OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Very well, Richard,
I have given you two admonitions and now I must reject you as per Paul's instructions to Titus.
Concerning the verse you claim is evidence someone received the gift of the Holy Ghost without speaking in tongues in Acts 11, however, I must offer this correction so as others are not deceived.
This is Peter relaying to some of the circumcision (Jews) what had just taken place in Acts 10 when the Holy Ghost fell upon Cornelius (an Italian man) and his friends, and they spoke with other tongues and magnified God (as on the 120 at the beginning -verse 15).
As a priest of my masterJesus Christ I must rightly divide the word, and give reproof, instruction and correction. in righteousness. That we all might come into the unity of the faith.
Dear Chris and friends, God allowed time to continue while many sincere, innocent, defenseless, born again Christians were buried alive or had scolding oil poured over their heads and worse. It wasn't a judgement by God but a witness of the love of God and the power of believers to withstand cruelty by forgiveness by faith in Jesus Christ while speaking and living the truth without fear. This period of time not so long ago helped establish the times where enough freedom outside of forced baptism existed that the Gospel of Jesus Christ could be spread throughout the whole world. For these believers this was a great tribulation in this time.
Thank you for conversing with me on these couple subjects. Please let this be the end of our discussion with all respect.
About The Word of God not being Jesus Christ is your own belief. It is not from the pits of hell. Hebrews 1:1-4, Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 2:26-27, Revelation 3:20-21, Revelation 19:11-16. We are to honor the Son the same way we honor the Father, John 5:21-23. The Messiah/Christ being the anointed one of God. ( 1 John 2:23-24.
Just to straighten up a little with reply about receiving the Holy Ghost. I never said my experience, or experiences, was "feeling peace". Me stating most people in the world would not believe my experiences is because they are supernatural things. It was not me who chose God, He chose me. I know not why. All glory be to Jesus Christ our Lord and our Father in Heaven.
I don't know of any Scripture of people receiving the Holy Ghost just by "feeling peace". Although I do know of one that doesn't state it was after a water baptism nor did they speak in tongues. Acts 11:11-18.
I hope our discussion shall keep you from discrediting other believers in the Lord just because they don't speak in unknown tongues. We should all try to help one another with our faith in the Lord. Hebrews 13:1-2.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV, I do not understand the latter part of your post maybe that's me. My post was on the 7-year rapture theory using the last week of the 70th-week prophecy to create 7 years. My meaning was no part of that prophecy should be combined with Revelation. There is a lot that was fulfilled during those 70 weeks. More than can be covered in a small post. As far as the temple I have not found any scriptures that say there will be another before Jesus sets his kingdom upon the earth but there could be. If you read ( Revelation 21:22) The holy city, New Jerusalem there is no temple.
Jesus was sent only for the lost sheep of Israel and Jesus commanded his disciple to only go to the lost sheep and not to go unto the Gentiles.
Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Matthew 10:5-7 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
They did not until Peters dream and Jesus appeared to Paul, around the same time Stephen was killed. That ended the 70th-week. If you read ( Matthew 23:31-38) it shows who made it desolate and the temple was destroyed 30+ years later in their generation, by the people of the prince, Rome. When Jesus was talking to the woman at the well he talks about this happening. ( John 4:21-24).
Hi Liz, I agree that it can be a little confusing as to what to believe in respect of the Rapture, but even after your study (& consideration of the comments here), you will need to come to your own understanding of this great subject, yet remaining open to the Spirit for any further light you receive through study.
Just a couple of things to keep in mind: you will read of 'tribulation' in the Bible, but you need to ascertain whether it is the 'Great Tribulation' that is being spoken of. We will all go through tribulation while living in the world ( John 16:33, Acts 14:22), but the Great Tribulation is different ( Matthew 24:21).
The Great Tribulation is a short period of time where the outpouring of God's Anger is seen & felt & this Anger is against the world of sinners where God causes a great annihilation through various means. You can compare it to the time of the Great Flood or to the destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah: all these were specific to God's Anger & Judgement rather than from the usual effects of living in a sinful world & condition. And the righteous were saved from His Anger (i.e. Noah, Lot & families) while the others were destroyed.
As Christians, cleansed & saved by the blood of the Lamb, our judgement against sin has already been accomplished at the Cross. Then ask, 'do we have to once again suffer the judgement of God with other Christ-rejectors?' If so, the work at the Cross hasn't fully accomplished its purpose as we would have to be dealt with twice under God's Hand: once in Mercy (seeking forgiveness & spiritual healing/restoration) & then again without Mercy, in Judgement with the others. Or, is His Church removed before His Terrors against sinners are poured out?. And here I speak of God's Judgement only & not at the revelation of the Anti-Christ, which event is not part of that Judgement (Revelation chapters 6 to 19).
For your consideration & discussion in your online Bible study. Blessings.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Yea Ron,
Daniel 9:27
King James Version
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
I have received that this is speaking of the covenant Jesus Christ made and confirmed. After his 3.5 yr ministry, Jesus was killed and the veil was rent: causing the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and the Jews havent had a temple since, nor will they until the consummation (of the marriage of the bride) and that which is determined (the wrath of God) will be poured upon the desolate (the ungodly).
So yea, the great tribulation/time of Jacob's trouble will be 3.5 yrs (a time, times, and half a time or 1260 days- as referenced elsewhere in the book of The Revelation). As to the time of the catching up, we can see from Scripture that the Man of sin/son of perdition must be revealed first, as to when in the tribulation I believe is just speculation.
John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Well praise the Lord if you have been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ!
That's the first half of being born of water & Spirit Jesus spoke of in John 3:5 necessary to enter into the kingdom.
As to Christ being the Word, that is a lie from the pit of hell to get people to believe in a "pre-incarnate Christ" and a "trinity" (words not found in the Holy Scriptures), so that they don't know the Son of God, and He will tell them, "depart from me I never knew you" as you referenced in Matthew 7.
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. Amen. How did God create everything? By His word. It doesn't say "and the word was Christ."
And the word was made flesh ( John 1:14).
God was manifest in the flesh ( 1 Tim 3:16)
Amen.
When was God manifest in the flesh?
Luke 3:22
And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Amen.
When the Holy Spirit (God) descended upon and began to dwell in His Son, God was manifest in the flesh, and then Jesus began his 3.5 year ministry of miracles signs and wonders.
Which brings us to the root of our conversation. Murmuring or babbling (i.e. sha la la ba ba like you can hear in some "pentecostal/apostolic" churches) is not evidence of having received the Holy Ghost. However, as I said; the fake tongues do not invalidate the real thing. The Book of Acts shows forth that anytime someone received the Holy Ghost they spoke in another tongue (be it of men or angels). If you can show me, from the scriptures, an instance that someone received the Holy Ghost by "feeling peace" then I will gladly stand corrected, but I have not found any such scripture. I wouldn't trust a "personal experience" over what the word of God says.
Isaiah 55:1
Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
Hi Liz, I agree with what Richard in Christ said, trusting in the Lord and keeping our faith and Matthew 24:29-31.. The rapture theory pre, mid, or post is based on taking the last week from the 70th-week prophecy given to Daniel in Daniel 9: 27. This is the only scripture that will give you 7 years.
You may ask. How long will the tribulation period last? Is it three and one-half years? Is it seven years? To answer your question I would suggest you study Daniel's 70-week prophecy and if you find what I have found if the 70-week prophecy has been fulfilled it will answer your question. Without the last week, the 7-year rapture theory is false and the pre, mid, or post is irrelevant.
The 70th-week prophecy Daniel 24-27 is Determined on Israel and Jerusalem/The Holy City. This prophecy tells the year the Messiah/Jesus Christ will come the first time, the baptizing by John. They rejected Him. This prophecy also tells when Jesus was crucified.
The seven-year rapture theory is taken from vs 27 and it is said he in this verse is the antichrist and he makes a covenant with Israel and in the middle of this last week, he breaks the covenant, and the great tribulation starts, (short version).
One clue, it was 69 weeks when Jesus came and He was crucified 3 years later, that puts it in the middle of that last week, the 70th week. So who is he? There is also one who we know and scripture backs up, made a covenant. Study to find and be confident in your own heart.
Liz, May the Spirit grace you with His wisdom and His understanding.
Acts 14:22 .....that we through MUCH TRIBULATION enter into the kingdom of God.
It's been 2000 years since Christ preached the GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD ( Mark 1:14) under the theory of the seven year tribulation (still waiting) no one would have entered in the kingdom of God.
Revelation 1:9 I John, whom also am your brother, and COMPANION IN TRIBULATION, and in THE KINGDOM...
It appears that John believed he was living during the time of TRIBULATION.
Revelation 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: FOR THE TIME IS AT HAND.
As the "Rapture" is not something I get into much as I'm sure you know there seems to be three beliefs, pre/mid/post, of when this will occur in relation of the tribulation in the end. The one verse I see that proves some of Gods children or chosen ones shall be here after the tribulation is stated in Matthew 24:29-31.
I would say just trust in the Lord, keep your faith, no matter what shall come about in this world. Amen.
No man has told me I have received the Holy Ghost. Just as no man shall ever persuade me that the Holy Ghost is not in me. I know because of what I have experienced. The Holy Bible is what God lead me to read which lead me to Jesus Christ. Most people in this world would not believe what I have experienced. Those who do are wise as I speak truth. All glory to our Lord Jesus Christ and our Father in Heaven.
I did avoid your first question. As it was unlearned. I do not believe in a "trinity of gods". God is one. It seems you do not believe in Jesus Christ being the Word of God? As stated in ( 1 John 1:14, John 14:10? The Father and the Son are also one, John 9:30. Let's not get into that though as you have your own belief. Your assumption of my water baptism is false also.
No where in the Holy Bible does it specifically state everyone who receives the Holy Ghost shall murmur or babble. That in no way is magnifying God. And to prophecy people must understand your words. Again remember as in Matthew 7:21-23 that no matter how much you prophesied, or cast out devils, in the name of the Lord that is not what saves you. The Lord searches hearts. I also just as you will have to give account for our words Matthew 12:36-37.
To OTITW KJV. Just to clarify a couple of your references.
a. Isaiah 28:11,12: "For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing..." If you read this portion of Scripture, it has nothing to do with the experience of speaking in other tongues. It has to do with the Assyrian captivity, when Ephraim (one of Joseph's sons) is particularly mentioned who would go into captivity along with Israel, because of their many sins & wicked prophets & priests. Instead of hearing the Word of God through His prophets, they would receive the Word from those "with stammering lips & another tongue", i.e. another nation & another language, implying that the Word given would also be spoken in scorn & derision to God's people. This verse has nothing to do with the spiritual gift of Tongues.
b. the 'doctrine of the Trinity'. You would have a hard time to deny the Trinity, as it was not only believed by the apostles & the early Church ( John 17:5, Matthew 28:19, John 20:28, etc), but was also believed by the early Church fathers (i.e. those who were eminent men in the post-apostolic Church, after the apostle John). Names such as Ignatius ("For our God, Jesus the Christ, was conceived by Mary according to God's plan..."; "There is only one physician, who is both flesh and spirit, born and unborn, God in man, true life in death, both from Mary and from God, first subject to suffering and then beyond it, Jesus Christ our Lord."). And Polycarp ("Now may the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the eternal High Priest himself, the Son of God Jesus Christ, build you up in faith and truth...and to all those under heaven who will yet believe in our Lord and God Jesus Christ and in his Father who raised him from the dead."). And not to mention Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Hippolytus, Origen, who all believed it. This is not an RC introduced belief.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
I can say without apology, by the Holy Ghost; speaking as the oracles of God ( 1 Peter 4:11), that the word of God declares that when someone receives the gift of the Holy Ghost, they will speak in an unknown tongue, prophesy and magnify God. This happened all throughout the book of Acts and still happens today
So if this hasn't happened with you, then no; you have not received the gift of the Holy Ghost, yet.
But the good news is you can still ask & seek the Father in prayer & praise for His promise.
Who told you that you had received the Holy Ghost because you felt peace..the bible? Or a man?
Since you avoided confirming the first question I posed to you, I will take it that you believe in a "trinity" of gods, & that you were baptized by a man who said, "I baptize you in the NAME of the Father Son and Holy Ghost " and never said the one NAME given among men by which we must be saved.
These words will either serve as a testimony for you or against you on judgement day. For your sake I pray it will be the former. Either way, your blood is off my hands.
As this will probably be the last question I have for you Andrew. Being a yes or no question. Which I believed you have stated already but just to be sure. Are you saying I do not have the Holy Ghost because I do not speak in "unknown tongues"?
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Well praise the Lord!
Pardon my redundancy but since this is a dalvation issue allow me to confirm; you have been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ (and not the titles Father Son and Holy Ghost) for the remission of sins?
Verily what you said that The Father (God), The Word (God) and the Holy Ghost (God) are one. However, if you happen to believe that the word; Word actually means Christ, or Son of God, then unfortunately you have been deceived by rome's sorcerers/ theologians. JOHN 1:1 KJV 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Amen.
The word, Word means written or spoken unit of communication. Just like these words I am writing to you here. They are my word (aside from my Father's word -1 Perer 4:11 :) and they are with me.
In summary, getting back to the original question at hand: yes, the Holy Scriptures clearly show that every time someone received the Gift of the Holy Ghost in the book of Acts, the initial manifestation and evidence of it is that they would speak in an unknown tongue (be it of men or angels) and prophesy and magnify God, Hallelujah! This is not to misconstrue the initial evidence of having received the Gift with the individual 'gift of diverse tongues' or being able to speak in known languages of men without ever having learned them (Paul speaks of this in 1 Corinthians 12).
So yes, in summary, all who receive the gift of the Holy Ghost will speak in an unknown tongue as the Spirit gives them utterance. However not all have the gift of diverse tongues. Covet the best gifts.
I hope this helps you so that you can press in in prayer and praise and receive the Gift, as Jesus said in Luke 11:13 13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
Amen.
We don't want to boast of a false gift as that would make us like what is spoken of in Proverbs 25:14, & Jude 1:12 if we continue.
As I agree with you there are many false teachers/doctrines out in the world today. The only one I feel is not false, although can be taken out of context like anything, is the trinity. Only meaning the Father, the Word, and Holy Ghost are one. Tri(three) +unity(joined/one)= the word trinity. Which I believe.
Let's stay on track with what we began to discuss though. Being "tongues" is needed to prove, or show, you have the Holy Ghost? If this is off please correct me.
Your question of "have I been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ" is yes.
Well I did not say that tongues was the gift. I said the Holy Ghost is the gift. Tongues is the utterance. And yes the Spiritual gifts are separate gifts like I said. This is a subject many do not learn/understand. I wonder how many churches teach wrong! There's scripture for this truth.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Amen. Praise the Lord brother!
Just as brother Paul asked John's disciples @ Ephesus in Acts 19, "unto what were ye baptized?" When they said they had not even heard of the Holy Ghost for He had not yet been poured out during the time of John the Baptist. We need to tell as many professing Christians as we can. This is how Christian's confess Christ (to others) to be saved after baptism as per Romans 10: 9, it's not a one shot deal. Praise God!
What you have witnessed I know not. What I do know is I myself have been Blessed to have received the Holy Ghost and I do not speak in tongues or "unknown tongues". The Spirit of Christ resides in me.
Where have you learned that speaking in tongues is "the gift"? Have you read ( 1 Corinthians 12? It explains "spiritual gifts". That there are diversities of "gifts" but the same Spirit. All unique members in the one body of Christ.
To try and move this to a higher level. What does speaking in "tongues" do for the Will of God? So your praise or prayer to the Lord is more important that my prayers? Because you don't know what your speaking but God does? I pray, praise, and give thanks from the heart as a loving child. If you have zeal for tongues, ok. I have zeal to follow Jesus Christ and do the Will of our Father in Heaven.
If you want to tell me I have not received the Holy Ghost because I don't speak in "tongues" know this. You do not know who you are posting to. You shall have to give account for your own words. Be careful.
OnlytruthintheworldKJV - In Reply on Mark 3 - 3 years ago
Greetings in Jesus' name, Richard,
In every instance when a Christian received the gift of the Holy Ghost after the New Testament began in the book of Acts (the first Church), it was always accompanied with speaking in another tongue (Samaritans: Acts 8:16-18 , Gentiles- Acts 10:46, Jews- Acts 19:1-6).
This is the proof or earnest (token) of a Christian's inheritance ( Ephesians 1:14).
This was prophesied by the prophet Isaiah
11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.
With all due respect, a Christian does not receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and is not sealed thereby the moment they believe as many lying pastors/theologians teach (along with other false doctrines like the "trinity" "once saved always saved" "purgatory" etc). Likewise a feeling of peace is not evidence you have received the Holy Ghost. While I do agree there are many that speak false tongues in emulation (primarily in the "Pentecostal/Apostolic" businesses), that does not invalidate the real thing.
May I ask you Richard (in Christ), have you been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins ( Gal. 3:27)?
I was just getting ready to post a reply but I see no need to add anything to what you just said. Amen!
I think many people are being ruined today by this teaching. My personal belief is that the "tongues" that are being taught today are not the tongues of the bible!
Andrew, amen amen. It truly is Acts 2:38. As we follow Christ w love.Even the Holy Spirit asked me to tell others about having the indwelling of his Spirit. Many ppl think they have it , & they really don't. We can not live for God in the flesh. The Holy spirit indwelling is a supernatural birth from above. I spoke in tongues too. Praising Jesus daily
My small church speak in tongues. We pray in the Spirit. It is speaking to God. Only God understands. The "gifts of the Spirit" are totally separate. When receiving the Holy Ghost, THAT is the gift, not the utterance in the book of Acts. I have witnessed ppl speaking in tongues when receiving the Holy Ghost.
Just to reply on one of your statements. As living proof(myself) you do not need to speak in "unknown tongues" to know you have received the Holy Ghost. The second detail, about receiving the Holy Ghost, you stated is much more accurate and important than the first about "unknown tongues". Helping us to repent from sins of the flesh and follow the Lord walking after the Spirit.
In Acts 2 you will see it is stated "other tongues" and the people who surrounded the building understood them speaking in "our own tongues"(or their own native language). Which means it was not "unknown" babble. Also in ( 1 Corinthians 12 as it just being a specific Gift of the Holy Ghost. That not everyone receives who has the Holy Ghost. Then in ( 1 Corinthians 14 it states if "there be no interpreter" to keep silent in the church with your "tongue" gift.
It just saddens me to see some people state that you have to speak in "tongues" to know you have the Holy Ghost which is a false teaching.
Not knowing if that is what you preach. Hopefully I will receive a reply and thank you for your time.
I have given you two admonitions and now I must reject you as per Paul's instructions to Titus.
Concerning the verse you claim is evidence someone received the gift of the Holy Ghost without speaking in tongues in Acts 11, however, I must offer this correction so as others are not deceived.
This is Peter relaying to some of the circumcision (Jews) what had just taken place in Acts 10 when the Holy Ghost fell upon Cornelius (an Italian man) and his friends, and they spoke with other tongues and magnified God (as on the 120 at the beginning -verse 15).
As a priest of my masterJesus Christ I must rightly divide the word, and give reproof, instruction and correction. in righteousness. That we all might come into the unity of the faith.
It's between you and the Lord now, Richard.
Be well my friend
That you know, in love, I remain teachable.
Carleton
Thank you for conversing with me on these couple subjects. Please let this be the end of our discussion with all respect.
About The Word of God not being Jesus Christ is your own belief. It is not from the pits of hell. Hebrews 1:1-4, Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 2:26-27, Revelation 3:20-21, Revelation 19:11-16. We are to honor the Son the same way we honor the Father, John 5:21-23. The Messiah/Christ being the anointed one of God. ( 1 John 2:23-24.
Just to straighten up a little with reply about receiving the Holy Ghost. I never said my experience, or experiences, was "feeling peace". Me stating most people in the world would not believe my experiences is because they are supernatural things. It was not me who chose God, He chose me. I know not why. All glory be to Jesus Christ our Lord and our Father in Heaven.
I don't know of any Scripture of people receiving the Holy Ghost just by "feeling peace". Although I do know of one that doesn't state it was after a water baptism nor did they speak in tongues. Acts 11:11-18.
I hope our discussion shall keep you from discrediting other believers in the Lord just because they don't speak in unknown tongues. We should all try to help one another with our faith in the Lord. Hebrews 13:1-2.
Peace be with you.
Jesus was sent only for the lost sheep of Israel and Jesus commanded his disciple to only go to the lost sheep and not to go unto the Gentiles.
Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Matthew 10:5-7 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
They did not until Peters dream and Jesus appeared to Paul, around the same time Stephen was killed. That ended the 70th-week. If you read ( Matthew 23:31-38) it shows who made it desolate and the temple was destroyed 30+ years later in their generation, by the people of the prince, Rome. When Jesus was talking to the woman at the well he talks about this happening. ( John 4:21-24).
God bless, Ron
Just a couple of things to keep in mind: you will read of 'tribulation' in the Bible, but you need to ascertain whether it is the 'Great Tribulation' that is being spoken of. We will all go through tribulation while living in the world ( John 16:33, Acts 14:22), but the Great Tribulation is different ( Matthew 24:21).
The Great Tribulation is a short period of time where the outpouring of God's Anger is seen & felt & this Anger is against the world of sinners where God causes a great annihilation through various means. You can compare it to the time of the Great Flood or to the destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah: all these were specific to God's Anger & Judgement rather than from the usual effects of living in a sinful world & condition. And the righteous were saved from His Anger (i.e. Noah, Lot & families) while the others were destroyed.
As Christians, cleansed & saved by the blood of the Lamb, our judgement against sin has already been accomplished at the Cross. Then ask, 'do we have to once again suffer the judgement of God with other Christ-rejectors?' If so, the work at the Cross hasn't fully accomplished its purpose as we would have to be dealt with twice under God's Hand: once in Mercy (seeking forgiveness & spiritual healing/restoration) & then again without Mercy, in Judgement with the others. Or, is His Church removed before His Terrors against sinners are poured out?. And here I speak of God's Judgement only & not at the revelation of the Anti-Christ, which event is not part of that Judgement (Revelation chapters 6 to 19).
For your consideration & discussion in your online Bible study. Blessings.
Daniel 9:27
King James Version
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
I have received that this is speaking of the covenant Jesus Christ made and confirmed. After his 3.5 yr ministry, Jesus was killed and the veil was rent: causing the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and the Jews havent had a temple since, nor will they until the consummation (of the marriage of the bride) and that which is determined (the wrath of God) will be poured upon the desolate (the ungodly).
So yea, the great tribulation/time of Jacob's trouble will be 3.5 yrs (a time, times, and half a time or 1260 days- as referenced elsewhere in the book of The Revelation). As to the time of the catching up, we can see from Scripture that the Man of sin/son of perdition must be revealed first, as to when in the tribulation I believe is just speculation.
John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
Be well
That's the first half of being born of water & Spirit Jesus spoke of in John 3:5 necessary to enter into the kingdom.
As to Christ being the Word, that is a lie from the pit of hell to get people to believe in a "pre-incarnate Christ" and a "trinity" (words not found in the Holy Scriptures), so that they don't know the Son of God, and He will tell them, "depart from me I never knew you" as you referenced in Matthew 7.
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. Amen. How did God create everything? By His word. It doesn't say "and the word was Christ."
And the word was made flesh ( John 1:14).
God was manifest in the flesh ( 1 Tim 3:16)
Amen.
When was God manifest in the flesh?
Luke 3:22
And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Amen.
When the Holy Spirit (God) descended upon and began to dwell in His Son, God was manifest in the flesh, and then Jesus began his 3.5 year ministry of miracles signs and wonders.
Which brings us to the root of our conversation. Murmuring or babbling (i.e. sha la la ba ba like you can hear in some "pentecostal/apostolic" churches) is not evidence of having received the Holy Ghost. However, as I said; the fake tongues do not invalidate the real thing. The Book of Acts shows forth that anytime someone received the Holy Ghost they spoke in another tongue (be it of men or angels). If you can show me, from the scriptures, an instance that someone received the Holy Ghost by "feeling peace" then I will gladly stand corrected, but I have not found any such scripture. I wouldn't trust a "personal experience" over what the word of God says.
Isaiah 55:1
Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
You may ask. How long will the tribulation period last? Is it three and one-half years? Is it seven years? To answer your question I would suggest you study Daniel's 70-week prophecy and if you find what I have found if the 70-week prophecy has been fulfilled it will answer your question. Without the last week, the 7-year rapture theory is false and the pre, mid, or post is irrelevant.
The 70th-week prophecy Daniel 24-27 is Determined on Israel and Jerusalem/The Holy City. This prophecy tells the year the Messiah/Jesus Christ will come the first time, the baptizing by John. They rejected Him. This prophecy also tells when Jesus was crucified.
The seven-year rapture theory is taken from vs 27 and it is said he in this verse is the antichrist and he makes a covenant with Israel and in the middle of this last week, he breaks the covenant, and the great tribulation starts, (short version).
One clue, it was 69 weeks when Jesus came and He was crucified 3 years later, that puts it in the middle of that last week, the 70th week. So who is he? There is also one who we know and scripture backs up, made a covenant. Study to find and be confident in your own heart.
May God bless your study, Ron
Acts 14:22 .....that we through MUCH TRIBULATION enter into the kingdom of God.
It's been 2000 years since Christ preached the GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD ( Mark 1:14) under the theory of the seven year tribulation (still waiting) no one would have entered in the kingdom of God.
Revelation 1:9 I John, whom also am your brother, and COMPANION IN TRIBULATION, and in THE KINGDOM...
It appears that John believed he was living during the time of TRIBULATION.
Revelation 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: FOR THE TIME IS AT HAND.
As the "Rapture" is not something I get into much as I'm sure you know there seems to be three beliefs, pre/mid/post, of when this will occur in relation of the tribulation in the end. The one verse I see that proves some of Gods children or chosen ones shall be here after the tribulation is stated in Matthew 24:29-31.
I would say just trust in the Lord, keep your faith, no matter what shall come about in this world. Amen.
God Bless.
No man has told me I have received the Holy Ghost. Just as no man shall ever persuade me that the Holy Ghost is not in me. I know because of what I have experienced. The Holy Bible is what God lead me to read which lead me to Jesus Christ. Most people in this world would not believe what I have experienced. Those who do are wise as I speak truth. All glory to our Lord Jesus Christ and our Father in Heaven.
I did avoid your first question. As it was unlearned. I do not believe in a "trinity of gods". God is one. It seems you do not believe in Jesus Christ being the Word of God? As stated in ( 1 John 1:14, John 14:10? The Father and the Son are also one, John 9:30. Let's not get into that though as you have your own belief. Your assumption of my water baptism is false also.
No where in the Holy Bible does it specifically state everyone who receives the Holy Ghost shall murmur or babble. That in no way is magnifying God. And to prophecy people must understand your words. Again remember as in Matthew 7:21-23 that no matter how much you prophesied, or cast out devils, in the name of the Lord that is not what saves you. The Lord searches hearts. I also just as you will have to give account for our words Matthew 12:36-37.
God Bless you.
a. Isaiah 28:11,12: "For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing..." If you read this portion of Scripture, it has nothing to do with the experience of speaking in other tongues. It has to do with the Assyrian captivity, when Ephraim (one of Joseph's sons) is particularly mentioned who would go into captivity along with Israel, because of their many sins & wicked prophets & priests. Instead of hearing the Word of God through His prophets, they would receive the Word from those "with stammering lips & another tongue", i.e. another nation & another language, implying that the Word given would also be spoken in scorn & derision to God's people. This verse has nothing to do with the spiritual gift of Tongues.
b. the 'doctrine of the Trinity'. You would have a hard time to deny the Trinity, as it was not only believed by the apostles & the early Church ( John 17:5, Matthew 28:19, John 20:28, etc), but was also believed by the early Church fathers (i.e. those who were eminent men in the post-apostolic Church, after the apostle John). Names such as Ignatius ("For our God, Jesus the Christ, was conceived by Mary according to God's plan..."; "There is only one physician, who is both flesh and spirit, born and unborn, God in man, true life in death, both from Mary and from God, first subject to suffering and then beyond it, Jesus Christ our Lord."). And Polycarp ("Now may the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the eternal High Priest himself, the Son of God Jesus Christ, build you up in faith and truth...and to all those under heaven who will yet believe in our Lord and God Jesus Christ and in his Father who raised him from the dead."). And not to mention Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Hippolytus, Origen, who all believed it. This is not an RC introduced belief.
So if this hasn't happened with you, then no; you have not received the gift of the Holy Ghost, yet.
But the good news is you can still ask & seek the Father in prayer & praise for His promise.
Who told you that you had received the Holy Ghost because you felt peace..the bible? Or a man?
Since you avoided confirming the first question I posed to you, I will take it that you believe in a "trinity" of gods, & that you were baptized by a man who said, "I baptize you in the NAME of the Father Son and Holy Ghost " and never said the one NAME given among men by which we must be saved.
These words will either serve as a testimony for you or against you on judgement day. For your sake I pray it will be the former. Either way, your blood is off my hands.
Be well Richard
Thank you for your time.
God Bless.
Pardon my redundancy but since this is a dalvation issue allow me to confirm; you have been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ (and not the titles Father Son and Holy Ghost) for the remission of sins?
Verily what you said that The Father (God), The Word (God) and the Holy Ghost (God) are one. However, if you happen to believe that the word; Word actually means Christ, or Son of God, then unfortunately you have been deceived by rome's sorcerers/ theologians. JOHN 1:1 KJV 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Amen.
The word, Word means written or spoken unit of communication. Just like these words I am writing to you here. They are my word (aside from my Father's word -1 Perer 4:11 :) and they are with me.
In summary, getting back to the original question at hand: yes, the Holy Scriptures clearly show that every time someone received the Gift of the Holy Ghost in the book of Acts, the initial manifestation and evidence of it is that they would speak in an unknown tongue (be it of men or angels) and prophesy and magnify God, Hallelujah! This is not to misconstrue the initial evidence of having received the Gift with the individual 'gift of diverse tongues' or being able to speak in known languages of men without ever having learned them (Paul speaks of this in 1 Corinthians 12).
So yes, in summary, all who receive the gift of the Holy Ghost will speak in an unknown tongue as the Spirit gives them utterance. However not all have the gift of diverse tongues. Covet the best gifts.
I hope this helps you so that you can press in in prayer and praise and receive the Gift, as Jesus said in Luke 11:13 13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
Amen.
We don't want to boast of a false gift as that would make us like what is spoken of in Proverbs 25:14, & Jude 1:12 if we continue.
Be well
I will just leave the verse from Jesus Christ instead of saying it myself. Matthew 12:36-37.
God Bless you.
Although is this not what this discussion was about? Needing to speak in "tongues" to know you have the Holy Ghost? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
God Bless.
As I agree with you there are many false teachers/doctrines out in the world today. The only one I feel is not false, although can be taken out of context like anything, is the trinity. Only meaning the Father, the Word, and Holy Ghost are one. Tri(three) +unity(joined/one)= the word trinity. Which I believe.
Let's stay on track with what we began to discuss though. Being "tongues" is needed to prove, or show, you have the Holy Ghost? If this is off please correct me.
Your question of "have I been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ" is yes.
Thank you. God Bless.
Just as brother Paul asked John's disciples @ Ephesus in Acts 19, "unto what were ye baptized?" When they said they had not even heard of the Holy Ghost for He had not yet been poured out during the time of John the Baptist. We need to tell as many professing Christians as we can. This is how Christian's confess Christ (to others) to be saved after baptism as per Romans 10: 9, it's not a one shot deal. Praise God!
What you have witnessed I know not. What I do know is I myself have been Blessed to have received the Holy Ghost and I do not speak in tongues or "unknown tongues". The Spirit of Christ resides in me.
Where have you learned that speaking in tongues is "the gift"? Have you read ( 1 Corinthians 12? It explains "spiritual gifts". That there are diversities of "gifts" but the same Spirit. All unique members in the one body of Christ.
To try and move this to a higher level. What does speaking in "tongues" do for the Will of God? So your praise or prayer to the Lord is more important that my prayers? Because you don't know what your speaking but God does? I pray, praise, and give thanks from the heart as a loving child. If you have zeal for tongues, ok. I have zeal to follow Jesus Christ and do the Will of our Father in Heaven.
If you want to tell me I have not received the Holy Ghost because I don't speak in "tongues" know this. You do not know who you are posting to. You shall have to give account for your own words. Be careful.
God Bless you.
In every instance when a Christian received the gift of the Holy Ghost after the New Testament began in the book of Acts (the first Church), it was always accompanied with speaking in another tongue (Samaritans: Acts 8:16-18 , Gentiles- Acts 10:46, Jews- Acts 19:1-6).
This is the proof or earnest (token) of a Christian's inheritance ( Ephesians 1:14).
This was prophesied by the prophet Isaiah
11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.
With all due respect, a Christian does not receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and is not sealed thereby the moment they believe as many lying pastors/theologians teach (along with other false doctrines like the "trinity" "once saved always saved" "purgatory" etc). Likewise a feeling of peace is not evidence you have received the Holy Ghost. While I do agree there are many that speak false tongues in emulation (primarily in the "Pentecostal/Apostolic" businesses), that does not invalidate the real thing.
May I ask you Richard (in Christ), have you been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins ( Gal. 3:27)?
Sincerely,
Andrew
I was just getting ready to post a reply but I see no need to add anything to what you just said. Amen!
I think many people are being ruined today by this teaching. My personal belief is that the "tongues" that are being taught today are not the tongues of the bible!
Just to reply on one of your statements. As living proof(myself) you do not need to speak in "unknown tongues" to know you have received the Holy Ghost. The second detail, about receiving the Holy Ghost, you stated is much more accurate and important than the first about "unknown tongues". Helping us to repent from sins of the flesh and follow the Lord walking after the Spirit.
In Acts 2 you will see it is stated "other tongues" and the people who surrounded the building understood them speaking in "our own tongues"(or their own native language). Which means it was not "unknown" babble. Also in ( 1 Corinthians 12 as it just being a specific Gift of the Holy Ghost. That not everyone receives who has the Holy Ghost. Then in ( 1 Corinthians 14 it states if "there be no interpreter" to keep silent in the church with your "tongue" gift.
It just saddens me to see some people state that you have to speak in "tongues" to know you have the Holy Ghost which is a false teaching.
Not knowing if that is what you preach. Hopefully I will receive a reply and thank you for your time.
God Bless.