Discuss Genesis 9 Page 4

I believe the Bible is God's Word. If you believe it's a corrupted man's word then I wonder why you're reading it and what other info source you're comparing to, like Hebrew? Did someone tell you the KJV is corrupted and do you believe them or are you assuming this based on your own research of something in particular?

You gave a few examples in a sentence, but I can't quite discern what you're referring to. It sounds you're mentioning someone being naked, but you didn't say what book/chapter/verse nor whether you think the KJV says that or Hebrew says that or some other source? If you want to discuss your questions in an open manner that can be done and you'll probably get others' input, but to come to a KJV Bible site and claim that the Bible is corrupt without any dialog seems inappropriate.

I was able to comprehend your statement about tower of babel, however. Ok, you seemed to ask where races came from and I gave my opinion and wrote the 2nd paragraph response to you. But now you're saying that it wasn't in the Bible. Of course it's not in the Bible- if it was in the Bible would you be asking about it? And that's why I wrote what I did: "While the Bible doesn't explain all answers to all questions we have..." which is why I offered my opinion.

I'm just going to go and say it... Why does Noah get naked? I'm quite confused, and don't really see any symbolism in it.

I would love some responses as I'm currently trying to learn more about christianity as I've recently felt more and more drawn toward god.

Thank you for you comment, I too trust GOD word over man's assumptions, but isn't what's in the KJV, the translation from the Hebrew writings? And if yes, then why do the Hebrew writings from 200BC say without covering his nakedness. brother your soul is at stake, and you have to make sure for yourself, do your own research, but be wise about it, don't go by what somebody is telling you it says, look for yourself, and you quoted some theories about Noah having a mix race family, that's just bonkers to me, and I've only been study for 6 months, and at the tower of babel, it says nothing about changing Thier races, he confounded their language,and scattered them across the earth. We know Satan Will cause a great deception, don't you think that corruption of the word of GOD, and misleading the followers of Jesus Christ could be the great deception? That's why you should do your own research, and not trust man. You said you will take God words over man's words any day didn't ya?

Now ask yourself, does that make any sense? If you read what the Hebrews originally wrote, it say's without covering his nakedness. You are correct, when you say he went out of the tent, and told his brother's, and that's how they new to bring a garment and walk backwards, that's not what's in question here, it's what they have taken out from the Bible, and what was originally written, that's in question, and that's just so they don't have to talk about, different civilization's, using the curse of Canaan, to justify them in slaving black people, but the curse was, he and his offsprings would be of a darker hue. We have to go by the closest too, and the most reliable information that we have, and when they start leaving out words, and start changing words, just to be politically correct, and Christians except it, well I have a problem with that and so does GOD!!! GOD Bless brother.

Hi David. Just to clarify Genesis 9:22, "And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without."

The word "without" here, is an older English word usage, meaning 'outside'. It is supposed to be the opposite of 'within'. We use 'within' often, but not so with, 'without'. Therefore, when Ham saw (or, observed) his father's condition, he went & told his two brothers who were 'outside' the tent. So when the brothers, knowing their father's state, approached the tent opening, they put a (large) material across their shoulders & walked backwards into the tent to cover their father & in so doing gave him due respect.

No words are missing in the KJV Bible. The meaning has been the same for more than 400 years since its first printing, which can easily be verified on a website like this. People sometimes make false assumptions about it though. I trust God's word over man's word any day.

In the middle of your statement, you said "no other time in the bible that can account for the black race." I'm not sure where you get your information from. While the Bible doesn't explain all answers to all questions we have, it does say a lot. Maybe your question is where do races come from. Two common theories exist- some believe Noah's family was diverse and spread out into different people groups from there. And others, including myself, believe God's work at the Tower of Babel included changes to culture and race, along with the already disclosed language creation and regional placement across the earth. God bless.

Well canaan, the son of ham was cursed with a darker hue, and that's been toking out by are trusty bible Scholars, so they don't have to talk about slavery. But, ham's son was cursed because Noah couldn't curse ham, because GOD Blessed Noah and his 3 Son's before they step out of the ark, so canaan was ham's first born, and therefore he had to be the one that Noah cursed. I pray this answer the question you had. GOD Bless.

There is a lot of missing words here, it says, he told his two brothers without. And goes on to the next verse, without What? It supposed to say "without covering his nakedness, also the bible scholars don't want to talk about it, but the curse before it was taken out to be politically correct, but it should say that canaan was cursed with a darker hue, meaning that he was the start of the black race, you can argue until the cows come home, but if that curse of a darker hue didn't mean black, then where did they come from, there is no other time in the bible that can account for the black race, it's not saying anything offensive to the black race, we are all sinners, and fall and fall short of the glory of GOD, when you start taking out the word of GOD, because you don't want to talk about slavery, well then you are doing the Devil's Work, and leading people astray on to the road of destruction, I can't in good faith ask for any mercy on their soul.

Hello,

I just want to expand on your question/answers.

1st perspective: usually this question is asked after a loved animal dies.

If you just lost an animal that you loved, GOD knows our pain, suffering & sorrows.

Isaiah 53:3, 1 Peter 5:7,

Interesting scriptures about animals

Numbers 22:28,30,

Isaiah 11:4,6,7,8

Genesis 9:5

Hope

1 Corinthians 2:9

Hopefully these scriptures are encouraging.

Thank you for your reply Chris.

Hello John. I don't believe that Leviticus 18:12 can be applied to the Noah/Ham matter as that verse is specifically referring to unnatural familial relationships whereas Ham showed disrespect & disregard to his Father by what he did, in spite of Noah's pitiful condition.

English Sacha's graphical retelling of this portion may be closer to the truth than we know, which I had not earlier considered.

Thank you "English Sacha". I have always agreed with your interpretation of these events. When I hear a new interpretation of bible facts it seems prudent to apply "Occam's Razor".

Hi John , you are correct , the Bible doesn't mess about when discussing human sinfullness . This is why I don't believe that Ham had sex with either of his parents . I think that if he did it would say exactly that . This is just my opinion , I think that Ham found his father 'uncovered ' and had a laugh at his expense , something along the lines of ' look at this silly old drunk ' perhaps ? He said as much to his two brothers and invited them to mock their dad with him . They were a bit more respectfull , Noah awoke with a hangover and in a bit of a bad mood and realised the kind of thing that had happened because of the blanket covering his nakedness . After he had made his enquiries and learnt of Hams disrespect of him , Noah had a few choice words . This is all in my imagination of course . We can always speculate and try to read between the lines as long as we recognise that thats what we have done . May God bless us all with ears to hear and eyes to see .

I know the bible often discusses the most despicable and unsavory parts of man's sinful nature. The account in Genesis where Ham "saw the nakedness" of his father seems to be one such scripture.

Growing up hearing and studying Genesis 9:22, I was taught Ham was cursed because he literally "saw the nakedness" of his father Noah. (This seems to be the most polite way of explaining what actually happened.)

Here is the full account of this incident:

Genesis. 9:22

And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father and told his two brethren without.

23. And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father, and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness.

24. And Noah awoke from his wine and knew what his younger son had done unto him.

25. And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.

I have recently come across an interpretation of this incident that is rather disturbing.

In Lev. 18: 12: Thou shalt not "uncover the nakedness" of thy father's sister: she is thy father's near kinswoman. God is forbidding copulation with close relatives.

In Genesis 9:22 The language is very similar and seems to indicate that Ham copulated with his father Noah and possibly with his mother because a son of Ham was also cursed.

I know this incident is a little unsavory. However, it is in the word of God, and I would like to know the truth about this incident. Especially, in light of the current worldly corruption that is permeating every part of our current world.

You're going to have to do some fancy googling; maybe read some Hebrew history. You can hang out or check tomorrow; CHRIS may already know that date.

Genesis 6:9

These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

Genesis 7:13

In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark;

Genesis 5:32

And Noah was five hundred years old: and Noah begat Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Genesis 7:9

There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.

Isaiah 54:9

For this is as the waters of Noah unto me: for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth; so have I sworn that I would not be wroth with thee, nor rebuke thee.

Genesis 9:28

And all the days of Noah were nine hundred and fifty years: and he died.

Genesis 7:6

And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth.

Genesis 7:11

In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.

Genesis 8:13

And it came to pass in the six hundredth and first year, in the first month, the first day of the month, the waters were dried up from off the earth: and Noah removed the covering of the ark, and looked, and, behold, the face of the ground was dry.

Genesis 10:1

Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood.

Genesis 9:4-6

Exodus 23:28-29

Joshua 24:12



I hope these scriptures help your search for truth.

Thami, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

Revelation 4:7

The four beast should be translated as the four LIVING creatures.

These four living creatures are ALL OF CREATION:

Man, Cattle, Fowl, and Beast.

We can see this same thing explained when God made a covenant with CREATION never to destroy it again with water.

Genesis 9:9 And I, behold, I establish my covenant with you (Noah) (MAN), and with your seed (MAN)

after you.

Genesis 9:10 And with every living creature (CREATION) that is with you (MAN), of the FOWL, of the CATTLE, and of every BEAST of the earth with you (MAN).........

Revelation 4:7 And the first living creature (CREATION) was a lion (BEAST), and the second living creature (CREATION) was a calf (CATTLE), and the third living creature (CREATION) had a face as a man (MAN), and the fourth living creature (CREATION) was a flying eagle (FOWL).

This same thing is in:

Ezekiel 1:10 As for the likeness of their faces, they (CREATION) four had the face of a MAN, and the face of a lion (BEAST), on the right side: and they (CREATION) four had the face of an ox (CATTLE) on the left side, they (CREATION) four had the face of an eagle (FOWL).

Nakedness ; meaning Ham had sexual relationship with his mother,

And did you mean Cain ? ,.. if so , Eve was the mother of both Cain an Able , they were twins , by different Fathers,.. Cain of course of the Devil , for she partook of the tree of good an evil ,.. an Able of Adam ,.. hence the very first prophesy of our Heavenly Father, genesis 3 vs 15 ,..

Explain the nakedness of Noha

In Verse 21 and 22

and who was the mother of Canaan

I'm not sure how all these verses prove how evil we all are? But salvation in Christ is spoken of in detail in 2 Corinthians 5 (whole chapter) and in other places in the New Testament. But let me deal with the first quote you gave which says:

"And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually." Genesis 6:5

Now Noah found an exception with God. So, it is noted that he was a just man and perfect in his generations ( Genesis 6:7-9). In fact, he was the only man worth saving.

I won't go into all the other verses you mentioned because some of them are the words of kings (not God) and some of them relate to man in general (not all men).

The brazen serpent was made so if men looked at it after being bitten he would not die. If men look to the cross and unto Jesus that man will not die. That is why Jesus likened himself to be like the brazen serpent.

Jesus was not made of sinful flesh. But the flesh is not that important. It is the remission of blood that atones for sin. Jesus as all of us, had His Fathers blood. A child is normally born with his father's blood. That is why they prove paternity with blood test.

Because Jesus had God's blood He was sinless and He shed his sinless blood to atone for our sins. This is the victory. It had little to do with his sinless flesh. Jesus had no sin. He kept himself through His whole life. He was therefore the perfect sacrifice.

Jesus couldn't stay dead because He was perfect and God gave Jesus power to lay down his life and take it up again.

We execute people for killing other people because God told us to in Genesis 9:6 "Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man."

So, yes it is just to execute a man for killing another man.

I hope this helps you to understand.

You are correct Dianne. In Genesis 9:1, the same Hebrew word is used & in the context of what had occurred earlier (i.e. the flood & annihilation of all flesh), then using the word 'replenish' will satisfy the meaning. Since all was lost earlier, it could only be through Noah, his family & the preserved animals that the 'new world' would be set into a 'living' motion again.

But if we use 'replenish' in Genesis 1:28 instead of the word 'fill', then some unanswerable questions arise as to whether the Earth was inhabited in a 'previous' creation: if so, what form they took, if humans were created, then the sin question, their recovery, etc., etc. So, it's one thing to consider an earlier creation, but as some would like to confirm their belief on the basis of the word 'replenish', without any other information given in the Bible or in history, has to be placed in the "I can't be sure" basket. Thank you.

Thank you Leon for your comments. I looked at Genesis 9:1 also, & the same Hebrew word is applied there, so really it is a matter of how one chooses to apply that word to those three references in Genesis given, whether "to fill up" or "to replenish"/refill. And when I read your understanding of Genesis 1:1-3, I still cannot discern a previous creation of humans being implied, nor that there was light created in verse 1. I'm not saying that those things are impossibilities, but I don't see it in the normal reading & understanding of that Scripture. Are you learning this information from other sources?

And as far as the meaning & use of the Urim & Thummim goes, again, I can't assimilate them with God's pure Light & utter Perfection. God bless.

OSEAS,

You mention Israel's punishment for disobedience. According to Deuteronomy 26, Israel was punished by God 7 times (7 x 360 day per yr = 2,520 years). Here's the breakdown for both houses:

1) The house of Israel was taken into captivity by Assyria in 721 BC + 2,520 years = 1,799 as Ephraim became the British empire, and America (Manasseh) would soon come out of his twin brother. The lead tribes of the house of Israel (Ephraim, Manasseh, sons of Joseph) are the birthright people (land, wealth) per their ( Genesis 48) cross-handed blessing.

2) Next, the house of Judah was taken captive to Babylon in 604 BC +2,520 years = 1917 Balfour Declaration, signed to the hour, where Britain (Japheth born Rothschild) bought the false Ashkenazi Khazar Jews a home on land they hadn't claim to. They are supplanters of a massive conversion to Judaism. Genesis (10:2-3) Japheth is the grandson of Ashkenazim, today's convert Jew, who are NOT Semitic, or genetically connected to Abraham, Issac, Jacob, or Judah. ( Genesis 9:27) God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

It is a clear pattern, according to their Genesis 48 blessing, that Ephraim and Manasseh are Briton and US respectively. Even though Manasseh was born first, his younger brother (British isles) came first, and why Jacob crossed his hands over the 2 boys heads.

Will there be fire next time

My God comes back to earth?

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven( Job 38:4-7 4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. 5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? 6Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; 7When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?) and the earth. ( Isaiah 14:12-14 12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.) What I put in parentheses are the the other scriptures that show angles were made before the earth, since they are witness of the creation of the earth. Also I put in scripture were Lucifer first decide to rebel against God which would be after the creation of the earth before the flood of the universe which is why the Spirt of God is hovering over the waters. It was due to judgment against Lucifer and his fallen angels and creation at the time. Now angles cant die by the flood waters they are sprit but what ever was on the earth during that time could die which is were you can find your dinosaurs living during Lucifer rein over the earth. Also its the reason why God said in Genesis 9:11-15 And I will establish my covenant with you; neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth. Their was a flood before Noah's flood its the reason why good use the pervious waters already left over from the pervious flood. When ever waters is mentioned in Genesis it refers to the waters in Genesis 1:2.

Jesus was a Hebrew. The 1st man to be called Hebrew was Abram ( Genesis 14:13)

Jesus was Semitic (Shem), with color and tone similar to their Arab cousins

Today's Jews are Ashkenazi ( Genesis 10:2-3) they are 7th century Khazar converts of Japheth. ( Revelation 2:9)



( Genesis 9:27) God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

Sounds like Canaan will be a slave to his two brothers ( Isaiah 14:1-2)

Mishael comment: The verses show Noah's age during Bible events. I didn't show them, but Noah made sacrifices upon an altar to God; worshipping God in a time of gross sin. He was human and subject to the aging process.

I believe there is a prophetic reason why Enoch and Elijah were taken to heaven without seeing physical death. And... we will be witnesses of that reason.

Genesis 6:8

But Noah found GRACE in the eyes of the LORD.

Genesis 6:22

Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.

Genesis 7:6

And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth.

Genesis 8:13

And it came to pass in the six hundredth and first year, in the first month, the first day of the month, the waters were dried up from off the earth: and Noah removed the covering of the ark, and looked, and, behold, the face of the ground was dry.

Genesis 9:28

And Noah lived after the flood three hundred and fifty years.

Genesis 9:29

And all the days of Noah were nine hundred and fifty years: and he died.

Mishael: 'Grace', means Noah had the unmerited favor of God. He didn't earn it.

Just one ,the human race .

Jesse.

Well insignificant may be a poor choice of wording used by me. Kenna may want to know for secular reasons.

What I'm getting at is some things have no spiritual virtue.

Jesse

I Googled human races and it gave me the 100 yard dash, the 200 yard dash and ect.

Sometimes you can get insight on what is left out of scripture by rendering it insignificant.