Discuss Hebrews 9 Page 2

Hi Ronald.

You stated, "the apostles had not been told the Gospel will also be given to the Gentiles, the time had not come. There were another 3.5 years after Jesus's ministry before the apostles were told the gospel of Christ will be given to the Greeks/Gentiles.

I agree with Gigi, The Apostles were told to go out to preach the gospel to the whole world and I believe the old economy "if that's the correct term to use" ended at the crucifixion when the veil was rent from top to bottom.

The timing of the beginning and ending of what God ordained in the old and in the new covenant was totally of God, "Not according to man's response to it"

The OT scripture said salvation would go out to the Gentiles by the seed which shall come. some expected it in the New Testament as seen in Luke 2:30-32. For mine eyes have seen thy salvation, which thou hast prepared before the face of all people. A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

Also.

Jesus said in John 2:19-22 he would tare the temple down and build it again in 3 days.

That was the end of temporary temple that only served as a shadow of what was to come. Hebrews 9:6-11.

When he rose from the grave, he went to the disciples and see here what he said in Luke 24:42-48.

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

And ye are witnesses of these things!

Concerning the veil being rent from top to bottom.

Here is what was accomplished at the death and resurrection of our Lord.

Here in Hebrews 6:17-20 we see Jesus as our "forerunner" and High Priest.

We have been once and for all cleansed and can now enter therein with a clear conscience. See Hebrews 9:8-26.

Also.

Hebrews 10:8-22.

The veil being rent signifies the end of the old covenant and the resurrection ushered in the new covenant.

The commission came right afterwards. Luke 24:42-49. and Matthew 28:19-20.

God bless.

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Hi Friend

There's two stages that we may obtain too in the work of regeneration, 1st to the state Adam was before the fall, then as we continue steadfast, faithful & confident unto the end, in exercising the Grace that brings salvation, He brings us into the 2nd state of being in Christ who never sin, although He was tempted. This show us that being tempted is not a sin, only in our submission to it.

I'm presently in this 1st stage & have fallen,

Sanctification is a progress work, & as we continue to exercise Grace appearance in our hearts. Hebrews 9:28 Rom 10:10 the wording of Scripture is "unto salvation", denoting this on going work. Philippians 2:12 There is no instant salvation! There will be encounter with the Lord, where His Spirit deals mighty within us, tearing down the strongholds of thoughts & imaginations that keeps us in bondage & separated from Him, this a part of the ongoing work of salvation.

I believe David0921, that you have understood me correctly to a point. However, I'm not saying that Israel's salvation (a yet appointed time in the future), those who were faithful to the Lord was based on their works (i.e. obedience to the Law, sacrificial offerings, etc.), but that salvation would come to them (looking forward) by the merits of Christ's Death, just as for us post-Cross.

When I said 'works based', I didn't mean that they would be saved by their law-keeping, etc., for nothing they or we could ever do, would secure redemption. They only did what was required of them by God (which was based solely on works yet should have caused them to cleave to God trusting in Him alone). Were they saved by their works? If they were, then there was no need for Jesus' Coming. But those works (obedience, sacrifice) brought them into a standing before God, where the Blood of Christ could retrospectively be applied to them; these who had no knowledge of such a Redeemer, but only knowing sin & cast upon God's Mercies for the covering of that sin until their redemption (salvation). Hebrews 9:15, 'the called only received the promise'.

I don't know whether that explains it better, but your quote, "Salvation is by Grace alone" seems to not take into account what takes place before salvation is granted: how a person's life is directed, how & when the Gospel comes to him, or the drawing in by the Father ( John 6:44). For us, we don't consider this as Works, only when we try to add to or replace the Grace of God. Jews weren't adding to their future salvation; they only did what was required of them; and God knowing their hearts would apply the True Sacrifice. See Romans 4:1-5: righteousness that was imputed to Abraham. Why? Because he believed God, having hope, trusting His Word, without calling upon his works. Likewise, to all OT Israel who placed their trust & hope in God were marked for salvation, without works - unlike those who disobeyed or trusted in their works.

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Isa 53, Now as then, Christ walks the same path as He did then, but in Spirit, He is despised, rejected of men, we esteem Him not, He's experiences the sorrow & grief in mankind unbelief of Him by His appearances in Spirit within our hearts. He has no form of comeliness that we such desire Him, meaning; the Word spoke in our hearts is Christ in Spirit, that Word is God, John 1:1; His first works within us John 16:8 Titus 2:11,12 When we reject His reproof of correction, through unbelief, His words has finds no place in our hearts, we hidden our faces from Him, & run to other things to drown out His Voice, the tender motions of Holy Spirit in His proffering of salvation.

It is indeed Christ within conscience, the mystery Col 1:26-28 Jesus said to the Jews, John 5:39 as then now, God is a Spirit, we must come to Him in & by His Spirit John 14:6 When Jesus said; Matt 11:25 He wasn't stating the Scriptures, Pastors, bible studies etc; but to Him personally. The Scriptures are profitable as we honor them in their right place, the words of God, but not God the Word, who was in the beginning with God, before the Scriptures were. The true glory & honor of the Scriptures is they give us a true testimony of Him, & that they point us to His 2nd coming in Spirit. Hebrews 9:28 John 16:13 OT promise Isa 54:13 it is only by receiving Him in His Spirit appearance within our hearts/conscience that we receive Him, that He may work out His great salvation for us. There is no other way! John 14:6 For in the working of the operations of faith, Rom 10:17 which is in Rom 10:8 we come into relationship & fellowship with Him who suffered so on our behalf. We experience 1John 1:1-3 in the work of redemption. Trust & love is increased as we grow in Grace.

John 17:3

In love & truth

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Hi Chris

How do we fulfill the requirements of the Law?

I've answered that fully in my previous opening statement, picking up the Cross & following Christ in the regeneration. The Way of death is the Way to receiving His life, & that more abundantly, by the Grace of God. The Law will ever be against the old Adamic nature, Rom 8:6,7;. The new birth could not be forth by the blood of bulls & goats, but Blood of Christ does, through the Eternal Spirit, the Power; making us partakers of the Divine Nature, its Rom 8:2-4; "might be fulfilled in us".

Other questions? We're a new creation, have the mind of Christ, the blood of the NC has fulfill it purpose, Gen 1:26;

1 Pet 1:2; the Blood & Life are synonymous, Leviticus 17:11; Christ Life was in His Blood which made it so very precious. Not only cleansing the flesh, but the conscience/heart. Hebrews 9:11-15; the eternal inheritance "the eternal Spirit", we too can offer up ourselves to God, He leads us in the very same path that He, Himself walk & empowering of the very same Spirit. Having cleansing us spirit, soul, & body in the regeneration, by entering Rom 6:4,5; We enter eternal life now, on earth as it is in heaven & in the end everlasting Life, the Blood of sprinkling, that speaks of better things than that of Abel..

Friends;

Christ has already come & that in Spirit, He told His disciples; Mark 9:1; Matt 16:28; over 2000 yrs ago, which came in full power at Pentecost.

I will not leave you comfortless, but you will see me again, that your joy maybe full, & Christ doesn't come alone, He brings His Father within Him, They became Ephesians 2:22; John 17:21-23; & they Micah 4:3;

Hebrews 9:28; is Titus 2:11; diffusing the fragrance of His knowledge in every heart. 2Cor 4:6 This is Titus 2:13; describing His 2nd appearance in Spirit. Who continually gives of Himself that Titus 2:14;

As for this son of perdition; it's the old Adamic nature that is rule by Ephesians 6:12; who's coming 2Thessalonians 2:9; this spirit works even deceive the very elect, who, we all must engage with within 2 Cor 10:3-5; Jesus says; Matt 15:18,19; for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks, so their within us. Think about this, we all have these thoughts spring up within us, 1 Pet 4:3; thus Jesus commands; Luke 14:27; The ones, Satan does deceive is explain, 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12; they refuse to believe the Witness, whom God has place within conscience. John 16:8; John 12:47-50; Jesus says, 8:24; Therefore were He has gone one cannot go.

Both seeds are spiritual, both kingdoms are within mankind.

This rapture theory John 17:11:15 "not to take them out of the world". But describes receiving 1Pet 1:5-9;The cumulation is the Baptism of the Holy Spirt, describing 2 Cor 10:6; resulting from Titus 3:5; by 1Pet 1:23; unto John 3:3; the chaff, ( old man sin nature is thoroughly purges out without a trace, Daniel 2:34,35; these earthen vessels, 1Cor 15:48,49; ) the wheat (new man created in the image of Him that created him) is gather unto the Gardener, we're His & He's ours, Acts 1:9-11; Daniel 7:13;

It's a spiritual encounter & habitation with the One true God, John 17:24; here & now, Acts 4:32,33;

Do you perceive the wonderous honor & glory of God's Great Salvation, on earth as it is in heaven.

Hi Judy.

To be baptized is to identify with.

Jesus was baptized by John to fulfill all righteousness.

Matthew 3:15.

John's baptism was a baptism of repentance for the people of Israel.

John came in the spirit of Elijah to turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers,

Malachi 4:5-6.

Jesus is the fulfillment of all God's work in the world.

He is the goal and consummation of all God's saving activity.

God sent John as the final herald of the King's return, and now Jesus comes in line with this and fulfills it by submitting to John's baptism.

( He was baptized to fulfill all righteousness, He was IDENTIFYING with all what was said of him in the OT. Prophet, King, Priest, ect.

Jesus was 30 years old, The required age to enter the Leviticus Priesthood.

Jesus was soon on his way to the cross where he would end that priesthood and covenant by dying and usher in a new covenant and a everlasting Priesthood.

see Hebrews 9:15-17

SIDE NOTE:

Jesus had no sin so he had no need of repentance.

John the baptist said Jesus would come and baptize with the Holyghost and with fire. Luke 3:16.

He done this after his death and resurrection, He gave us an earnest of his spirit and sealed us until the day of redemption.

We now are IDENTIFIED with Jesus death and resurrection.

Romans 6:3-11.

God bless.

Hi S Spencer,

Part 1

Just to finish up on the Last Week. Sorry, this is so long but I hope you will have all the reasons for my understanding of this very important prophecy. I have learned much.

I know we differ on this and I believe we both respect each other as brothers and the truth is what matters. The word prince in vs 25 is the same as in vs. 26 it is the Hebrew word nagiyd or nagid meaning chief commander, leader, ruler, or prince, but never translated as king, but many times as the commander of a military.

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks, 490 years are given for the things that are determined to be accomplished that is the prophecy. 1. To finish the transgression. 2 To make an end of sins. 3 to make reconciliation for iniquity. 4 to bring in everlasting righteousness. 5 To seal up vision and prophecy. 6 To anoint the most holy.

These 6 things were determined upon Daniel's people, the lost sheep of Israel, and the holy city, Jerusalem. Were these things accomplished when Jesus first came, or will they be accomplished after Jesus second coming? These six things are the purpose of the prophecy, Dan. 9:24.

My understanding Jesus accomplished this when He first came. The 70 weeks which is 490 years are given for these 6 things to be accomplished.

1 To finish the transgression. From "transgress," to pass over or beyond; to overpass, as any rule prescribed as the limit of duty; to break or violate, as a law, civil or moral; the act of transgressing; the violation of a law, rebellion. Isaiah 53:5,8 Isaiah 53:11 Hebrews 9:15-18.

Jesus with a perfect life gave up his body to death; he fulfilled the first covenant of law and redeeming of the transgressions under the first covenant of law. He became sin for us, and with his blood made the new covenant being the only mediator of the New Testament that we through faith in Jesus Christ receive the promise of eternal inheritance. Offered first to the house of Israel then offered to the rest of the world.

See part 2

S Spencer on the last week.

Part 3.

Jesus by His blood entered once into the holy place not made by hands having obtained eternal redemption everlasting, never to fade, and in Jesus, we have everlasting righteousness and salvation, through faith, given by grace from God, by the blood of the Lamb freely offered for us. To look for everlasting righteousness to be brought in the future is to deny the work of Christ, which he claimed was finished. We have no righteousness apart from Jesus Christ.

5 To seal up vision and prophecy; seal up, affix a seal, a seal in biblical times as today, is used to guarantee security, or indicate ownership, fulfill a vision of God's communication with man, prophecy w-n-, the same word for prophet, the word of God given to us through a prophet. The greatest prediction, which runs through the whole Old Testament, is that regarding the coming and work of the Messiah, Jesus. Daniel 9:23 John 6:27 Mark 1:14-15 Acts 3:18 John 5:36-40 Matthew 11:11-15 Romans 3:21.

All through the New Testament, it shows the fulfillment of the prophets and the law; fulfilled on the cross at Calvary. Gabriel was sent to help Daniel understand the matter, and consider the vision.

6 To anoint the Most Holy. Anoint, the theological meaning of mashach to smear, anoint. The Most Holy qa-da-sm qo-des, most holy, most holy place, Set apart from the rest for a special function. This was done by Jesus after he ascended to heaven before the destruction of the temple made by man. It is the anointing of the holy of holies in the temple not made with hands. Hebrews 8:1-12 Hebrews 9:6-14

Jesus went in once and anointed the Holy of Holies not made with hands. Jesus anointed the Holy of Holies once and made it possible for man through him and the Holy Spirit to enter the most holy and God can dwell in us. When Jesus cried out and said it was finished and gave up the ghost, the veil of the temple rent in half.

See Part 4

Hi Chris;

Rom 5:12-14

I would agree with all except, for the last sentence, beginning with "Absolute Purity". Luke 6:40; 1John 4:17; Rom 12:1; the plain write of the words used denotes we're still living in this world.

Hypocrites; I don't believe you intentionally imply this, yet the results of your statement implying this. They did not speak of the new birth, but from the new birth, 2Cor 5:17; Ezekiel 36:25,26,27; heart of flesh; denotes our life now in the flesh. Eph 4:24; you put Him on, here; Col 3:10; The apostles lived, enjoy & possessed what they preached; Philippians 3:15,16; Again, what God required of us is to live according to the measure of the Truth that He has revealed, the apostles received Acts 1:8' Eph 1:19; Eph 3:20; Col 1:29; to do so.

You stated "has sin left them or ever leave them: Never, but they can have victory over sin; this is an oxymoron. Being born again of His Spirit alias; Matt 3:11-12; the threshing floor of the heart is thoroughly purge of the chaff. (sin nature), the spiritual old man of sin, the Adamic nature that animates the flesh. He's deny, mortify & final crucify, he's dead & self is seen no more. All by the Grace appearance within our hearts.

Friend,,,,your covering yourself, but not with the Spirit of the Lord, but with; Gen 3:7;

Your the understanding is veiled, for only the spirit of darkness would plead for sin to remain within one, after all that God has wrought & revealed to us through His Son. For he (Satan) knows that despite one's profession, though maybe ever so high or lofty, & profess with elegant words, it what one does that defines him, Rom 6:16; John 8:34; Rom 2:6;

Hebrews 9:11,12,13,14,15; do you hear what the Spirit is saying here? The flesh purified, OT, now in NT even our conscience cleanse, the heart. Eternal inheritance Roman 8:17; 2 Pet 1:4; John 17:21-23;

Therefore, 2Cor 7:1;

In Love & Truth

Frankie J

David

"what I believe the Bible declares"

This is just the point David,I've been making all alone. Faith does not come by reading, studying, pastor preaching, Sunday school, etc: Its comes by Rom 10:17; this is the faith that Paul preached, speaking to you personally within your heart. These others maybe good execises to support & encourage if there inspired by Holy Spirit. But it cannot stand alone or take the place of having a personal relationship with Jesus, & this is what God has set His heart upon. John 14:21,23,26; John 17:21,22,23; Our faith is cannot be base on other people experinences, though ever be so helpful. In the work of regeneration we come to 1John 1:1-4 Here John is speaking of His Spirit appearance within our hearts, the Life/Light was manifested, Grace appearance. As we diligently hearken to His still small Voice we come to experiential knowledge of the Lord, 1John 5:20; "we have heard, seen with our eyes & have looked upon & our hands have handled of the Word of Life, spiritually, in this working out of our salvation. Hebrews 9:28; 2Cor 4:6,7; that the excellency to the Power to understand & receive the things of God, is of God & not of ourselves. John 3:27; We come to know His mind/will & good pleasure. Its what King David experience in Psalm 119:130; it what made him more wiser than his teacher Psalms 119:99; it was his Psalm 119:105; Psalm 123:2; Psalm 59:9; Psalm 69:3 & he commands his soul to wait upon the Lord Psalm 62:5; its call in Scripture the Key of David, Rev 3:7; He alone can Rev 5:2,5; Isa 22:22: He is the Treasure we have in these earthen vessel. Col 1:26,27,28; 1 Cor 2:12;

Blessing to you, you have a great desire & a zeal David.

in Love & Truth

Frankie J

Hi Adam.

John 5:24. actually says exactly that along with a accumulation of scripture when discerning them properly.

Here's John 5:24. "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; BUT IS PASSED FROM DEATH UNTO LIFE".

Also see John 11:25-26.

There's physical death and there is spiritual death.

Everyone will die the physical death, ( Once.) Hebrews 9:27. Jesus took care of the Spitual death on the cross.

Those who haven't trusted Christ is ALREADY SPIRITUALLY DEAD! There is no sequence to this. You see it in Jude 1:12 "These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, TWICE DEAD, plucked up by the roots;

Revelation 20:13-14. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. THIS IS THE SECOND DEATH.

This concept is spreaded broadly throughout scripture when interpreted right.

Romans 6:3-11.

Ephesians 2:1-9. And you HATH HE QUICKENED, who were dead in trespasses and sins: He gave life!

This is there present condition.

He didn't say "You whom he WILL quicken!"

If we don't have eternal life now, we don't have nothing to apply our faith to.

God bless.

Hell testimonies part 3

I would be sadly remiss if I didn't emphasize how we should fear the Lord who can send both body and soul to hell ( Matt. 10:28).

This; in my opinion should elicit a response in the souls of all true believers; as we should be ever greatful for what He did for us on the cross; taking the punishment of God the Father on Himself for our benefit.

What we can do now; however is be ambassadors for the truth; and allow God to make us vessels of reconciliation ( 2 Cor. 5:19).

We cannot save anyone; but are held responsible for the death of others if we don't sound the alarm (see Ezekiel 33). Notice there that they may or may not heed the warning.

One cannot separate the love of God for fear of the Lord; and one cannot appreciate the joys of heaven without realizing the horrors of hell they have been delivered from.

We also have to understand predestination in that regard; if we disagree on certain aspects it is clear that in the end a certain number are saved and sadly it is only "few" according to Christ Himself. ( Luke 13:23 among other verses).

Another thing which needs consideration is the reports of children being in hell. Matthew 18:10; as well as Matthew 21:16 tied to Psalm 8:2; and the testimony of David in 2 Samuel 12:23 should dispel this; there are other verses as well which I may elaborate on in a future posting. Those scenes where people seem baffled or confused as to what is happening to them isn't scriptural; and we also must ponder Hebrews 9:27; and understand that judgment comes first immediately after death (although before the Great White Throne one at the end of the Millennium). The punishment is justly given in different levels depending on the crime. I need to be careful here; but will say that punishment will be no more or less than deserved; more "tolerable" for some as in Matthew 11:22.

In conclusion; God's Word should make us tremble; the subject matter should never be looked at as entertaining.

Jimbob,

I think we both agree that the atoning blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ is very important. I was drawn to your comparison of Colossians 1:14 between the NIV and the KJB. I do not own an NIV but I have a few bible software programs that give me access to multiple bibles.

Anyway, I looked this up for myself. You are correct. But was it the intent of the NIV to eliminate or diminish the blood sacrifice? I don't believe so. I read a little further down in the same chapter (Verse 20) which reads, "and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross"

If it was the intent of the NIV to leave out the words "through His blood," why would it be mentioned in other places, especially in Ephesians 1:7 (NIV) which reads, "In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins."

You would think that if the NIV was intentionally trying to remove the blood sacrifice, then it would not be found in any other place.

Is there any reason why you fail to mention other verses in the NIV such as Romans 3:25 that says "God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood," 1 Peter 1:18-19 which mentions the precious blood of Christ, Ephesians 2:13 which says we have been brought near by the blood of Christ," Hebrews 9:14, "How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!" or Revelation 1:5 which says "To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood."

It doesn't seem fair to only bring up Colossians 1:14 without mentioning these other verses, especially Ephesians 1:7.

I am not defending the NIV, but I'm also not condemning it either.

Blessings to you in Christ Jesus!

Hello Palmettosr. A passage that helps us understand this phrase of Christ "shedding His Blood for our sins" is found in Hebrews chapter 9.

The Hebrews writer shows how the sacrifice that Jesus made for us by willingly dying in our stead is eminently more precious, acceptable, & efficacious than any other sacrifice made before Him or after Him. In Hebrews 9:6,7, we read that the high priest went into the holiest place of the tabernacle each year with the animal blood sacrifice, for his & the people's sins. God had instituted this blood sacrifice whereby instead of the sinner dying for his sins as judgement & being forever rejected by God, the death of an animal & its blood shed would be man's substitute. But such sacrifices could only be temporary since they had to be done year-by-year & could never fully deal with the sin problem (i.e. man was always conscious of his sins before God while awaiting this sacrifice & even then, such a sacrifice only covered the sin's of the flesh & gave no confidence about an inward cleansing: see Hebrews 9:9,10).

So, there would be coming a time when Israel would no longer need to sacrifice animals to attain this temporary, limited covering for their sins; at the right time in history, God sent His Son Jesus (i.e. man no longer sacrificing to gain God's forgiveness, but now God providing His Sacrifice). And this Sacrifice not only provided full cleansing, but since it was only required to be done once, it not only gained God's forgiveness & cleansing, but also cleansed our consciences ( Hebrews 9:12-15). God fully accepted the sacrifice payment by His Son & to those who believe this & call upon Him for cleansing, receive His Spirit Who also cleans our consciences (i.e. we can remain confident that we are fully clean, saved & accepted by God because it is God's Work, not man's, & the Holy Spirit in us gives us great assurance).

I hope you can see that blood needed to be shed - only Jesus' Blood could fully deal with the sin problem.

Hi Chris,

Thanks, Chris I was just being silly with the ruckus, I took a closer look at John 3 and I understand what you are saying about John 3:13 being in the discussion with Nicodemus. Jesus is telling him that no man had, or could go up to heaven, to bring the knowledge of heavenly things. That is a better understanding of the context of what Jesus was telling Nicodemus.

On the other, We are told in Hebrews 9:27 man is appointed once to die but it is God's will and His pleasure, and some things we have not been told. We know in Hebrews 11:5 Enoch was translated that he should not see death, and in 2 Kings 2:11 Elijah was taken up, other than that we speculate.

We do know Moses died Deut. 34:1-5, that is why I believe the transformation was a vision, whether a future event like things John was shown in Revelation or just a vision to strengthen the three to be apostles. My understanding is our soul is not immortal, to me scripture says we are mortal 2 Cor. 15:46-48 and will be until we are resurrected, 1 Cor. 15:53-54. The spirit that goes back is our breath/life, Ecclesiastes 12:7

In Matt. 27:50-54 my understanding is different, the word resurrection is a different word than used for all the other times it is in scripture it has more of a meaning of waking up. I would think after being hung on the cross for 6 hours one would be in and out of consciousness. In vs 50 Jesus cried out and yielded up the ghost.

All the things that happened next are connected with and, all happened when Jesus died. The earthquake opened the graves and those who arose went into Jerusalem when Jesus died not after Jesus was resurrected. That is my understanding, but scripture does not tell us about who they appeared to or what happened to them. Verse 54 confirms this to me and ties it to John 8:28.

Thanks for your reply and a better understanding of John 3:13, but my understanding is still no one but Jesus has ascended to heaven or will.

God bless,

RLW

Assurance of salvation: Focus on meaning of 1 Timothy 2:4 in light of current subject matter

The matter of Predestination becomes a thorny one on this verse. On the surface it would seem a Universalist mindset saying that all men eventually will be saved is a logical conclusion but clearly the Bible indicates otherwise. When we examine the same book in chapter 4 verse 10 we see that Christ is the Savior "especially of those who believe" which makes no sense unless we understand that He knows all who will eventually come to Him therefore in that sense while we were yet sinners; Christ died for us as we see in Romans 5:8. There are certain joys and comforts in this life as well for everyone; saved or lost to some extent; the subject being called "common grace" is a cause of no small stir among some; I would prefer to say delayed sentence.

This verse clearly is different when we understand the will of the Father toward Christ and all those predestined to come to the Lord as we see in the Book of John. There are verses in Isaiah where it states that He came to take away the sins of many ( Isaiah 53:12; also see Hebrews 9:28). It is clear also that "few will be saved" ( Luke 13:24).

The focus on much of this should be on God's method of salvation; all man centered attempts to somehow fulfill statements in the Sermon on the Mount may appeal to a humanist or even an atheist in principle; but in reality unregenerate man has no capacity to fulfill the law; let alone the deeper implications; both of omission and commission of righteousness and avoiding sins of those types as well.

His church is a part of His Body in a mystical sense but also in a very real one as well ( 1 Cor. 12:27). He purchased it or redeemed it with His blood; and this in a legally binding covenant as it were. God always keeps His end of a bargain; man on the other hand finds many schemes. Again; the key is if the Lord confesses we are His own ( Matt. 10:32).

Jema:

Christ has already come the second time, he came when you and he were resurrected TOGETHER.

He is the kingdom of God, you became a joint heir of that kingdom by being resurrected together.

The kingdom is WITHIN YOU"

Colossians 1:27 .... this mystery (of the resurrection) ...... Christ in you .....

Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was ONCE offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the SECOND TIME (as the SPIRIT of TRUTH), without SIN (unbelief) unto SALVATION.

John 14:6 .... I am the way, the TRUTH, and the LIFE (your his body): no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

1 Corinthians 15:54 .... Death is swallowed up in VICTORY ......

1 Corinthians 15:54 .... this mortal SHALL PUT ON immorality .....

1 Timothy 6:16 ... Christ ONLY hath IMMORTALITY, dwelling in the light (of the Father) ....

1 Corinthians 15:49 As we have borne the image of the earthly, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

I Corinthians 15:38 But God giveth it (the new creation in Christ) a body as he has seen fit, and to every SEED his OWN BODY.

God Bless you.

Hi Anita.

The shed blood of Jesus Christ is the most important factor of all 66 books of the Bible

The wages of sin is death.

Romans 6:23.

There's no remission of sins without the shedding of blood.

Hebrews 9:22.

Jesus took our sins upon himself and cleansed and sanctified us.

Hebrews 13:12.

Christ died the sacrificial death for the whole world.

John 1:29.

John 3:15-17.

That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Feel free to msg back if you have any more questions.

God bless.

UNDERSTANDING THE POWER OF THE RESURRECTION

Psalms 17:15 As for ME (Christ), I will behold thy (the Father and God of Christ) face: I (Christ) will be satisfied, when I (Christ) awake (am resurrected, by the Father's SPIRIT), with THY (the Father's) likeness.

Romans 6:5 For if were be planted TOGETHER (you and Christ) in the likeness of his (Christ) DEATH; we shall also be the LIKENESS of HIS RESURRECTION.

Genesis 5:1 In that DAY (the day of the LORD; ALL MEN died with Christ and all MEN were resurrected with Christ) that God created man ( BY the resurrection), in the LIKENESS of GOD created he them.

Psalms 104:30 Thou sendest forth THY (the Father of ALL ( Ephesians 4:6) SPIRIT, THEY (all men) are CREATED; thou renewest the face of the earth.

Ezekiel 1:5 And out if the MIDST thereof (Christ) there came forth four LIVING CREATIONS, And this was their appearance, they (the new creation) had the appearance of A MAN (Christ).

Ezekiel 10:10 And as for the for their appearances (the LIVING CREATIONS), they four (the new creation) had ONE LIKENESS, as a WHEEL (Christ) in the MIDST of a WHEEL (Christ).

Colossians 1:27 ..this MYSTERY (of his resurrection) ... CHRIST IN YOU ..

Romans 8:28 For whom he (the Father of ALL) did foreknow, He (the Father) did predistinate (by the resurrection of Christ) to be conformed to the IMAGE (God) of his son, that he (Christ) might be the FIRSTBORN among many (cloned by his resurrection) BRETHREN.

Psalms 82:6 For I (the Father) have said, YE (my new creation, by your brother's resurrection) ARE GODS, the children of the most high.

John 10:35 If he (our Father, the WORD) called them (the new creation, by resurrection) GODS, unto WHOM the word of GOD CAME ( Hebrews 9:28), the scripture CANNOT be BROKEN.

Luke 20:36 Neither can THEY (the new creation) DIED ANYMORE (you died with Christ on the cross): for they are EQUAL to the ANGELS ( Isaiah 63:9...and the ANGEL of HIS (Christ in YOU) PRESENCE SAVED THEM.

Do YOU BELIEVE God's WORD?

GiGi:

You said there is no where in scripture that says he comes a second time, this is adding to scripture.

Hebrews 9:28 .....and unto them that who look for him shall he appear the SECOND TIME without SIN unto SALVATION ....

God Bless YOU!

Verse by verse explanation in simple language. I am learning the bible.

Six things determined upon Daniel's people and the holy city.

Part 2

To finish the transgression

To finish; to withhold something from someone. transgression "transgress," to overpass as any rule prescribed as the limit of duty, to break or violate, as a law, civil or moral, the act of transgressing, rebellion, revolt, offend, that a penalty for the transgression a payment is due for the offense. Debt and transgressions, that they/we cannot pay, and the animal sacrifices fall short.

The only way anyone can stand before a just and holy God is if somebody is worthy and spotless to pay the debt. And the only one who has earned the right to pay that debt is the Messiah the Son of God and we have justification through Christ alone.

Psalm 32:1 Psalm 89:32 Psalm 103:11-12 Isaiah 43:25 Isaiah 53:5-8 Isaiah 53:11 Galatians 3:19 Ephesians 2:4-5 Hebrews 9:15-18

Jesus with a perfect life gave up his body to death; he fulfilled the first covenant of sacrificial law. His sacrifice is the redemption of the transgressions and the fulfillment of the first covenant of sacrificial law.

He became sin for us, and with his blood made the new covenant being the only mediator of the New Testament that we through faith in Jesus Christ receive the promise of eternal inheritance. Offered first to the house of Israel for He came first only for the lost sheep of Israel then was offered to the rest of the world.

See Part 3

Six things determined upon Daniel's people and the holy city.

Part 3

To make an end of sins.

To make an end; as put an end to/make an end to, affix a seal, to seal up, a document is rolled up and sealed with wet clay. The signet ring of the owner bears the image of his seal and is pressed into the clay. This is what was done by the Holy Spirit, 2 Cor. 1:22 Eph. 1:13 2 Tim. 2:19.

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Sin reaches for things, such as safety, knowledge, peace, happiness, and pleasure. Nevertheless, behind the act of good, sin ultimately creates a confrontation between obedience and rebellion. If not in faith, it is sin.

Psalm 32:1 Matthew 1:21 Matthew 22:11-13 John 1:29 John 3:5 Acts 5:31 Romans 3:25 Romans 8:3 Hebrews 9:26 Hebrews 10:8-12 1 Corinthians 15:3 1 John 3:5-6 Revelation 16:15

The covering of our sins was accomplished on the cross at Calvary. When he said IT IS FINISHED, he provided us with the garments (wedding garments) to cover our sins. Sin has not completely stopped yet but it is covered by the blood of Jesus and sealed by the Holy Spirit.

This passage points toward the Messiah who died because of our sins. In Jesus's death, punishment for our sins is paid for. Jesus's death we are dead to sin. Walking in the Spirit meant that we are trusting in Christ by faith to be made right before God, and not trusting in the law.

Whenever Paul speaks about walking after the flesh, it is in the context of trying to be made right before God by the law, which is equivalent to self-righteousness. I believe the prophecy is fulfilled in Jesus Christ and if we are in Jesus Christ, it is fulfilled for us. Praise God that Jesus Christ made an end of sins! As Jesus said from the cross, "It is finished!"

See Part 4

Six things determined upon Daniel's people and the holy city.

Part 6 last part

To anoint the Most Holy.

Anoint, the meaning of mashach is fourfold. First, an individual or object set apart for divine use, the anointed. Most Holy q--m q-e most holy most holy place.

Some put this at the baptizing of Jesus by John the Baptist, the start of Jesus's ministry.

Matthew4:13-17 Mark 1:9-11 John 1:29-34

This could very well be the anointing in Daniel 9:24. It started Jesus's ministry, and we know he is most holy. There is another choice, which I believe is what is said in Daniel, not in the future, but was done by Jesus after he ascended to heaven before the destruction of the temple made by man. It is the anointing of the holy of holies in the temple not made with hands. Hebrews 8:1-12 Hebrews 9:6-14

With this, it shows Jesus went in once and anointed the Holy of Holies not made with hands. Jesus anointed the Holy of Holies once and made it possible for man through him and the Holy Spirit for God to dwell in us, a tabernacle. If we look at verse 9:8 "The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing". Remember when Jesus cried out and said it was finished? He gave up the ghost, the veil of the temple rent in half, and the holy of holies opened to man. Like the tabernacle of David an open tent everyone could see the glory of God.

This is to take however you may, my understanding These were fulfilled.

God bless,

RLW

Page 1.

To this I would agree U4YAH, that some, maybe many, are led to Christ, reciting the "sinners prayer", told that their salvation is secure & then left to their own devices. Maybe nothing of the Spirit's regeneration Work, of holy living, of Satan's wily ways, of staying in the Word & prayer & of Christian fellowship, would be shared. It is: "you are saved brother/sister - press on in the joy of the Lord". What change, if any, took place in that confessing sinner? What teaching, including water baptism, was given in follow up & nurturing? We are accountable to not only how we treat God's Word, but also how we apply it & share it, even to sinners seeking salvation.

Which leads me to an important matter that we differ on. I believe that the regeneration work (or, re-birth) done in the believer is a present Work of the Holy Spirit. It can't be a re-birth if we haven't died first (Nicodemus was thinking this way that he had to die & be born again from the womb), nor can it be a re-birth at the time of the body's resurrection or entrance into Glory; it's too late, the decision for Christ & being sealed by the Holy Spirit ( Ephesians 1:13,14) has to be made while breath is still in the body - no repentance nor re-birth after death - only a heavenly reception or certain judgement ( Hebrews 9:27).

If a person is truly saved & regenerated by the Holy Spirit, he will know it. And I'm not talking about the grass looking greener or the birds singing more sweetly, it is the new life, new power, new hope, new confidence, & most of all, an absolute pure devotion to the Lord Who did it all & paid it all for him. Can such a person then desire to fool around with sin, doubt his salvation, or even entertain other gods of this world in his life? Even if he is tempted to do so, wouldn't the Spirit within check him immediately that he should go no further - & if he disobeys, then a stronger measure taken? See Page 2.

Greetings, Joleen! As you know, there is no forgiveness after death. Hebrews 9:27

"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:" Nowhere in the Bible does it give a hellbound sinner the option to wait until death to ask for forgiveness. Tell your friend this. That's all you can do is make him aware, and then pray for him without ceasing.

God bless you!

And may your friend wake up

Okay last post for real.

The final example is the lack of belief in fundamental tenets such as Creation (sadly found in some Bible believing churches with certain members). There is also those who have other Christ's that will inevitably end up changing who He is by some image; or imaginary "escape" of His crucifixion; or putting Him into the category of "ascended Master"; etc. Hebrews 9:27 slays the pundits of "reincarnation". Man is destined to die once and face the judgment (also eliminates "purgatory").

Then there is the example as in Genesis 3 "did God really say this?" There are plenty of source materials explaining the accuracy of the original writings in the Bible by the priests; how they would discard things even one LETTER off from the text of a scroll of an entire manuscript; etc. This is not a posting on apologetics; but on rightly dividing the Word.

Going back to 2 Timothy 3:16 we see the "God breathed" aspect of ALL of the Word followed as stated before as being suitable for all things needed in our walk (loosely translated). That being said; IF a truth is found (for instance to an event in the intertestamental period) then we can accurately put together the puzzle (for example the many prophecies in Daniel 11). If there is a moral statement in other writings; no doubt the essence comes from the Holy Scripture as to any true wisdom found. Such is the case admittedly in most major religious writings along with the error; we need to be careful of course determining these things. We can't play the game of some who want to detach from the Old Testament (I won't mention the name again) in order to focus just on Christ and the Resurrection in the N.T. All scripture fits together as glove; as a web of knowledge. We must all seek to be careful that we are reading with "spiritual eyes" these immortal truths of the Living Word of God. There is no "perfect translation" but the picture is clear enough for all to see; and the original text true.

It looks as though we don't believe in the same Jesus. All those verses you presented are either talking about those who were never saved, or who profess to be saved. Nothing shows that they lost their salvation. You've been getting the wrong interpretation.

I'll hopefully end it with this: 1 John 1:9, if we confess our sins he is just to forgive us our sins, and to clean us from all unrighteousness.

We are all sinners, saved or unsaved, we all fall into sin in one way or another. It's are nature to sin, we were born with it.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us: that's in (verse 10).

We all sinned and come short of the glory of God. None of us deserve salvation, it is a gift from God to those that confess their sins and believe, from the heart the name of the Lord, thou shalt be saved.

Once you are saved God, the Holy Spirit, comes down and lives inside us, we become the temple of God.

His spirit is strong, but our flesh is weak, and remains weak. You can lock yourself up away from the outside world and still fall into sin. It's everywhere we go. Once saved our whole life becomes a spiritual battle, that's why prayer is important. Asking God to help us fight off that battle.

Believing that you can lose your salvation must bring a lot of anxiety to those that believe that. Constantly backsliding and giving up with worry because sin just seems to come in, no matter how hard they try. Constantly putting them in worry.

Hebrews 9:27: As it is appointed unto men "once" to die. Just as Jesus only had to die "once," after this the judgement. I'm sorry but if you want to go through life fighting a never ending battle for a sinless life then have at it. I can assure you, Once saved always saved. That's one of the things you must believe to be saved. I hope this helps you. God bless.

Revelation 11, Revelation 11:4, Matthew 5:15, Mark 4:21, Luke 8:16, Luke 11:33, Hebrews 9:2,

Exodus 25, Romans 11,

Hopefully these are also helpful in your study