Bible Discussion Replies PAGE 239

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Thank you GiGi - I appreciated your insight into those Scriptures that I find invaluable in any discussion as we've been having here.

I can't disagree with what you've shared, as I too, see that all of God's Laws are holy, special, & pertinent to knowing the Will of God & pleasing Him by following them. I also understand the passages you shared, viz Romans 7:22,23 & Romans 8:1-5, in a similar way as you, except to highlight these points:

a. In Romans chap 8: "the law of sin & death" (v2), I don't see it as simply as being freed from "the condemnation that we acquire from sinning against the Holy Law of God". This is certainly true that the witness of our new lives in Christ is evidence of no longer standing condemned before God. But Paul writing, "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh", strongly suggests that "what the law could not do" by its weakness (inability) in its successful working in sinful flesh, refers directly to the Decalogue, which really is the Law of sin & death, or we can read it as 'the Law that reveals sin & ultimately leads to death'.

After we have been freed from the limitations & constraints of such a Law, the righteousness that is contained in that Law (v4), might yet be fulfilled in us. And how is this possible? Only by the Spirit's application & enabling us to perform it in our lives. On its own, the Law was totally incapable of doing this - it wasn't given for that purpose - just to show sin & its severity & permanence. The Israelite who truly loved God & desired to please Him would have been tormented by the magnitude of his sins, as the Law in simple terms showed him, & if it were not for those sacrifices proving that God still heard their cries & promised to cover their sins for that time, the Israelite would have found no relief at all. Onto Page 2.

THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH ?

JESUS SAID:

Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth. Mat.5:5

And has made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Rev. 5:10

Question:

How can the meek inherit the earth?

The answer is here: Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit, saith the Lord of hosts- Zechariah 4:6

Zechariah 4:1-6

1 And the angel that talked with me came again, and waked me, as a MAN that is wakened out of his sleep.

2 And said unto me, What seest thou?

And I said, I have looked, and

behold (1) a candlestick all of gold

with (2) a bowl upon the top of it,

and (3) his seven lamps thereon,

and (4)seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:

3 And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.

Interpreting the above Scriptures:

1 Candlestick is the Church(Rev.1:19)of the LORD- His body;

2 with a bowl upon the top of it: -the bowl is for storing and conserving the oil produced by the two olive trees to the Candlestick-that is for the anointed Church of the LORD;

3 and his seven lamps thereon:-the seven lamps are the seven Spirits of God-Rev.4:v.5;

4 and seven pipes to the seven lamps which are upon the top thereof: the 7 lamps -7 spirits of GOD- are placed on the top of the pipes to enlighten the Church of the LORD mainly in this time of Apocalypse -the END of the times and establishment of GOD's Kingdom Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit, saith the Lord of hosts, and confirmed by Mat.5:5 combined with Revelation 5:10, among other biblical references.

4 So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these my lord?

5 Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No my lord.

6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying,This is the Word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit, says the Lord of hosts.

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My perception then, is that believers generally aren't looking at this matter in such a way. Why? Because it is believed & unquestionably accepted that 'these are clearly God's Commands, written in the Word for us, therefore they are relevant & must be obeyed; end of story'.

But that is not the full story given to us from the Word. If we focus only on obedience to a very very basic set of Commandments to adhere to & we deny the Work of the Spirit in our lives, we would certainly fail. Likewise, if we want to include the Decalogue along with the Spirit's Ministry to show us our sins that are outside or beyond those original parameters, then does the Spirit ever negate what was given in the Decalogue? In other words, does the Spirit's Ministry not also include the Ten Commandments, making them, as all other Words from Him, very special & applicable to us personally?

Then one more thing which perplexes me: if we hold the Decalogue in such high esteem as to say it is very relevant to us today & should not be dismissed, why do most Christians reject the 4th Commandment & give excuses for not obeying it or changing the name or day to suit them? The Decalogue is a complete package from God (to Israel) - not one Command should be broken; it's a case of accepting or rejecting the whole - not dissecting it to suit them or us. As I've mentioned before, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that Old Law - it is simply not relevant to the one in Christ now, & for the Jew especially, finding welcome liberty from a Law that could never give him cleansing, victory, & assurance of eternity. And for those of us who are "without the Law" & also the Jew now in Christ, we need only look to & rest upon the Spirit of Grace & Peace, to lead us perfectly through life, teaching us ALL that the Father requires of us to please Him - something the Old Law could never achieve nor designed to do. GBU

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Thank you brother Giannis for your fine post. And I do agree with what you've written, not having tired me at all in my reading of it.

It is my belief that Christians are generally absorbed by the fact that if God has spoken anywhere in the Bible then those words must apply to all of us today. And that is true to an some extent, but as you would also know, the Word must be rightly divided. If God commanded the Israelites to go into Canaan & destroy all the heathen Gentiles there, we clearly don't use that command to do likewise in our own or nearby lands. So we then conclude that only God's Moral Laws (leaving aside the 4th Commandment!) that we obey because they must apply to us, but not those commands that were Israel-specific, prophet-specific, etc.

What I maintain, & from my reading & study of the Word, is that we must look beyond the letter of the Law delivered by God, but to rightly include the reason for the giving of the Law, to whom it was delivered, its limited time frame, & intended results of blessing or punishment. I agree that the Old Mosaic Covenant, which included the Decalogue, was a shadow of the New, but I see that when I include not just the mighty Commandments therein, but also consider & apply these other factors listed above, then the whole package of the Decalogue takes on a completely different understanding. And this is an understanding, if I were to avoid, would continue to wrestle with my spirit & knowledge, not giving me peace. So this is why I come on very strong on this matter, because the Decalogue was something I was taught from a young age, but now in my revived spirit state, find that the Word of God gives me much more to help understand the matter more fully. Onto Page 2.

Chris

THE PERSON OF HOLY SPIRIT-AN UNKNOWN PERSON

The person of the Holy Spirit is not a ghost as is written in English language, but a Person. As a Person, as JESUS was in flesh and bones, he is completely unknown, and he has several missions, as JESUS said: John 16:12-15 & 8-11:

12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth is come, he will guide you into all truth: for HE SHALL NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF; but whatsoever HE SHALL HEAR, THAT SHALL HE SPEAK: and he will shew you things to come.

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

15 All things that the Father has are mine:therefore said I, that he shall take of mine,and shall shew it unto you.

8 When he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of Judgment:

9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;

10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

11 Of Judgment, because the prince of this world is Judged.

WOULDN'T THE PERSON OF THE HOLY SPIRIT BE THE YOUNGER BROTHER OF JESUS? LUKE 15:32 - THE LAWFUL / LEGITIMATE BROTHER OF JESUS?

- The Person of he Holy Spirit has not genealogy as JESUS has; why? Because he is not a Jew.

- The NAME of JESUS is known of men, and is also known of the angels, and He is known of the demons too. But the person of the Holy Spirit has a NAME written that no MAN knows, but he himself. He has not genealogy as JESUS has.

- JESUS came from heaven and He was born in Israel. John 6:v.38 - I came down from heaven not to do mine own will, but the will of Him that sent me.

In other hand, the prophetic birth of the person of Holy Spirit is not in Israel, its in a Gentile nation.His birth is within the body of Christ-the Church-and as JESUS said, he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that he speaks, he shall receive of mine, he shall take of mine.

JESUS existed before the world was, the person of HS is the ancient of days

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That question would require us to further examine the merits of the New Covenant; but briefly to your question, I don't believe that the Spirit would again resurrect a Law upon us, one which has been superseded by the New. All that is contained in the New Covenant in Christ's Blood entirely covers all that the one in Christ needs to know & practise to please God. The Decalogue could never do this & was never intended to, even as we read in Galatians 3:21, "if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." No Law could ever instil or even be the cause of righteousness to rise within us - and so Jesus' Coming was necessary, not only for the redemption of the sinner, but that sinner would never have to adhere to a set of Laws that only led to his eternal demise. Why should we then, we who have been revived, released, & given power to live in & by the Spirit, ever need to resort to the Letter that kills?

And you asked, "what Commandments(s) from God's 10 Commandments we are not required to follow now under the New Covenant? And why." The Decalogue is now abrogated through Christ's death, so none of the 10 Commandments with its purpose & penalties ever apply to the believer. Why? Simply because we have God Himself by His Holy Spirit in us to teach, lead, & empower us to know ALL His Commandments, which the Decalogue could never do - and was never designed to do. I always wonder, 'do believers actually understand this - really believing that the Spirit in them alone can fill us with much more than that old Law that was done away could ever do, with the advent of the New Covenant - that it is now perfectly fulfilled in Christ, Who fulfilled the Old entirely? Blessings.

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I appreciate your comments Bro. Dan; and yes, God's Laws were essential then, as it is now, not only to understand the Mind of God & His Will for mankind, but also that we might live righteously before Him & with all due consideration for others. And true, societies & govts have created their own laws largely based on what was learned from God's Word, or for those "without the Law", on the natural instincts & inclinations of their minds, doing what they believed was right for their societies. Of course, many of those Laws have since been altered, even mangled, because man has preferred to continue to follow his own inclinations from sin-gripped minds & persuasions & pressures from others, instead of adhering to what is good & right.

So what does a believer in Christ do now, who has heard of, understands, & uses the Decalogue as a measure against the state of his own understanding & life's practises? Had the Holy Spirit not been sent to indwell & minister in the believer to guide him comprehensively to doing all of God's Will in his life, then yes, he must resort to that Law as his sole Standard, & very much so to include the 4th Commandment. And let's not forget, that just as obeying that Law is imperative, so also the penalties, or else what would the Law serve, if only a nice abridged set of rules for living without consequences for disobedience?

I won't again raise the matter of that Law given solely to Israel: I have raised it before with you. But on the matter of either fully accepting the Law, fully abiding by it, & to suffer the consequences for disobeying it (as we read in the Bible), then how do we stand before God? You asked, "would the Holy Spirit guide us - to not follow God's 10 Commandments?" Onto Page 2.

Covenants: Comparing Old and New Testaments; blessings and curses.

Deuteronomy 7:7-10 show how God did not choose israel due to its size; but in His love they were called out. They are reminded of being loved and protected coming out of Egypt; but verse 9 shows how the Covenant brings lovingkindness to those who love Him; and judgment is shown in verse 10 to those who hate Him.

The original promises; of course were set forth as far back as Abraham in Genesis 15 and 17 which would continue with his descendants until they finally entered the Promised Land. In actuality; many in Reformed circles think that an informal covenant was involved with God's creation of Adam and Eve (at least in the creation of Eve to be his wife and the consummation of the marriage relationship even without formal ceremony involved). The rainbow was God's original covenant which God promised not to once again flood the entire earth. Interestingly animals are implied as well ( Gen. 9:13

In reality; these were all things instigated by God. Adam was asleep when the rib was taken out of him; and likewise was the situation with Abraham when he was in a deep sleep in Genesis 15:12. God was to use men such as Moses to rescue His people; but He was only using the power of God through the rod; for instance to perform miracles; and God of course drew Pharoah's army to a watery grave in the Red Sea.

The same concept involves many of Israel's conquests; angels would often fight supporting men; or fight alone such as the example of Exodus 14:14 and 2 Kings 19:35 against the Assyrians when 185,000 were destroyed by a single angel in a night.

God also draws all those who will come to Him as the Gospel of John and many other scriptures indicate. God has given the Spirit nowadays to permanently reside in a Christian ( Ephesians 1:13). God's eternal plans in the Godhead allowed for Christ's atonement to be efficacious for all who would believe and be "granted repentance" ( Acts 11:18).

If we are in Christ, we have the power that can only come from Him. Therefore, we determine the times, we determine the day of judgment!

Having these things therefore as now part of our nature , we surely are a new creature, and are given to prepare another peculiar people through the same Holy Spirit!

Another generation who shall learn from us the things that will empower the children,He so much loves, another generation!

Our strength once again is made perfect, through the weakness that we have all inherited in Adam.

Let no man beguile you through false understanding, the understanding we live in is the revelation of the life of Christ!

The shed blood of His only begotten son! The power that lives!!! Repent and be Baptized

Jema, Music appreciation is a good thing. There are many musical compositions, songs, and genres to enjoy. But my problem with the music that has been dominant in generations since the 60's is that it is worldly minded, often having lyrics that speak of immoral things. Many have occultic lyrics. many of the artists were or are involved with drugs/alcohol abuse, occultic fascinations and pagan religious affiliation. For me, I choose to not have anything to do with music such as this. I rejected such pop music early on when I became an adult and was more dedicated to following the Lord.

Everyone must prayerfully make choices about the entertainment/hobbies they partake of or pursue. Living out our life in Christ is sacred in every day life just as much as it is when we are in church service. We should have an overall consistent lifestyle that involves godly actions, words, thoughts, preferences, affections, appetites, and witness. This is how I want to live my life.

There are some very beautiful secular songs out there. But overall, secular music is pretty godless and not very innocent, in my opinion.

Jema, we all have things in our life that give us pleasure. If yours is music, then indulge in it according to the Spirit's leading. I love to grow things. So gardening is what I am enjoying now that I am retired. But I must also subject this pleasure to the will of the Holy Spirit, too. I love to cook new recipes and make up my own. I love to write out ideas. I love to be around nature. These are all good things to enjoy. But even so, we can indulge in these things so much that we ignore God or push Him aside when we wish to commune with Him. So, in everything that is permissible, we are to control our participation in such a way that our hobbies/secular interests do not master us or lead us into sin.

Thanks for letting me know that you love music. I have found that the more you sing out loud., the better your voice becomes, as it is trained by the music heard

A final warning on appearance of Antichrist

No doubt a repeated theme; it seems prescient to once again drive home the point that "peace and security" will be the mantra bringing in the Antichrist to launching his campaign to take over the world. ( 1 Thess. 5:3). The "bloodless coup" which Revelation 6:1 seems to indicate will be accompanied by a man of intrigue understanding "dark sentences" ( Daniel 8:23). That verse is also packed with the description of all world rulers at the peak of corruption at the time this event occurs. These verses indicate occult origins; which the reader will note was prevalent particularly with Adolf Hitler in World War two.

No doubt like a chameleon this man will be able to give an appearance that will appeal to men of all audiences. As to the amount of success he will have with his military resume before this time is somewhat speculative; it would seem from Daniel 7:8 that his description as the "little horn" means that he comes from relative obsurity; then suddenly starts controlling the world scene. The Abraham accords which encompass dividing the land for gain ( Dan. 11:39) through massive economic payments and redistribution certainly seem like they will be the catalyst or at least one major component of the Daniel 9:27 confirming of this covenant.

Just how he will pull off explaining the Resurrection of the dead and the Rapture is subject to speculation. It is also uncertain exactly when the first seal event occurs; it seems that it could be immediately after the Rapture; but perhaps there will be a time of transition beforehand just to alleviate the inevitable chaos; if indeed my eschatological view is correct on the Pre-Trib rapture.

Resistance on a human level based on the previous scriptural references clearly is going to be futile (see also Rev. 13:4). No doubt the full power will come after the assassination and possession (I contend with the angel from the abyss Rev. 9:11.)

see Zech 11:17.

I have to be honest , I love music , all kinds from the 1950's to the 1990's but when it comes to church services , they are to the glory and praise of God , I love all the old tradition hymn's and the organ . I have a horrible singing voice though :( .

Conditional vs unconditional prophecies

In general; there is a set series of events that are going to consume the time period known as "Jacob's trouble" ( Jeremiah 30:7).

The incense of the prayers of the saints which encompass the initial scene in Revelation 5:8 prior to the seal judgments; and Revelation 8:3-4 (in that case before the Trumpet Judgments) show a sort of collective mass of prayers; either reflecting directly the persecutions on the earth at the time; or answering Millennia old prayers of saints long since forgotten by man; but held by God. (see Psalm 56:8).

Because of this; we see a difference in prophetic utterances such as Acts 21:10; and Acts 11:27-28. Such utterances indicate that the choices made (i.e. Paul heading straight to Jerusalem; preparing for a famine) certainly make these things conditional.

In Revelation it is generally structured indicating great events with associated signs and wonders that are already designed and predicted in detail. However; as with anything else there is latitude apparently for the two prophets to cause things as they wish in regard to droughts; etc. ( Rev. 11:6). Undoubtably some details are not straightforward (such as which part of the world the 1/4 die in the seal judgments). Safe to say it ain't going to be a fun time here on planet earth; that's for sure.

Looking at the Second Coming of Christ; no doubt great deception will occur with multitudes of false prophets at the time of the end. Antichrist Himself will basically act as a substitute for Christ; and will be the only man other than Judas Iscariot to be doomed to perdition. ( John 17:12; 2 Thess. 2:3). God will use him to make rulers agree to submit to his authority; as well as destroying the false "Mystery Babylon" which encompasses all the world's false religions sort of rolled into one. ( Revelation 18:17).

There are suspect individuals that certainly match many characteristics of such an individual. More in next post.

Further insights on prophecy: Conspiracies vs fulfillment

The line of demarcation exists when we consider 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7. For now; the gates of hell do not prevail against the church ( Matt. 16:18); but in the Tribulation or time of Jacob's trouble they will be overcome ( Rev. 13:7; Daniel 7:25). While we remain as salt and light the putrification is held back along with the final fulfillments of prophecies.

Ezekiel 38 is something geopolitically that seems to have aligned uniquely with Iran; Turkey and Russian agreements. As with anything else; those who look to the current war in Ukraine or any other conflicts basically are repeating centuries old patterns.

The downfall of currencies also seems to have been thwarted temporarily as of the last few days; apparently some small countries are utilizing the dollar more; and there seems to be both a new gold standard backed currency with the BRICS nations; and the concept of electronic currency concurrently happening; for now. Certainly there are harbingers of things to come. The recent lowering in prices of gold and silver (See Zephaniah 1:18; Ezekiel 7:19; and James 5:3) could indicate a collapse either just before the Tribulation and or during it (perhaps further enforced by Antichrist). To have the Mark of the Beast all other trade methodologies must be cancelled; I don't believe that can happen prior to the Rapture of the church in entirety.

Isaiah 8:12 reminds us not to call everything "conspiracy" that everyone else says is. The two dangers we have are thinking everything is an indication that the end has come; OR belittling the literal final fulfillment after all the predictions of the past proved false. Such could of course be argued with verses such as 1 Cor. 15:52 on the Rapture (Rapturo in Latin). Full Preterists think everything happened by 70 AD. Most think it was partially fulfilled; which again makes the most sense with a literal interpretation of the texts.

More to come...

Approaching the end: Convergence of truth and lie

In the infinite counsels of God; it has been predetermined for Satan to reach the pinnacle of his insane world rule; where for a period of 42 months all authority is given to him to conquer the saints; to enforce a worldwide "mark" of ownership; and finally have all the unregenerate worship him. No doubt this upcoming reign is known by the enemy of our souls; who naturally will take credit for himself for fulfilling all the prophecies of the "Maitreya" or 12th Imam (and no doubt his chosen vessel the Antichrist will take credit for things himself as well ( 2 Thess. 2:4).)

The New Agers already have the "reeducation" program for mankind as a set event in the near future (i.e. us being taken out and removed from the earth). It wouldn't surprise me that Christ Himself as well as His armies (us) will be considered alien invaders when the Battle of Armageddon commences (see Psalm 2; Revelation 19).

It has been brought up that people will become more religious rather than less as the Lord's coming approaches. Clearly as I have stated many times by the sixth seal Atheism will cease (although perhaps it will increase until the Rapture).

Whether a "self fulfilling" prophecy; or something attempted by man to speed up events false signs and wonders will eventually be lauded as true when Antichrist appears to fulfill everyone's expectations. We see the power vacuum that exists in Europe since the great dictators of World War two setting the stage for the rise of One World Government; and we see evolving groups of nations or world regions that will; for the "hour" in the Tribulation only "receive a Kingdom" sharing willingly their authority with the Beast. ( Rev. 17:13).

When the timing is off; we have seen what appeared to be Babylon rising in the early 1990s in Iraq; for instance. We saw the 10 Nation EU grow to 13; but the final fruition likely is a 10 region league in the Mediterranean or 10 world regions.

Greetings in Christ S Spencer

See, I did not disagree of you, I only meant to remember the James 2:10's preaching.

Also Paul Apostle said: Galatians 4:22-25 and 29-30

22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.

24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage(of the Enemy) with her children.

29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

30 Nevertheless what saith the Scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

What was the population of Israel in the time of the prophet Elijah? Million(s)? But GOD said: 18 Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel, all the knees which have not bowed unto Baal, and every mouth which hath not kissed him-1Kings.19:18

1Kings 20:15 - 15 Then he numbered the young men of the princes of the provinces, and they were two hundred and thirty two: and after them he numbered ALL THE PEOPLE, even all the children of Israel, being seven thousand. (The others were of the rebel Israel idolater, in Revelation synagogue of Satan, and in John 8:44, sons of ...

Alex,

Most of what you have communicated in this post is good analysis of the relationship between the bronze serpent and the work of Christ on the cross. The last part about the Man/Child I firmly disagree with.

This account of Moses erecting up the bronze serpent is a shadow pointing to Christ on the cross who became sin for us so that the sting of the law of sin and death would not have victory over us anymore.

Hi Jema, Agreed.

I do think that how contemporary music is presented in many churches today reflect to way present generations have been exposed to the music styles and special effects of worldly music. Certainly MTV and those that followed influenced how music is presented. Performances have become increasingly more and more visual sometimes even overpowering the vocals. Christian musicians, music directors, church leaders have approved the usage of these worldly aspects of music more and more.

I grew up in the era where music concerts began to be prevalent. I went to a few as a teenager (in the 70's). As an adult I pretty much rejected indulging in secular music. I went to a few Christian concerts (back in the 80's). Even then I was put off by the emphasis among the crowd of adulation of the performers. So I stopped going to these concerts. Then after 2000 I was invited to go to a few Christian concerts and was overwhelmed by the special effects. The light show, smoke, and big screen images of the performers with them dancing and jumping around the stage seemed to me to be less about God and more about the performers and the performance. After enduring a few of these and feeling literally sick, I said, "No more". Then this style was showing up in the churches during services. Uuuugh!

I say all this because the way "sacred" music is being presented in churches today has a direct correlation to the way people were groomed for it when they were growing up. It saddens me greatly, because like you, musical worship should be all about God and none about self. It should reflect that we deem God and His name as "hallowed" and that coming before Him in worship should be spiritual, not carnal. This does not mean that we cannot sing with vigor and gladness and use many types of instruments and differing music styles. Rather, the use of these things should always put the focus on God and exalt Him from the heart as well as with our voice, hands, and instruments.

Sorry but I dont know the verse.But when Jesus called the disiples he said come he did not say Peter come.Beacuse he said Lazers *sorry for mispelling* just he came.If he said come everyone dead around whould come.

SSpencer

Yes, "to atonement of sin GOD requires perfection", so to understand this deeply mystery of redemption then the Word of GOD takes us millennia back, i.e. to Genesis, and describes for millennia the battle between GOD and the DEVIL in the process of redemption of man through the birth of "a perfect Lamb" , our Lord JESUS Christ, who still was in the bosom of the Father.

That said, only the Omnipotence and Omniscience of GOD could provide a perfect Plan for MAN's salvation that was raptured by the Devil,even in the garden of Eden(a clue:Matt.23:35 combined with John 8:44).Having happened an usurpation of GOD's creation by the Devil, a former and superpowerful Cherub, even in the garden of Eden,then GOD Almighty made a long term Plan of works(6 Days/6 millenniums) to redeem His creation in six Days, i.e. to redeem His created man from the Devil's power, and the first step to start His Plan of restoration, was to clothe Adam and Eve decently, by a GOD's clothe, replacing the leaves of the fig tree - the clothe that was derived from the former Cherub, the Devil, the fig tree, that is the MAN of sin, the tree of good and evil.

After this, the Omnipotent GOD make the same Devil's captived Adam and Eve bring forth Abel,a keeper of sheep, and Eve was silent, and said nothing. But before Abel,was born Caim and Eve said:"I have gotten a man from the Lord".It's false, Eve lied terribly;Caim was of Devil- 1John 3:12

Satan knew Abel was GOD's seed, so he killed Abel. GOD's Plan was to seek a godly seed";Adam knew his wife again; Eve bare a son-Seth-,saying: GOD has appointed me another seed instead of Abel whom Cain slew. And to Seth there was born a son; Enos, then began men to call upon the NAME of the Lord. Genesis 5 describes the generation of the godly seed that GOD did seek until Noah, 1656 years after Adam.

Later(2080 after Adam)was born Abraham;2500 years after Adam was born Moses, the battle against Satan is more strong and intense. GOD's works continues

You say that your husband has died , I'm so sorry . You are not responsible for his behaviour and he isn't responsible for yours . It can break our hearts when someone we love turns away from our God . You must try to move on , you are still here , God wants you to be alive today . He hasn't finished showing you His lovingkindness yet , try to enjoy the rest of your life that God has granted you , stay strong in your faith , cling to your God and He will bless you every day . Thank Him and trust Him and He will give you happy days in His love .

I agree with you , any songs or music in a church should glorify and praise God alone , not those performing it , they are trying to glorify themselves and feed their own egos and please people and themselves . It totally detracts from what a church service should be , which is to the glory of God and to honour Him .

Strangely enough that debate along with that of the veracity or lack thereof of the moon landing came into a contentious discussion at my small group. Isaiah 40:22 talks about the "circle" of the earth; and there are verses such as Luke 17:34-36 which discuss those asleep (in night) and those awake working during the day in the field. This shows the different time zones. The seasons also make things pretty clear; it is winter in the southern hemisphere and summer in the northern currently; vice verse in 6 months. This surely shows the nearly spherical (in reality slightly pear shape) of the earth. The fact that there is 6 months of light and darkness in each pole which gradually reduces in length and the sun at it's highest point is lower than anywhere else shows evidence as well; and also indicates the 23 degree tilt of the earth (hence the sun only shines straight up to the south of the tropic of cancer; north of capricorn.

Movement of stars with it's annual cycle coming back to where it started also shows how the earth rotates around the sun in close to 365 days (leap year bringing things closer to exact measurement). Again; creful examination of the scriptures is needed; as indeed the sun does move through the solar system while we and other planets rotate around it. The local star group moves through local constellations; in turn the whole galaxy moves in a circle as well as through space (with upcoming Andromeda "collision" predicted in some millions of years from now.

Tidal forces are not just on the earth but on the moon (whose curvature is obvious). We also see in Job an indication of the hydrological cycle (moving of course in opposite directions for cyclone and anticyclone between the northern and southern hemisphere) such as indicated in Job 28:26 and other verses.

I'm not sure of other verses; this is more of a logic argument here. Obviously; if the world was flat gravity would be disproportionate. Hope some of this helps.

Salvation

Romans 3:10,12 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:there is non that seeketh after God.

Psalms 33:12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance.

Matthew 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

Mark 13:20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

John 15:19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

1 Corinthians 1:27,28 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

James 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

1 Peter 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Your hair is given you for a covering, don't cut your hair and you are always covered.

People think just because they use Yewah name when they play their music it doesn't mean they are saved. I am so sickening when the church let their peoples come in the house of God and sing Rap. I don't understand Church music is to make your soul happy, peaceful. I think that kind of music is not the place in the home of God to me, just saying, comment on the Richard H Priday.

Thanks Giannis,

Because of the large input on this subject, I wanted to really study this section of Romans 7 and 8 carefully to understand it with an open mind.

Good Evening Alex,

Glad to see that you changed you name ID back to Alex from Pierre. I know you have good by several screen names int he past months: Nocal, Alex N, and also one that I think was your last name. It helps for people to stick with one name over time.

I know you said that your daughter changed yours to Pierre. It is good that you changed back to Alex for those of us who share this forum with you I hope you are doing well. Even though I rarely find anything in your posts that I can agree with, I do care for you and pray for you almost every day. Be blessed, Alex.

HI all, I'm new to this, so let me just ask the question, towit: Is there anywhere in the Bible that can be used to quell the argument that the Earth is FLAT?? There seem to be SO MANY folks that think we live on a disk of some sort, that it's not funny anymore.

Of course they can't answer the simple question of WHAT is at the edge of this disk, but if anyone could help answer my question, it would be much appreciated.

AKM

Hi Lodebar,

Thanks for sharing your life saving testimony, God does miracles John 14:13. Amen