a 'doctrine of devils' teaching. That this 'falling away' & the 'man of sin' being revealed, shows just how far Christ's Church has departed from the Body of Truth, and this 'man of sin' could well be a religious person but giving no regard to God's Word, rather submitting his own word as God's Voice. Of course, those who are believers, whether in the congregation of such apostasy from the Word, would soon depart, wanting only to hear the Truth of God's Word, but those who have no such discerning spirit, would readily pay him heed. Even now, as was in the past ( 1 John 2:18,19), there would be imposters, even among the clergy, that have infiltrated the Church. So I just share this, an option here, as we need to keep the matter open concerning 'apostasy', since Paul hasn't directly stated in what manner this 'apostasy' would happen, whether concerning true believers or concerning God's Word & those professing to be Christian. Blessings.