Thanks for your response Oseas. Actually, what I did present was that "Yahweh" IS seen elsewhere in the Word. In John 8:44, Jesus is deriding the Jews for holding onto lies instead of believing Jesus' Words of Truth to them; this verse doesn't suggest that Satan initiated these supposed lies of the Names of God - here was Satan playing with their minds & hearts against Christ & not against what was written in the Word of God, which even Satan cannot deny. So we cannot assume that the 'father of lies' has forced upon us these 'false' Names of God; what we do need to do to prove it, is to ascertain if the original writings didn't have these Names. So far, we have gone back to the CJB & Tanakh: would there be any older genuine Hebraic writings available to us that show us differently? If not, we simply can't speculate or assume, for that in itself would lead us in error.
Re: Exodus 6:2,3. As I re-read it again, I believe that God Himself is telling Moses (& all who read His Word), that His Name is Jehovah but this Name was not known to Abraham, Isaac, & Jacob. They knew Him as "God Almighty" (El Shaddai: the Almighty God) as seen in Genesis 17:1:
"And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the ALMIGHTY GOD (El Shaddai); walk before me, and be thou perfect".
God here in Exodus is stating Who He is to His people under this special Covenant. If you believe that this is not what God said, then I can't go further with it, because I read it with plain understanding. All I can see, is that these names, which you find detestable & demonic, are Hebrew words of God showing Himself in His fullness. But where we have God's compound Names (e.g. Jehovah-Jireh/Ropheka/Nissi/Shalom/Sabaoth/and others) these I will admit are Names that are given when Israel saw their God at Work in their presence but most certainly NOT Satan-inspired names. If anything is debatable or problematic, then we need to search for proof.
I hope even though you may not agree, you can make sense of my replies. I would like to tell you I do not Have anything in common with JW or their translation of the bible.
My understanding we are mortal beings and no part of us is immortal. I see the spirit as our breath/life that goes back to God when we die, Ecclesiastes 11:7 and Scripture tell us the soul can die, Ezekiel 18:4Matthew 10:28 Hebrew 9:27. Like Paul said of David being dead in the tomb and has not ascended to heaven, Acts 2:34. We do not put on immortality until the resurrection, 1 Corinthians 15:53-54.
Bear with me my Greek is kindergarten level, arche the beginning or origin I see it maybe a little differently I understand God the Father as the Creator as in Genesis 1:1 and Psalm 19:1. I believe in the plan of God Jesus was first and as in Romans 4:17 Jesus was in Gods eyes in the womb of Mary and then the angels and all the counsel of heaven then the earth and all that was to be.
In Genesis 17:5 when God renamed Abram to Abraham God said, "for the father of many nations I have made thee". It was not Abraham will become a father of many nations it was already done in the plan of God.
"Firstborn of every creature and the firstborn from the dead" Jesus was the firstborn, Jesus being the first in God's plan would make Him the firstborn, and Jesus is the firstborn of the dead. There were people brought back from the dead like in 2 Kings 13:21 the guy was thrown into Elisha's tomb and when his body touched Elisha's bone he came back to life and stood up, and we see the ones in the New Testament. No one who died before Jesus who came back to life died again Jesus was the first to overcome death.
Jesus is the firstborn of the dead because He had no sin and death could not hold Him and when Jesus rose He rose in a glorified body never to die again, Revelation 1:18. That is what we look forward to when we are resurrected.
Perfect people in the bible, do they exist or is Jesus the only perfect one? We hear so much about how only Jesus is perfect from almost every Christian and yet, they can not find any scripture or any verse to back up their false claim. The apostle Paul said this:
Titus 1:16] They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
Christanity rebells when they have to be perfect thry immediately pass it on to Jesus when Jesus preached in Matthew 5:48 we (human beings) have to be perfect even as our Father which is in heaven is perfect. Why does Christanity argue agianst Jesus? Because they were never told the truth. Let's look in the bible to find more perfect people before, during and after, Jesus. Adam and Eve were in Genesis 1&2 before thry heard another gospel in Genesis 3 from Rev Serpant/Rev Devil.
Before: Genesis 6:9] These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.
Genesis 17:1] And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.
Deuteronomy 18:13] Thou shalt be perfect with the LORD thy God.
Job 1:1] There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.
2nd Chronicals 16:9] For the eyes of the LORD run to and fro throughout the whole earth, to shew himself strong in the behalf of them whose heart is perfect toward him. Herein thou hast done foolishly: therefore from henceforth thou shalt have wars.
Psalm 37:37] Mark the perfect man, and behold the upright: for the end of that man is peace.
During Jesus:
Matthew 1:[19] Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privily.
When asked that question in Scripture it seems God answers back with one of his many names. like he does when Paul asks in Acts 9:5.
Paul asked Who art thou, Lord? "kurios" (supreme in authority that is (as noun) controller; by implication Mr . (as a respectful title): - God Lord master Sir.)
The Lord answered him simply, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
There are several names for the one and only true God.
Each of the many names of God describes a different aspect of His many-faceted character. Here are some of the better-known names of God in the Bible:
I've looked up some of those names; Here they are.
Part 1.
EL, ELOAH [el, el-oh-ah]: God "mighty, strong, prominent" ( Nehemiah 9:17; Psalm 139:19) - etymologically, El appears to mean "power" and "might" ( Genesis 31:29). El is associated with other qualities, such as integrity ( Numbers 23:19), jealousy ( Deuteronomy 5:9), and compassion ( Nehemiah 9:31), but the root idea of "might" remains.
ELOHIM [el-oh-heem]: God "Creator, Mighty and Strong" ( Genesis 17:7; Jeremiah 31:33) - the plural form of Eloah, which accommodates the doctrine of the Trinity. From the Bible's first sentence, the superlative nature of God's power is evident as God (Elohim) speaks the world into existence ( Genesis 1:1).
EL SHADDAI [el-shah-dahy]: "God Almighty," "The Mighty One of Jacob" ( Genesis 49:24; Psalm 132:2,5) - speaks to God's ultimate power over all.
ADONAI [dna; ah-daw-nahy]: "Lord" ( Genesis 15:2; Judges 6:15) - used in place of YHWH, which was thought by the Jews to be too sacred to be uttered by sinful men. In the Old Testament, YHWH is more often used in God's dealings with His people, while Adonai is used more when He deals with the Gentiles.
It is clear that there was always a chosen line of ancestry. This is evident from the fact that the Book of Genesis only gives the genealogy of Seth (although Cain's genealogy is mentioned briefly), ignoring all the other descendants of Adam and Eve.
The line of Seth takes us all the way to the birth of Jesus. "There are some Gentiles in the line of Jesus by way of Rahab and Ruth.
There was always a chosen line, but that does not mean there has ALWAYS been a separation of Jews and Gentiles.
It seems, then, that the separation of Jews and Gentiles did not BEGIN to occur until God called Abraham to be the father of His chosen nation, Israel ( Genesis 12). Many view Abraham as the first Jew, even though the precise term Jew did not come into use until after the return from exile when the tribe of Judah was dominant.
Another placement of the division of Jews from Gentiles would be with Jacob, whose name was changed by God to Israel
Genesis 32:28.
(All of the descendants of Jacob, through his 12 sons)
I believe the separation of lineage started with Seth and the ACTUAL separation of Jews and the rest of the world/Gentiles Started in Genesis 17:10-19 and highlighted in vs 17-18.
"And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee!
And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
Abraham was given a seal if a covenant of circumcision, "A cutting away of sinful flesh" in
Genesis 17:10-14.
This pointed to Christ work on the cross. Colossians 2:10-17.
This has nothing to do with race!
It has everything to do with covenant!
And a Jew inwardly has nothing to do with Israel as a Nation and God's covenant and future promises to the Nation Israel and the Davidic kingdom in the Millennium.
All of us are descended from the Noah, who had three sons. Noah was from the lineage of Seth (who was a son of Adam and Eve.
Noah's sons were Shem, Japheth. At the time of Noah and his sons, no one was a Hebrew.
You can read the lineage of Adam and Eve in Genesis Chapter 5. You can read the lineage of Noah in Genesis Chapter and 11.
Eber (or Heber) was the great grandson of Shem. It is from Eber that the name Hebrew came about People called them Hebaru.
All of the descendants of Eber were Hebrews, not just the Israelites. Abraham was descended from Eber in the sixth generation from Eber.
There were many descendants from Shem (Noah's son). These people were considered as Semites (which is derived from the name Shem).
Abraham was a Hebrew. So was Lot and Sarai. Abraham had eight sons-Ishmael (from Hagar), Isaac (from Sarai), and six more sons from Keturah after Sarai died. All of the peoples descended from the sons of Abraham are Hebrews and Semites. These are mostly the people who settled the Arabian peninsula and wilderness/ mountainous areas near Canaan. Isaac settled in Canaan with his father, Abraham. So, the Israelites are not the only descendants of Abraham, however, God told Abraham that it is through Isaac that are heirs to the promises (covenant) to Abraham ( Genesis 17:19)
Jacob and Esau were born to Isaac. They were twins. God determined that the promises/covenant God made with
Abraham and Isaac will be fulfilled through Jacob as the heir, not Esau. So, both Esau and Jacob were Hebrews, grandsons of Abraham, but the people God was going to call to Himself were to come from Jacob.
God changed Jacob's name to Israel and renewed the covenant of Abraham with Jacob. Jacob had twelve sons. These sons were
all Hebrews. Jacob's son, Judah was selected as the son by whom the Messiah would descend. The people of Judah's lineage were called Judahites, Jehus, and as a term of derision, Jews by the surrounding peoples.
If we go back to Eve. she gave birth ( Genesis 1:27,28;4:1,2;5:25). some of these offspring's died by means of old age,
Genesis 3:19; Genesis 6:3, violance or destroyed by the flood ( Genesis 6:5-7,11-13;17). Only Noah his wife, Shem, Ham, and Japheth their 3 wives survived. that means only eight people survived out of Adams and eve's children and grand children.
The point! not all of Noah's children listened to God. They followed Satan the devil and his lies Genesis 3. when you read about the Canaanites ( Genesis 13:7; Leviticus 18:1-5) this bad nation came through Ham descendance ( Genesis 10:6). or Ammorites, some Noah's descendance created a nation by their family name Genesis 11. When Jehovah ( psalm 83:18) confused their language they all spread out and became nations of people like you see today.
to the point: Abraham was a righteous man who lived in Canaan. but one of God's angels told him to leave Canaan then became a father to a nation of Israel ( Genesis 17:1-8). God name Jacob Israel ( Genesis 32:28). this is how a Nation of Isreal came about. Canaan land later became Jerusalem belonging to Israel the Jews.
However, Israel repeatedly sinned by worshiping other gods. even Solomon the last king worshiped false Gods ( Nehemiah 13:23-27) Jesus turned to the Gentiles which means nation who will believe ( John 3:16,17).
However, their are some Israelites who did believe, but most rejected Jesus.- Acts 1:6-8; Matthew 24:14; 2 Timothy 3:13-17
It's a lot of info. but I hope the bible answered your question HOW A NATION BECAME A INDEPENDANT NATION
Abraham in Genesis 17:6 where it is recorded: "And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee."
This is restated in verse 16 of the same chapter in relation to the promise of the son of Sarah: "And I will bless her, and moreover I will give thee a son of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of peoples shall be of her."
It is probable that there would be little question about the meaning of this covenant, if it did not involve eschatology as a whole. It would seem that the promises are simple and direct that David's posterity should continue forever and that his political kingdom would not end. However, even such a simple interpretation presents some immediate problems, as David himself seems to anticipate when he notes that the prophecy concerns a long time to come.
The principal difficulty, however, seems to be that the connotation of the Davidic covenant supports the premillennial interpretation of the Bible involving a future reign of Christ on earth as David's greater Son. This point of view is quite unacceptable to the amillenarian and therefore for them some interpretation of the Davidic covenant must be found other than that of a literal fulfillment. Generally speaking, amillenarians deny that this covenant has any decisive force on the millennial question and find its terms fulfilled in the present day with God's dealings with the church. Quite often the attempt is made to deny that anything in the Old Testament construes a premillennial eschatology and statements are made such as that of Louis Berkhof: "The only Scriptural basis for this theory [i.e., premillennialism] is Revelation 20:1-6, after an Old Testament content has been poured into it" (Systematic Theology,)
Centuries after Abraham died, the children of Israel took possession of the land under Joshua's leadership ( Joshua 21:43). At no point in history, though, has Israel controlled all of the land God had specified. There remains, therefore, a final fulfillment of the Abrahamic Covenant that will see Israel occupying their God-given homeland to the fullest extent. The fulfillment will be more than a matter of geography; it will also be a time of holiness and restoration (see Ezekiel 20:40-44 and 36:1-37:28).
The Abrahamic Covenant also promised many descendants ( Genesis 12:2). God promised that the number of Abraham's children would rival that of "the dust of the earth" ( Genesis 15:16). Nations and kings would proceed from him ( Genesis 17:6). It is significant that the promise was given to an aged, childless couple. But Abraham "did not waver through unbelief" ( Romans 4:20), and his wife Sarah "considered him faithful who had made the promise" ( Hebrews 11:11). Abraham was justified by his faith ( Genesis 15:6), and he and his wife welcomed Isaac, the son of promise, into their home when they were 100 and 90 years old, respectively ( Genesis 21:5).
God reiterates the Abrahamic Covenant to Isaac and to his son Jacob, whose name God changes to Israel. The great nation is eventually established in the land where Abraham had dwelled. King David, one of Abraham's many descendants, is given the Davidic Covenant ( 2 Samuel 7:12-16), promising a "son of David" who would one day rule over the Jewish nation-and all nations-from Jerusalem. Many other Old Testament prophecies point to the blessed, future fulfillment of that promise (e.g., Isaiah 11; Micah 4; Zechariah 8).
In Genesis 15, God alone moves between the halves of the animals. Abraham was in a deep sleep. God's solitary action indicates that the covenant is principally His promise. God binds Himself to the covenant.
Later, God gave Abraham the rite of circumcision as the specific sign of the Abrahamic Covenant ( Genesis 17:9-14). All males in Abraham's line were to be circumcised and thus carry with them a lifelong mark in their flesh that they were part of God's physical blessing in the world. Any descendant of Abraham who refused circumcision was declaring himself to be outside of God's covenant; this explains why God was angry with Moses when Moses failed to circumcise his son ( Exodus 4:24-26).
God determined to call out a special people for Himself, and through that special people He would bless the whole world. The Lord tells Abram,
"I will make you into a great nation,
and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
will be blessed through you" ( Genesis 12:2-3).
Based on this promise, God later changed Abram's name from Abram ("high father") to Abraham ("father of a multitude") in Genesis 17:5. As we've seen, the Abrahamic Covenant is unconditional. It should also be taken literally. There is no need to spiritualize the promise to Abraham. God's promises to Abraham's descendants will be fulfilled literally.
The Abrahamic Covenant included the promise of land ( Genesis 12:1). It was a specific land, an actual property, with dimensions specified in Genesis 15:18-21. In Genesis 13:15, God gives Abraham all the land that he can see, and the gift is declared to be "forever." God was not going to renege on His promise. The territory given as part of the Abrahamic Covenant is expanded in Deuteronomy 30:1-10, often called the Palestinian Covenant.
Abraham was called by God to move from "Chaldea" from a city called Ur in southern Mesopotamia. Abraham and Sarah were kinsmen, related through their father but different mothers. They both lived in Ur and then followed God's lead up the Euphrates valley to Haran, (in modern Iraq/Syria).Their relatives lived in Haran. From Haran, they traveled westward along the road that connected Haran with Damascus and then south into Canaan modern Israel.
There are multiple reasons for delay & no from GOD.
James 4, not GOD's perfect plan, timing = look at Abraham he was promised a son, even past natural ability Genesis 12:4,6,7, Abram 75 yrs old, Genesis 17:1-8, Abraham also called Abram 90 yrs old, Sarah Genesis 18:10,11, Genesis 21:1-3, was the delay for example of faith Hebrews 11, was it for the linage of Salvation timing? Matthew 1:17, ?
1John 3:22, John 16:23, Psalms 37, Luke 11, Matthew 6, Matthew 7, Matthew 7:7, Matthew 21:22, Luke 18,
I fasted, prayed, begged, cried out & received what I asked many times & several of those caused me years of deep pain, regret, sadness etc. Trust GOD ALMIGHTY sometimes it's protection, not seeing & knowing everything & everyone attached to the things we ask. Luke 8:10-18,
I may have said a lot of this stuff before; hopefully there are a few nuances of difference. The scripture is always the best guide to answering tough questions. We have examples of Abraham called out of Ur of Chaldee; for example who was the father of all those of Monotheistic faith today. He was called in a foreign land; and given a future promise of a Promised Land as well as offspring who would inherit it ( Genesis 17:2 and repeated in Hebrews). He never got to dwell permanently anywhere but was a nomad in the desert and through miraculous means his wife of 90 conceived when he was 100.
When we look at the story of Sodom and Gomorrah; we could say that Abraham was having a sort of contest with God on a similar theme; His preservation of the city if a small number of righteous men lived there; he started with 50 men and ended at 10. This shows a theme which also was repeated with God waiting for a certain period until transgressions were full to judge in Genesis 15:16. Sodom was ripe for judgment as were the Amorites; but in their case it wasn't until four generations later and THAT along with Egypt being judged for their fullness of iniquity that finally bought the descendants to conquer the Promised Land. So God calls out His people wherever they are if they are chosen (predestined) to be His children. He will send angels or whatever means to reach the lost; and we see this happening again in the Book of Revelation. If we seek the God of the Bible then we have to believe His Word on our spiritual condition (as sinners) and we need to have it revealed to us (i.e. granted repentance as shown in Acts 11:18 and elsewhere.
The confession of our mouth and believe in our heart ( Romans 10:19) it is a RESULT of His Spirit working in us to convict of sin; righteousness and judgment to come ( John 16:8-11).
Conversion of course involves interaction and our choice to verbally repent.
My understanding, Jesus coming, the Messiah/Christ was not a secret, Daniel 9:25 prophesied when He would come. Jesus came to fulfill the prophets and the law, and when Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist the Holy Spirit descended on Jesus, and Jesus was filled without measure, John 3:34.
John the Baptist proclaimed it, John 1:34 and His disciples did as well, John 1:41 Jesus told the woman at the well He was the Messiah, John 25:25-26 and Martha John 11:27. It was confirmed by all the miracles Jesus did by the Spirit of God, Matt. 12:28 the kingdom of God has come, but the death and resurrection were, at that time a secret/mystery, Rom. 11:25.
The kingdom of God has come, John said it was at hand, Matt. 3:1-2. After John was put in prison Jesus came preaching Mark 1:14-15. The mystery of the kingdom; they were looking for the stone to crush Rome and the kingdom would be set up then Daniel 2:44, but it was like the parables of the mustard seed and the yeast Matt. 13, increasing even today until the crushing blow at Jesus second coming.
The disciples knew Jesus was the Messiah/Christ, so I am sure that was part of their preaching, but Jesus' death and resurrection were hidden even from the disciples Luke 9:45. We see how they fled when Jesus was arrested, Matt. 26:56, and they did not believe He resurrected Mark 16:10-11Luke 23:10-11 it was hidden from them for if Satan had known the results, he would have tried to stop it.
Jesus spoke mainly to the Pharisees and Sadducees in parables to fulfill the prophecy, Matt. 13:10-15Mark 4:10-13Luke 8:10. The mystery was not revealed until after Jesus was resurrected as Jesus told them the Holy Spirit would bring remembrance and teaching to them John 14:26John 16:3-4Romans 11:25Romans 16:25 the promise to Abraham Genesis 17:4-7 and that seed was Jesus the Messiah/Christ.
This is my understanding may someone else have another, pray and study for your understanding.
After much study & reading, I've understood deeper the connections of names, families, places etc.
For instance Melchizedek, in Genesis 14:18, is very significant later! Psalms 110:4,
Hebrews 7, Hebrews 5:5-10, Hebrews 6:18-20,
Lot, Abraham's nephew also called brother Genesis 14:12-16, Genesis 13:8-13, also shows Abraham's love, meekness, loyalty to Lot. Genesis 18, also Lot spoken of in New Testament as a promise of deliverance of GOD"S people 2Peter 2:4-9,
Genesis 19, Sodom & Gomorrha also spoken of several times
& Abraham himself named Abram, Genesis 17:5,15, & Sari, Sarah, it's amazing the significance of names we find as we keep reading & studying! John 14:26
It's not really fair to judge someone based on the definition of a name given before or at time of birth, before the person defines who they, themselves are by their life, actions, achievements etc. 1Chronicles 4:9-10, Genesis 10:25, Genesis 35:18, Neither is it Justice to define anyone by a name because someone has the same name. Please read these scriptures: 1Samuel 2:3, Genesis 25:25,26, Genesis 29:32, yet not exactly true, because Genesis 29:33, contadicts the previous name. Following Genesis 29:34,35,
Sometimes people live up to names given, is it because they've been called so? Genesis 27:36,
However sometimes a name is earned: Genesis 25:30, Genesis 30:13, Revelation 11:8, Revelation 12:9, Revelation 19:13, Revelation 17:14
Many times people in the Bible share name, yet are completely different. Especially 1611 KJV, on this site. Examples today many people have name like Jesus pronunciation different are not even close, or Angels names, that are far from. We should be careful to not be deceived even evil can appear as light, likewise many names have been made to deceive. 2Corinthians 11:13,14
There are divine names given by GOD however, those maybe we should take more notice of, :
Covenants and Land ownership - In Reply on 1 John 5 - 2 years ago
Isaac and Jacob were both circumcised__as was Ishmael.
God initiated a covenant with Abraham that the Jews would be circumcised. Genesis 17:7-14; 21
In Genesis 17:15-21. God initiated a Covenant with Abraham and his wife Sarah, that a child of their flesh would be born to them in one years time.
In Genesis 17:20 God tells of the blessing given to Ishmael and his descendants: wealth, princes, power, kingdoms. Genesis 15:4, God says Ishmael is not Abrahams heir.
The DEED to the Lands of Israel- Genesis 12:1-3, 6-7 and
Genesis 17:7-8. Genesis 15:12-21.
These are the issues that perpetuate struggles in the land of Israel. I know Ishmael was firstborn, but his mother is Hagar a handmaiden to Sarah. Abrahams wife was Sarah; the marriage covenant wife of Abraham. If you'll Google Hagars history, you'll see she returned to her people with Ishmael.
Later Sarah died and Abraham married another woman. Hagar returned there. I think I remember that she lived there for a time, but not in Abraham's household. Eventually she returned to her people. It's a very sad story.
I've lived missed opportunities myself. It's harsh. But we get up out of the ashes and see what God has planned for us, next.
Endings are usually sad, but new beginnings can be joyful.
Congratulations are in order! Amen Eldon and welcome to the church. Your message brought joy to me today and I want to first leave you with these verses of encouragement:
Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.
2 Corinthians 1:3-4
Starting with verse 9 in Genesis 17 we see God establishes the Abrahamic covenant and with physical circumcision. This covenant was of blood from the male and established at that time (during the days of Abraham there was no law yet, no commandments) this being an early way of raising blood up. Now, thank goodness Christ Jesus was that Blood for us (especially for us men) as His Blood that he shed for us once we accept His Grace by Faith; this then circumcision is by the heart. The Apostle Paul explained it like this:
Romans 2:25
For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
Romans 2:26
Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
Romans 2:27
And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
Romans 2:28
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Romans 2:29
But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.
I hope this helps and now that you're saved. Please find a community of fellow believers to share the good news with and stay close to your KJV Bible. It's living Word which will guide you every step of the way.
Blessings to all through our lord and savior Jesus Christ.
I have accepted our divine lord as my father of all my existence. I am studying the Bible and getting to be closer to my Father Abba through his teaching.
I have read this chapter and would like to know what it is meant by circumcising? What motions or act is done when a person is being circumcised spiritually?
As I promised I would get back to you on your reply and questioning.
Let's start with the verses you gave as the promises that Israel forfeited over to the Church.
1. Genesis 12:1-3,
2. Genesis 12:7,
3. Genesis 13:14-17,
4. Genesis 15:5-7
5. Genesis 15:13-15,
6. Genesis 15:18-21,
7. Genesis 17:4-10,
8. Genesis 21:17-18
You stated, "Abraham and his seed pass to Jesus and His children. and you say according to
Galatians 3:16. Paul atributes these verses to Christ it is obvious that they are for Israel as well.
Let's look at Galatians 3:14-17.
If you notice in the link the promise/covenant was not a land covenant. Verses 2-8 you gave are all the land covenant.
Did you notice in Genesis 15:15-17. God told Abraham he would die before they would enter the land?
Look how Stephen put in Acts 7:4-5.
"and is is after God performed the covenant!!" So when will he inherit it? Hebrews11:8-10.
Now the 1st verse is a preview of both. The Promise his seed going to be given land. "Israel"
( and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. ) "Christ"
This is the only portion associated with Galatians 3:16.
Here is the covenant Paul is speaking of in Galatians.
( And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; AND THY SEED SHALL POSSESS THE GATE OF "HIS" ENEMIES;
And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. )
Genesis 22:16-18.
The Gospel was preached even before there was a law to be broken.
Galatians 3:8.
" Important verse"
I removed "if it" because I believe it's in italics and shouldn't be there.
( Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet be confirmed, NO MAN DISANNULLETH, OR ADDETH THERETO.) Galatians 3:15.
DearSpencer, lets talk about God's promises to Abraham.
Lets go to Genesis. The verses that describe God's promises to Abraham are the following:
1. Genesis 12:1-3,
2. Genesis 12:7,
3. Genesis 13:14-17,
4. Genesis 15:5-7
5. Genesis 15:13-15,
6. Genesis 15:18-21,
7. Genesis 17:4-10,
8. Genesis 21:17-18
Now in most of them God gives His promises to Abraham and his seed. Who is this seed. the obvious answer is that it is his biological descedants. Paul in his epistle to Galatians 3:16 disagrees, he says "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.". So we can agree that all the promises given to Abraham and his seed pass to Jesus and His children, Which are they? The 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and the 8th. Only one is left the first. You will argue that although Paul atributes those verses to Christ it is obvious that they are for Israel as well, the land covenant as you call it. You are right about that. But that promise that Cannan will be given to Israel by God wasn't fulfiled when Joshua and his descendants conquered that land? Yes it was. So what other promise/covenant given to Abraham is left to be fulfiled? I cannot see any other, correct me if I am wrong. GBU
Great question., Here's a few scriptures you can look over that may have answers to your questions.I would chime in when time permits. In the meantime hopefully someone can help us.
NOTICE THE PROMISES AND COVENANT MADE BY GOD WITH NO PARTICIPATION ALLOWED BY MAN.
Genesis 15:1-12.
Genesis 17:18-19.
Romans 9:6-9.
Galatians 4:22-31.
EMPHASIS.
This Promised Covenant is the work of God and can't be annulled by man.
Likewise you see a similar method as a allegory in the birth of Jacob and Essau.
Gods elected way, "By grace ".
Romans 9:10-12. And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
I understand what you are saying, but not everyone on our planet has a belief in it.
The Covenant of the Land was CUT between God and Abraham; Abrahams children born ONLY with Sarah: Gods Perfect Will.
In Gods PERMISSIVE WILL, he blessed Ishmael too. It was not a covenant for any lands God set apart for Israel.
Israel's Lands (boundaries) are recorded in heaven and in the BIBLE. Look at the ancient maps of Abraham's time.
Throughout History, those boundaries have been illegally changed. God does Not Change. He personally cut the covenant Himself.
Most modern day maps of Israel deny what is recorded in the Bible: the Original Deed.
More info: God cut the covenant Himself. The Deed to the Land= Genesis 17:7:8
Genesis 16:10-16, 17:36-21
Genesis 21:14-18, Genes 25:12-17
Promise & blessing on Ishmael
Genesis 17:18-26. Story Gen. 21:16-21
ISRAEL's SIZE TODAY=
Israel stretches 424 km (263 mi) from north to south, its width ranges from 114 km (71 miles) length, to 15 km (9.3 miles) width, at its narrowest point. *Israel and New Jersey are similar in size.
Folks, this is why the end of this fight/war__ will be fought at ARMAGEDDON__in Israel, in the the Valley of Megiddo. As it is written in the Bible, so shall it be done.
There will be NO PEACE until THE PRINCE OF PEACE returns
We're getting close to that time. "wars, rumors of wars, nations rising up against each other. Read Matthew 24, Luke 21 and the Book of Daniel, minor prophets books: if you want to know what's going to happen. If you don't read much; listen to some Nelson Walters videos on YouTube.
There's going to be 7 Seals opened; 7 Trumpets; 7 Bowls of Judgment.
The internet "thought leaders" are going to force one world currency (money system, one world government and one worldwide religion. Look for it now.
Don't be deceived. Choose Jesus NOW. Lack of food , water and fuel are signs. Somebody please preach this every day. Signs are speeding up.
In Genesis chapters 12 to 50, there is only one Covenant, that God made with Abram.
Genesis 12:1-3, the Covenant made. But of this Covenant, several 'expansions' to it were made to fully express it. And they are:
Genesis 15:18, God ratifies that Covenant in a national perspective.
Genesis 17:4-6,16, God ratifies that Covenant in an international perspective.
Genesis 17:7, God ratifies that Covenant as an Everlasting Covenant.
Genesis 17:10-14, God ratifies that Covenant by an act of circumcision (also in Stephen's message in Acts 7:8).
So, if you're thinking of these 'aspects' of the Covenant, then one can see & appreciate several Covenants. However, I believe most would deduce that only one Covenant was made with Abram, which composed of these four separate parts of the One.
Hi Wayne. Do you mean, "why was Titus not required to be circumcised"?
If that's what you're enquiring about, then that was, in part, because Titus was a Gentile (a Greek) & not a Jew. Every Jewish male at eight days of age, was required to be circumcised ( Genesis 17:10-12 ff) as part of the Covenant God made with Israel, separating them as a special people from the surrounding heathen.
When the Apostle Paul & Barnabas went up to Jerusalem to meet with the Jerusalem Council of Apostles & Elders (see Acts 15:2), he took Titus with them as well. But the Council agreed that Titus, a gentile, should not be circumcised; some were believing & requiring (chiefly by the Judaizers: Galatians 2:4), that gentiles must first be circumcised (i.e. become 'Jews') before they could be accepted as (Christian) believers. So with the agreement & blessing of the Council, the apostles & the early Church were unified that neither circumcision nor the workings of the Law ( Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2-13) should ever be imposed on gentiles, even as the Law no longer had strength on anyone (Jew or Gentile) when only God's Grace through faith brought salvation & liberty to those now in Christ. This was a major aspect of the early Church as they battled with not only Gentiles being brought into the body of believers, but that all the Laws that served to show the Jews their inability to keep them, were also now cast aside, because of "Christ is (now brought) the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth" ( Romans 10:4).
Re: Exodus 6:2,3. As I re-read it again, I believe that God Himself is telling Moses (& all who read His Word), that His Name is Jehovah but this Name was not known to Abraham, Isaac, & Jacob. They knew Him as "God Almighty" (El Shaddai: the Almighty God) as seen in Genesis 17:1:
"And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the ALMIGHTY GOD (El Shaddai); walk before me, and be thou perfect".
God here in Exodus is stating Who He is to His people under this special Covenant. If you believe that this is not what God said, then I can't go further with it, because I read it with plain understanding. All I can see, is that these names, which you find detestable & demonic, are Hebrew words of God showing Himself in His fullness. But where we have God's compound Names (e.g. Jehovah-Jireh/Ropheka/Nissi/Shalom/Sabaoth/and others) these I will admit are Names that are given when Israel saw their God at Work in their presence but most certainly NOT Satan-inspired names. If anything is debatable or problematic, then we need to search for proof.
Part 3
I hope even though you may not agree, you can make sense of my replies. I would like to tell you I do not Have anything in common with JW or their translation of the bible.
My understanding we are mortal beings and no part of us is immortal. I see the spirit as our breath/life that goes back to God when we die, Ecclesiastes 11:7 and Scripture tell us the soul can die, Ezekiel 18:4 Matthew 10:28 Hebrew 9:27. Like Paul said of David being dead in the tomb and has not ascended to heaven, Acts 2:34. We do not put on immortality until the resurrection, 1 Corinthians 15:53-54.
Bear with me my Greek is kindergarten level, arche the beginning or origin I see it maybe a little differently I understand God the Father as the Creator as in Genesis 1:1 and Psalm 19:1. I believe in the plan of God Jesus was first and as in Romans 4:17 Jesus was in Gods eyes in the womb of Mary and then the angels and all the counsel of heaven then the earth and all that was to be.
In Genesis 17:5 when God renamed Abram to Abraham God said, "for the father of many nations I have made thee". It was not Abraham will become a father of many nations it was already done in the plan of God.
"Firstborn of every creature and the firstborn from the dead" Jesus was the firstborn, Jesus being the first in God's plan would make Him the firstborn, and Jesus is the firstborn of the dead. There were people brought back from the dead like in 2 Kings 13:21 the guy was thrown into Elisha's tomb and when his body touched Elisha's bone he came back to life and stood up, and we see the ones in the New Testament. No one who died before Jesus who came back to life died again Jesus was the first to overcome death.
Jesus is the firstborn of the dead because He had no sin and death could not hold Him and when Jesus rose He rose in a glorified body never to die again, Revelation 1:18. That is what we look forward to when we are resurrected.
See part 4 sorry I am slow.
Titus 1:16] They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
Christanity rebells when they have to be perfect thry immediately pass it on to Jesus when Jesus preached in Matthew 5:48 we (human beings) have to be perfect even as our Father which is in heaven is perfect. Why does Christanity argue agianst Jesus? Because they were never told the truth. Let's look in the bible to find more perfect people before, during and after, Jesus. Adam and Eve were in Genesis 1&2 before thry heard another gospel in Genesis 3 from Rev Serpant/Rev Devil.
Before: Genesis 6:9] These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.
Genesis 17:1] And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.
Deuteronomy 18:13] Thou shalt be perfect with the LORD thy God.
Job 1:1] There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.
2nd Chronicals 16:9] For the eyes of the LORD run to and fro throughout the whole earth, to shew himself strong in the behalf of them whose heart is perfect toward him. Herein thou hast done foolishly: therefore from henceforth thou shalt have wars.
Psalm 37:37] Mark the perfect man, and behold the upright: for the end of that man is peace.
During Jesus:
Matthew 1:[19] Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privily.
See part 2
When asked that question in Scripture it seems God answers back with one of his many names. like he does when Paul asks in Acts 9:5.
Paul asked Who art thou, Lord? "kurios" (supreme in authority that is (as noun) controller; by implication Mr . (as a respectful title): - God Lord master Sir.)
The Lord answered him simply, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
There are several names for the one and only true God.
Each of the many names of God describes a different aspect of His many-faceted character. Here are some of the better-known names of God in the Bible:
I've looked up some of those names; Here they are.
Part 1.
EL, ELOAH [el, el-oh-ah]: God "mighty, strong, prominent" ( Nehemiah 9:17; Psalm 139:19) - etymologically, El appears to mean "power" and "might" ( Genesis 31:29). El is associated with other qualities, such as integrity ( Numbers 23:19), jealousy ( Deuteronomy 5:9), and compassion ( Nehemiah 9:31), but the root idea of "might" remains.
ELOHIM [el-oh-heem]: God "Creator, Mighty and Strong" ( Genesis 17:7; Jeremiah 31:33) - the plural form of Eloah, which accommodates the doctrine of the Trinity. From the Bible's first sentence, the superlative nature of God's power is evident as God (Elohim) speaks the world into existence ( Genesis 1:1).
EL SHADDAI [el-shah-dahy]: "God Almighty," "The Mighty One of Jacob" ( Genesis 49:24; Psalm 132:2,5) - speaks to God's ultimate power over all.
ADONAI [dna; ah-daw-nahy]: "Lord" ( Genesis 15:2; Judges 6:15) - used in place of YHWH, which was thought by the Jews to be too sacred to be uttered by sinful men. In the Old Testament, YHWH is more often used in God's dealings with His people, while Adonai is used more when He deals with the Gentiles.
See Part 2.
It is clear that there was always a chosen line of ancestry. This is evident from the fact that the Book of Genesis only gives the genealogy of Seth (although Cain's genealogy is mentioned briefly), ignoring all the other descendants of Adam and Eve.
The line of Seth takes us all the way to the birth of Jesus. "There are some Gentiles in the line of Jesus by way of Rahab and Ruth.
There was always a chosen line, but that does not mean there has ALWAYS been a separation of Jews and Gentiles.
It seems, then, that the separation of Jews and Gentiles did not BEGIN to occur until God called Abraham to be the father of His chosen nation, Israel ( Genesis 12). Many view Abraham as the first Jew, even though the precise term Jew did not come into use until after the return from exile when the tribe of Judah was dominant.
Another placement of the division of Jews from Gentiles would be with Jacob, whose name was changed by God to Israel
Genesis 32:28.
(All of the descendants of Jacob, through his 12 sons)
I believe the separation of lineage started with Seth and the ACTUAL separation of Jews and the rest of the world/Gentiles Started in Genesis 17:10-19 and highlighted in vs 17-18.
"And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee!
And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
Abraham was given a seal if a covenant of circumcision, "A cutting away of sinful flesh" in
Genesis 17:10-14.
This pointed to Christ work on the cross. Colossians 2:10-17.
This has nothing to do with race!
It has everything to do with covenant!
And a Jew inwardly has nothing to do with Israel as a Nation and God's covenant and future promises to the Nation Israel and the Davidic kingdom in the Millennium.
GB.
All of us are descended from the Noah, who had three sons. Noah was from the lineage of Seth (who was a son of Adam and Eve.
Noah's sons were Shem, Japheth. At the time of Noah and his sons, no one was a Hebrew.
You can read the lineage of Adam and Eve in Genesis Chapter 5. You can read the lineage of Noah in Genesis Chapter and 11.
Eber (or Heber) was the great grandson of Shem. It is from Eber that the name Hebrew came about People called them Hebaru.
All of the descendants of Eber were Hebrews, not just the Israelites. Abraham was descended from Eber in the sixth generation from Eber.
There were many descendants from Shem (Noah's son). These people were considered as Semites (which is derived from the name Shem).
Abraham was a Hebrew. So was Lot and Sarai. Abraham had eight sons-Ishmael (from Hagar), Isaac (from Sarai), and six more sons from Keturah after Sarai died. All of the peoples descended from the sons of Abraham are Hebrews and Semites. These are mostly the people who settled the Arabian peninsula and wilderness/ mountainous areas near Canaan. Isaac settled in Canaan with his father, Abraham. So, the Israelites are not the only descendants of Abraham, however, God told Abraham that it is through Isaac that are heirs to the promises (covenant) to Abraham ( Genesis 17:19)
Jacob and Esau were born to Isaac. They were twins. God determined that the promises/covenant God made with
Abraham and Isaac will be fulfilled through Jacob as the heir, not Esau. So, both Esau and Jacob were Hebrews, grandsons of Abraham, but the people God was going to call to Himself were to come from Jacob.
God changed Jacob's name to Israel and renewed the covenant of Abraham with Jacob. Jacob had twelve sons. These sons were
all Hebrews. Jacob's son, Judah was selected as the son by whom the Messiah would descend. The people of Judah's lineage were called Judahites, Jehus, and as a term of derision, Jews by the surrounding peoples.
see Part 2
Genesis 3:19; Genesis 6:3, violance or destroyed by the flood ( Genesis 6:5-7,11-13;17). Only Noah his wife, Shem, Ham, and Japheth their 3 wives survived. that means only eight people survived out of Adams and eve's children and grand children.
The point! not all of Noah's children listened to God. They followed Satan the devil and his lies Genesis 3. when you read about the Canaanites ( Genesis 13:7; Leviticus 18:1-5) this bad nation came through Ham descendance ( Genesis 10:6). or Ammorites, some Noah's descendance created a nation by their family name Genesis 11. When Jehovah ( psalm 83:18) confused their language they all spread out and became nations of people like you see today.
to the point: Abraham was a righteous man who lived in Canaan. but one of God's angels told him to leave Canaan then became a father to a nation of Israel ( Genesis 17:1-8). God name Jacob Israel ( Genesis 32:28). this is how a Nation of Isreal came about. Canaan land later became Jerusalem belonging to Israel the Jews.
However, Israel repeatedly sinned by worshiping other gods. even Solomon the last king worshiped false Gods ( Nehemiah 13:23-27) Jesus turned to the Gentiles which means nation who will believe ( John 3:16,17).
However, their are some Israelites who did believe, but most rejected Jesus.- Acts 1:6-8; Matthew 24:14; 2 Timothy 3:13-17
It's a lot of info. but I hope the bible answered your question HOW A NATION BECAME A INDEPENDANT NATION
Part 1.
Abraham in Genesis 17:6 where it is recorded: "And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee."
This is restated in verse 16 of the same chapter in relation to the promise of the son of Sarah: "And I will bless her, and moreover I will give thee a son of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of peoples shall be of her."
It is probable that there would be little question about the meaning of this covenant, if it did not involve eschatology as a whole. It would seem that the promises are simple and direct that David's posterity should continue forever and that his political kingdom would not end. However, even such a simple interpretation presents some immediate problems, as David himself seems to anticipate when he notes that the prophecy concerns a long time to come.
The principal difficulty, however, seems to be that the connotation of the Davidic covenant supports the premillennial interpretation of the Bible involving a future reign of Christ on earth as David's greater Son. This point of view is quite unacceptable to the amillenarian and therefore for them some interpretation of the Davidic covenant must be found other than that of a literal fulfillment. Generally speaking, amillenarians deny that this covenant has any decisive force on the millennial question and find its terms fulfilled in the present day with God's dealings with the church. Quite often the attempt is made to deny that anything in the Old Testament construes a premillennial eschatology and statements are made such as that of Louis Berkhof: "The only Scriptural basis for this theory [i.e., premillennialism] is Revelation 20:1-6, after an Old Testament content has been poured into it" (Systematic Theology,)
See part 2.
In brief the Amillennial view.
Part 3.
Centuries after Abraham died, the children of Israel took possession of the land under Joshua's leadership ( Joshua 21:43). At no point in history, though, has Israel controlled all of the land God had specified. There remains, therefore, a final fulfillment of the Abrahamic Covenant that will see Israel occupying their God-given homeland to the fullest extent. The fulfillment will be more than a matter of geography; it will also be a time of holiness and restoration (see Ezekiel 20:40-44 and 36:1-37:28).
The Abrahamic Covenant also promised many descendants ( Genesis 12:2). God promised that the number of Abraham's children would rival that of "the dust of the earth" ( Genesis 15:16). Nations and kings would proceed from him ( Genesis 17:6). It is significant that the promise was given to an aged, childless couple. But Abraham "did not waver through unbelief" ( Romans 4:20), and his wife Sarah "considered him faithful who had made the promise" ( Hebrews 11:11). Abraham was justified by his faith ( Genesis 15:6), and he and his wife welcomed Isaac, the son of promise, into their home when they were 100 and 90 years old, respectively ( Genesis 21:5).
God reiterates the Abrahamic Covenant to Isaac and to his son Jacob, whose name God changes to Israel. The great nation is eventually established in the land where Abraham had dwelled. King David, one of Abraham's many descendants, is given the Davidic Covenant ( 2 Samuel 7:12-16), promising a "son of David" who would one day rule over the Jewish nation-and all nations-from Jerusalem. Many other Old Testament prophecies point to the blessed, future fulfillment of that promise (e.g., Isaiah 11; Micah 4; Zechariah 8).
See Part 4.
Part 2.
In Genesis 15, God alone moves between the halves of the animals. Abraham was in a deep sleep. God's solitary action indicates that the covenant is principally His promise. God binds Himself to the covenant.
Later, God gave Abraham the rite of circumcision as the specific sign of the Abrahamic Covenant ( Genesis 17:9-14). All males in Abraham's line were to be circumcised and thus carry with them a lifelong mark in their flesh that they were part of God's physical blessing in the world. Any descendant of Abraham who refused circumcision was declaring himself to be outside of God's covenant; this explains why God was angry with Moses when Moses failed to circumcise his son ( Exodus 4:24-26).
God determined to call out a special people for Himself, and through that special people He would bless the whole world. The Lord tells Abram,
"I will make you into a great nation,
and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
will be blessed through you" ( Genesis 12:2-3).
Based on this promise, God later changed Abram's name from Abram ("high father") to Abraham ("father of a multitude") in Genesis 17:5. As we've seen, the Abrahamic Covenant is unconditional. It should also be taken literally. There is no need to spiritualize the promise to Abraham. God's promises to Abraham's descendants will be fulfilled literally.
The Abrahamic Covenant included the promise of land ( Genesis 12:1). It was a specific land, an actual property, with dimensions specified in Genesis 15:18-21. In Genesis 13:15, God gives Abraham all the land that he can see, and the gift is declared to be "forever." God was not going to renege on His promise. The territory given as part of the Abrahamic Covenant is expanded in Deuteronomy 30:1-10, often called the Palestinian Covenant.
See Part 3.
Nehemiah 9:7, Acts 7:2,
Hopefully helpful
James 4, not GOD's perfect plan, timing = look at Abraham he was promised a son, even past natural ability Genesis 12:4,6,7, Abram 75 yrs old, Genesis 17:1-8, Abraham also called Abram 90 yrs old, Sarah Genesis 18:10,11, Genesis 21:1-3, was the delay for example of faith Hebrews 11, was it for the linage of Salvation timing? Matthew 1:17, ?
1John 3:22, John 16:23, Psalms 37, Luke 11, Matthew 6, Matthew 7, Matthew 7:7, Matthew 21:22, Luke 18,
I fasted, prayed, begged, cried out & received what I asked many times & several of those caused me years of deep pain, regret, sadness etc. Trust GOD ALMIGHTY sometimes it's protection, not seeing & knowing everything & everyone attached to the things we ask. Luke 8:10-18,
Luke 8:15, Revelation 3:10,
Hopefully these are helpful
What about those who have never heard?
I may have said a lot of this stuff before; hopefully there are a few nuances of difference. The scripture is always the best guide to answering tough questions. We have examples of Abraham called out of Ur of Chaldee; for example who was the father of all those of Monotheistic faith today. He was called in a foreign land; and given a future promise of a Promised Land as well as offspring who would inherit it ( Genesis 17:2 and repeated in Hebrews). He never got to dwell permanently anywhere but was a nomad in the desert and through miraculous means his wife of 90 conceived when he was 100.
When we look at the story of Sodom and Gomorrah; we could say that Abraham was having a sort of contest with God on a similar theme; His preservation of the city if a small number of righteous men lived there; he started with 50 men and ended at 10. This shows a theme which also was repeated with God waiting for a certain period until transgressions were full to judge in Genesis 15:16. Sodom was ripe for judgment as were the Amorites; but in their case it wasn't until four generations later and THAT along with Egypt being judged for their fullness of iniquity that finally bought the descendants to conquer the Promised Land. So God calls out His people wherever they are if they are chosen (predestined) to be His children. He will send angels or whatever means to reach the lost; and we see this happening again in the Book of Revelation. If we seek the God of the Bible then we have to believe His Word on our spiritual condition (as sinners) and we need to have it revealed to us (i.e. granted repentance as shown in Acts 11:18 and elsewhere.
The confession of our mouth and believe in our heart ( Romans 10:19) it is a RESULT of His Spirit working in us to convict of sin; righteousness and judgment to come ( John 16:8-11).
Conversion of course involves interaction and our choice to verbally repent.
My understanding, Jesus coming, the Messiah/Christ was not a secret, Daniel 9:25 prophesied when He would come. Jesus came to fulfill the prophets and the law, and when Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist the Holy Spirit descended on Jesus, and Jesus was filled without measure, John 3:34.
John the Baptist proclaimed it, John 1:34 and His disciples did as well, John 1:41 Jesus told the woman at the well He was the Messiah, John 25:25-26 and Martha John 11:27. It was confirmed by all the miracles Jesus did by the Spirit of God, Matt. 12:28 the kingdom of God has come, but the death and resurrection were, at that time a secret/mystery, Rom. 11:25.
The kingdom of God has come, John said it was at hand, Matt. 3:1-2. After John was put in prison Jesus came preaching Mark 1:14-15. The mystery of the kingdom; they were looking for the stone to crush Rome and the kingdom would be set up then Daniel 2:44, but it was like the parables of the mustard seed and the yeast Matt. 13, increasing even today until the crushing blow at Jesus second coming.
The disciples knew Jesus was the Messiah/Christ, so I am sure that was part of their preaching, but Jesus' death and resurrection were hidden even from the disciples Luke 9:45. We see how they fled when Jesus was arrested, Matt. 26:56, and they did not believe He resurrected Mark 16:10-11 Luke 23:10-11 it was hidden from them for if Satan had known the results, he would have tried to stop it.
Jesus spoke mainly to the Pharisees and Sadducees in parables to fulfill the prophecy, Matt. 13:10-15 Mark 4:10-13 Luke 8:10. The mystery was not revealed until after Jesus was resurrected as Jesus told them the Holy Spirit would bring remembrance and teaching to them John 14:26 John 16:3-4 Romans 11:25 Romans 16:25 the promise to Abraham Genesis 17:4-7 and that seed was Jesus the Messiah/Christ.
This is my understanding may someone else have another, pray and study for your understanding.
God bless,
RLW
After much study & reading, I've understood deeper the connections of names, families, places etc.
For instance Melchizedek, in Genesis 14:18, is very significant later! Psalms 110:4,
Hebrews 7, Hebrews 5:5-10, Hebrews 6:18-20,
Lot, Abraham's nephew also called brother Genesis 14:12-16, Genesis 13:8-13, also shows Abraham's love, meekness, loyalty to Lot. Genesis 18, also Lot spoken of in New Testament as a promise of deliverance of GOD"S people 2Peter 2:4-9,
Genesis 19, Sodom & Gomorrha also spoken of several times
& Abraham himself named Abram, Genesis 17:5,15, & Sari, Sarah, it's amazing the significance of names we find as we keep reading & studying! John 14:26
Hopefully these are helpful
Sometimes people live up to names given, is it because they've been called so? Genesis 27:36,
However sometimes a name is earned: Genesis 25:30, Genesis 30:13, Revelation 11:8, Revelation 12:9, Revelation 19:13, Revelation 17:14
Many times people in the Bible share name, yet are completely different. Especially 1611 KJV, on this site. Examples today many people have name like Jesus pronunciation different are not even close, or Angels names, that are far from. We should be careful to not be deceived even evil can appear as light, likewise many names have been made to deceive. 2Corinthians 11:13,14
There are divine names given by GOD however, those maybe we should take more notice of, :
Genesis 16:11,12, Genesis 11:29, + Genesis 17:5,15,19, Genesis 32:28, Genesis 35:10, Revelation 19:11,
Thanks for your question, for it did remind me of that. Genesis 5:2,
Hopefully these are helpful & give you intrigue into deeper study of names with scripture & reading GOD's WORD
God initiated a covenant with Abraham that the Jews would be circumcised. Genesis 17:7-14; 21
In Genesis 17:15-21. God initiated a Covenant with Abraham and his wife Sarah, that a child of their flesh would be born to them in one years time.
In Genesis 17:20 God tells of the blessing given to Ishmael and his descendants: wealth, princes, power, kingdoms. Genesis 15:4, God says Ishmael is not Abrahams heir.
The DEED to the Lands of Israel- Genesis 12:1-3, 6-7 and
Genesis 17:7-8. Genesis 15:12-21.
These are the issues that perpetuate struggles in the land of Israel. I know Ishmael was firstborn, but his mother is Hagar a handmaiden to Sarah. Abrahams wife was Sarah; the marriage covenant wife of Abraham. If you'll Google Hagars history, you'll see she returned to her people with Ishmael.
Later Sarah died and Abraham married another woman. Hagar returned there. I think I remember that she lived there for a time, but not in Abraham's household. Eventually she returned to her people. It's a very sad story.
I've lived missed opportunities myself. It's harsh. But we get up out of the ashes and see what God has planned for us, next.
Endings are usually sad, but new beginnings can be joyful.
Mishael
Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.
2 Corinthians 1:3-4
Starting with verse 9 in Genesis 17 we see God establishes the Abrahamic covenant and with physical circumcision. This covenant was of blood from the male and established at that time (during the days of Abraham there was no law yet, no commandments) this being an early way of raising blood up. Now, thank goodness Christ Jesus was that Blood for us (especially for us men) as His Blood that he shed for us once we accept His Grace by Faith; this then circumcision is by the heart. The Apostle Paul explained it like this:
Romans 2:25
For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
Romans 2:26
Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
Romans 2:27
And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
Romans 2:28
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Romans 2:29
But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.
I hope this helps and now that you're saved. Please find a community of fellow believers to share the good news with and stay close to your KJV Bible. It's living Word which will guide you every step of the way.
I have accepted our divine lord as my father of all my existence. I am studying the Bible and getting to be closer to my Father Abba through his teaching.
I have read this chapter and would like to know what it is meant by circumcising? What motions or act is done when a person is being circumcised spiritually?
Part 1
As I promised I would get back to you on your reply and questioning.
Let's start with the verses you gave as the promises that Israel forfeited over to the Church.
1. Genesis 12:1-3,
2. Genesis 12:7,
3. Genesis 13:14-17,
4. Genesis 15:5-7
5. Genesis 15:13-15,
6. Genesis 15:18-21,
7. Genesis 17:4-10,
8. Genesis 21:17-18
You stated, "Abraham and his seed pass to Jesus and His children. and you say according to
Galatians 3:16. Paul atributes these verses to Christ it is obvious that they are for Israel as well.
Let's look at Galatians 3:14-17.
If you notice in the link the promise/covenant was not a land covenant. Verses 2-8 you gave are all the land covenant.
Did you notice in Genesis 15:15-17. God told Abraham he would die before they would enter the land?
Look how Stephen put in Acts 7:4-5.
"and is is after God performed the covenant!!" So when will he inherit it? Hebrews11:8-10.
Now the 1st verse is a preview of both. The Promise his seed going to be given land. "Israel"
( and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. ) "Christ"
This is the only portion associated with Galatians 3:16.
Here is the covenant Paul is speaking of in Galatians.
( And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; AND THY SEED SHALL POSSESS THE GATE OF "HIS" ENEMIES;
And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. )
Genesis 22:16-18.
The Gospel was preached even before there was a law to be broken.
Galatians 3:8.
" Important verse"
I removed "if it" because I believe it's in italics and shouldn't be there.
( Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet be confirmed, NO MAN DISANNULLETH, OR ADDETH THERETO.) Galatians 3:15.
DearSpencer, lets talk about God's promises to Abraham.
Lets go to Genesis. The verses that describe God's promises to Abraham are the following:
1. Genesis 12:1-3,
2. Genesis 12:7,
3. Genesis 13:14-17,
4. Genesis 15:5-7
5. Genesis 15:13-15,
6. Genesis 15:18-21,
7. Genesis 17:4-10,
8. Genesis 21:17-18
Now in most of them God gives His promises to Abraham and his seed. Who is this seed. the obvious answer is that it is his biological descedants. Paul in his epistle to Galatians 3:16 disagrees, he says "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.". So we can agree that all the promises given to Abraham and his seed pass to Jesus and His children, Which are they? The 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and the 8th. Only one is left the first. You will argue that although Paul atributes those verses to Christ it is obvious that they are for Israel as well, the land covenant as you call it. You are right about that. But that promise that Cannan will be given to Israel by God wasn't fulfiled when Joshua and his descendants conquered that land? Yes it was. So what other promise/covenant given to Abraham is left to be fulfiled? I cannot see any other, correct me if I am wrong. GBU
Great question., Here's a few scriptures you can look over that may have answers to your questions.I would chime in when time permits. In the meantime hopefully someone can help us.
NOTICE THE PROMISES AND COVENANT MADE BY GOD WITH NO PARTICIPATION ALLOWED BY MAN.
Genesis 15:1-12.
Genesis 17:18-19.
Romans 9:6-9.
Galatians 4:22-31.
EMPHASIS.
This Promised Covenant is the work of God and can't be annulled by man.
Likewise you see a similar method as a allegory in the birth of Jacob and Essau.
Gods elected way, "By grace ".
Romans 9:10-12. And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
All for now
God bless.
GOD is = GOD ALMIGHTY, Genesis 17:1, Genesis 28:3, Genesis 35:11, Genesis 48:3,
JEHOVAH, Exodus 6:3, FATHER : Matthew 23:9, Matthew 6:6-10, GOD of thy father, GOD of Abraham, GOD of Isaac, GOD of Jacob, Exodus 3:6,
Many times GOD is referred to by what HE has done: GOD that sees; Genesis 16:13, GOD that provides,
Hopefully this is helpful
The Covenant of the Land was CUT between God and Abraham; Abrahams children born ONLY with Sarah: Gods Perfect Will.
In Gods PERMISSIVE WILL, he blessed Ishmael too. It was not a covenant for any lands God set apart for Israel.
Israel's Lands (boundaries) are recorded in heaven and in the BIBLE. Look at the ancient maps of Abraham's time.
Throughout History, those boundaries have been illegally changed. God does Not Change. He personally cut the covenant Himself.
Most modern day maps of Israel deny what is recorded in the Bible: the Original Deed.
More info: God cut the covenant Himself. The Deed to the Land= Genesis 17:7:8
Genesis 16:10-16, 17:36-21
Genesis 21:14-18, Genes 25:12-17
Promise & blessing on Ishmael
Genesis 17:18-26. Story Gen. 21:16-21
ISRAEL's SIZE TODAY=
Israel stretches 424 km (263 mi) from north to south, its width ranges from 114 km (71 miles) length, to 15 km (9.3 miles) width, at its narrowest point. *Israel and New Jersey are similar in size.
Folks, this is why the end of this fight/war__ will be fought at ARMAGEDDON__in Israel, in the the Valley of Megiddo. As it is written in the Bible, so shall it be done.
There will be NO PEACE until THE PRINCE OF PEACE returns
We're getting close to that time. "wars, rumors of wars, nations rising up against each other. Read Matthew 24, Luke 21 and the Book of Daniel, minor prophets books: if you want to know what's going to happen. If you don't read much; listen to some Nelson Walters videos on YouTube.
There's going to be 7 Seals opened; 7 Trumpets; 7 Bowls of Judgment.
The internet "thought leaders" are going to force one world currency (money system, one world government and one worldwide religion. Look for it now.
Don't be deceived. Choose Jesus NOW. Lack of food , water and fuel are signs. Somebody please preach this every day. Signs are speeding up.
Genesis 25:13-18, 1Chronicles 1:29-31,
Genesis 16:10-12, Genesis 16:15, Genesis 17:20-21, Genesis 25:8-10,
Genesis 28:9, Genesis 36:3,
Ishmael the son of Nethaniah
2Kings 25:23,25, Jeremiah 40:8,14,15,16, Jeremiah 41:1-18,
Ishmael the son of Azel
1Chronicles 8:38, 1Chronicles 9:44,
Ishmael the son of Jehohanan
2Chronicles 23:1,
Ishmael the son of Pashur,
Ezra 10:22,
1Timothy 1:4,
Genesis 12:1-3, the Covenant made. But of this Covenant, several 'expansions' to it were made to fully express it. And they are:
Genesis 15:18, God ratifies that Covenant in a national perspective.
Genesis 17:4-6,16, God ratifies that Covenant in an international perspective.
Genesis 17:7, God ratifies that Covenant as an Everlasting Covenant.
Genesis 17:10-14, God ratifies that Covenant by an act of circumcision (also in Stephen's message in Acts 7:8).
So, if you're thinking of these 'aspects' of the Covenant, then one can see & appreciate several Covenants. However, I believe most would deduce that only one Covenant was made with Abram, which composed of these four separate parts of the One.
If that's what you're enquiring about, then that was, in part, because Titus was a Gentile (a Greek) & not a Jew. Every Jewish male at eight days of age, was required to be circumcised ( Genesis 17:10-12 ff) as part of the Covenant God made with Israel, separating them as a special people from the surrounding heathen.
When the Apostle Paul & Barnabas went up to Jerusalem to meet with the Jerusalem Council of Apostles & Elders (see Acts 15:2), he took Titus with them as well. But the Council agreed that Titus, a gentile, should not be circumcised; some were believing & requiring (chiefly by the Judaizers: Galatians 2:4), that gentiles must first be circumcised (i.e. become 'Jews') before they could be accepted as (Christian) believers. So with the agreement & blessing of the Council, the apostles & the early Church were unified that neither circumcision nor the workings of the Law ( Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2-13) should ever be imposed on gentiles, even as the Law no longer had strength on anyone (Jew or Gentile) when only God's Grace through faith brought salvation & liberty to those now in Christ. This was a major aspect of the early Church as they battled with not only Gentiles being brought into the body of believers, but that all the Laws that served to show the Jews their inability to keep them, were also now cast aside, because of "Christ is (now brought) the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth" ( Romans 10:4).