Discuss Hebrews 6 Page 8

To JOEL OSTEEN

Regarding your views on Water Baptism it cannot save a person. Please read Hebrews 6:1,2. It was one of the rites of of the Jewish Religion ( Numbers 19:7, Hebrews 9:10). Like circumcision, it was strictly an act of faith, and as Peter explains it is an a pledge of good conscience towards God.

For a better understanding and the 'spiritual truth' of what it means to repent, and learn how and by whom mankind has been deceived ( Rev. 12:9) and what people must do to be reunited with the true and living God, we invite you to seek Him according to the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive ( Matthew 7:7; John 14:17).

Repentance is the key principle of all the teachings of Jesus Christ and the axiom (basis) of the Word of God and a prerequisite and primary requirement for the salvation of mankind. It actually means the changing of spirits - to turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan unto God ( Acts 26:18).

You need not that any man teach you ( Isaiah 54:13; 6:45; 1 John 2:27), as mankind follows after an image of a false god and a false Christ ( Matthew 24:24; Mark 13:22; Gal. 4:8; 2 Cor. 11:13-15; Rev. 12:9).

It is only by revelation of God that people will come to know the true Christ ( Daniel 12:4,9; Amos 3:7; Matthew 16:17; Luke 2:26; Romans 16:25; 1 Cor. 2:10; Gal. 1:16; Eph. 3:3,5; Rev. 1:1), and only then will you be able to overcome the spirit of this world ( 1 John 5:4; Rev. 3:21) and learn what 'True Repentance' means, and how this whole world has been deceived ( Rev. 12:9). It should also be remembered that it is a narrow way that leadeth unto 'Life', and few there be that find it ( Matthew 7:14; Luke 13:23).

LUKE 15:10. LIKEWISE, I SAY UNTO YOU, THERE IS JOY IN THE PRESENCE OF THE ANGELS OF GOD OVER ONE SINNER THAT REPENTETH.

Seek, and ye shall find ( Matthew 7:7).

In His Service.

Andy & Dianne van den Berg - Nova Scotia, Canada

Richard, as long as we are on the side of life; there is still time to be reconciled, by the enduring Love of God.

2 Corinthians 5: 16-21

All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is: in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

Stop here and read Exodus 33:11-23. And Luke 15:11-32. Hebrews 6:18 and 12:1-2

Lastly, 1 John 1:9

Satan has demons that keep an eye on us: what we do, say, read. They're invisible "spies". Ephesians 6. Satan uses the info collected, to ACCUSE you at the throne of God. You feel those accusations. However the Holy Spirit is still with you, convicting you about your sins. He desires to reconcile these things and stop the torment in your mind.

1 John 2:1 names Jesus as your ADVOCATE: your attorney. And He's sitting right beside His Father in heaven, NOW. Your name is still written in the Book of Life.

It's time now for you to pray. Confess your heart. Receive the cleansing power that is in the shed blood of Jesus. 1 John 1:2. Jesus already paid for it. It will be well with your soul, afterwards.

We all need to run to, 1 John 1:2 as soon as sin happens. We are soul and spirit encased in flesh. All that Bible reading makes the spirit man get bigger than the sinful flesh and the gullible soul. Hebrews 12:2, said, to RUN THE RACE. Win!

I love you brother and never feel that you are alone in this. You're blessed.

Get to know God the Holy Spirit, who is The Spirit of Christ. Book of John, ch 16

M.

Baptism is not able to save children or anyone else. Please read Hebrews 6:1,2; 9:4.

The word 'Repent' in different forms (repent, repentance, repented, repentest, repenteth, repenting, repentings) is mentioned 110 times in the KJV, and means a lot more than what people by nature have been conditioned to believe. The word 'repent' used in the New Testament was translated from the Greek word "metanoeo", and means to change, transform, to think differently or reconsider.

It is the key principle of all the teachings of Jesus Christ and the axiom (basis) of the Word of God and a prerequisite and primary requirement for the salvation of mankind. It actually means the changing of spirits - to turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan unto God ( Acts 26:18).

For a better understanding and the 'spiritual truth' of what it means to repent, and learn how and by whom mankind has been deceived ( Rev. 12:9) and what people must do to be reunited with the true and living God, we invite you to seek Him according to the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive ( Matthew 7:7; John 14:17).

You need not that any man teach you ( Isaiah 54:13; 6:45; 1 John 2:27), as mankind follows after an image of a false god and a false Christ ( Matthew 24:24; Mark 13:22; Gal. 4:8; 2 Cor. 11:13-15; Rev. 12:9).

It is only by revelation of God that people will come to know the true Christ ( Daniel 12:4,9; Amos 3:7; Matthew 16:17; Luke 2:26; Romans 16:25; 1 Cor. 2:10; Gal. 1:16; Eph. 3:3,5; Rev. 1:1), and only then will you be able to overcome the spirit of this world ( 1 John 5:4; Rev. 3:21) and learn what 'True Repentance' means, and how this whole world has been deceived ( Rev. 12:9). It should also be remembered that it is a narrow way that leadeth unto 'Life', and few there be that find it ( Matthew 7:14).

LUKE 15:10. LIKEWISE, I SAY UNTO YOU, THERE IS JOY IN THE PRESENCE OF THE ANGELS OF GOD OVER ONE SINNER THAT REPENTETH.

Can you reword your question? Thanks

Psalms 62:7-8 - In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God.Trust in him at all times; ye people, pour out your heart before him: God is a refuge for us. Selah.

Deuteronomy 4:7 - For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for?

Psalms 9:9 - The LORD also will be a refuge for the oppressed, a refuge in times of trouble.

2 Samuel 22:17-20 - He sent from above, he took me; he drew me out of many waters;He delivered me from my strong enemy, and from them that hated me: for they were too strong for me.They prevented me in the day of my calamity: but the LORD was my stay.He brought me forth also into a large place: he delivered me, because he delighted in me.

Psalms 91:1-9 - He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty.I will say of the LORD, He is my refuge and my fortress: my God; in him will I trust.Surely he shall deliver thee from the snare of the fowler, and from the noisome pestilence.He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust: his truth shall be thy shield and buckler.Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night; nor for the arrow that flieth by day;Nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness; nor for the destruction that wasteth at noonday.A thousand shall fall at thy side, and ten thousand at thy right hand; but it shall not come nigh thee.Only with thine eyes shalt thou behold and see the reward of the wicked.Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation;

Proverbs 18:10 - The name of the LORD is a strong tower: the righteous runneth into it, and is safe.

Hebrews 6:18 - That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

I found the Mercy Seat to be just the right fit.

:)

I think the scriptures discussed here are probably Hebrews 6:4-6, 2 Peter 2:20-22, Hebrews 10:26, Matthew 5:13 suggesting that in some cases Christians can't return to the faith once they leave and denounce it. Maybe some of this could be referring to blasphemy of the holy ghost? Matthew 12:31-32.

But James 5:20 suggests that you can return to the faith, as well as the prodigal son story. The forgiving 7x70 story sounds like a huge amount of forgiveness is allotted to us, as long as we forgive others: Matthew 18:35.

What do you think?

Truth in the Scripture

John 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If ANY man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

Revelation 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And WHOSOEVER will, let him take the water of life freely.

Matthew 10:32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

John 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

what are the six principals of the documents of christ

Chris,

Thanks for taking the time to respond to my questions as well as your thoughts on the matters being discussed.

I would tend to agree with most of your thoughts concerning being saved. But I look at it from this point of view. Those that are predestinated, and chosen, and accepted, etc such as Abraham, Enoch, Moses, etc. are saved because God said so, as many of the verses you offer supports. We have examples of them throughout Scripture (whether they wanted to do the will of God or not i.e., Jonah or Saul / Paul). And I agree, it is only Jesus and God that truly know you are saved, man does not. Neither God, nor Jesus, nor the Holy Spirit, has revealed to me that I have been chosen, or have become acceptable, etc

I would like to believe that I have been predestined, and already saved through my steadfast belief in The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

I feel very blessed throughout my lifetime.

I want to believe that I have an unshakable faith that can withstand all the horrors that can be inflicted upon myself and my family and my friends.

I realize that I have had to fight for none of the religious freedoms I currently enjoy.

I have never been truly tested; life or death to be a Christian; as in other parts of the world today.

I feel as though I need to contend every day for the faith that was once given unto the saints ( Jude 1:3).

I pray that I can withstand the fiery darts of Satan if and when the time comes.

I know that if the end times weren't shortened by Christ Himself, even the elect would not be saved ( Matthew 24:22).

Hebrews 6:9 concerns the hope / confidence / trust that the beloved in Christ will not falter; but for those spoken of in Hebrews 6:6 that were once enlightened, and have now fallen away; Hebrews 6:8 is their final end.

God bless you, and I fully agree those who are saved and born-again of the Spirit. Have access in the New Covenant to come behind the veil as well, meaning heaven because of the ultimate price Jesus paid in full on the cross, and especially to those who will believe in Him.

Praise God!

Ann Hering. With respect to the "Mystery", Paul is not the only one to use that expression. In Rev 1:20, 17:5, 7 the Angel reveals a mystery of the end times. In Daniel 2:22, 30, 47 God reveals a mystery. A mystery is something we don't yet know or understand. In Isa 44: God tells us He is going to reveal things that have not happened. See also Amos 3:7.

Sometimes well-intentioned people teach things that seem true, but are wrong. As stated before, the Bible never segregates the Tribulation as an event that will only affect Jews. The New Testament letters were written for the Church, not for the Jews. It is God's message to us who believe, 1 Cor 1. Paul and Peter were adamant about not returning to Judaism, 2 Peter 2:22.

Perhaps Hebrews 6:4, 6, 10:26 can shed some light on this. There remains no Sacrifice for anyone that thinks they can be saved by returning to Judaism. And if that is the case, why would God nullify Christ's ultimate sacrifice on the Cross, to punish the Jews for 7 years? Sacrifices, by Jews or anyone else are worthless. So why would God want to restore them as a means for Salvation in the Tribulation? The doctrine that the Tribulation is for the Jews, absent Christians, is a fabrication that doesn't meet the test of reality. God works within the framework of reality, not fiction.

If you can show where the Bible says the Tribulation is for the Jews, please do. But first, you must deal with Matthew 24:29, 2 Tim 2, which set the stage for every other mention of the 2nd Coming and the Rapture. We know from the mouth of Jesus that He is coming Immediately After the Great Tribulation. It remains to be shown that He is coming before that for a Rapture. But if there is a place in Scripture that says otherwise, please point to it. I can tell you now, you won't find it. Every mention of a Rapture scenario follows the description in Matt 24.

Furthermore, don't believe the lie that some of the books of the NT are for the Jews. They are not.

>You say you can be tempted to sin and the Holy Spirit can convict you, but you can still choose to sin?

Absolutely, that's the definition of freewill. If you believe a Christian is incapable of being tempted and sinning then you don't believe in freewill, which defeats the whole purpose of life on earth and Jesus dying on the cross for you so that you have the opportunity to CHOOSE whether you want to follow Him or not, and if you do then you everyday make the same decision on whether you want to continue to follow Him. It's not a one time task that you check off your list then go back to being in the world. It's a life transforming decision that requires regular discipline. If avoiding sin was automatic then why do Christians struggle with sin so much both in the Bible and today? Paul described his struggle in Romans 7:19. If he was incapable of sin then he wouldn't struggle. If followers couldn't sin Jesus wouldn't have warned his disciples so many times to avoid sin and be obedient and wouldn't have taught them or others so many lessons.

>a true genuine believer cannot live a lifestyle of continuous sin, the lifestyle they lived prior to salvation. It's impossible.

If impossible then why does it happen so often? It sounds like if someone sins beyond a certain point then you don't believe they are a Christian. Why is that? Who do you think is a Christian then? Is someone who repents, confesses, believes Jesus is Lord, is baptized and follows Him a genuine-enough Christian? What if they later turn from Christianity, were they suddenly never a 'genuine' Christian then? Since you don't know anyone's future actions can you ever be 100% sure of anyone being a 'genuine believer'? I believe the Bible is clear that anyone can be saved and can start their journey to follow Jesus and are a Christian. They still have freewill though and some later turn away. Maybe you've never met them but some Christians do this. Hebrews 6:4 Hope this helps.

Hebrews 6:19-21 A forunnner is a lil vessel or boat that carried the anchor and dropped it in shallow water so the ship can be firm. We are the big boat Christ is our forunnner that took our hope and anchored us in the holy of holies . When Christ was on the cross and he gave up the ghost of spirit the veil torn . The lord is the way the truth and the life . He anchored our hope hidden in him and only thru him . No matter what storms we face and no matter how rough the waves crash against us we are firm and secure in who we are in him amen.

No where in Scripture does it say we continue to Sin untill we die if we are Born Again of God's Seed He tells us to Work out our Salvation not meaning work for it to put our Carnal flesh to death by The Holy Spirit Romans 8:15- 2Tim2:19-21- Colossians 3:4-6 to be Perfect like He is Matthew 5:48 - Hebrews 6:1 We will No longer Sin 1John 3 and -5:18-20-2:28-29-Jn8:34-36 Rom6and8 Danial12:10and more.

No where in Scripture does it say we continue to Sin untill we die if we are Born Again of God's Seed He tells us to Work out our Salvation not meaning work for it to put our Carnal flesh to death by The Spirit Romans 8:15-2Tim2:19-21- Colossians 3:4-6 to be Perfect like He is Matthew 5:48 - Hebrews 6:1 We will No longer Sin Read all of 1John 3 and -5:18-20-2:28-29- Jn 8:34-36 Rom6and8 Danial12:10.

Many think we can Never be Perfect and in a Wordly way we Can't but in God's Way we Can. He tells us to be Perfect like He is Matthew5:48 He is Love 1John 4:16 to put our Carnal flesh to death by The Spirit Romans 8 and Aim to be Perfect Hebrews 6:1 in Love 1John 4:11-21 When we are Born Again of Gods seed 1John 3:9 we will not Sin1John 5:18 our Old Carnal Nature has gone our Nature is Righteous.

Hi Stan, I'd be interested in how that belief reconciles with Hebrews 6:4-6, Hebrews 10:26, Matthew 12:31 that warns Christians against following away and blasphemy. Do you believe Christians who use their freewill to denounce Jesus and follow satan, commit mass murder, and commit blasphemy will still be saved?

You can have confidence in salvation, follow Jesus and be obedient at the same time. It's a false assumption to assume that just because the Bible is true about losing your salvation in Hebrews 10:26 that a Christ follow must live in fear? No, if you're following Christ in obedience you have freedom. Matthew 10:28, John 14:15, Matthew 12:31-32, Matthew 7:21. I believe what the Bible says. Hitler would go to heaven according to your once saved always saved belief.

If you choose to live in constant fear of losing your salvation every time you sin and struggle to "keep" yourself, I think you missed the point of resting in Christ. Paul said he did what he shouldn't do and did not do what he should do. According to your theology, Paul was not saved. In Christian love, I recommend you study more and use solid Christian resources. Green, Magee, Fruchtenbaum etc.

Steve have you ever heard and understood God's Plan of Salvation, are you Working out your Salvation not meaning Working for it. Have you put your Carnal fesh to death so you can be Perfected in God's Love and are you now Born Again of God's seed and no longer Sin. Does God knows every hair on your head and did He knew you before you were Born and knew everything you would say and do on earth.

God's Plan of Salvation Adam does not agree that we Continue to Sin when we are Born Again yes we all have free will so those who fall away were never Chosen by God's forknowelage to be Conformed into the image of Jesus. God knows if we will Choose Him or Satan He knows all things and He tells us He knows those who are His and not One of us will be lost, He Protects our Souls He knows our Hearts.

So this entire OSAS belief stands on misinterpreting that one verse while disregarding the numerous other Bible verses? You incorrectly assumed my beliefs on grace BTW. In your view if Christians are saved regardless why do you believe Jesus said to keep his commandments? What is your exact reason for being obedient if there's no incentive to do so and zero consequence for not? James 2:26 Have you prayed and asked God if your view is true? 2 Peter 2 says what happens to disobedient people including Christians who turn away (verse 21).

That is the false doctrine of Lordship Salvation. Saved by grace through faith WHAT? Is your sin greater than Jesus' ability to keep you? You cannot save yourself but yet you can keep yourself ? We are sealed until the day of our redemption. Ephesians Christians who sin all of us will be chastised but will NOT lose our salvation. Nor do we purposely sin as OSAS opponents always purport.STUDY

The hope of eternal life through Jesus's gift of salvation isn't revokable, but this verse doesn't mean it's individually permanent regardless of one's actions. Are you aware of other supporting verses supporting this belief? There's a mountain of verses supporting that Christians have freewill and need to follow Jesus. If you turn from Jesus and commit blasphemy a Christian risks going to hell- black and white in the Bible. Since Satan is the father of lies and since there is only 1 truth, which belief is satan more like spreading: that Christians should follow Jesus and be obedient for hope of eternal life - or - that Christians don't have to obey or follow Jesus whatsoever and can indulge in the sin of this world with zero consequences and still go to heaven? MATTHEW 10:28

Hi Adam, Of course Christians sin and disobey, I was speaking of salvation--not sin or disobedience. Are you suggesting that the Holy Spirit is weaker in a Christian than Satan's power? Born again Christians are bought with a price and belong to Christ. Are WE capable of forcing him to disown us? The gift of salvation is irrevocable, as are all God's gifts. Romans 11:29 OSAS

Hi Richard, do you have a Bible verse that backs up the idea that a Christian is incapable of blasphemy or incapable of sin? Do you not believe Christians have freewill to sin like non-Christians? Even angels in heaven still had freewill to rebel from God and be cast out of heaven, so why not believe a Christian on earth has the same freewill? If Christians can't commit blasphemy then why were Christians told in the Bible not to? If Christians can't disobey then why are they told to keep commandments? John 14:15

Born again Christians, in whom dwells the holy spirit, are incapable of blasphemy of the spirit. Additionally, Christ's reference to those who "he never knew" is not in reference to those who have truly believed and are saved. Once you are saved, that salvation is sealed. Satan cannot overcome that. Modern day cults who claim to be Christians should take heed-not truly born again Christians. OSAS

According to Matthew 12:31-32 if a Christian chooses to blaspheme the holy spirit they absolutely will not be forgiven. Even angels already in heaven still had the freewill to rebel against God. Humans on Earth including Christians absolutely still have freewill and sadly do turn and denounce Jesus and commit blasphemy. The Bible is crystal clear those Christians will not be saved. Matthew 7:21.

Salvation is a gift of God. God's gifts are irrevocable. OSAS

It seems Evangelist Andrew you misunderstood what I was saying, Paul's words are what I was refering to Philippians3:12-14 Not as though I had already attained either were already Perfect but I follow after if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus Brethren I count not myself to have apprehended but this one thing I do.... And Hebrews 6:1 Yes I'm on the way.