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Lucifer was known as the son of the morning in Isa 14, but most bibles change the diety of Christ and give it to Lucifer by saying that Lucifer was the morning star.
Isa.14 :[12] How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
Jesus is the only morning star in the bible according to the KJV.
Rev.22: [16] I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
So, instead of this passage showing Jesus as just a man, it shows that He is, indeed, man, but also Lord, (Adonai) thereforem divine.
John wanted people to repent of their sins and prepare their hearts to receive the Messiah, whom John knew was alive at that time and that he, himself was called by God from infancy to be the prophet that prepared the way for the Messiah. He prepared the way by calling people to repent and be baptized and then pointed to Jesus after Jesus was baptized and said, "Behold the Lamb of
God that takes away the sins of the world." He was told by God that the Messiah would come to be baptized and that upon being baptized God would speak from heaven and the Holy Spirit would come upon the Messiah. When this happened with Jesus' baptism, John then knew who the Messiah was-his very cousin! John must have known something ahead of this because he told Jesus that Jesus should be baptizing him, not the other way around. So, John was listening to God and seeking to know whom he was to announce, and God inform him concerning the Messiah both before Jesus came to be baptized and after Jesus was baptized. Therefore, John announced that Jesus was the long awaited Messiah.
Regardless, as you and others have demonstrated time and again, we participate in civil discourse here, being respectful of others' contributions, but also speaking strongly to matters that are very crucial to us, disagreeing when we sense something is in error, and holding out the Word of Truth as our standard, rule, and guide.
spread that Jesus Christ was a holy Man. Now even to this day in the middle east a holy mans spittle is believed to have
healing power so the times when Jesus Christ used spittle was because God told him to. If someone was not healed
immediately it had nothing to do with gods power it had everything to do with the unbelief he was surrounded by. When he
raised lazarus from the dead nobody believed he was going to do it that's why he wept and also that's why he said out loud
I know my father always hears me and then said out loud Lazarus come forth. Nothing has changed people still don't believe
God can move that big.
Scripture does not tell us when Satan rebelled and lost his rank, when Jesus said I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven, Luke 10:18, Scripture does tell us when he will be cast down permanently with no more access to heaven. He still has access because he is the accuser. When he will be cast out forever is in the future, that starts the tribulation that is coming.
Revelation 12:7-9 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, 8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
God bless,
RLW
Romans 12 whole chapter what to do how to act. Phillipians 4:5-10 how to think, Clossians chapter 3 whole chapter
have fun.
also as jesus christ said to fulfill all righteousness. The law ended in practice with john the baptist that's why in
John 1:17 grace and truth came with Jesus christ. Also notice in Acts 1:5-8 john indeed baptized with water but incontrast
ye shall absolute tense be baptized with Holy spirit the lesser the law replaced by Grace via the spirit. The first one works
the second without merit cannot be earned through works must be believed by romans 10:9+10 God given then the works is
putting on the word mind and doing it.
Dear Ronald, this conversation really gets very interesting. Both sides, we, have brought our points forward.
Whaw, many things to answer, I don't know where to start from.
a. Personally i don't rely much on verses in the Old Testament about life in Heaven since people's knowledge during those times about heavenly things and eternal life was very vague and limited. There was a progressive revelation about these things which was clarified and completed by Jesus in New Testament
b. In Acts 2"22-35 in verses 27 and 31 the word HADES is written in the greek text not HELL, actually everywhere where the greek text writes Hades the KJV Bible writes Hell, I don't know why because they are not really the same thing. I believe that Jesus' soul went to Hades in Abraham's bosom, that's why He said to that thief who was crucified next to Him that "today he would be with Him in Heaven". How do you explain that? If Jesus' soul was dead, how could the thief's soul be with Him in Heaven since they were both dead in the grave? In Acts 2"27 says "you will not abandon my soul in Hades". So God resurrected Jesus in the 3rd day, He didn't abandon Jesus in Hades.
The same in 1 Cor 15"55 "O death, where is thy sting? O Hades, where is thy victory?" is the proper translation. I have noticed that the KJV translates as grave almost everywhere where the greek writes death or Hades. Sometime I will make and post a list of all those.
c. Even if I accept the belief about an immortal spirit and mortal soul, this still doesn't explain how come Jesus went to the dead and preached the gospel to them. I think it is clear that Peter doesn't mean the spiritually dead but the physically dead people.Those verses, as you say, are hard to explain why, but it seems to me that Jesus gave a second opportunity to those who never heard of Him and the Gospel He preached(?)
to be cont..
Ronald
d. My opinion about spirit, soul, body. The spirit is us, our personality, thoughts, emotions etc. The soul is where our spirit is placed/located. Spirit and soul are nseparable and immortal. The physical body is a vehicle that is used by our spirit/soul to live in this physical world and it is of course mortal. If soul and not spirit is us, then where is God's, angels', demons' personality/life/emotions are located since they don't have souls.
e. Now about ancient philosophy, yes there have been attemps from the very begining to compromise philosophy with christianity. But those attemps in the early times failed. Also attempts were made by the Gnostics (Eastern beliefs) to enter christianity. Gnosis in greek means Knowledge, so the gnostics were people that claimed that they had some kind of a deeper and mysterious knowledge that ordinary believers didn't have. But we know that Paul as well as the other apostles fought all these. Jesus in Revelation gives warnings to churches to avoid those. You are right about St Augustin and others in the 2nd and 3rd centuaries AD that made attempts to import philosophy into christianity but never really succeded. In contrast to those, christianity wrongly took many things from Judaism, like the priests and temples and all those things that are still present in Catholicism and Orthodoxy.
f. Acts 20:7-10 is about the story of that young man who was sleeping during Paul's teaching and fell down from the first floor dead. In verse 10 says "And Paul went down, and fell on him, and embracing him said, Trouble not yourselves; for his life is in him." But the greek text says "soul" not 'Life". His soul was in him. Why? Was there a case that the soul would be out of him, if soul simply dies?
Many other things can be said, but I think I may have tired you.
God Blessings
not to one up so I'm with you, its your priviledge to believe what you will and also mine. All I know in my personal
life as the scripture says I have had lots of scripturally based signs miracles and wonders. P.S. I believe jesus Christ
is Gods only begotten son, and I believe in God almighty and In His Gift Holy spirit and these three work together
as one to deliver mankind from the adversary Gods arch enemy.
are passive .?
of heaven and thrown down to earth in genesis. He was in eden and tricked eve but he was not a snake, the term serpent
is used in reference to sly influence its a figure of speech. In eden he was beautiful look at references in isaiah and jeremiah
also he was known as then bright and morning star. The significants of that is jesus Christ is now the morning star. How
wise is our God.
Consequently, without time or space, a moment in time ,if you will, without fear, who walk in the same paths of those that do and will love Him.
A pure condition that only looks too Him.
Even with the questions as the apostles had, we follow Him, waiting to see His next miracle, that will happen.
Are we like the apostles that are waiting and watching!?
Beholding the truths of His word?
How this one, Judas could not see, is an example of brothers whom I've known who have fallen by the wayside! Including myself!
Is falling from grace the same as Satan entering into the soul. What would it take to change our mind? Money?
These things we may soon find out!
Living in a time, this evil one waiting once again to control us.
Being a follower of Christ is, and will be the constant subject of interference in our relationship to our Father.
Is falling from grace the same as denial?
I think not, if it were, than Judas would not have tried giving back the money!
If I am wrong, please show me why.
John 15:2 is a frightening verse; in that on the surface it would seem that someone could be saved but end up being lost. Romans 11:21-22 seems to reflect the same sort of picture. Since scripture can't contradict itself; this can't mean salvation can be lost. It does reflect that there are some who would gain prominence, reputations or financial gain from association with the church but whose hearts were never in it. Continuation is a theme here in verse 9 (perseverance of the saints in a way). Verse 16 makes it clear once again that God chose us for these good fruits; i.e. good works.
Going back to verse 2; the second part shows how God is doing the purging (or chastisement; and testing through trials) to gain MORE fruit for those truly in Him. The parable of the sower and the seeds ( Matthew 13:3-9 and in Luke) illustrates how those in Him must get to the point of producing fruit. This fruit comes from Him; therefore He is gaining a return for His investment or redemption achieved through the Atonement.
The concept of being called friends is once again attached to the idea of producing LASTING fruit as WELL as seeing answered prayers. This should give us pause to reflect on our own spiritual growth as well as being selective in WHO prays for us; looking for those that show evidence of these things.
Finally; we have verse 17 about the COMMAND to love one another; followed by the fact that men will HATE us because of Christ in us. This theme goes on to verse 26 where the Comforter is promised to do the talking; as well as the Disciples own eyewitness testimony in the following verse as part of their unique ministry. In light of this; we have to question churches that the world readily accepts in light of whether the TRUE and whole Gospel is being preached.
The scriptures I quoted doesn't disagree with there being two groups of people IN THIS AGE.
Two thirds shall die and a third left there in.
I do know one thing. God has a purpose and a time for everything; therefore, You and I and everyone on this site ARE IN THE PLACE OF GOD. HIS WORKS.
Genesis 50:19-20
God Bless YOU, his body.
He was kicked out three times.
Positionally
Bodily ( Luke 10:18)
Eternally
Gen 11 (who is the "us" in verse 7....trinity perhaps)(also, note LORD in all caps and then refer to Rev 19:16 "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS......that is Jesus as well) Jesus came down and confounded the language in His spiritual form.
[1] And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.
[2] And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.
[3] And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter.
[4] And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
[5] And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.
[6] And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
[7] Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
[8] So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
[9] Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the LORD did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the LORD scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth.
Prov 8
[22] The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
[23] I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
[24] When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
[25] Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
[26] While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world.
[27] When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
[28] When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep:
[29] When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
[30] Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him;
As we continue here and the following chapter; we see how Christ gave comfort and assurance immediately before the trial at Gethsemene which He knew was imminent. Heaven itself is mentioned right off the bat in verse 3. This; of course leads to confusion and further questions.
The answer in verse 6 is that no one comes to the Father but by me (Christ). So; the access to heaven is the priority; and that essentially is showing them how the Father makes Himself known. Previously; the emphasis was on understanding who Christ was and that no one could know HIM unless the Father had elected them. Thomas was told that he was soon to understand in verse 7; followed by Phillip's request to see the Father (obviously he still didn't get things completely). He then explains the Godhead and how the Holy Spirit would come soon at Pentacost to remain with them (verse 18-21) and continues to show how prayers are answered in understanding these concepts. He promises peace despite the remorse over His upcoming death; and comfort as the Holy Spirit will remind them of these things; with further reminders of these things just spoken as well.
Before we do a V-8 moment as to the apparent dullness of mind these 12 Disciples appeared to demonstrate; we should all be reminded that without the Holy Spirit we are toast; and if it weren't for restraint being enacted by God Satan would have destroyed all of us and the whole earth by now. We should see at least occasionally as Christ saw; that we are indeed seated at heavenly places and perceive the spiritual world and the unseen and not focus in on what our five senses and the devil are constantly promoting. We need to take on the milk of the Word as babes before we can mature and discipline helps; nonetheless we can do nothing without Him ( John 15:5).
As we continue here and the following chapter; we see how Christ gave comfort and assurance immediately before the trial at Gethsemene which He knew was imminent. Heaven itself is mentioned right off the bat in verse 3. This; of course leads to confusion and further questions.
The answer in verse 6 is that no one comes to the Father but by me (Christ). So; the access to heaven is the priority; and that essentially is showing them how the Father makes Himself known. Previously; the emphasis was on understanding who Christ was and that no one could know HIM unless the Father had elected them. Thomas was told that he was soon to understand in verse 7; followed by Phillip's request to see the Father (obviously he still didn't get things completely). He then explains the Godhead and how the Holy Spirit would come soon at Pentacost to remain with them (verse 18-21) and continues to show how prayers are answered in understanding these concepts. He promises peace despite the remorse over His upcoming death; and comfort as the Holy Spirit will remind them of these things; with further reminders of these things just spoken as well.
Before we do a V-8 moment as to the apparent dullness of mind these 12 Disciples appeared to demonstrate; we should all be reminded that without the Holy Spirit we are toast; and if it weren't for restraint being enacted by God Satan would have destroyed all of us and the whole earth by now. We should see at least occasionally as Christ saw; that we are indeed seated at heavenly places and perceive the spiritual world and the unseen and not focus in on what our five senses and the devil are constantly promoting. We need to take on the milk of the Word as babes before we can mature and discipline helps; nonetheless we can do nothing without Him ( John 15:5).
I might add that a manicure refines us on the outside, reshaping our nails. But the Word of God refines us on the inside, reshaping our innermost person. One (the manicure) is superficial and optional, but the other (the Word of God) is deep and needed by all believers.