Bible Discussion Replies PAGE 74

Greetings

James 2:21 "Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?"

James 2:22 "Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?"

Hebrews 10:24 "And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:"

Blessings

The harmony of God's Word is so beautiful and bursting with hope! Thank you for these promises and reassurance! They are much needed in such a time as this!

I will pray for your friend Kim. It sounds like a difficult situation. I pray she will continue in faith and not give up on the Lord.

Dear Chris,

I want to take a moment to thank you for your thoughtful response to my statements regarding the olive tree. While we may not see eye to eye on every detail, I truly value the dialogue we share. It is clear that there are certain points where we do find common ground, and I find that very encouraging.

It is a real pleasure to read your responses and to consider your perspective as we both continue to learn and grow in our understanding. I appreciate the time and care you put into your thoughts, and I look forward to continuing our discussions.

Thank you once again.

With respect and gratitude,

LBooth

Hello again in peace "Lbooth1955". I didn't get an answer to the question I asked about the day of God's wrath? Where is it mentioned? I think that Jesus is at least described well at the end of Revelation. I might be able to help you a little here when I checked it up, I found out, God's wrath. I do not doubt that you do not know it yourself, but to make the word alive for other readers. The day of God's wrath is mentioned in Proverbs 11:4 in Zeph 1:15 in Romans 2:5 and many warnings from Jesus and the Apostles mention some in Matthew 24:48-51 and Mat 25:13 Rev 14:19-20 And of course this word when the Earth is to be harvested. The day of God's wrath is when He begins to reap the Earth. So just to mention it in the book of Rev we understand that we are talking about what was and what is. And afterwards we have glorious days with the Lord and finally a new Earth and a new Heaven are created. I completely agree that the Bible was written for the Jews first and then the Gentiles. Those words have been mentioned many times, probably a whole study if you want. But when you have received the Holy Spirit, you can understand the reading. Therefore, the Jews deserve our thanks for their faithfulness to God.And last but not least, we must never forget that they are the first to receive the Word. But as we know, they did not accept Jesus when He visit Israel. But they will see Him, and we expect that Jesus has made everything ready for us. The day we lay down our earthly bodies we are truly with Him. We can't do anything more, so if we come to the last regret about something we didn't do, it's too late of course. I'm sure you've gotten good answers from others here in the forum.To be honest,I haven't read them all. Because we have something going on here now.And the day of the Lord's wrath is coming quickly.But before it we receive many warnings, as we have read the Lord's words in Matthew 24.Here Jesus says, among other things, wars, earthquakes, and so on.There we are. GBu

Jer.17.24 "Hallowed"

And it shall come to pass, if ye diligently hearken unto me, saith the Lord, to bring in no burden through the gates of this city on the sabbath day, but hallow the sabbath day, to do no work therein;"

God set blessings and curse befor man. 'if ye diligently hearken unto me' ine does so with the ear of faith. If any man is in Christ he is a new creation.Law of the Spirit has delivered us from the law of sin and death.' (Rom.8.1-4)

Secte who mix two laws of liberty and sin are compared to dogs turning to its vomit. 'I have seen the light and turn to vomit are the false brethren. " For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning./... to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire."(2 Pet.2.20-22)

When you see Gothic cathedrals and its grandeur is amazing; sects build mega churches and when you hear limited Atonement of seven dispensations you are pardoned to wonder whence did they garner wealth to build them up. Churches robbed princes and merchant princes on the threat of hell fire, while sects swindle widows and the poor in their congregation promising untold riches waiting to be tapped.

Diligently abiding in Christ so a believer called to be a saint need not carry any burden to the city that hath foundations whose maker and builder is God seems to be rare these days. May God help us to be dandled as an infant up on many promises of God.

"For thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees."(Isa.66.12)

Conclusion: priestly garments Jer.17.1 (2 of 2)

Those who rejected to enter into God's rest hallowed by God are under curse. God had foreseen their rejection in His wisdom and instituted the Law ofMoses. Under which the same principle applies Whole or nothing. "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." (Jas.2.10)

God set a meansurement which had everything to do with doctrine of Christ, so this compound number of 12 is made by the 'only begotten Son'. The Spirit sets it 4x3=12. On the other hand we have the vision of Ezekiel and in very telling way instructs us and it the number 6, signifying those who refusedto enter into the rest of God. It is exemplified in the two onyx stones, one for curse and the other for blessing. . So Judah's sin is a collective curse than of one man.God in this vision is indicating the measurement of the outer darkness.The Spirit takes over- 'he hand of the Lord was upon me'and tells him, "Son of man, behold with thine eyes, and hear with thine ears, and set thine heart upon all that I shall shew thee' (Ezek.40.4) The measuringreed,'and in the man's hand a measuring reed of six cubits long '.(v.5)

In the end wehave multiples of 6, "It was round about eighteen thousand measures: and the name of the city from that day shall be, The Lord is there.". Significant is the mark of beast is 6-6-6 indicating the body-soul,spirit. 18,000 is made up of 6x6x6x1000. For comparison 144,000 is made up 12x12x12x1000

Imposter churches having given a false interpretation to the Covenant has ever since taken over the same sin of Judah. Hence the false teachers instead of entering into thr God's rest has made a concord with darkness and cannot distinguish between holy and what is not. for instance tJer.17.24 "And it shall come to pass, if ye diligently hearken unto me, saith the Lord, to bring in no burden through the gates of this city on the sabbath day, but hallow the sabbath day, to do no work therein".

Hi everyone, since I open my King James Bible every day at random, ps a morning ritual to say the least. I have to have something to share if the need arises. It is the Lord who will make us ready. Always be prepared! Help us on our journey to understand that the Holy Spirit is here with us.

In uncertainty:

Luke 1:17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.

Matthew 17:16 And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.

Matthew 26:40 And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour?

Safe and Sound:

1 Cor 5:5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.

Eph 4:12-13 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Eph 3:18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;

So dear everyone, these are all trustworthy words, believe it and live it. He has so much to show us, and so much we have to live for. When we see this, all Scripture becomes manifest. Trust the Word. A few words on a sunny Sunday morning. Have a good day everyone in Jesus Christ name!

Jer.17.1 "Sin" (1 of 2)

"The sin of Judah is written with a pen of iron, and with the point of a diamond: it is graven upon the table of their heart, and upon the horns of your altars;"

As conclusion to the priestly garments the office of Aaron was under the law of sin and death. No better example we can have than the two onyx stones "Six of their names on one stone, and the other six names of the rest on the other stone, according to their birth./ With the work of an engraver in stone, like the engravings of a signet, shalt thou engrave."(Exod.28.9-11) . Law of sin and death was indicated by the Law of Moses and the Decalogue. What was the sin of Judah? Law ofthe Spirit set all heavenly blessings andof the earth,"The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come,"-Gen.49.10). Israel's rejection of the king that God had in mind and choice of Saul for a king showed a slippery path, cutting of Israel's blessing, and theAaron's office was a testimony to it.

The Word was God and the Word became flesh, the command number Four in the priestly garments testified Aaron stood in relation to Melchizedk 'but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.'The golden altar with four horns proclaims, east,west,north south the order of Melcizedk ('King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;'-Heb.7.2) establishes the Law of the Spirit. "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death/ For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:/That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."(Rom.8.2-4)

The Covenant in seven days set forth in the very outset of the Bible sets the Law of the Spirit. This accepts whosoever comes to God is accepted in the Son

Hi GiGi. What a sad lonely situation that your friend Kim is in. I know it can be so easy to blame God for the painful things that come into our lives, especially when we know we haven't done anything wrong to receive such undeserving hardship or discipline. She seems like she is now in a state where it is just self-pity & the overwhelming magnitude of her problems that are consuming her mind and spirit and she sees no way out of it. Unfortunately, we can all go through suffering to a minor or major extent and with her stroke, loss of husband and the indifference of her own daughter, all this together can be far too much to bear.

You have consistently tried to help her and your act of love should let her know that she still has a friend "that stickest closer" than her very own kin. As well, you can't be expected to devote all your time with her and neglect your own life and responsibilities at home. Even with her severe physical problems and limitations, you would know what her interests are, and whether suggesting something like that might prompt her to engage with you better. Anyway, those were just some thoughts, as I recall a friend who had multiple sclerosis for over ten years after which he ended his life by consuming all his medications in one hit. But in the time he was alive, I tried to keep up with visits, even for a short time to just chat, or take him to the bank, chemist, or hospital. Fortunately, he was the type that looked forward to my visits, as he probably did to others who came by, but his pain and sense of hopelessness in any improvement in quality of life, caused him to consider release in death better than bearing with the constant pain (he wasn't a believer, and very resistant to the Gospel). So, I feel very much for you too GiGi, as it can't be easy at all to see a dear one in such a state and being helpless to render her effective help. But God can!! So, we must pray and continue to plead His Hand of Divine help and blessing.

Page 3.

There's much more to write to respond to your other points, but that would not be worthwhile in such a discussion. Though I hope that what I have shared might have covered those other points.

In summary, from Paul's illustration in Romans chap 11, I don't see believing Gentiles being of placed in "Israel's tree" (i.e. becoming an extension of Israel), but that we have been given the opportunity and privilege of being brought in, from being outcasts, into the life-giving tree planted by God, being nourished & blessed along with Israel who have turned to faith in Christ just as us. Only one tree, whose branches were to be faithful and fruitful to their LORD and minister Truth and blessing to the heathen. They failed, many lost their position, and the heathen were then invited to join others in this common faith whose foundation & root only found in Christ. Thank you Lbooth1955 for these discussions - I have enjoyed them and have indeed considered what you've presented. As much as I can understand your belief, particularly of those of the 'wild Olive Tree', my reading of the passage & Paul's direct speech to the Gentiles doesn't convince me to alter or force any other interpretation. That cast off Israel do not form their own 'wild Olive Tree', rather remain in such a state of separation until their blinders come off. Blessings.

Page 2.

1 i. "Do we partake of Israel's tree? Do we fit the description of the wild graft?" As stated previously & without duplicating it here, we do fit the description of the "wild graft", simply because of Paul's reference to Gentiles, & by him speaking to them ( Romans 11:13-24). I realize that you read this differently, but I simply can't do so, for the passage seems very clear to me, especially when Paul warns the Gentiles not to boast of this great privilege (vv18,19); not to do as Israel has done (vv21,22); and a reminder to them of God's Plan/that mystery of both becoming one, once Israel takes off her blinders (vv25,26).

2 i. "Isaiah spoke of God's fruitful plant becoming wild - Isaiah 5:2-4". God planted a good vine, but it brought forth wild grapes. The whole vine became corrupted with rottenness and was to be destroyed (vv5,6). Whereas, Paul's illustration was for the removal of those of Israel who with hardened hearts & blinded eyes, were not fit to take up space and pollute the good Olive Tree & their position given to those of the Gentiles who would hear and believe. The vine was to be destroyed - the Olive Tree was, is and will be preserved.

2 k. "Ezekiel spoke of grafting branches of Judah and Israel together - Eze 37:16-20". This passage came up recently, to which I responded. These verses don't speak of "grafting" rather of 'joining'. The earlier verses (vv1-14) refer to Israel's future political and spiritual revival (the bones coming together and then their breathing into new existence). Then vv15-22, where Judah (Southern Kingdom) and Israel (Northern Kingdom) will one day come together and be joined together as one under Christ. The picture here is of these brothers who were once distinct and separate in both their ruler ship and exile, would one day be joined together, but not engrafted one into the other. To Page 3.

Thanks Lbooth1955. That was an extensive list of verses you shared to examine. Most of them I do agree with (on their own), in context to the chapter/book, but will only highlight a few requiring comments, using your point structure.

1 c. "Since the church exists now, the most popular identification of the graft is you" (using Romans 11:17). I understand that Paul's use of the natural Olive Tree and the Wild Olive Tree is NOT to compare Israel/blind faithless Israel with the Church, but simply comparing them to the Gentiles. Of course, when God receives the Gentiles by Grace through Faith based on Calvary, then they do become the Church of Christ in union (as one) with believing Israel.

But in Paul's illustration, I see it simply as two distinct trees (of the same genus, but one specially selected, planted and nurtured, and the other, uncultivated, unkempt, fit for nothing). As much as olives from a good tree can't be readily eaten in its natural form, more so from a wild tree whose olives are extremely bitter & best discarded. As a people, Gentiles are that wild Olive Tree fit for nothing, yet so as to be acceptable and nourished by God, He has brought us (those saved through faith) and grafted us into the natural good tree. This doesn't mean these believing Gentiles become spiritual Israel, for we only now partake of the same nourishment and blessings from the root of the tree & nothing else ( Romans 11:17,18). Israel and believing Gentiles are distinct in the Plan and economies of God, but together, by our common faith in Christ, are one as Christ's Church. To Page 2.

Sounds awful. I pray that God gives you wisdom and that her daughter and relation won't be taking advantage of her.

I; as per the norm this summer took a trip hours out of town and returned the same day; I got electric in the cabin although he has to check the heater and close an outlet later this week. I couldn't think of anything else when he asked me what to put on since lights work inside and outside the door. Between the snake (probably a harmless garter); in the porta potty and the fiberglass insulation opened up and exposed that wasn't used upstairs exposed to the heat the air wasn't suitable to spend a night there so once again I have come home after 10 hrs of driving; at least I got to hand out a GOSPEL tract up there so all wasn't lost.

My friend from church says he was willing to pay to rent the cabin; but I mentioned it didn't have running water but i said he can stay for free.

Keep me posted on that prayer request.

RP

Dear Friends,

I am asking for prayer once again for my friend Kim. She is disabled from a stroke she had 30 years ago, but the past 5 years have been so difficult with her husband dying of leukemia two years ago and she is unable to take care of herself due to being unstable of her feet.

Her daughter and her partner live with Kim, but barely take care of her. She spends all of her day in her bed. Her room is full of various junk food that she consumes instead of regular meals. Her daughter and partner do not get her up and in her wheelchair to take her out of her room to the living room to visit with them or share a movie or meal.

This really saddens me. Her doctor recommended for her to go to an assisted living situation but she won't for several reasons, she wants to stay in her home and she does not wish to displace her daughter due to needing to sell the house to pay down her assets until she can then have Medicare take care of the expenses of assisted living care.

She rarely contacts me now. I have taken her to a few appointments but does not wish for me to come over and just hang out.

She is lonely, depressed, and mad at God for having her life be so difficult and full of trials when she is trying to live in faith.

She is 67.

I appreciate if a few of you would keep her in your prayers often. Thank you.

Amen Lbooth1955.

Very well spoken!

I'm very busy this weekend,playing catch up!

Hopefully I can join you guys soon.

God bless.

Dear Friends in Christ,

I just want to take a moment to say how much I truly enjoy discussing Scripture with all of you. Even when we don't fully agree on certain issues, I value the fellowship and the opportunity to search God's Word together. Each conversation challenges me to think more deeply, to listen with humility, and to grow in knowledge and understanding.

The beauty of our unity in Christ is not that we all see every detail the same way, but that we share the same Lord and Savior who unites us by His Spirit. I'm grateful for the respect and kindness shown in our discussions, and I pray that the Lord continues to sharpen us through His Word.

May the Lord of Glory bless each of you richly in your walk with Him, and may His truth guide us into greater wisdom and love.

In Christ,

L.Booth

Hi Chris,

Beautifully written, thanks.

I think we're pretty close with this one...

Here's my take!

Paul never teaches that believers in the Body of Christ can lose salvation, though some verses are misread that way. For example, 1 Corinthians 9:27 warns of being a "castaway," but Paul is referring to disqualification from reward or service, not loss of eternal life. In Galatians 5:4, "fallen from grace" means leaving the principle of grace for law-keeping, not forfeiting salvation. 2 Corinthians 13:5 calls for self-examination of genuine faith, not teaching that salvation can be undone. Likewise, Colossians 1:23 emphasizes perseverance as evidence of true faith.

In contrast, Paul repeatedly assures believers of eternal security. Romans 8:38-39 declares that nothing can separate us from Christ's love. Ephesians 1:13-14 teaches that believers are sealed with the Spirit until redemption. Philippians 1:6 promises that God will complete His saving work. 2 Timothy 1:12 affirms Christ's power to keep what is entrusted to Him. Romans 11:29 states that God's gifts and calling are without repentance.

Thus, the "warning" passages deal with reward, service, and testimony, while Paul's consistent teaching is that salvation itself is secure in Christ.

God Bless.

Hi Free,

Thanks for your feedback.

I believe knowing Who We Are in Christ Matters, it's crucial.

To understand OUR identity in Christ, we must distinguish between God's program for Israel and His program for the Body of Christ. Covenant theology often blends these, spiritualizing Israel's promises and applying them to the Church. Yet God's covenants with Israel are unconditional and tied to their national FUTURE.

Israel was promised land, a throne, and blessing through the Abrahamic, Davidic, and New Covenants ( Gen. 12:1-3; 2 Sam. 7:12-16; Jer. 31:31-34). The prophets foretold Messiah reigning from Jerusalem, with Israel restored as head of the NATIONS ( Isa. 2:1-4; Zech. 14:9,16). These remain unfulfilled and will be realized at Christ's return.

Paul, however, revealed a "mystery" hidden from ages past ( Eph. 3:1-9). The Body of Christ is not Israel, but a new creation with a heavenly destiny. Our blessings are spiritual and heavenly ( Eph. 1:3), our justification is by grace apart from the law ( Rom. 3:28), and we are united to Christ as His Body ( 1 Cor. 12:13). Sealed with the Spirit ( Eph. 1:13), we display God's wisdom in the heavens.

This also explains why Revelation does not address the Body of Christ as so many subscribe too. It only continues Israel's prophetic program: Jacob's trouble ( Jer. 30:7), Daniel's seventieth week ( Dan. 9:24-27), the sealing of Israel's tribes ( Rev. 7), and Messiah's earthly reign ( Rev. 20). Its judgments and kingdom promises fit Israel's covenants, NOT Paul's revelation of grace. The Church, delivered from wrath ( 1 Thess. 1:10; 5:9), is absent.

Knowing who we are in Christ preserves both Israel's earthly hope and the Church's heavenly calling, magnifying God's faithfulness to Israel and the Body of Christ.

Blessing

Free,

Amen sister-in-Christ. Just got back from vacation in Norway,

Bestrong in the Lord,

Exod.38. 35 "Priestly garments" (4 of 4)

"And it shall be upon Aaron to minister: and his sound shall be heard when he goeth in unto the holy place before the Lord, and when he cometh out, that he die not."

Gospel preaching is a trumpet blasting and it is sustained. So much so people quaked. "And when the voice of the trumpet sounded long, and waxed louder and louder, Moses spake, and God answered him by a voice."(Exod.19.19) On the

other how does the doctrine of Christ sound? "And all bare him witness, and wondered at the gracious words which proceeded out of his mouth." ( Lk 4.21) and Moses as the double for the Son testifies, "My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass."(Deut.32.2) The golden bell coupled with pomegrate round about the hem (v.34) makes a circle recalling the word of God,, 'Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.'(Rom.10;18;Isa.55.11) This throws additional significance to the mist mentioned in Gen.2,5-6 "And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the Lord God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground./But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.." Moses' speech iinspired by the Word that was with God in the beginning knows no time as we make of it. Word of God had foreseen the perfidious heart of the nation of Israel. Thus the Covenant stipulated the role of the fruit-bearing tree with seed in itself,(Gen.1.11) and Jesus tells them,"Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word./Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do."(Jn.8.43-44) The Law of Moses revolved about the Ten Commandments where the number 10 was set as condemnation. Law of sin and death, 'that he die not." Death is the focus here

Exod.28.34-35 Priestly Garments-3

" A golden bell and a pomegranate, a golden bell and a pomegranate, upon the hem of the robe round about."

Recalling an Oscar Hammerstein lyric,'a bell is no bell till you ring it', the golden bell is coupled with a pomegranate to indicate how our walk should be. What we hear instead is Jesus Talk but in terms of works, it is zero. Hypocrisy is abounding but here is a warning to abound in our works. 'Upon the hem of the robe round about makes' a circle, is it not? These circles are repeated in two manners wreaths of gold and rings as in this verse,"And thou shalt make two rings of gold, and thou shalt put them upon the two ends of the breastplate in the border thereof, which is in the side of the ephod inward." There are four rings altogether. They signify the four horns of the golden altar, also a square, (Exod.30,1,6;Rev.8.6)

"And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne./And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand./ And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth." (8.3-5) These rings primarily represent Melchizedek,'Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually. "(Heb.7.3).Secondary meaning is the single measurement,"according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel." (Rev.21.17)

Angels of waters, of fire, of wind and of wrath (Rev.14.17-20) another angel is of the Lord "Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him" (Exod.23.20-21).because 'my name is in him'

2.'pure gold at the ends; of wreathen work' host of angels (v.14)

Page 3

iv. The graft could be cut off just as the broken (conditional, covenantal) 11:21-22

v. The graft does NOT constitute 'all Israel' (but a part) - 11:24-26

c. Do these details fit: 1) All Gentiles 2) dispensational position, 3) church 4) remnant

i. If we do not fit the context, we must quit forcing ourselves in.

March 2nd, 2025

4. Who Are We

a. Don't fail to appreciate the similarities we have to the graft, though we are not a tree.

b. In some ways we are like the graft BUT in important ways we are not.

c. We are brought together as one,

i. BUT a new creature, mystery body, kept secret - Eph 2:15

d. We are saved by grace and faith,

i. BUT our faith is in the free and finished work, not faith that can be dead.

e. We partake of promises in Christ,

i. BUT we are members of His Body not branches - 1 Cor 12:13, Eph 5:30

f. We ought not boast of our blessings and should do good works,

i. BUT we are complete in Christ not in a covenant - Col 2:10

g. We are Abraham's seed by faith, heirs of promise, ( Gal 3:28)

i. BUT we are put into the fellowship of the mystery of Christ, not Israel's tree.

h. If you still struggle w/graft, know who you are in Christ. Then, you'll know who it isn't.

God Bless

PG 2

e. Much doctrinal confusion come from failing to rightly divide Prophecy and Mystery.

f. Romans 11 is where prophecy and mystery touch (see Rom 11:25-26), but

i. Do we partake of Israel's tree? Do we fit the description of the wild graft?

2. Wild and Broken Israel

a. Israel fell because of unbelief, they rejected Christ - Rom 11:20 (9:32, 10:2-3)

b. Peter speaks of unbelieving Israel and a people coming out of darkness - 1 Pet 2:6-10

c. Hebrews speaks to Israel in disbelief, and a people in the wilderness - Heb 3:12-4:2

d. John spoke of Israel not receiving, but some did receive grace/truth - John 1:11-14

e. Jesus spoke of being the vine, branches abiding in him, others broken - John 15:1-6

f. Jesus said the kingdom would be removed from blind Israel, given to"IMPORTANT" A NATION... Matt 21:33-43

g. Hosea - Israel becomes 'not my people', then receives mercy - Hos 1:9-10

h. Jeremiah wrote of Judah becoming a degenerate plant - Jer 11:16, 2:21

i. Isaiah spoke of God's fruitful plant becoming wild - Isaiah 5:2-4

j. Isaiah also spoke of a root and light coming to Gentiles - Isa 11:10, 42:6, 49:6

k. Ezekiel spoke of grafting branches of Judah and Israel together - Eze 37:16-20

l. Paul spoke already of Israel's two vessels of wrath & remnant - Rom 9:21-24, 11:5-7

m. If you struggle with the New Covenant, Hebrews, John, 'not my people', Calvinism, two

houses of Israel, MMLJ you will end up thinking we are the grafted in branches.

3. Looking Closer at the Graft

a. To get an understanding of the passage, people tend to summarize or tell stories.

i. Jews had God's blessing, but now Gentiles which leads to Israel's salvation.

b. Summarizing is good, unless it overlooks important details.

i. The roots/trees/branches already existed before the graft (prophesied) 11:18

ii. The graft is personal: "and thou" "if thou boast" " fear" - 11:18-19

iii. The graft stands by faith (the same faith that the broken refused) 11:20

see page 3

Hello Chris,

Thank you for your insight into Romans 11. I truly respect your thoughts and opinions on this important passage. However, I believe that scripture must always be interpreted with scripture. When we attempt to understand a passage without looking at supporting verses, it can open the door to missing the true meaning intended by God. For that reason, I am including my Bible Study, which carefully connects Romans 11 with other passages that shed light on its context and meaning. A casual reading of this Bible Study may not provide the clarity needed, but I believe a sincere and patient study-comparing scripture with scripture-makes Romans 11 crystal clear. Please take time to go through it slowly, as I am convinced the Word will speak for itself. Thank you again for sharing your perspective, and may the Lord continue to guide both of us as we seek His truth.

God bless,

1. Partaking of Israel's Promises

a. Romans 11 speaks of Israel's fall, what takes its place, and Israel's fulness.

b. 11:17-24 - pictures this through two olive trees, broken branches, and a wild graft.

c. Since the church exists now, the most popular identification of the graft is you.

d. This is the primary justification for identifying the church as Israel, spiritual Israel, etc.

e. Much doctrinal confusion come from failing to rightly divide Prophecy and Mystery.

f. Romans 11 is where prophecy and mystery touch (see Rom 11:25-26), but

i. Do we partake of Israel's tree? Do we fit the description of the wild graft?

2. Wild and Broken Israel

a. Israel fell because of unbelief, they rejected Christ - Rom 11:20 (9:32, 10:2-3)

b. Peter speaks of unbelieving Israel and a people coming out of darkness - 1 Pet 2:6-10

c. Hebrews speaks to Israel in disbelief, and a people in the wilderness - Heb 3:12-4:2

d. John spoke of Israel not receiving, but some did receive grace/truth - John 1:11-14

see page 2

Greetings

James 2:14-17

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?" "If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food," "And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?" "Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."

Bleesings

Greetings,

Romans 13:9 "For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

John 14:15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

John 10:30 "I and my Father are one."

Blessings

As an interesting sidenote; apparently Hillary Clinton said she would recognize our current leader for the Nobel Peace prize if he ends the Ukraine Russia war. We need to pay attention to peace being promised especially if things continue to change for the better in the world at large as a sign to convince the masses to accept the final covenant with many. Israel also is going to have to radically change its position. The situation is interesting in light of what many claim was a genuine sacrifice of the red heifer that was originally designated as a trial run.

I'm taking a brief road trip; should be back Lord willing in a couple days. Lord willing it will be safe. I may check out another church in the rural area I'm staying so I'd appreciate prayers for insight as to whether or not it is a place I can sink roots into or not which I have no doubt the Lord will make clear.

Keep looking up.

Agape; RIch P

The coming of the lawless one

Factors that bring in deception; no doubt are with music as I talked about before as well as world wide media influences with the internet. I mention humanism a lot because it presents an idyllic future for men if we have the mindset that we are capable of a peaceful coexistence. Surely our past history as mankind should shatter any illusion of that fact; and the most recent well known incident of someone promising 1000 years of glorious reign was Hitler under the Third Reich. Under that scenario there was much influence from mysticism and the concept of the master race; today it is considered through New Age that we are about to "evolve" to a more advanced level-no doubt borrowing the more recent concept of a more spontaneous stage when there are quick evolutionary shifts explaining the fossil record. We also need to pay attention to John 5:43 for this "self made" man who comes in his own name; who is promised in the future with the Antichrist beast that Israel for a time accepts. We see this prophecy indicated in Isaiah 10:20 (not the verse I was looking for but another prophetic reference to this individual).

We can't ignore the framework already in place (Abraham accords) to be what is eventually added on to with many nations and confirmed as Daniel 9:27 states. I won't tackle the issues currently there that are making the area a particular hotbed for controversy but will say that the Lord will purify His people in the Tribulation so that they are truly a righteous nation and justified to inherit all the territory promised to them in the original land covenant. They will not come to the Messiah until near the end of the Tribulation as stated in Zechariah and many other scriptures.

I can't dogmatically state this is or isn't the time of the Rapture (Rosh Hashanah). Perhaps it is; as when He does come there may be some warning to those alert and there are some unique time markers.

Thank you very much, of course "Bennymkje"!

Be strong love u