Bible Questions & Discussion PAGE 992

The Lord expects us to be aware of things happening..Not be asleep spiritually.

Genesis 1:14 - And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: Matthew 16:3

And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?

Matthew 24:24

For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Mark 16:20

And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following.

Luke 21:25

And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

John 4:48

Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.

Acts 1:7

And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

1 Thessalonians 5:1

But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2 Timothy 4:2-4 - Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

Be watchful, looking up. Keep a ear out for 3rd Temple building in Israel; completion.

Gigi,

Thank you for your words of encouragement. You've said some things that truly ministered to me. What stands out the most is "We all can err and make mistakes in interpretation." It takes an honest believer to admit that, and I say amen to that. There's something I said here a long while back. I said it's not what I say that is truth, it's not what you say (Not you personally, but anyone), it's not what anyone of us says that is truth. It's God's word (Logos) alone that is truth.

And yes, we are fallible beings. It doesn't mean were stupid, but we are incapable of knowing the mind of God. I do value the things everyone here has to share. I don't have to agree with it all, but I do value it. We're all to be as the Bereans and search the scriptures daily to see if the things we are being told are true.

But then again, what is truth? Is truth just a bunch of words written in the pages of a book we call the Bible? Many would say "Yes, God's word is the truth" (And it is), but then we turn around in our fallible human minds we think we understand but do we really? I think a lot of it has to do with human pride. I would be the first to raise my hand and say "Guilty."

Once again, what is truth? Here's what truth is to me, but first, here's what truth is not. It's not what I say, period! To me, truth is a person, and that person is Jesus Christ. Jesus said in John 14:6, "I am the WAY, I am the TRUTH, and I am the LIFE."

So, do you or I or anyone else here have the truth? We do if we have Christ. He is the only truth a believer has. It's not head knowledge and it's not the words written in a book, but Christ Himself. If there were no Bibles, we would still have Christ, and He's all the truth we need!

James Reynolds My only comment in this is anything that produces worry doubt or fear for me is a red

flag spiritually because all people believing in Gods Word were handled within there scope of understanding

i.E. Moses burning bush attention getter, look at Gideon with the fleece, the shepherds with there flocks

fear not! Also in 2 Timothy God has not given us the spirit of fear but power love and a sound mind so

anything outside of that realm should be of concern. Anything spiritual must be lined up with gods Word

which is the source of all truth in all realms of Life and Godliness.

Part 1.

The story of the church of the New Testament isn't the story of victory after victory. There were major battles that had to be fought to keep the early church united. In particular, there were two early disagreements in the church and one battle against false doctrine that had the potential to divide the church or to send the church on a downward spiral into false doctrine.

First, Acts 6:1-7.In the early church, there quickly arose a disagreement between the Hebraic Jewish Christians and the Grecian Jewish Christians. Both groups were Christian. Also, both groups were Jewish. But one group spoke Hebrew and the other group spoke Greek (thus the distinction between Hebraic Jewish Christians and Grecian Jewish Christians). The disagreement came fromthe Grecian Jewish Christians whose widows were being neglected in the daily distribution of food. So, in essence this was an ethic controversy. The Grecian Jewish Christians brought their grievance to the apostles. This threatened the unity of the church, so the apostles acted. The oversaw the selection of specific men of Grecian background (we conjecture that they were Grecian based on their names) to oversee the distribution of food to the Grecian widows. This solution worked well. Unity continued until the battle for unity occurred. That's usually how it works. Peace reigns for a while, then another controversy emerges

Indeed brother S. Spencer: keep on fishing - your thoughts are very good & not wasted - certainly thought-provoking.

Along with 1 Timothy 2:13, we have 1 Corinthians 11:3. That specific order of creation was to be observed both in our daily lives in the world & especially in the daily life of the Church. And for the greater part it was, but for a variety of reasons, that order became distorted then dismantled, so in the name of 'equality & fairness to all', that order & our roles (in family, society & Church) have taken on a different perspective. No doubt, with some husbands not fulfilling their God-given responsibilities of godly leadership and of sacrificial love & care to their wives & children, this too has contributed to the woman's desire to be un-submitting to him & to take over his responsibilities. Sin is very much evident in the breakdown of society & we are being conditioned to accept what is abnormal to be normal in the God-ordained family & also in Church order & responsibility.

Your thoughtful statement: "Perhaps if anyone else could have been around to offer Adam that fruit just maybe he wouldn't have taken it." True, maybe he wouldn't have, or, would the convincing justifiable reasons given to Adam by the offeror of the fruit or whether to choose to obey the Giver of the Command not to eat, still apply? How interestingly our minds work, using all our reasoning powers to fulfil a lust, rather than refusing anything that God has forbidden. The Word that should have been at the forefront of Adam's mind is, "God has spoken & I will obey", and not, 'Adam has determined & God will surely understand'. And isn't that the very same way we manage to justify our sins & failings before God today? That Adam wasn't deceived, cannot justify the fact that he too succumbed to temptation & disobedience; he still had to be removed from God's Presence, as Eve was. And still God still wanted the order of creation to be maintained in the family, society & His Church.

Two fundamentally different Christologies developed in the early Church, namely a "low" oradoptionistChristology, and a "high" or "incarnation Christology."The chronology of the development of these early Christologies is a matter of debate within contemporary scholarship.

The "low Christology" or "adoptionist Christology" is the belief "that God exalted Jesus to be his Son by raising him from the dead," thereby raising him to "divine status." According to the "evolutionary model "evolutionary theories," the Christological understanding of Christ developed over time, as witnessed in the Gospels, with the earliest Christians believing that Jesus was a human who was exalted, c.q.adoptedas God's Son, when he was resurrected. Later beliefs shifted the exaltation to his baptism, birth, and subsequently to the idea of his eternal existence, as witnessed in the Gospel of John. This evolutionary model was very influential, and the "low Christology" has long been regarded as the oldest Christology.

The other early Christology is "high Christology," which is "the view that Jesus was a pre-existent divine being who became a human, did the Father's will on earth, and then was taken back up into heaven whence he had originally come,"and from where heappeared on earth. According to Hurtado, a proponent of anEarly High Christology, the devotion to Jesus as divine originated in early Jewish Christianity, and not later or under the influence of pagan religions and Gentile converts.The Pauline letters, which are the earliest Christian writings, already show "a well-developed pattern of Christian devotion already conventionalized and apparently uncontroversial.

Some Christians began to worshipJesus "a Lord"

This is the down side to trying to pattern our beliefs with the early Church rather than relying on the present scripture and Holyspirit. They were divided on several issues.

Christianity in the first century

by Wikipedia.

( GRADUAL SPLIT OF EARLY CHRISTIANITY AND JUDAISM, )

Early Christianity developed out of theeschatologicalministry ofJesus. Subsequent to Jesus' death, his earliest followers formed anapocalypticmessianicJewish sectduring the lateSecond Temple periodof the 1st century. Initially believing thatJesus' resurrectionwas the start of the endtime, their beliefs soon changed in the expectedSecond Comingof Jesus and the start ofGod's Kingdomat a later point in time.

Paul the Apostle, a Jew who had persecuted theearly Christians,convertedand started to proselytize among theGentiles. According to Paul, Gentile converts could be allowed exemption from mostJewish commandments, arguing that all arejustified by faithin Jesus. This was part of a ( GRADUAL SPLIT OF EARLY CHRISTIANITY AND JUDAISM, ) as Christianity became a distinct religion including predominantly Gentile adherence.

Here you see a period of transition.

After the death of Jesus, Christianity first emerged as a sect of Judaism as practiced in theRoman province of Judea. The first Christians were allJews, who constituted aSecond TempleJewish sect with anapocalypticeschatology. Among other schools of thought, some Jews regarded Jesus asLordandresurrectedmessiah, and the eternally existingSon of God, expecting thesecond comingof Jesus and the start ofGod's Kingdom. They pressed fellow Jews to prepare for these events and to follow "the way" of the Lord. They believedYahwehto be the only true God,the god of Israel, and considered Jesus to be themessiah(Christ), as prophesied in theJewish scriptures, which they held to be authoritative and sacred. They held faithfully to the Torah, including acceptance ofGentile convertsbased on a version of theNoachide laws.

This is why we use the Holyspirit to guide our practices.

Genesis 1:14 , Psalms 104:19,

Exodus 23:14, Nehemiah 9:6-38,

1 Thessalonians 5:1-23, Act 1:7-11, Daniel 2:20-22,

Psalms 16:7, Matthew 21:31-41, Daniel 7:23-27, 2 Timothy 3:1-7, Isaiah 33:6, Jeremiah 8:7, Ezekiel 12:27, Daniel 7:2-27, Daniel 9:2-27, Daniel 11:2-45 -continues- Daniel 12:1-4, Luke 21:5-36, Revelation, the whole book,

Psalms 106:3, Psalms 31:15,

Deuteronomy 18:10, Deuteronomy 18:14, 2 Kings 21:6,

1 Chronicles 12:32, Esther 1:14,

Psalms 9:9, Psalms 62:8,

Matthew 16:2-3,

Hopefully these are helpful in your study.

Tom Not to my understanding the devil biblically is the Kingpin He doesn't show true colors so to speak but satan

is regard to His indirect approach i.e. circumstances situations and conditions that he manipulates and sets up i.e.

like roaring lion seeking who he may devour. Also everything the true God has done he tries to manipulate to make

look stupid. That's why experience is no guarantee for truth unless it lines up with scripture.

Thank you!

Matthew Henry's Bible Commentary (concise)

Acts 19:1-7.

Paul, at Ephesus, found some religious persons, who looked to Jesus as the Messiah. They had not been led to expect the miraculous powers of the Holy Ghost, nor were they informed that the gospel was especially the ministration of the Spirit. But they spake as ready to welcome the notice of it. Paul shows them that John never design that those he baptized should rest there, but told them that they should believe on Him who should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. They thankfully accepted the discovery, and were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. The Holy Ghost came upon them in a surprising, overpowering manner; they spake with tongues, and prophesied, as the apostles and the first Gentile coverts did. Though we do not now expect miraculous powers, yet all who profess to be disciples of Christ, should be called on to examine whether they have received the seal of the Holy Ghost, in his sanctifying influences, to the sincerity of their faith. Many seem not to have heard that there is a Holy Ghost, and many deem all that is spoken concerning his graces and comforts, to be delusion. Of such it may properly be inquired, "Unto what, then, were ye baptized?" for they evidently know not the meaning of that outward sign on which they place great dependence.

for they evidently know not the meaning of that ( OUTWARD SIGN )on which they place great dependence.

He called their water baptism an outward sign! He see it the way some of us do.

Water baptism ritually points to the baptism of the Holyspirit.

Acts 19:4.

And when they believed, by believing they were baptized in the name Jesus.

Acts 19:5.

Amen.

Gigi Skip comment on Mathew 3:2 wrong context.

Hi Rick

That sounds like a wild situation. Boy, I'd walk out, too.

I have participated in two charismatic style church fellowships in my walk.

One an Assembly of God and the other a FourSquare church.

I never observed any of what you described. Services were orderly and reverent. So, I think there are wide degrees of differences from one congregation to another, since many are "independent" or "non denominational"

But, we are to test the spirits in such situations. I would not remain in a fellowship that overemphasized emotional manifestations that they attribute to the Holy Spirit over the reading and preaching from the word, singing, praising, and praying in an orderly way.

God's ways for us are not sensual and sensational. We are to have a sober, controlled mindset as we joyfully worship Him and interact with one another in holy ways.

Free for alls are not usually grounded in correctly dividing the Word or being led by the Holy Spirit.

I left this type of church when it was evident that most were readily embracing the. Newest " move of the Holy Spirit" without questioning it. I thought that that was a dangerous way to approach one's spiritual walk.

I still have close friends from those situations who have been dear to me for 40 years.

I am blessed to have them in my life.

Revelation 20:2,

Is Satin and the Devil the same methodically?

Explain more on times and Seasons with bible verses

Bro Dan

You are so right on explaining what is meant by "baptizing with water and the Spirit"

So many here just seem to resist the idea of water baptism. If some think it is an action added to the work of Christ, then we should not lay hands on someone or pray for them to be "baptized in the Holy Spirit" because it involves action on the human part. We cannot "see" what God does to a new believer when they are water baptized, but, by faith, one believes that God is at work in this rite because He instituted it, just like He instituted the Lord's Supper.

Partaking of the Supper is an action, but like baptism by water or laying on of hands, it isn't adding to the finished work of God in Christ. It is just following in the way Jesus instructed. We pray, it is an action. I would ask those who balk at water baptism because it is a "work" added to that of Christ, "is praying a work that adds to the work of Christ , since God knows what we need before we ask?

Matthew 10:29-34,

Revelation 8:8-9, Hosea 4:1-19, vrs. 3, 2 Esdras 5:1-13,

Thanks Rick, I'll toast to that!

Gigi My concern with the charismatic movement so to speak is there not lining up what they do with what is written,

my wife and i went to an assembly that were doing some off the wall stuff, then the so called pastor walked out on

the pulpit picked up a telephone back in the day and said when he hung up that God was telling Him what to do

for the congregation. The man who invited us there when everything was done looked like he was on a drug, but I

ask Him one question the whole time there nobody opened a bible! He had no words and we never went back, so

if these are what people are seeing I would think somethings wrong too. Thank God we have the Truth of Scripture.

Alex

Water baptism as John, Jesus , the apostles, and disciples did throughout the apostolic times was never a part of the OT law.

Hi Ethel Mae The psalms in the bible were song and written by David the King inspired of God of course or men

under His leadership they are prayer and prays and wisdom and asking forgiveness and as everything else in Gods Word

perfect! So Go to them for a spiritual Heart Boost!

I felt led to tell you personal experience. 1st time I saw something in resemblance of what you said. I was working 110 hours weeks + taking care of small children. Totally sleep deprived. I was driving after leaving work little early, right before sun rose. The freeway was well lit & from median, I saw dark shadow dart across freeway, in front of my vehicle, going aprox.60mph. It really rattled me. I actually watched it trying to figure out what the image was. Fear gripped me, I prayed. I chalked it up to sleep deprivation but even then, that was rattling. I felt in that moment danger. I stopped working as many hours. I may have seen a few more dark shadow creatures during my life, seems to be during dangerous situations.

Here are some scriptures I hope will be helpful.

Ephesians 6:10-18, Hebrews 13:2, 2 Samuel 22:3-20,

1 Chronicles 21:15, Exodus 10:21,

1 Corinthians 13:1-13,

Hi Rick

Good job explaining this.

The disciples on Pentecost were compelled to open their mouths and speak by the Holy Spirit. They had no preconceived ideas of what to expect. I think that this is the normal way that the Spirit works with this gift.

For some, it comes during times of singing , praise, or prayer. But you are right, in the assembly it is to be orderly, and we do have some control over exercising it once it is received.

I do not believe that everyone receives this gift. Paul's teachngs in Corinthians seems to indicate that the Spirit assigns the gifts as He sees fit. And, giving the body as an analogy, it isn't all made up of one single part, but has diverse kinds of parts. A hand cannot be a foot, or a mouth be an eye. The same with gifts, everyone does not have the same gift, but gifts differ from person to person. Speaking in tongues should not be a litmus test to determine if someone has the Spirit or not. It is the truth of the word that determines this.

It says that no one can say Jesus is Lord without the Spirit. That is the proof.

We should not judge anyone's "spiritual level" by the gifts that operate on a person.

That is being a "respecter of persons".

We just believe that those who claim Jesus as Lord and Savior have the Spirit in them and us working in and through them, whether we "see" it or not.

If Jesus is the same yesterday, today, tomorrow, he did not have to be glorified to be the head of the church. The disciples were with him for three plus years. He was leading them, His infant church. He also knew that the eternal plan was for Hom to return to heaven to be glorified and that the Holy Spirit would CONTINUE His work of growing the church.

I just don't believe the church started at Pentecost. Scripture does not state that anywhere.

The Holy Spirit always points us back to Jesus, the author and perfect or of or faith, not to Himself. His mission is to bring people to Jesus. Jesus is the focus of our faith, because in Him we can know what God is like in a way that makes human sense, since we are but crestures.

Over-emphasizing the Holy Spirit is often done in charismatic circles, but I think that is misplaced "allegiance".

We worship a Triune God who wants us to know Him through His Son, Jesus Christ by the power and work of the Holy Spirit.

Darnita One other point even in my life I've been to assembles where people were supposedly operating

other spiritual gifts but again so out of order and not lining up with scripture so me and my family just walked

out, no profit. Everything the true God does in an assembly or church should be decent and in order which is

why Paul spent 1 Corinthians chapters 12, 13 and 14 they had major confusion with matters of the Spirit.

Precious friends, no one is "content/ignoring tons of scripture" that commands we be 'water baptized' Today, Under God's GRACE. We have "studied" Much, Prayerfully And Carefully, And Have Found ONLY "ONE Baptism" for Today, and it is NOT "water"! Link

We Must Be Very Careful not "to blaspheme The Holy Spirit" = (as the Jews did) "attributing The 'Work Of The Holy Spirit' unto men/Satan, Instead Of To God." Matthew 12:31; Mark 3:28-30 Correct?

Some 'May Be confused' so, Other "Confirming" studies are here

Solving water Confusion:

Part 1 Link

Part 2 Link

Israel's 'water' for the priesthood = various washings:

Part 1 Link

Part 2 Link

All are invited to study "ALL The Holy Scriptures" on this Important Issue - Be Encouraged!

Gigi I have taken the time to do that but again when you start getting into the original language translations

then your thought of changing scripture so wisdom says don't go there. You can't upset an apple cart if you dont

supply more apples.

Jesse, I appreciate your well thought out sincere posts as well. So many people contribute good words to ponder and hold up to the word to see if the view is supported by Scrpture or not.

We have an obligation to do that as well as an obligation to speak sound biblical doctrine to others.

We may have many words in our minds, some may be of questionable scriptural merit, but we should not post those thoughts, but only those that we believe honor the truth of God's word. We all can err and have make mistakes in inerpretation, but there is a whole body of writing online from devout Christian thinkers over the centuries who have spent their lives searching, studying, and teaching scriptures and the doctrines of the church that we can read and find out more about a view and help us form a mindset that aligns with revealed truth.

Some on here do not value the contributions of these forefathers, thinking each person can decide for themselves how to interpret Scripture. We are all fallible, and I do not think that anyone on their own can correctly interpret scripture and doctrinal views solitarily without the input of others. I think it is foolish to believe that, that is why I research and have done so all my life.

I have had to change my thinking on some things over the years. We can stay flexible enough to let the Spirit mold our mind to conform with truth.

I deeply appreciate what I read on this site. I am blessed everyone I read on it.

Jesse You can't wash away old man nature needs to be spiritually toasted, cooked from inside out. This

sounds odd I'm getting hungry.