Bible Discussion Replies PAGE 90

Hi Momsage,

That is funny story and absolutely based on the true experiences of their flock. As an ex Catholic, I have experiences of being told that we were expected to give a certain amount of money to be members. Now I am all in favor of tithing my 10%. But, the mercenary approach was quite off putting.

I do agree with all you said. And, it was well put. I do love the Catholic people. My very dear friend of several decades is Catholic. Recently, her mother died. My dear friend is certain her mother is haunting their home. And, my dear friend says she is happy that her mother is haunting the house. How do I tell her, if it is not in her imagination, that the haunting is a demon? Also, my parents were Catholic. My siblings were all Catholic. My children were all baptized Catholic. I unfortunately did not leave the church til I was 37.

You know, I heard a preacher say, "The truth goes marching on," in that greater and greater light (knowledge) is given to us as time goes on. Those churches with a statement of faith that does not allow for receiving greater light are forever stuck.

There are fascinating things to learn. And, as you are well aware, there is joy in that new discovery where Jesus becomes more personal.

I hope you have a fabulous day, Momsage. And, I pray "come LORD Jesus. Amen". :)

Hi Gus,

Thank you, there are different understandings of who Jesus was and is, whether He was a man born of a woman His Father being God, or the incarnation of the eternal Son the second member of a Triune God, fully man, and fully God. However, one believes Jesus was without sin from birth to death. There was no sin in Him, He did not commit any sin. He is the spotless Lamb that was slain for our sins. He lived a perfect life that no man has ever done or can do, before or after Him, 1 Peter 1:19 1 John 3:5.

God bless,

RLW

Hadassah, Genesis 1:14 does not support that.

Hello Hadassah,

I never said that you were showing hate to people who practice Catholicism, but towards the Catholic Church.

It is a fact that many of the leaders of the reformation thought that the papacy was the Antichrist, but it is actually a fact that the Catholic church, Vatican, and papacy are the antichrist is not yet proven as fact.

I think it is more helpful to point out the errors taught by the Catholic Church or any other sect than to speak as though the entire body of teachings of the Catholic Church or other sects are erroneous and evil.

Being precise in this manner shows facts instead of emotion filled vitriol.

OK Jema, thanks for your reply. You were referring to people other than the one you posted to, so they were also directed at these people in a derogatory manner. So, I still think that they need some explanation to the people referred to negatively in these posts. But if you choose not to do so, that is your choice.

Momsage

I so understand your intent concerning hating false doctrine. The Catholic Church has many correct doctrines that we should support, but also many false doctrines that we should denounce. We should not hold a blanket denunciation of the whole body of teaching of the Catholic Chruch, in my view. They have a very correct view of God as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, about the life and sacrificial death of Jesus and his resurrection.

I think it is important to point out where they did change the Scripture i.e. verses, phrases, words. (if they truly did

There are many false teachings in Protestant churches today. So, we should hate these as much as the ones taught in Catholicism. Whereas we do not blanketlike denounce these sects, we should not blanket like denounce the Catholic Church either.

Sects that teach that Jesus is Michael the archangel, that he is not the eternal Sonn of God, that he became divine at His baptism or crucifixion, that He is only filled with the Holy Spirit as we are but to the fullest and only human, that teach that the Holy Spirit is only a power or force, but not a person that can be interacted with, grieved, lied to, etc., that humans will become gods, that Jesus needed to be born again, that all persons will be saved eventually. These are all false teachings in my view. Some of these we find in sects like Mormonism, Jehovah Witnesses, but also in sects that many find to be within the Christian faith. There are those sects that teach that you must belong to their sect to be saved, such as Church of Christ, Plymouth Brethren, Catholic Church. And there are those who teach that you must be baptized in the Holy Spirit with evidence of speaking in tongues to be saves, such some Pentecostal churches.

So Momsage, there are many false teachings in numerous sects besides the Catholic Church. The language that you and Hadassah use towards the Catholic Church is hateful and generalized rather than specific. Compassion is needed.

Hey Momsage,

I do not want to confuse you, I will give my understanding, and others may give theirs. You may find different views on the soul, go to the bible and with the Holy Spirit for your understanding. If we look at a soul, in Hebrew it is nephesh a living being, it can be a human being, an animal, or a living creature, as we see in Genesis 1:20 the word creatures is the word nephesh, the soul is who we are in our body.

When God breathed the breath of life into the body He formed out of the dust of the ground, that breath was the spirit that gave life to Adam and Adam became a living soul/being, the combination of a body and spirit. A soul is one's life, self, thoughts, desire, passion, appetite, and emotions. All of who we are inside our body is the soul, so yes Jesus had a soul, He was a soul, a living being. The soul is not some immaterial part of us that separates from our bodies when we die.

I hope this helps, like I said this is my understanding study for yours.

God bless,

RLW

Oh. Sorry I misunderstood your comment and I agree with it all. I knew you had been a Catholic. Your disdain for the doctrine seemed to match mine. I"d like to share a funny story with you? I can't say for sure it's true, I just heard it somewhere but I think you'll agree with me it very well could be.

A widow "donated " funds every month to a priest of her local church to pray for her husband who, she believed, was in purgatory so he could get to heaven sooner. After a very long time of donating she asked the priest she had been giving her "donations " to how much longer it would be? He told her not to much longer her husband still had a leg in purgatory. :) :)

I sent a comment to GiGi explaining that it is the doctrine of thr Catholic Church we loath not the Catholics. That we only want rescue from this evil doctrine and salvation for their precious souls. I believe you will agree. God bless you

Momsage great post! I don't get on here very much anymore but it seems that you fit right in on this site.

The KJB truly is the pure Words of the Lord, the (Spirit of truth) is the KJB! All those who trust modern version bibles are putting their trust in doctrines of devils ( 1 Tim 4:1) and deceiving themselves and others ( 2 Tim 4:3-4)

The Comforter IS the Holy Ghost ( Jn 14:26) This verse tells us that the "Comforter" WHICH IS the "Holy Ghost" will teach us all things "he shall teach you all things".

Now in ( Jn 16:13-15) This verse tells us "when the "Spirit of truth" is come, he will (guide) you into all truth"

The word (guide) is #3594; and it means to show the way.

The Spirit of truth will show the way to all truth, the KJB is that Spirit of truth! The Comforter, which IS the Holy Ghost, will teach us all things from the Spirit of truth.

The Comforter, which IS the Holy Ghost is joined with the Spirit of truth. ( Jn 14:16-17) v16 tells us "and he shall give you another "Comforter" that he may abide with you for ever". v17 tells us "(Even) the "Spirit of truth" whom the world cannot receive because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you and shall be in you". The word (Even) is #2531; it means just (or inasmuch) as, according to, with which it is joined.

WITH WHICH IT IS JOINED? WOW!

The Comforter, which IS the Holy Ghost IS joined with the Spirit of truth.

The Holy Ghost, which is the Comforter IS joined with the Spirit of truth, which IS the King James Bible!

The KJB is the pure Words of the LORD ( Proverbs 30:5-6) and ( Ps 12:6-7)

All modern version bibles are words of men who (changed) the words of the living God to deceive, ( Jer 23:36) The word (perverted) is #2015; it means to turn about or over, to change. modern version bibles DONOT have the Holy Ghost joined with them! Those who are using modern versions cannot find this truth!

The Word of God is Alive, it truly is Amazing!!

Blessings to you Momsage.

Amen to you .

Hello Gigi , sorry if you are confused by my comments but they were for the individuals that I posted them to . If they had been to or for any and every one I would have just put them as new comments . Obviously we are all able to read all comments , as long as the people that I posted them to know what I meant by them , I'm happy .

Although Genesis 11:26-27 lists the order of Terah's sons as Abram, Nahor and Haran, this appears to be according to the regard God has for them in terms of their importance to establishing His chosen godly line of promise and not their natural birth order. Haran almost certainly is the natural first born son of Terah for several reasons:

1. Haran dies in Ur of the Chaldeas before any of His relatives begin to sojourn.

2. If Haran was Terah's first born son and died before Terah did, Lot would have to remain with Terah from that time until Terah's death, since Lot would then be the heir of Terah's possessions, not Abram or Nahor.

3. Haran is old enough to father the wife of Abram's brother Nahor before he dies. If Haran was older than Abram by 60 years this makes sense.

4. In Gen 12 Abram seems to be genuinely interested in being treated well by Pharoah for Sarai's sake, which would be less likely to be important to Abram if he had inherited all of Terah's possessions as the first born son.

5. Lot's possessions seem to rival Abram's possessions in Gen 13, which would be significantly more likely if he was nearly equal in age with Abram and Lot had become wealthy through inheriting Terah's possessions.

6. In Gen 13 Lot is given first pick of the land of their sojournings by Abram. Lot makes no effort to show any special appreciation to Abram for granting him this honor. Lot's acceptance of the honor without showing any deference would be unthinkably arrogant if Abram was actually the first born heir of Terah. However, this all makes sense if Abram was showing recognition that Lot was the heir of Terah as the son of Terah's first born deceased son.

7. In Gen 19:31 Lot's daughters consider him old when they conspire to get pregnant by him. This is much more likely if he was in his 80s or 90s like Sarah and Abraham, rather than in his 60s or 70s, which is the oldest he would likely be if Haran was Abraham's younger brother.

I'm sorry Gus but I don't know what in the world you are talking about. Could you explain? :)

Gigi, These are your comments to me:

"Do you know that the translators of the KJV used a Bible composed by Erasmus, a Catholic priest in the times of the reformation in their translation?"

Answer: Yes. I know.

"So your are saying that the KJV translators used a corrupt version in their work."

Answer: No. Where in my posts have I said that the KJV translators used a corrupt version?

"It is fine to discuss the topic of the validity of translations based on facts, but not on an obvious vehement bias towards the Catholic church as you have shown in your post. I am not defending the Catholic Church here. Just saying that your argument would be better received if you left out the hate and based your viewpoint on factual information. "

Answer: The topic of Bible translations and how they came about is an hours and hours long study comprising volumes of reading material. This site is for quick comments not lengthy dissertations. You are accusing me of hate but that is quite unfair. There is nothing in my posts indicating hate of the Catholic people. However, the Catholic/vatican/Papacy is antichrist. The system is the Beast. It was identified as so by the Protestant church fathers. And, that Gigi, is a fact.

"O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

I think you and I are partly saying the same thing. I meant when God breathed His breath into Adam He made him a living soul. Adams soul was clean until he sinned and from then on a Savior was needed for mankind to have a cleansed soul again to enter heaven.

I am confused on what you said about Jesus, do you think He had a soul or He didn't? God is God. How can he have a soul even in His humanity? :)

Erasmus, King James, and His Translators (Part 1 of 3)

By David H. Sorenson

Erasmus thus became an enigma. He slowly but surely shifted away from Catholic theology, but stopped short of joining with Luther. He attacked the Roman Catholic Church, but never officially left it. Part of this confusion is to be found in the personal temperament of Erasmus. Whereas Luther had the temperament to stand and thunder, "Here I stand, I can do no other," Erasmus was more timorous. He was not an open fighter. His battling was through his pen. Whereas Luther eventually was excommunicated from the Catholic Church, Erasmus tried to reform it from within. [5] Whereas Luther became a "come-outer," Erasmus remained a "stay-inner." He would have been better served to follow Luther's example. However, he did not. He thus became a target from both sides. The establishment of the Catholic Church detested him. Most of the Reformers were suspicious of him as well.

Erasmus is a fascinating character in the lineage of the Received Text of the New Testament. His Greek New Testament, without doubt, was the catalyst which sparked the Reformation. He was a Catholic at the beginning of the Reformation. However, as he continued to search the Scriptures, he increasingly became less and less Catholic in his position. By the time he died in 1536, he had virtually become an Anabaptist in his theology. To his demerit, he never officially left the Catholic Church. However, when he died, it was not in the arms of Rome. Rather, in 1534, he returned to Basel, Switzerland, and two years later died in the midst of his Protestant friends, "without relations of any sort, so far as known with the Roman Catholic Church." [9]

Hello Mssue70710: Your comment really touched me. Please let the Lord give you comfort. I feel true sorrow for what you are going through. I don't want to hurt you or cause you any more pain but I feel I must be gently honest with you in a mistake I believe you are making in this sad situation. If you are asking God for something with a sincere heart, not out of selfishness or pride or other ungodly reasons, which I know you are not doing, He is going to answer that prayer through His great love for you in giving you what is the very best for you now. If you love the Lord with all your heart, soul and mind you will eventually walk, run, skip, etc. for eternity with Him so perhaps while still here you may have to spend the rest of your time in the wheelchair. I'm NOT saying He won't heal you here, I'm just wanting you to send your mindset in a little bit of another direction that perhaps the answer has already arrived, "No not now." and to be thankful that he has sent you a man who loves you and wants you to be his wife. It grieves me that you sent him away like you did. He loves you. Marry him and let him love you and just wait on the Lord. If you can, do a Google search for Nick Vujicic and watch his videos. He is incredibly inspiring. I hope in some way this has helped you. :) God Bless You Ann

Hello GiGi: Nice to talk to you. I would like to respond to your reply to Hadassah about his comment on how "the Vatican started messing around with the Bible, omitting things, altering things, adding things in order to support their doctrine." I'm apologize if my comment is also upsetting to you, although, I'm glad you weren't defending the Catholic Church.

Basically, I loath the DOCTRINE of Catholicism, it is an evil, false doctrine that has sent many, many poor souls to hell. I loath any false doctrine that deceives souls to damnation. Don't imagine that because I find the doctrines loathsome that it means I hate the people who believe in those doctrines because I love the souls who are being deceived. I grieve that they may not have eternal life with Jesus because they are not understanding the truth of His teachings and His salvation because their minds and hearts are so firmly held captive by those extremely deceitful teachings. :) Be Blessed, Ann

Hey Momsage,

Sorry for the delay, thank you for your reply. My understanding in Genesis when God breathed the breath of life into the first Adam he became a living soul. The Hebrew word is nephesh, that means a living being, Adam was not given a soul he became a living soul/being. Same as the last Adam Jesus the Messiah was conceived in the womb of Mary, Luke 1:31-33, and He was a living being/nephesh.

As the first Adam, Jesus came into this world without sin, but not like the first Adam He lived a perfect life without sin totally obedient to the Father even though He was tempted as you and me, Hebrews 4:14-15.

God bless,

RLW

Jema, this response and the one to Gus strike me as being snarky, but I may be wrong. What did you mean by each of them?

It is helpful if one gives a grounded explanation of their thoughts rather than a "quip" or a "jab" at others.

I find that for the most part, your responses are kindhearted, but these do not seem to be so. Why? For what purpose did you send them?

Please know that I respect you and I keep you in my prayers as I do so many on this site. I mean no harm in this post. It was just that these two posts seemed out of place and unedifying. I hope you can explain your thinking so I can better grasp what you were wishing to convey, not to be judgmental, so forgive me if it seems to be to you.

Yes Hadassah, I believe that folk today who don't have English as their primary language/mother tongue, have no other option than to use the translation undertaken for their language. This maybe from Bible Societies or Bible translators, and I strongly suspect that these folk won't be using the KJB or another version taken from the Textus Receptus, rather from a more modern translation that would also make their job a lot easier.

A case in point, that I've shared here before: when ministering in Pakistan back in the late 80's, I was giving a Bible study to a small Church group & 1 John 4:10, "Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins" was one of many references that was given. I had to use a Urdu translator (a brother in Christ) for this study, since my Urdu proficiency is woefully inadequate, & I had checked with him on some of our more 'difficult' biblical English words, e.g. 'propitiation'. He told me that in Urdu it is 'kafara' which in English is 'atonement'. But when I asked if 'kafara' could mean anything else to him (as we understand it in English), he replied, 'no other meaning at all'; they had no word in Urdu for 'propitiation', which meant that the translators made no effort to maybe give the proper meaning as a footnote, for example.

So Christians in Pakistan & parts of N. India actually miss out on receiving the full Truth & value of verses such as 1 John 4:10, thinking that the Gift of God's Son had atonement as its only message - they had no idea, because of a bad translation, that Jesus not only died for mankind's sins, but that He also bore the Wrath of God upon Himself that was actually destined for us. That by believing on Jesus, both our sins have been forgiven & God's Anger has been averted. Now not only lacking in Urdu, but I wonder how many other foreign language translations are denying Christians the full & accurate Words of God given for them.

Hi Brother Ronald, I meant to send this to you.

Somehow I sent it to myself.

"No Problem Brother.

We have always discussed doctrine with the intention to grow spiritually.

Just remember a few years ago I said I was happy to call you my brother and that still remains and I'm happy you consider me a Brother as well.

I'm sure others fill that way.

When these such things causes hatred amongst the Brothern then there's an BIG issue.

Beware of those who cause divisions.

I will be reaching out to you during the week

God bless.

Hi Momsage,

Yes, I agree with everything you said. I was just carrying it a step further.

We Christian's will face intense persecution in the near future. I want to have the same type of strong faith exhibited by our LORD. I want a firm, unwavering stand for the LORD so that I will not be moved no matter the consequence.

We Christian's do have faith IN Jesus and all that implies. Now, we need HIS same faith that he exhibited when going to the cross.

Your testimony made me feel joyful. Thank you for sharing. Praise the LORD that we both escaped the Catholic Church.

Belief in Jesus as the true Savior is necessary for salvation, else you could believe He is the tooth fairy and get saved. The demons knew who He was, believed He was God, but not unto salvation.

How can I have the faith OF Jesus if I'm a sinner praying for salvation? Why would I be willing to die for that faith if Jesus hasn't even saved me yet? The faith I'm talking about is faith that Jesus will forgive of my sins so I can give my heart to Him.

When someone gives up sin to become a child of God, that's not a good work, that's obedience to God to live a holy, righteous life. Once we love God with our whole heart, souls and minds then we love doing good works for His sake. It brings joy to our hearts. :)

Be Blessed

No Problem Brother.

We have always discussed doctrine with the intention to grow spiritually.

Just remember a few years ago I said I was happy to call you my brother and that still remains and I'm happy you consider me a Brother as well.

I'm sure others fill that way.

When these such things causes hatred amongst the Brothern then there's an BIG issue.

Beware of those who cause divisions.

I will be reaching out to you during the week

God bless.

For people of non speaking English nationalities: use any Bible that had its translation in the Textus Receptus. Many Bibles, from the early 1900's and earlier might be good translations. (The king James was translated from the Textus Receptus).

The problem entered when the Vatican started messing around with the Bible, omitting things, altering things, adding things in order to support their doctrine. The Vatican system is the beast. All the early Protestant fathers knew that fact and wrote about it.

Exactly right, Momsage! Thank you.

"Don't let yourself be fooled by ANY of the modern, corrupt translations. of the "bible." Stick to the 1611 KJB."

It takes more than belief. Even the demons believe and tremble. It takes more than faith IN Jesus, we must have the faith OF Jesus. We must be willing to die for this faith.

And, the evidence of our faith is the fruit that faith produces. Faith without works is dead. I do not do works to be saved, but rather, I do works because I am saved.

Hezekiah prayed for more years. Notice what he says about death. It is a soul sleep verse.

18 For the grave cannot praise thee, death can not celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.

19 The living, the living, he shall praise thee, as I do this day: the father to the children shall make known thy truth. Isaiah 38:18.

The following verses are object lessons explaining the relationship between God the Father and Jesus Christ. Two separate Gods united as one in purpose, plan, and action. Add in the Holy Spirit, which is also God. And that's the Trinity. It is easy to understand:

26 And God said, Let US make man in our image, after OUR likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Genesis 1:26 (emphasis mine).

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and THEY SHALL BE ONE FLESH."

Genesis 2:24 (emphasis mine).

God is ONE GOD in purpose, plan, and action. There is no shadow of turning with our God who will never change. Thank you, LORD, that we, your children, may trust in you. We sojourn in a scary land that is not our home. Come soon. Amen.