Discuss Jude 1 Page 7

  • Rick - In Reply on Jude 1:19 - 3 years ago
    Hi Anthony You are going to get a few takes on this, one of them praying in the spirit, for the spirit to

    come in which is not possible because we already have it. 2 Be too be praying to God quietly about his word

    mind with understanding. Third which is what I understand scripturally is speaking in tongues which is

    your own private prayer life with God. Now many believe this doesn't exist anymore, or went out with

    apostolic age. Also they've seen examples like I have that are so out of order who would want to do that.

    Correctly understood all things of God are decent and in order, this manifestation of Gods gift is primarily for

    your private prayer life been doing this for 42 years.

    I manifested power from on High shortly after confessing Romans 10: 9+10, now like everything

    else biblically you have to make up your mind to believe or not. There's got to be something to it because the

    Apostle paul said to the church at Corinth that he thanked God he spoke in tongues more than ye all

    and keep in mind he was given how the church was suppose to operate. There are 12 benefits to SI.T. biblically.
  • Jesse - In Reply on Jude 1:19 - 3 years ago
    Anthony,

    Paul touches on this in 1 Corinthians 14:15. He says "What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also:

    He puts himself out there hypothetically as saying "If I did what you did, if I prayed in the spirit, but not with my mind, and I prayed in an unknown tongue, then my understanding is unfruitful. I don't even understand what I'm praying!"

    So he says "I will pray with the Spirit." He didn't say anything about tongues. He says I will pray with the Spirit, and pray with the understanding also. So when I pray, it will be from my spirit where Christ dwells, but I'm also going to pray thoughts. There are things that I want to pray about and I'm literally involved with Jesus Christ. I'm not bypassing my brain to try and reach some type of spiritual euphoria. This is a relationship!

    Paul then says I will sing with the spirit, and with understanding also. You see, to those people in Corinth, it's like "That's unspiritual!" But once you start understanding the songs you sing, and this is what we are guilty of today, is that we have a lot of songs that we just repeat the same phrases over and over again. And it's like hypnotic stuff. People try to reach a spiritual high. And then you sing other songs, and people will say "Well, I don't feel the spirit there," but the song might have some good doctrine to it.

    Once a person is saved, the battle is for the mind. It's no wonder that Satan brings some of the pagan mystic religions into the church to try and reach a spiritual high! As far as singing in the Spirit, Paul says in Ephesians 5:18-20 "Don't be drunk with wine, but be filled with the Spirit, speaking to yourselves in psalms, and hymns, and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord."

    One of the things of being filled with the Spirit is singing with melody in your heart. It doesn't necessarily mean with your mouth. Paul says I'm going to sing with my understanding also!

    Hope this helps?
  • Anthony on Jude 1:19 - 3 years ago
    what is praying in the holy ghost?
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 years ago
    Brother Earl. The Greek word for 'Convince' that you're seeing in Jude 15 is 'elegcho'. And this means 'to convict, reprove, expose, rebuke, discipline'.

    The word that you believe it means is 'peitho', meaning, 'to persuade, urge, convince' (as in 2 Corinthians 5:11). Therefore, Jude 1:14,15 speaks of the Lord coming with His saints to carry out judgement & convict & expose the remnant ungodly upon the Earth. That they might know clearly their sins & their rightful judgement forever banished from the presence of the Lord, just as Sodom & Gomorrah "suffering the vengeance of eternal fire" ( Jude 7).
  • Earl Bowman - 3 years ago
    WHAT HAPPENS AT JUDGEMENT

    Jude 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, PROPHESIED of these, saying, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

    Jude 1:15 To execute judgement upon all, and to CONVINCE ALL that are ungodly among them of their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

    What happens when Christ, through judgements, convinces them that they are ungodly:

    Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess him as Lord.

    Isaiah 26:9 ...for when thy judgements are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.

    Psalms 22:27 And all the ends of the earth shall REMEMBER and turn unto the LORD: and all the kindreds of nations shall worship before thee.

    Jesus CAME TO SAVE SINNERS.
  • Ronald L Whittemore - In Reply on Genesis 6 - 3 years ago
    Hey Tony,

    If I may, what people call demons are devils, unclean spirits, principalities, powers, rulers of the darkness of this world, and spiritual wickedness in high places, some spirits with no physical bodies, some angels that have bodies that cannot possess humans but can control. Evil spirits are on this earth that can influence and also possess humans.

    We see while Jesus was here the first time, He cast them out of many people, also he gave power for the disciples to do the same Matthew 10:1. We also see Paul doing the same, one in Acts 16:18. They are still on this earth, many do not believe they're real but believe me they are real.

    The bible is not clear how or why these beings are on the earth. There are writings outside of the bible that talk about these but how true are they. The sons of God you speak of are angels, not unembodied spirits. Job 1:6 Job 2:1 and Job 38:7. We know some angels left their first estate and sinned that are locked in chains of darkness until judgment. 2 Peter 2:4 Jude 1:6.

    These angels are not the devils or spirits that are roaming this earth, they are locked in the bottomless pit. We see they have a king in Revelation 9 whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon. Strange is his name has the same meaning as the son of perdition, that means destruction/destroyer.

    Through scripture, it says angels can take on human form, they ate and drank and even wrestled with Jacob. We are even warned when entertaining strangers they may be an angel. The sons of God you speak of in Genesis are those angels who left their first estate and mated with human women that produced the giants (Nephilim and Rephaim or Rephaites) The name of these people means "terrible ones", they were before the flood and after Genesis 6:4 tells us they were then and after the flood and when the sons of God mated with women it produced giants.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • T. Levis - In Reply on Jude 1 - 3 years ago
    Dgjot, to add, somethings mentioned : in Daniel 10:7-13,21, -continues - Daniel 11:1 , Daniel 12:1, Zechariah 3:1-3, speaks also about rebuke, more on Michael- Revelations 12:7,
  • S Spencer - 3 years ago
    Did you ever wondered if the Devil was out to kill us, Why didn't he just kill Adam and Eve? Then he would have laid the axe at the root of all Mankind.

    He's a deceiver.

    When he Deceived them He took Dominion.

    The Devil is in the Business of Mankind Desciples of his own. The Devil wanted Gods Glory and so do his Children.

    Pride is What's a attribute of Satan and our flesh.

    I believe Jude has a lot to say about this

    I believe this is the context of Jude 1:7-13. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

    Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, DESPISE DOMINION, AND SPEAK EVIL OF DIGNITIES.

    Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

    BUT THESE SPEAK EVIL OF THOSE THINGS WHICH THEY KNOW NOT: BUT WHAT THEY KNOW NATURALLY, AS BRUTE BEASTS, IN THOSE THINGS THEY CORRUPT THEMSELVES.

    Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.

    These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

    Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

    Ephesians 6:11. Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the ( WILES )of the devil.

    Ephesians 6:12-13.

    We're not given this Armor to March forward. It's so we will be able to Stand.

    We don't present ourselves as brute beasts.

    Paul says when I am weak I'm strong.

    2 Corinthians 12:7-10.

    The strength is not U

    The strength is he that is in U.
  • Beating up Bad Demons __Slaying the Giants - In Reply - 3 years ago
    Ask the Holy Spirit to prepare you for the gift of discerning of "spirits" at work in situations. Pray to be anointed. Luke 4:18

    Jude 1:25

    25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be GLORY and MAJESTY, DOMINION and POWER, both now and EVER. Amen.

    JESUS gave his disciples HIS AUTHORITY to act and pray in Jesus Name. As we follow Jesus the Holy Spirit will prepare us for ministry.

    David was insulted by Goliaths' taunts against calling God; a NAMELESS God. He killed Goliath with a rock and took his head off; and took Goliaths' sword.

    We have to read All the Old Stories. There is Gods Perfect Will and then Gods permissive Will.

    Our Weapons are MIGHTY TO THE PULLING DOWN OF STRONGHOLDS. The Bible says WE ARE PRIESTS AND KINGS. Look up all these verses for starters ok? Chronicles-and Kings.

    It's the Holy Spirits ministry to EQUIP the Saints FOR SPIRITUAL Warfare. If you aren't willing to learn it, then as someone once challenged me.. "don't mess with college material before you learn the BASICS. Now I know how he felt. God spoke through him. I had a pity/angry party, and then I pursued the Lord with all of my strength. Every day. I wasn't Envious. I was INSULTED like David was by Goliath!!

    Demons have tried to stop me all my life; or kill me. So I say "why God won't you rescue me?! He's not gonna give you rattlesnakes till you learn to tame the firery Tongue of DOUBTS (James). Saul tried to kill David for years. GET FED UP WITH SATAN HURTING PEOPLE YOU ARE TRYING TO HELP.

    The Gospels and Jesus's Example, in spiritual warfare; plus Eph.6: is where we find our WEAPONS. Mighty through God, to the PULLING DOWN OF STRONGHOLDS. Are you a priest or ready to learn through the Holy Spirit; how to kill the giants?

    Gigi, did you listen to Iverna Thompkins videos on youtube? Go get yourself on fire and learn of JESUS's AUTHORITY. David's strength: he praised God exceedingly. I talk to HS all day long.

    He teaches of JESUS. I never get tired of it.
  • Comfort Love and Assurance - In Reply on Matthew 2 - 3 years ago
    These scriptures are not as well known as Psalm 23; but they offer assurance that you will see your loved ones again. Hold fast to Jesus. Follow Him.

    Proverbs 2:8

    He keepeth the paths of judgment, and preserveth the way of his saints.

    Psalms 116:15

    Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.

    Jude 1:24-25

    Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

    25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and EVER. Amen.

    2 Timothy 1:12

    For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know WHOM I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able TO KEEP that which I have committed unto him [the soul] against That day. [the day of death]

    Pencil these in a bare page in your Bible.
  • Michael the Archangel in charge of Moses's body - In Reply on Jude 1 - 3 years ago
    Wesley's Notes for JUDE 1:9

    1:9 Yet Michael - It does not appear whether St. Jude learned this by any revelation or from ancient tradition. It suffices, that these things were not only true, but acknowledged as such by them to whom he wrote. The archangel - This word occurs but once more in the sacred writings, # 1Thess 4:16|. So that whether there be one archangel only, or more, it is not possible for us to determine. When he disputed with the devil - At what time we know not. Concerning the body of Moses - Possibly the devil would have discovered the place where it was buried, which God for wise reasons had concealed. Durst not bring even against him a railing accusation - Though so far beneath him in every respect. But simply said, (so great was his modesty!) The Lord rebuke thee - I leave thee to the Judge of all.

    People's Bible Notes for Jude 1:9

    Jude 1:9 Michael the archangel. Michael is brought forward as a contrast with those who speak evil of dignities. He is called by Daniel "the Great Prince" (Da 12:1), and here "the archangel", or head angel. He disputed about the body of Moses. The reference is not to a statement of the Bible, but to a Jewish tradition which held that the burial place of Moses was placed under the charge of Michael. Durst not bring against him a railing accusation. Yet in addressing the devil, a fallen angel, he did not rail at him, but only said, "The Lord rebuke thee".
  • Dgjot on Jude 1 - 3 years ago
    Re: Jude 1:9 Where in the Old Testament does it mention the dispute between Michael the archangel and the devil??? I don't know where to find it.

    Thank You.
  • S Spencer - 3 years ago
    Hi Alex.

    As you stand for what you believe in I will do so as well. It's natural that We clash considering what we believe in!!

    You and I went over your thoughts on scripture months ago. I pointed out an error in your interpretation of what seems to be your foundation verse, Which we have seen you do from time to time,

    We also have to be visual and beware of methods from what the Bible calls enemies of the faith. Because of their Doctrine or practices They set traps.

    These verses come to mind .

    2 John 1:10. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:.

    Jude 1:3-4. Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

    For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
  • Chris - In Reply on John 21 - 3 years ago
    English Sacha. Is that what you have gleaned from what I addressed to Earl? You've made some assumptions that clearly are emotive rather than what I had written or is revealed in the Bible. We're discussing the fact of God's Judgement to all who are not saved through Jesus Christ.

    How God decides who are worthy of judgement (whether some primitive soul or those with mental shortcomings, etc), is God's matter, not mine nor yours. If you believe this God of Love is incapable of judging sinners in such a manner, then you would need to consider the operation of God throughout Scriptures - i.e. He is indeed a God of Love but also a God of Justice. We can often be conditioned by the world & what we perceive to be right, to think of such a justice system as normal, as true. Whereas God's Justice always demands the correct penalty - and unfortunately, simply losing one's life in death (which happens to us all) is just one part of that justice. The wages of sin might indeed be death, but the wages for the rejection of God & His offer of salvation are far greater ( Daniel 12:1,2; Matthew 18:7-9; Matthew 25:31-46; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9; Jude 1:6,7; Revelation 14:9-11; Revelation 20:10-15). And sister GiGi has also given a very apt response to you.
  • Paballo on Jude 1 - 3 years ago
    Hallelujah

    To God be the glory great things has done
  • Earl Bowman - In Reply - 3 years ago
    Sister Sacha, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

    Daniel 12:1 And at that time: (prophecy) the coming ministry of Christ, in the FLESH for forty two months; afterwards the ministry of CHRIST THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT; which has been going on now for two thousand years.

    Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael: Michael is the MESSENGER (angel) of GOD; CHRIST is the MESSENGER (angel) of GOD. Michael is Christ and Christ is Michael.

    Malachi 2:7 For the priest's (Christ is our high priest) lips shall keep knowledge, and they (priest's lips) shall seek the law at his mouth (Christ mouth): for he (Christ) is the MESSENGER (angel) of the Lord.

    Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel (messenger of the Lord).....

    Revelation 12:7 ....Michael (CHRIST, messenger of the Lord) and his angels (ministering Spirits, messengers)......

    Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael (Christ) stand up, the great prince (Christ) which standeth for the children of thy (God's) people: and there shall be a time of trouble (has been going on now for two thousand years), such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time (when you can enter into the kingdom of God) thy people shall be delivered (saved from death and the grave), every one (chosen to be a priest) that shall be written (IN CHRIST) in the book (IN the WORD, IN CHRIST).

    There is TWO RESURRECTIONS; the resurrection of the saints, both those of the old testament (at Christ resurrection) and those that are born again (that share in Christ resurrection, so they never see death).

    Daniel 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth (all those that died before Christ resurrection and those not chosen in the AGE of grace) shall awake, some to (age of the ages) life (those in the FIRST RESURRECTION), and some to shame and (age of the ages) contempt (SECOND RESURRECTION).

    You can NEVER understand the prophecies without understanding there are TWO RESURRECTIONS.
  • Chris - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    To my knowledge the book of Enoch was never included in the KJV since it was only found in the 50s with the death sea scrolls. There are ample mentions of him and his writing throughout the bible though, especially the new testament.

    Genesis 5:18-24. And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him. This and his for the times below average lifespan of three hundred sixty and five years, everyone living about 700-1000 years in those days, mean to me that his life wasn't ended because of death, but because, as it says, God took him after Enoch walking with him, which is perfectly described in the book of Enoch.

    Hebrews 11:4-5. 5 makes mention of Enoch, whom by faith was "translated". I interpret this word as him being taken by God, since he was not found due to God having translated him. For before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God, so it says, and this testimony is likely to be his writing. 4 makes mention of Abel speaking even after death, which to my knowledge isn't really explained anywhere else in the bible but is perfectly made sense of in Enoch, where he looks into the depths of the Sheol only to find Abel claiming vengeance for the murdering of him (if someone knows of any passage of the bible which also mentions this I'd be very happy to know).

    Lastly, Jude 1:14-15. Must I say any more?

    I don't know much about other Apocrypha. I know, superficially, for example, that the deuterocanonical books were instilled by the catholic church and are quite contradictory with the rest of the bible, for the reasons this very same website mentions in its page about the apocrypha. I haven't read them though, so I couldn't know. I recommend the book of Enoch because sufficient mention is made of him to prove its veracity, and that it satisfies the curiosity of us creationists while also explaining, as I said, the nature of malevolence, the giants, of whom David fought one, the Lords cosmology and creation, etc.
  • T. Levis - In Reply on Revelation 14 - 3 years ago
    Philippians 2:12 please notice the similarity in these verses in context Philippians 2:3-4, read Philippians 2:1-15,

    Matthew 25:31-46

    Proverbs 3:1-35

    Isaiah 58:1-14

    Jude 1:1-25

    I have drawn comfort from these scriptures. Jude 1:24-25, 1 Jude 1:21,

    Nahum 1:7 also in context is the bigger picture

    Luke 12:32 Luke 12:1-59

    1 Colossians 1:10-23

    Philippians 1:6

    I hope these scriptures give you a bigger picture that the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY is showing us & are encouraging to you. Many more I wanted to share but deleted & held back to not overwhelm with too much reading all at once.
  • Chris - In Reply on Job 1 - 3 years ago
    Neither Jude 1:6 nor 2 Peter 2:4 tell us how many angels followed Satan in his rebellion, Prasanth. Some Bible students might use Revelation 12:3,4 referring to Satan taking with him one third of the angelic host with him, but the narrative is too vague in my opinion & Revelation itself is not always in sequential order.

    So, I cannot vouch with any certainty about the number of angels but my sense is that it would have been a great company of them, not just a dozen or so. And then of course, if the fallen angels were kept in everlasting chains awaiting Judgement Day, does the demonic activity of old & present days, represent the spirits of those angels? It's hard to have certainty & form conclusions.
  • Prasanth Konde - In Reply on Job 1 - 3 years ago
    Sir,

    I need one more clarification , Jude 1:6 says it was chained and locked untill the judement day. I just want to know howmany highrank angels are fallen from the kingdom of heaven and trouble to our mankind.

    .
  • T. Levis - In Reply - 3 years ago
    At 1st glance it appears to be truth. I went through a Bible study with a Pastor friend I really respected, who taught this idea also & it seemed accurate but didn't set right in my Spirit. Years later I was reading Genesis & noticed something important that contradicts the "angels" married women: Genesis 4:26, (Son's of God ) * Romans 8:14, so it defines who are the son's of God, Jesus also defines the son's & daughters of God: Matthew 12:50, additional scriptures to back it up 2 Corinthians 6:17,18

    1 Corinthians 6:3, Galations 4:6,7

    & if the Son's of GOD are those who do GOD's will, then that rejects fallen angel theory. & if we are called sons & daughters, it's mankind.

    2 Peter 2:11,12, James 2:19,

    Further scriptures: Jude 1:6,7,8,9,10, Hebrews 1:13,14

    &

    Tobit so far is the most indepth book speaking on these matters & interaction between Angels, & evil Spirits. Here are notable scriptures Tobit 6, Tobit 7, Tobit 8. If that kind of relation could have happened as you speak of wouldn't it have happened here?
  • T. Levis - In Reply - 3 years ago
    Let's start with scripture.

    2 Esdras 6:47-52 your reference

    Genesis 1:20-22 * one translation of the Bible I recently read: instead of "whales" says "Monster/s" , Jerusalem Bible translation says"great serpents", NIV says "great creatures " , Jubilee Bible 2000 translation says "And GOD created the great dragons" several other translations say "great sea creatures". = (Huge water creatures.)

    My 1st thought is the " dinosaur" namely "Brachiosaurus" & "Brontosaurus" [quotes- for names today?]

    Job 40:15 , Job 40:15-24,

    Job 41:1-10 Leviathan

    Bel and the Dragon 1:23-28

    Genesis 5:24, Jude 1:14, Hebrews 11:5,

    Linage to CHRIST Luke 3:37

    Opinion : Is Enoch symbolism for Huge in The Faith?
  • T. Levis - In Reply - 3 years ago
    Christi, hello. Raising 8 children is no small task!! I hope this scripture will help you.

    Jude 1:24 -25
  • S Spencer - In Reply - 3 years ago
    It is finished. Part 1.

    Is our atonement forever or once Christ freed us it's up to us to Atone for ourselves?

    When Christ offered himself, He did it all!

    The sacrifice had to be without blemishe.

    Jesus didn't need cleansing from sin.

    Jesus was sinless throughout his life.

    PERFECT AND COMPLETE.

    What's important to Know is the high priest in the levitical priesthood had to offer up sacrifices for himself and then the children of Israel. because it was IMPERFECT. But not Christ.

    Hebrews 7:27. Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.

    Jesus was an offering to the Lord for our sins. ONCE! By it we have atonement. He was raised from the dead showing the prophesied sacrifice was accepted.

    HOW ARE WE KEPT.

    As the offering of Christ was complete for remission of sins compared to the Levitical offerings because they had to offered often. Can we remain perfect by law keeping and continuous offerings? NO!

    Hebrews 10:11-12. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, WHICH CAN NEVER TAKE AWAY SINS:

    But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

    1 John 2:1-2. My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

    And he is the propitiation for our sins: Atonement that is (concretely)

    Colossians 3:3. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

    Jude 1:24-25. Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

    To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

    John 10:28. And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
  • Adam - In Reply - 3 years ago
    It uses the word "destruction."

    I don't know if you believe in hell or not. Most Christians do, because the Bible warns us about hell. So, if you believe in hell, the next question is how long does it last? Instant destruction/death, medium term death, long term, or eternity? The Bible uses different synonyms, examples, parables, etc to describe hell. For example, if you keep reading in Matthew 7 verse 19 it calls it a 'fire'. Matthew 8:12 says there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Mark 9:48 says the worm never dies and fire unquenched. 2 Thessalonians 1:9 says "everlasting destruction." I interpret this is not short. Revelation 20:10 also suggests it's not short in duration. Jude 1:7 - uses the word "eternal fire." Matthew 25:46, Matthew 25:41. These are only a handful of examples and I think there are more suggesting that hell is not an instant death. If you find just as many verses saying hell is instant and you die instantly, please share them. I also don't believe the word death or destruction automatically means it's instant. It can happen over a longer period of time. For example Adam and ate the fruit and was condemned to death, but lived 930 years. He became mortal and died just like God said and it wasn't instant, but the death was slow. Is it out of the question to consider the same could be true for hell, especially since many verses say it's eternal?

    People will likely interpret the duration differently and we probably won't know for sure until the end. But because of the scripture, the context, that hell is intended to be a punishment for those who disobeyed, I do not believe it is an instant death. I think people will be very sorry and deeply regret they disrespected God and did not take Him seriously and I believe God will fairly see those who chose evil are punished. God bless.
  • Chris - In Reply on Jude 1:9 - 3 years ago
    Thanks brother Philip, for those great additions to my understanding. As I read it over, my thoughts went to both our Lord & also to the Apostle Peter who brought out warnings about correct leadership of Christ's Church: Matthew 20:25-28 & 1 Peter 5:2,3. Those, of whom the early Church congregations were warned, certainly disregarded this great example of humility, leadership, & being a pattern to emulate. But aren't those the qualities that any leader, within or without the Church, should embrace & exercise? Thank you again & every blessing in your labours.
  • Philip Christian Parks - In Reply on Jude 1:9 - 3 years ago
    Dear Chris,

    Thank you for reminding me of the Nicolaitans ( Rev. 2:6 & 15). The proper name "Nicolaitans" literally means "conqueror (or destroyer) of the laity (people)." I cannot find any proof that they were disciples of the Nicolas mentioned only in Acts 6:5. I certainly do not desire to defame that particular Nicolas based on conjecture or speculation.

    The implication of the term "Nicolaitan" suggests that a despotic authoritarian, or a hierarchy had assumed unauthorized lordship as priests over the church, thus usurping The Headship of CHRIST ( Eph. 1:22; 5:23; Col. 1:18).

    The church must never underestimate the influential power these charismatic religious heretics have over gullible churches. Note how the Ephesian Church hated "the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I (our Glorified CHRIST) also hate" ( Rev. 2:1-6). Yet, the Pergamos Church appointed certain Nicolaitans into their church leadership positions and adopted and practiced ("hold") "the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate" ( Rev. 2:12-16).

    I also looked up the word "hold" ( Rev. 2:15) in my Greek dictionary and discovered it translates from the Greek verb root (pronounced "krat-EH-o"), which speaks of church leaders using dictatorial power over the church to enforce their Nicolaitan doctrine. This sets a dangerous precedence, for the powerful often gain power over the church far beyond that prescribed in the New Testament.

    If "Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them" (3Jn. v.9), was not a Nicolaitan, he certainly seemed to have patterned his authoritarian intimidation after their doctrine.

    Reading your post has given me some thoughts for adding to my own commentary. Thank you.
  • Chris - In Reply on Jude 1:9 - 3 years ago
    Indeed brother Philip, their ungodliness knew no bounds. Even if their many sins as you listed were sufficient for immediate condemnation, their "turning the Grace of God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ" (verse 4), seems to be the hook on which that list hangs.

    I think of the condemnation by our Lord in Revelation 2:6,14,15 of the Nicolaitans, from whom these "ungodly men" may well have arisen or at least from under their tutorship. As these men (in Jude), so also were the Nicolaitans, who made mockery of the Grace of God revealed in His Gospel. Believing that marriage was not binding on Christians as it was a human invention, this gave rise to all manner of unnatural unrestrained sexual behaviour. And with the Love & Mercy of God to all men being the foundation of the Gospel, they, without fear of punishment for their sins, literally turned & perverted God's Grace into lasciviousness. And with swelling convincing words, many were led astray, fulfilling fleshly desires & becoming ensnared by Satan. Having done despite to God's Grace, the Holy Character of the Lord God & His Son were so marred & distorted, that it could be well said of them, that they 'denied the Lord & His Christ'. And don't these words allude to the Gnostic teaching at that time, which refuted the belief that deity could unite with flesh? These men spoken of in Jude came in many disguises to believers everywhere, even today, tools of Satan, to weaken & destroy the Body of Christ & the yet the sure promise from Matthew 16:18, is that even "the gates of hell shall not prevail against it".

    Thank you for those thoughts brother, on this passage.
  • Philip Christian Parks - In Reply on Jude 1:9 - 3 years ago
    Your spiritual insight and hermeneutical ability to disqualify my commentary as having "no understanding of this tiny book at all" greatly impresses me. I'll take your criticism under advisement, even in light of the fact that you have not read my lengthy commentary in its entirety. Keep in mind, this website limits each submission to only 2000 characters which is hardly enough to make a basic point.

    Readers must first have a general understanding of the term "un-GODly" (Jude v.4) before they can apply it in the context. The general explanation details "why" they are un-GODly. Jude's epistle details "how" they are un-GODly. Jude provided no identities to these un-GODly people, for they exist in every age. Rather, Jude described them as "certain men crept in unawares" (v.4), and "these [filthy] dreamers" (v.8). While these two descriptions may identify different types of people, they all desire to produce the same result within the church: perversion of the Gospel and the Doctrines of CHRIST (e.g. vv. 11-12).

    They are un-GODly far beyond their "secretly engaged in gross sexual immorality without anyone knowing" as you say. Consider their unGODly ways of ...

    + hatred toward all in authority (v.8),

    + mimicking Cain, Balaam, and Korah (v.11),

    + deeds, hard [speeches] and great swelling words(vv. 8 & 15-16),

    + unjustified murmurings and ungrateful complaints (v.16), and

    + mockery of all things holy during "the last time" (v.18).

    Their behavior does not "imply they're going to lose their salvation", but rather they are not saved in the first place, for they "were before of old ordained to this condemnation" (v.4) because "they have not The SPIRIT" (v.19). These are the same type of heretics our LORD described as thieves, robbers, strangers, and hirelings ( Jn. 10).

    Yes, I'm keenly aware of Apostle Peter's account of the same type of un-GODly men as you correctly point out, particularly Second Peter chapter two, and to which I refer many times in my full commentary.
  • Philip Christian Parks on Jude 1:9 - 3 years ago
    un-GODly men; Jude v.4 = The adjective "un-GODly" describes a person who has no reverential respect, nor any honorable consideration for GOD, or anything pertaining to GOD. Thus, they reject any thought or form of worshiping HIM because "they did not like to retain {possessing and putting intelligence and wisdom into practical use} GOD in their knowledge" ( Rom. 1:28).

    As a point of antonymous (the opposite of synonymous) reference, the term un-GODliness describes the polar opposite contrast to GODliness. Un-GODliness is anything and everything in man that contradicts GOD, HIS ESSENCE, HIS PERSON, HIS Character, HIS Attributes, HIS Will, and HIS Purposes. Un-GODliness is the rejection of, and unbelief in, GOD, HIS CHRIST, and HIS Gospel.

    The un-GODly are not atheists by default or through any actual non-belief in GOD's real existence, for they are "men, who hold the Truth in unrighteousness" ( Rom. 1:18). They actually know about GOD, but choose to reject HIM, for "they did not like to retain GOD in their knowledge" ( Rom. 1:28). Moreover, the hatred the un-GODly seethe toward GOD prompts them to "despise the Riches of HIS Goodness and Forbearance" ( Rom. 2:4) because of their "hardness and impenitent heart" ( Rom. 2:5).

    Their hatred, hardness, and rejection of GOD turns them into "The fool [who] hath said in his heart, There is no GOD" ( Ps. 14:1; cp. Ps. 36:1; 53:1). Notice, the expression, "There is ", is in italics for it was added by the translators. What the fool literally says is this: "There is no God for me. I will worship and serve no god or deity." In essence, even though they "know the Judgement of GOD" ( Rom. 1:32), this mental knowledge poses "no fear of GOD before their eyes" ( Rom. 3:18; cp. Eph. 4:19; 1Tim. 4:2).


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