Discuss Matthew 24 Page 13

The modern rapture doctrine was never taught by the early church. Study John Nelson Darby and a Scotish girl named 'MacDonald' from whom this theory emerged.

Let us consider these verses in the KJV of Matthew 24:

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

AFTER the tribulation of those days........the angel GATHER TOGETHER THE ELECT!!!!!

Corrie Ten Boom's whole ministry that the Lord gave her was to warn Christians of the coming tribulation. She herself knew much about tribulation, having lost her whole family in a concentration camp! On one of her ministry trips, she was in China; Christians there told her about how American missionaries lied to them, and said they'd never have to go through tribulation, assuring the Chinese believers that before suffering-- they'd be raptured away. Then came Mao's tyranny - and Christians suffered horribly! Worse yet, many stumbled in faith because they were NOT raptured!! They thought that Jesus had 'let them down'!!!! What a dangerous doctrine!!

Christians in so many places today go through great and fiery tribulation, and experience hunger, cold, thirst, imprisonment, torture and death. We dare not ignore that, lest we stumble as well!! We must have our loins girt, and seeking the Lord now to have grace and strength to endure! He who ENDURES to the end shall be saved! Amen!

Blessings to one and all....

Hey Tom,

This is my understanding; All Israel was looking for the Messiah when He first came to deliver Israel from all oppressors and lead them into a new golden age. We see this as the question the disciples asked Jesus in Matthew 24:3. Jesus' purpose of His first coming was hidden from them, even the Apostles and John, Luke 18:31-34. They even asked Jesus right before He ascended, if He was going to set up the kingdom then, Acts 1:6.

We see how distraught all were when Jesus was crucified and they did not even believe Mary when she told them He had resurrected, Mark 16:10-14. They were confused and had doubts because they were looking for Him to set up the kingdom then. John probably had these same thoughts when he saw what Jesus was doing because it didn't look like Jesus was moving to deliver the people from the Roman rule and set up the kingdom.

No one could know, because Satan could not know this part of God's plan, it was still a mystery.

Just my understanding

God bless,

RLW

Matthew 24:35, Psalm 12:6-7, John 6:63, Psalm 119:89,

1 Peter 1:23-25, Proverbs 30:5, Luke 4:4, Acts 19:20, Romans 10:17,

John 1:1-3, Revelation 19:11-16.

We can look to most congregations today that were holding to basic Bible doctrines a century ago that now abandoning basic truths on the literal descriptions of hell; embracing New Age concepts or doctrines of demons causing manifestations (such as the "Toronto blessing" and Pensacola revival; etc. We are seeing a divorce rate the same as the world; remarriages (which all the early church fathers were against if a spouse was still living up to Erasmus); bringing women into positions of authority against scripture; evolution ascribed as truth; acceptance of deviant sexual practices clearly spoken against in Romans 1 and other scriptures; and basically the "love of many will grow cold." ( Matthew 24:12). This could be what the lukewarmness of the Laodiceans represents in Revelation. The characteristics in 2 Tim. 3:2 of the last days fits in; as well as the admonition that God is going to judge the church first ( 1 Peter 4:17). When Christ comes (the Rapture or perhaps the second coming); He states "will He find faith on the earth" ( Luke 18:8).

Whether some are left behind is another matter; but we are told that we should be praying always to be worthy to escape in Luke; and Rev. 3:10 states that that church will miss the hour of trial to come on the whole earth (i.e. the Tribulation).

Another issue today is that we don't want o preach that repentance in necessary for a genuine conversion. We also assume that sin can be taken lightly since Christ forgave all our sins at the cross. If He lives within us; we can no longer be content with sin; and if we are not being chastised then scripture says we are "bastards" (KJV). We are not teaching that all who are godly in Christ are going to suffer persecution; or there is some anomaly with all these big time preachers. "That which is honorable to men is an abomination to God." ( Luke 16:15). I may be off on the wording; but we need to be separate from the world and not laud their approval.

Hi dear, "WHO IS THE COUNTRY UKRAINE IN BIBLE PROPHECY?" Hint: Look at Russia.

Matthew 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

He wants to give us an understanding of the Truth, my advice is that you read for yourself. But watch and pray for the time is soon when Jesus comes.

Hi Mary!

I hope this will help.

1. Act 1:9-11. It tells us Jesus will return the same way he left.

2. Go to 1 these 4:14-18

Here it decribes how you will know Jesus when he comes. The most important part is we will met him in the skies. Jesus will NOT touch the earth. It is very plain on that.

Got to Matthew 24:29-31. Also here it tells us he does not come in secret. When he comes the trumpets of God will blow and shouts from heaven. His Angels will come to Earth.

Go to 1 corin 15:51-52

John 14:1-11 this should also help. As long as you seek for Jesus's truth he will always show you the way.

God bless my friend hope this helps. If you need more please let me know. Thanks.

Elect; chosen, Isaiah 42:1, 2Timothy 2:10, Isaiah 45:4, Titus 1:1, Matthew 24:22, Isaiah 65:9, 1st CHRIST Jesus, then His followers Romans 11:7,

Election ; 2Peter 1:10,

1Corinthians 12,

Hopefully these are helpful,

Though I didn't fully understand what you were asking

Hey Philip Murray,

I agree there is not any scripture that states at any time anyone goes to heaven. And Jesus is the only one who has gone to heaven from where He came John 3:13. Scriptures have been used to create a beautiful picture with the premise of not having to go through the tribulation that is coming but will be taken to heaven, adding a return of Jesus before His second coming.

There are several names Morgan Edwards, Edward Irving, a teenage girl in the lowlands of Scotland named Margaret MacDonald, and more, but spread by John Darby, and C.I. Scofield with the study bible with footnotes helped promote the doctrine. This is a deception I feel that Satan is behind, for those who are still living at the end (my opinion).

Where is in the air? Is it heaven? In Strong's 109 air (The air, lower air we breathe). In Strong's 3772 air Heavens, the visible heavens, the atmosphere, the sky, the starry heavens, the spiritual heavens. The word air 109 was used in 1Thessalonians 4:17 and seems as it says, it's no higher than the clouds. Now, this is a gathering in the air-breathing sky. Jesus will reign on this earth and also the elect, Revelation 11:15 2 Thimothy 2:12 Revelation 5:10 on earth not in heaven and on the new earth Revelation 21:1 Revelation 22:1-5.

No scripture says we are taken up to heaven after we meet Jesus but there is the scripture that says where Jesus goes when He returns. On that day His feet will stand Zechariah 14:4, He will send His angels to gather the elect, after the tribulation, Matthew 24:29-31 Mark 13:24-27. The earth is round, and the elect will be global when gathered will be in the air going to meet Jesus.

I could say more but it is up to us individually to pray and study for the understanding what is the truth led by the Holy Spirit. Consider the context when you study.

God bless,

RLW

Matthew 24:36, Matthew 24:3-51, in context

Hopefully this is helpful

hopefully this is what you're asking for, but there is also a few more you will find throughout the NT.

Matthew 24:27 "For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."

Matthew 26:64 "Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven."

Mark 14:62 "And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven."

Revelation 1:7 "Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen."

Acts 1:9-11, "Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven."

kingjamesbibleonline.org (no spaces)

I like this ..but other bibles have same address how do I find this one every time

Hey Jamie,

My understanding is, this is the deception of deceptions and will cause the great falling away, 2 Thessalonians 2:3. Part of this deception is that the great tribulation and the wrath of God are taught as being the same thing. We must understand the wrath of God comes after the second coming of Jesus not before. Matthew 24:29-31 Mark 13:24-27.

It developed in the 17th Century, and it quickly led to an understanding that the rapture of the church would be an event separate from and before the second coming of Christ. It was made popular by John Darby, and he is thought by many to be the originator but not. C.I. Scofield, with the study bible with footnotes, helped promote this doctrine of man. It started as pre-tribulation and still mostly believed in.

We as humans sometimes look for the easy way out, and many preachers oblige to fill the money plate that makes merchandise of people, 2 Peter 2:3. Scripture does not say we will be spared tribulation it says the opposite, Acts 14:22 John 16:33. It is debated that although all Christians go through some tribulation, there is yet a great tribulation to come those true believers will not have to undergo. So, who are these, Revelation 7:13-14 Revelation 20:4

Revelation 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

The mark and saving our physical life is the temptation, that so many don't believe they will be here to face, that is the great deception. Keep from does not mean we will be spared from being killed it means to spiritually guard (watch), keep intact, Hebrews 3:6. The believers in Jesus in the past were not spared being beheaded, burnt on a stake, fed to the lions, why should we.

God bless,

RLW

Yes ! They want smooth words instead of the Truth . For me it's just laziness , if you want to know the Truth , I mean really know it in capital letters , then you must read it for yourself . God's plan of salvation for us in Christ is actually quite simple , the rest is meat and drink to our hungry souls as we wait for the Kingdom , when I read the whole Bible it's strengthens me so much to see how God is in charge . He leaves nothing to chance and He knows each and everyone of us intimately , we don't need to be afraid in these dark times , as Jesus said , even the very hairs on each of our heads is numbered .The more we read the closer we feel to Him and our hearts are strengthened and our faith flourishes within us so that we can withstand anything this world throws at us , even our own deaths if we have to . Be not soon shaken ! Christ is coming ! For you !

Because they are wrong, and have been wrong for centuries. The Lord has kept them in the dark because they preach their opinion over what was written.

There is nothing worse that a foolish preacher. If you witness this, challenge it, and stop it before it grows.

Possibly out of tradition.

In these several years of difficulty personally longer & even for " traditional American churches" it has given many of us opportunity to look deeper into scripture, understanding & " tradition " within the fellowships & to ask why, are they doing this, & that. I hope, pray & believe through these trials a better, more biblical, believing Church will come forth.

Why do preachers preach that the church will be gone during tribulation when the bible does not say that.

Why do most of the people who believe the truth about salvation, use the King James only?

Could it really be God's only true word in English?

Possibly the "North" "Kingdoms" mentioned in Jeremiah, Isaiah, however that could have been Germany Jeremiah 23:8,

Some say Gog, Magog.

It may be symbolic of "Bear" Revelation 13:2,

* Matthew 24:6,

Matthew 24:6

The next prophetic event which will & can occur at anytime is the coming of the LORD Jesus in the clouds ( Mark 14:62), 1 Thessalonians 4:14-18. In Act 26:8 Paul ask King Agrippa why we would think it an incredible thing that God should raising the Dead. When Jesus Christ come the the earth he will bring with him the dead in Christ and they will be united with their resurrected bodies a body like unto his (Jesus's) resurrected body Philippians 3:21. We (saved) who are alive and remain shall be caught up into the clouds with the resurrected dead, and so shall we be with the LORD forever, 1 Thessalonians 4:17. When? In such an hour as ye think not Matthew 24:44.

Please read Revelation 9, 10, Daniel 7, Matthew 24:3-51, Mark 13:5-37, Matthew 25:31-46, 2Timothy 2:3, 1 Thessalonians 4, 2Thessalonians 2

1Thessalonians 4:17,

Please read: Daniel 7, Zephaniah 1:15, Zephaniah 1,

* Matthew 24:29-30, "After the tribulation" Matthew 24:3-51, Matthew 24:21,22, Matthew 26:64, Mark 13:5-37, * note Mark 13:23-27, Mark 13:19 first, Mark 14:62, Revelation 1:5-8, these all seem to be the same event; 1Corinthians 15:52, context: 1Corinthians 15:20-58, Revelation 9, has the six prior trumpet blasts then Revelation 10, also lining up with prior noted scripture of the last trumpet: Revelation 10:7, & Revelation 10:6, Revelation 10:1, Matthew 25:31-46, seems to be the end, beginning of judgement. Psalms 9:7,

2Timothy 4:3,

2Timothy 2:3, Matthew 24:13, Mark 13:13,

Hope this is helpful

Mary Ann Knight,

You ever notice after a wedding difference people will focus details on certain aspects of things? Sometimes it's things that you yourself didn't notice or didn't seem as significant as something else. Some talk about the cake, another about the people that attended, another can't get over how white the dress was, others saw the doves released.

There's also differences in personalities It may be one of reasons that Jesus chose the varying difference in people that wrote the Gospels. Knowing each would have a unique perspective & emphasis on different details.

Matthew speaks much about angels, major significant events pertaining angels. Matthew 4:6,11, Matthew 13:39,41,49, Matthew 18:10, Matthew 22:30, Matthew 24:31,36, Matthew 25:31-46, Matthew 26:53, in context: Matthew 26,

Mark 1:13, Mark 8:38, these following 3 Matthew & Mark both discuss: Mark 12:25, Mark 13:27,32,

Luke has emphasise on several events others do not mention: Luke 1, Luke 2, but, like Matthew & Mark mention Luke 4:10,

Luke 9:26, mentioned by atleast 1 other. Luke 12:8,9,

You asked also if the others were present or witnessed the angels, it looks like Luke 24:23, testifies to that question. & John 20:12, testifies to angels being present.

John also notes John 20:30-31, John 21:25,

Hopefully this is helpful

Jesus spoke of Matthew 24 and Luke 21 of events that would be happening; likened to a woman's birth pains.

Matthew 24:8 - All these are the beginning of sorrows. (Birth pains)

1 Thessalonians 5:3 - For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

These events on earth will happen simultaneously, and occur more frequently toward the end. It's good to keep an eye on the news, disasters around the earth, and events happening in Israel concerning the building of the third Temple.

The world will move towards One World Economy, One World Religion, One World Government.

They'll prepare people to receive the Mark of the Beast.

Don't freak out because that mark is in the Right Hand or The Forehead. A vaccination in the arm is NOT the Beast mark. Pandemics and Pestilence are one of the signs.

While world leaders are working out the details, we need to strengthen our closeness with the Lord. We could store food, water and meds now (at cheaper prices) than a year from now. Give Bibles to people who do not have one.

(Originally posted under wrong verse, should be Hebrews 11:5-7)

Enoch

Genesis 5:21-22

Hebrews 11:5-6

Jude 1:14-15

Noah

Genesis 6:1 through Genesis 9:29

Matthew 24:37-39

Luke 17:26-30

Hebrews 11:7

1 Peter 3:19-20

2 Peter 2:5

2 Peter 3:3-7

Whether or not a person acknowledges it, Enoch and Noah are fathers to every man, woman and child living today. However, without saving faith they will only be fathers according to the flesh to our generation. That genetic relationship will be undeniably proven before God, but it will not only profit us nothing, it will actually make anyone in our generation more guilty than the people in theirs if they mock or ignore the testimony concerning them in these last days without repenting and believing in Jesus Christ as they did. We need to carefully consider and draw both encouragement and warning from their examples of faith if we want to share any of the benefits of the heritage they have left us.

Jesus Christ is the one who will catch us up to be with Him, like He did Enoch, if we are confirmed by the Holy Spirit to be those who please Him and His Father. He is also the unexpected Bridegroom who will close the wedding feast door that lets in the prepared wise virgins but shuts out the unprepared foolish virgins where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth, like He closed the door of the Ark that Noah prepared behind him and his household, shutting out those who were unprepared outside.

Although no one should count on it, if in His grace the Father continues to patiently wait beyond our short lives to send Christ with His holy angels for the final harvest, we still must hold to the fear of the LORD we see in these two ancestors of ours and uphold their testimony so that we may be partakers with them in the pleasure the Father has in their faith and the faith of all those mentioned in this chapter of Hebrews. That is one of the ways we will be able to add our own testimony of faith to theirs.

Hi Sister Laura,

Thanks for your response, as well the reminder of the great sacrifice that Christ made for ALL OF US! Amen

I agree, It does seem that the "end times" are fast approaching, the events taking place are his signs to His people, even so, we must be ready for our Savior!

Matthew 24:32-33

"Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors."

God Bless

2 Thessalonians 2:3 = Matthew 24:15

Ronald,

You talk my language, we share the same interpretations. I told you a while ago that Christ had the first 1/2 of the week, and anti-christ had the second 1/2 of the week. The seven years prophesy is spread out over 2,000 years. That made sense to you, so instead of sticking to your own idea, you adopted it.

5th trumpet: ( Revelation 9:1-11) was 9-11-01. It was the US army that came out of the smoke like locusts to kill those without the seal of God in their foreheads (Muslim's). The US army didn't hurt any tree or green thing because the dessert has none (vs 4). The war on terror is over, troops are withdrawing ( Isaiah 33:1). We are awaiting the 6th seal, watching Revelation 17 simultaneously play out.

6th seal: ( Revelation 6:14) I see US/Israel attacking Iran's nuclear facility, a nuclear reaction, moving mountains. Scroll = mushroom cloud. Iran is the only recognized nuclear power in the ME, Israel's arch enemy, they have been talking about bombing Iran for 40 years, and they are always 6 months away, so the claim has merit.

Then, after a waiting period, there is a calm, a day with blue skies, and then the beast Russia strikes ( Jeremiah 15:7-9), changing the world forever. This is the day of the Lord ( Ezekiel 21). In the self-same hour that Babylon is taken. the earthquake opens up Israel to the beast invasion ( Revelation 6:12). This scripture is telling ( Luke 21:20-24) when Israel is attacked, where is the US to defend them? The US received ( Matthew 24:15). The beast, and his false prophet, China, will rule the world, fight bitterly, and eventually succumb to Christ Jesus at the last trumpet.

If we are in the end-times, shouldn't these prophesies manifest themselves before our eyes? Shouldn't they make themselves known? Yes, to those with understanding.

Brother SolaScrip,

Those 2 verses from ( Matthew 24:29-30) are not the same. The 2 verses are separated by 42 months.

Immediately after the tribulation starts the great tribulation, lasting 42 months. The saints are sealed prior to the great tribulation, and 42 months later, resurrected into Jesus Messiah's army.

(vs 29) depicts the 6th trumpet, day of the Lord, 2nd woe.

(vs 30) depicts the 7th trumpet, day of the Lord's vengeance, 3rd woe.

To make a fair assessment of prophesy, you have to gather context. The astounding thing here is you swear up and down you are are correct, and I'm here to tell you again, your testimony is inaccurate. It is easy to verify between the 2 verses because there is an abundance of parallel instances. The 6th trumpet is the 7th trumpet, is what your saying. Think it over, study it, and let me know what you find.