Discuss Matthew 20 Page 2

My Dear Brother:

"So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen." Matthew 20:16 KJV

"Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:" Romans 1:6 KJV

Grace and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Hi Roman.

Thanks for replying.

I've moved this conversation to a new thread since the other is a week old, And off topic.

You stated:

"Spencer, Jesus said 2 commandments are most important, above all. If I follow the commandments, I will be OK at that. I don't need to dissect a butterfly to see how it flies. My impression is that everyone good and bad make it to the promised land, the tainted spirits we wear will be made whole so we haven't the capacity to sin. Even though it's dangled in our faces, the lake of fire is only for the 3 evil spirits, and no one else. Too much speculation and fuss is made over what will never be known and confirmed from the hear and now. Anything that occurs past the 7th trumpet is beyond our scope, beyond our comprehension, and out of this world. For all we know, our salvation comes from being thrown back into the universe as dust particles, into a new realm.

I don't think about my salvation, I don't worry about it, because it's not mine to entertain, but God's.

My personal salvation is rooted in selfishness that I could be good enough to make the grade.

I seek truth well before salvation. I was never a fanatic for life, so I look forward to death, the charade over. I wouldn't mind being blotted out as if I never existed, no record, that would be fine with me, too. I will have to wait and see what the Lord has in store for me.' End quote.

Roman if I had that mindset there wouldn't be any need to witness.

Roman you said you believe the lake of fire was only for the 3 evil spirits. here's their fate. Revelation 20:10.

But in this same chapter here's

mention of the lost suffering the same fate!! Revelation 20:15.

Here's a few of many scriptures I believe.

We've all sinned and come up short.

Romans 3:22-25.

The payment/Blood sacrfice.

Matthew 20:28.

Hebrews 9:26.

Conclusion.

John 6:28-29.

John 3:16-17.

Romans 10:9.

1 Corinthians 15:1-4.

Thanks and God bless you Roman.

Perhaps later.

God bless.

(1) His miraculous birth was prophesied 800 years before His coming: "Behold a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Emmanuel" ( Isaiah 7:14, KJV).

(2) The prophecy was fulfilled to the letter. "Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favor with God. And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus" ( Luke 1:30, 31, KJV).

(3) Jesus demonstrated human characteristics: He became tired ( John 4:6). He thirsted ( John 19:28), He ate food ( Luke 24:40-43), He showed feelings ( Mark 6:34), He wept ( John 11:35), He knew temptation ( Hebrews 4:15), and He died ( John 19:30).

Jesus Christ Accomplished the Works of His Father:

(1) He died on the Cross. This is the fundamental theme of the Gospel.

The fact of His death-One-fourth of the Gospels are dedicated to His Passion and Resurrection. (a) For this purpose He came into the world ( John 12:27). (b) His death was prophesied hundreds of years before He came ( Isaiah 53:3-8).

The meaning of His death. (a) It was a ransom for sin ( Matthew 20:28; Romans 3:24; 1 Peter 1:18). (b) It was to pay the penalty for sin ( Romans 3:24; 1 John 2:2; 4:10). Man is the object of God's wrath because of rebellion and sin, but God took the initiative in satisfying His wrath by sending His own Son to Calvary. (c) It is a reconciliation. The enmity between us and God has ended ( Romans 5:10), and we are restored to God ( 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19). (d) It is a substitution: He died in our place ( 1 Peter 3:18; 2 Corinthians 5:21). (e) In summary, the matter of sin has been completely dealt with ( 1 Peter 2:24; Hebrews 9:26; Hebrews 10:12).

(2) He was resurrected from the dead: This is unique and fundamental to Christianity.

The reality of the Resurrection ( John 20:1-10; 1 Corinthians 15:4).

The credibility of the Resurrection: (a) Jesus predicted it: Matthew 13:39-41; Luke 24:1-7. (b) The tomb was empty: John 20:11-13. (c) Many witnesses saw Him alive: the women ( Luke 23:55, 56); Mary Magdalene

Hebrews 6:13-20

A person put over someone elses property, affairs, upkeep etc. Trusted with but belonging to another. Here are biblical examples. Genesis 1:26-30, Romans 14:12, In the Church: Hebrews 13:17, Titus 1:7,

Genesis 15:2, Gen 43:19,

Luke 16:1-15, Matthew 20:1-16, Luke 12:36-48,

Prophetic parable about Jesus & the religious Rulers of the time: Matthew 21:28-46, Luke 20:9-20, 'husbandman being "stewad" of the vineyard'

Hopefully these are helpful.

Hey Jcbu, Chris, and GiGi,

The apostles did not deny or abandon Jesus they were confused, scared, shocked. They believed Jesus was the Messiah and the Son of God, they did not doubt that. Even though Jesus told them several times, Jesus being arrested, crucified, buried, and resurrected, Matthew 17:22-23, Matthew 20:18-19 John 20:9, and more. It was hidden from them. Luke 18:32-34. When He was arrested, crucified, and buried in a tomb they were in shock.

During the time they were with Jesus they thought He was going to set up the kingdom then. They even asked Him before He ascended if He was going to set up the kingdom, Acts 1:6. When He was killed, they did not know what to do, the Messiah, Jesus the Son of God was supposed to set up the kingdom, now He is dead. For three days they mourned and cried not knowing what they would do now.

Then Jesus told them when He met and ate with them and opened their eyes where they would understand, Luke 24:44-47. The purpose of His death and resurrection was hidden from them and Satan. Things was held from them and much they did not remember as Jesus told them in John 14:26.

We think about all the apostles were told and being with Jesus for 3.5 years how we would act if we were there. It is not that simple, as John wrote if everything that Jesus said was written down the world could not hold it, John 22:25.

They never lost their faith they were just in shock for three days and as we see 120 of the disciples were together at Pentecost,

God bless,

RLW

Alan F. Portelli,

I appreciate your exactness. I have understood it to mean what you've stated. With emphasis on "few''. With a cross reference to Matthew 22:14. Matthew 20:16, Numbers 26:54, Luke 13:23-24, Matthew 7:14,22,23,

Romans 5:19 with "many" referred to in like manner: because scripture says 'all' Romans 3:23,

Romans 2:12,

Perhaps the word "many" is used to help us understand the magnitude of people and striking contrast to the emphasis on the word "few" as opposed to a translation of "all" would it seem impossible or less significant per the reader?

Hopefully this is helpful.

Matthew 20:23 answers your question quite plainly, God the Father has prepared a seat on His right hand for His Son Jesus,

Matthew 20:23 "And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father."

Mark 10:40 "But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared."

Mark 16:19 "So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God."

Luke 12:32 "Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom."

Luke 22:24-30 "And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;" "That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel."

Thank you!

Matthew 10:29-34,

Revelation 8:8-9, Hosea 4:1-19, vrs. 3, 2 Esdras 5:1-13,

Where in the Bible did Jesus say that the birds will fall from the sky and all the fish would die?

Thank you..

Sister Sacha, Christ is going to stand on this earth in GLORIFIED FLESH. The Saints also who have been CREATED in the IMAGE of CHRIST, with the same GLORIFIED FLESH, as Christ are going to stand with Him, and together they (being made ONE, same BODY and same MIND) are going to JUDGE THE EARTH IN RIGHTEOUSNESS ( Isaiah 26:9).

Luke 24:9 Behold my hands and my feet, that it (glorified flesh) IS I MYSELF: handle me, and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as you see me have.

1 Corinthians 15:39-41 ALL FLESH is not the SAME FLESH .....one celestial and one terrestrial .....

This is hard to wrap our minds around, Christ has a body that can exist IN MAN, or stand in the presents of man.

It's even harder to wrap our minds around the fact that we ALSO are going to have this SAME BODY.

This is what the thousand year reign with Christ is all about. The thousand years are not LITERALLY ONE THOUSAND YEARS, but one day (DAY OF THE LORD which has been happening now for two thousand years) is as a thousand years and a thousand years as on day ( 2 Peter 3:8).

Matthew 20:1-16 Christ went out at the first of the day (of the Lord) to call workers to his vineyard.

This would apply to all those that were apostles and received the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.

When they departed their terrestrial bodies they were given celestial bodies and they are still working in God's vineyard ( Revelation 10:11)( John 1:51)( Genesis 28:12).

Psalms 103:20 Bless the Lord, ye his angels ...

Psalms 104:4 Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

Luke 20:36 ...neither can the die anymore, for they are equal to the angels ...

For the last two thousand years (one day, God has been calling workers to work in God's vineyard vineyard; first in a terrestrial body and then in a celestial body.

You are a worker NOW in a terrestrial body; when you DEPART your terrestrial body, you will NEVER SEE DEATH, but CONTINUE being a worker in your CELESTIAL BODY. ( Revelation 20:6)

Hello Dwight. It was James & his brother John, whom the Lord referred to as "The sons of thunder" ( Mark 3:17).

We can't be too clear on why the Lord spoke of them in this way, but it might refer to their fiery zeal, as seen for example, in their wish to call down fire from heaven on the Samaritans ( Luke 9:54), and John's proactive stance to stop the work of one who cast out devils ( Luke 9:49), or even the prayer of their mother that her sons might sit on the Lord's right & left hand in His kingdom ( Matthew 20:21); maybe this wilfulness, boldness, & zeal ran in that family. Pure speculation of course.

Ed on Hebrews 9

How do you get to heaven?

You are replying to a comment by "Ed"

Heaven:

Matthew 22:14

Revelation 14:3 144,000 (only taken from the earth Matthew 20:23)

1 Corinthians 15:42-44

Revelation 20 (Only one can be president and only a few

can be co-rulers. when Jehovah/ Psalm 83:18 choses a person...no one can steal that

away (not family, friends or acquaintances etc.). only that person can decide if they want to receive the invitation of reject it. Mark 10:17-31)

Earth: Isa. 45:18

2 Peter 3:13

Psalm 37:9-11,29,34

John 5:28,29

Revelation 21:3-5

Luke 23:42, 43 (Earth will be a paradise again

just like the days of genesis 1,2)

Matthew 11:26-30 (Jesus will comfort those remaining on earth)

Hope this helps

Hello Thas. No, Jesus didn't lie when He said that only His Father knew of the time of His second appearing. Even though the Word doesn't specifically talk about this subject, i.e. how could a Divine Being come to Earth & not have all His Divine Powers still in His possession, the Scriptures do amply show us of Jesus' Divinity ( John 1:1-14; John 17:4,5; John 6:38 & many more) & Jesus' Mission on Earth ( Matthew 20:28; John 3:16; etc.).

However, Philippians 2:5-8 gives us vital information: "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross." The key word here (for the purposes of your question), is "reputation". In the original Greek, this word is "ekenosen" (from the word, kenosis), which means 'to empty'. So, if Jesus made "Himself of no reputation", the meaning is that 'He emptied Himself' of what He had in His Deity, for the sake of becoming a man, indeed, one of 'servitude' to both God & man, so as to die on a Cross.

We know that Jesus continued to have Divine Powers (of healing, raising the dead, knowing the thoughts of others, etc.), but there were also certain limitations that He placed on Himself while He was in the flesh on Earth and to be in subjection to His Father (by virtue of His Humanity). The one you quoted is a good example, as also Mark 5:25-32; Luke 4:1 (led of the Spirit). We can then understand that Jesus' coming was also to reveal the Glory of God ( John 1:18) & that to do so, His Own Glory had to be veiled. Therefore, we cannot know why Jesus didn't know the time of His second coming to Earth, except to understand that in His Humanity this knowledge was kept aside - but in Heaven now, He has all His Divine Attributes restored.

Elaine,

The HOLY SPIRIT revealed to me, one day after sometime pondering, that it was: Jesus

That was the Kingdom representation on earth, that suffered violence

& the Violent took Him by force, was it also Prophetic to what was about to happen to Him? & other people that belong to the Kingdom of Heaven? Also the Prophets that suffered violence previously.

John 10:30 -31

Mark 1:4

Matthew 4:17

Luke 17:21

Luke 17:25

Mark 14:46

Mark 14:48 -49

John 18:19

Matthew 20:19

Luke 13:34

Revelation 6:9 -11

Matthew 20:20-23

Mark 10:36-40

Revelation 4 - 5 = Chapters 4 & 5

Additional scripture about references to the left of Christ

Matthew 25:31-46

Isaiah 41:10

Hopefully that helps, your seeking answers

Artie, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

Christ HAS BEEN setting up HIS KINGDOM for the past two thousand years. The CHOSEN that have gone before us have been off the earth (delivered form their bodies of flesh into Christ's immortal body) and reigning and judging with Christ as messengers of SPIRIT.

Study the PARABLE of the workers (spiritual messengers) SENT to work in Spirits vineyard (CREATION).

Matthew 20:1-16

The DAY (TODAY, has been happening for two thousand years) of the LORD (second coming of (the SPIRIT of) CHRIST has been happening for two thousand years. Some workers (spiritual messengers) were SENT the first hour of the day: for example; the apostles that FIRST DIED IN CHRIST (and BORN AGAIN in Truth), afterwards other workers (spiritual messengers) that DIE IN CHRIST were rewarded with the immortal body of Christ to WORK in the vineyard (the garden) of God. This thousand year reign (this ONE DAY; the DAY of the LORD) will continue UNTIL the resurrection to JUDGEMENT occurs.

Hebrews 12:22-23

Thanks brother Philip, for those great additions to my understanding. As I read it over, my thoughts went to both our Lord & also to the Apostle Peter who brought out warnings about correct leadership of Christ's Church: Matthew 20:25-28 & 1 Peter 5:2,3. Those, of whom the early Church congregations were warned, certainly disregarded this great example of humility, leadership, & being a pattern to emulate. But aren't those the qualities that any leader, within or without the Church, should embrace & exercise? Thank you again & every blessing in your labours.

Wesley Benard - I agree that JESUS is the only BEGOTTEN SON of God.

Matthew 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?

Matthew 20:20 Then came to him the mother of Zebedee's children with her sons, worshipping him, and desiring a certain thing of him.

21 And he said unto her, What wilt thou? She saith unto him, Grant that these my two sons may sit, the one on thy right hand, and the other on the left, in thy kingdom.

22 But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto him, We are able.

23 And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine (Jesus said) to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father.

LEON,

I looked over your work, and you are stretching the story to fit your narrative that keep coming back around to Moses and Elijah. They are not the 2 witnesses. Matthew 20:21-20:23 is reaching to think those seats are for two people, when the witness are the 144k. There's no point going any further when you are married to your personal doctrine. ( Matthew 15:7-9) You didn't listen to what I said about who they are. I will not accept fairy tales, bogus doctrine.

Sissy, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

You will get two schools of thought on what happens to us at the death of our body of flesh.

I DON'T BELIEVE in a general rapture of the church; I BELIEVE we are gathered ONE BY ONE.

Isaiah 27:12

Matthew 24:40

I BELIEVE each believer is given HIS REWARD at the death of our body of flesh.

Our REWARD is ETERNAL LIFE and a BODY LIKE CHRIST. We become the IMAGE of Christ.

Colossians 1:15

Colossians 3:10

Romans 8:29

Every believer will receive the SAME REWARD; but different GLORIES.

Matthew 20:1-16

Romans 2:11

1 Corinthians 15:41

I BELIEVE when we leave our bodies of flesh we begin ruling and judging with Christ in the Kingdom of God.

Revelation 20:4

Obadiah 1:21

GBU

Matthew 20:28. Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

Matthew 28:19-20. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

JESUS COMMANDED HIS DISCIPLES TO GO OUT AND SHARE THE GOSPEL, AND THEY DID!

IT WAS IMPORTANT ENOUGH FOR THEM TO DIE FOR.

Today it is the least interesting topic of scripture.

John 3:14-16. And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 10:9. That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Acts 16:30-31. And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

1 Corinthians 15:3-4. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

John 12:24 . Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.



John 10:1. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

Let us not treat the gospel like a history book,

And Let's understand the necessity of it.

God bless

Hi Drama,

I very much like this post as I agree.

In reality why we are not to condemn others who may be against us today or living in deep sin/evil etc. Obviously we are to judge righteously in what is right and wrong. Make known these things though to try and save that person from their sin in where it may lead them. Not to condemn them as only God knows the exact time for every person, that is His, and there is a reason for it that we may not be able to understand. God knows everyone better than we know ourselves.

As said we are only able to plant or water though it is God that gives the growth. 1 Corinthians 3:7-8.

In this life it is truly not easy to see other people, even in your own family, that don't seem to listen to our words even though we are only spreading God's Word for their good. Though as two of the fruits of the Holy Spirit are patience and longsuffering as in the end of Galatians.

Even looking at Paul who condemned and murdered followers of Christ though he turned out to be the one who wrote most of the epistles in the NT. As you stated that some may be with the Lord from their childhood and some may accept the Lord when they are at the end of their life. Connecting to Matthew 20:16.

As there are some who never accept the Lord and, even more saddening is, people who were with the Lord then reject Him and go back to the world.

Stay close to the Lord, put all your trust in Him, and pray fervently without ceasing.

God Bless.

Hi Christine,

You stated "Christ died to change the world"

The scripture doesn't say Christ came to "change" the world. He came so those who receive him might have life, and that's "EVERLASTING LIFE" and fellowship with the Father.

Now he put his Spirit in us/ believers and the Holyspirit spirit changes us, ( providing his Spirit dwells in us ).

Here's just a few of many scriptures:

1 John 2:2. And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Matthew 20:28. Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

1 Timothy 2:5-6. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Maybe there's others who would like to elaborate.

God bless you.

I want to understand Matthew 20 please explain it for me.

PG 1.

Lets start with Hebrews 6:4-6 with the view you can loose your salvation.

4: For it is ""impossible"" for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

5: And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

6: If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

That sounds like they're saved right? Right.

So if you read that verse carefully with the mind you can loose your salvation "you got one shot at it!!" ( For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened....) ( If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance;...)

You can take this passage and say if you were saved and some how stumbled "a small lie, got angry, ect.." it is impossible to renew you to repentance!! your forever Lost!! Read it again with the view you can loose your salvation.

That does not sound right so now take the passage with the view you cant loose your salvation and say these people was not really saved, "The Calvinist view"

It seems they suffer the same fate! Whether professors or not 'they were once enlightened'.

It is "Impossible" ( for those who were once ""enlightened,"" and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance;...)

The unsaved premise seems to also fails. they also got one shot!

I believe the writer is writing to believers, he addresses them that way in Ch 3:1. "Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling",

I don't think this is talking about salvation at all, it don't say renew them again to salvation, it say repentance. The writer is writing to the Hebrews and urging them to maturity, the burden of the writer is not to return to Judaism. Legalism, them becoming fruitless

This is a repost to the 2 links that I pasted, Something went terribly wrong!!

Isaiah 32:12-13. They shall lament for the teats, for the pleasant fields, for the fruitful vine.

Upon the land of my people shall come up thorns and briers; yea, upon all the houses of joy in the joyous city:

"PARRELLELS WITH HEBREWS 6:8".

HERE'S THE 2ND

1 Corinthians 3:12-15 (KJV) Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

PG 2.

Lets revisit the text starting from-

Hebrews 5:11-14. Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.

For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.

But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Paul is urging them towards maturity.

Now lets take up Hebrews 6:7-9.

For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

Verse 8: But that which ""beareth thorns and briers"" is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

THE KEY IS IN VERSE 9.

Verse 9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and ( things that accompany salvation,) though we thus speak. WHAT ACCOMPANIES SALVATION? FRUIT AND REWARDS.

Verse 8 parallels with

Isaiah 5:6-7. And I will lay it waste: it shall not be pruned, nor digged; but there shall come up briers and thorns: I will also command the clouds that they rain no rain upon it.

For the vineyard of the LORD of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for judgment, but behold oppression; for righteousness, but behold a cry.

Also. Link

You see the whole concept here. Link

You see these verses can not be about salvation, if so we're all in trouble.

Its about what accompany salvation.

I hope that helps.

What does this passage mean exactly? I know Jesus spoke often (Especially to His Disciples) in parables. What's the reference?

"Whoever Does Unto The Least Of These Does Unto Me."

Matthew 20:20-28 KJV