I do not disagree , of course I don't , why would I ? I do not agree with some people who seem to want to imply that sexual sins are some how worse than others. Jesus says that even to think of adultery is to commit it , to me this does not mean that sexual sins are worse than others , it just reminds me of all the other kinds of sins that go through my mind every day . We all have sinful thoughts , some of a sexual nature but there are very many more kinds of sinful thoughts , judging others , looking down on others , pride in our appearance , pride in our so called accomplishments , witholding a kind word when we know it's needed , the list is literally endless as I'm sure we all know . These sins in our thoughts are easy for us to hide from others , we can keep doing them all day every day and no one can accuse us or point the finger at us because they don't know about them , we hide them in ourselves and so may appear to others to be holier than thou , but in fact we are festering inside . Some sins go before , outwardly appearing to others and inviting judgement and condemnation from others , who will not miss the opportunity to point the finger . God knows every thought that passes through our minds and hearts , we can hide many of our sins from others but we can hide nothing from our Heavenly Father . He knows what we all are and I believe that we all , including me , need to recognise who and what we are before pointing our fingers at others . How do we know any one else's prayers to their God ? How do we know any one else's struggles with their own personal weaknesses ? We don't and we are not judges in this life other than of our own weaknesses and faults and failings . God is my judge and I'm glad He is . He is righteousness and He is merciful and whatever judgement He lays on me I will take it because I know that He alone is pure and in a perfect state in order to judge me . Any one can think anything of me and I don't mind , God alone is pure and right
Hello Jema, I agree that before God any and all sin is equally deadly to our souls.
However, my point was that the effects of sin on a person that manifest in a person's life vary. It seems that sexual sin and idolatry do more harm to the community of believers than many other sins, such as in this instance. The draw of such enticement easily pervaded the camp of the Israelites, not taking very long to bring 24,000 men into such sin in a short period of time. This is what i was emphasizing.
Hi Gigi , I hope you don't mind me commenting on your post . With regards to sexual immorality being a more serious sin than some others , it's my belief that all sins are as serious as others , it's all disobedience to God's commandment , remember the man who was stoned to death for picking up sticks on the Sabbath ? Remember the first sin ? It wasn't about the eating of the fruit , it was the disobedience to God command . That's what sin is , disobedience to God's command . Luke chapter 13 verses 1-5 , the word perish in these instances , means to be utterly destroyed. We are all under the same condemnation , this was recognised by the man who was crucified on Jesus's right hand and was his confession . It should also be all of ours .
YHWH tells Moses to lead the nation against the Midianites and smite them because of the way they vexed Israel with their wiles and beguilement.
At first, it seems to say the women were Moabites, but here it says they were Midianites. Perhaps it was women from both peoples.
The account of this battle is in Numbers 31.
There are many lessons from this chapter.
The foremost one to me is that we need to be sure we are worshipping the LORD rightly and to never think that we can worship both Him and any other idol and expect to be blessed and spared from punishment. God is jealous for His own honor and for His bride, the Church.
The second lesson for me is how it seems that sexual immorality and idolatry are very serious sins, and especially so when done together as was done in this chapter. We must have God's view on moral sexual expression and not adopt the mores of the popular culture. Our culture today accepts every form of sexual expression as permissible. Even in the church, many are not bothered by people co-habiting prior to marriage with an active sexual relationship. Many are not fazed by the rampant divorce and remarriage in the church, the breaking of the one flesh union and covenant of marriage so readily and the unashamed remarrying after a divorce.
Third lesson is for us to value our commitment to the covenant we have with God, realize the cost of attaining it to our Lord and the giving of the benefits of this covenant to us who believe despite our sinfulness. We must commit to staying within the parameters of this covenant and not seek to covenant with anyone else but God.
The fourth is that God is not mocked. What we sow, we reap. So, we should sow to that which is lasting, given unto eternal life rather than sowing evil and reaping unto death and judgment. We cannot run with the world and have peace with God. Jesus is our peace and we have peace when we abide in Him.
It seems that these two were engaging in sexual immorality either in his own tent or within the tent of meeting. The text is unclear concerning this. It says that Phinehas having observed this from among the congregation makes me think it was an open act before where Moses and Phineas (the high priest) were seated. Phinehas is said t have rose up from his place. This action by Phinehas caused YHWH to stop the plague that was taking the lives of so many men in the camp.
YHWH commended Phinehas to Moses for his zeal for the honor of YHWH and for putting and end to these two flagrant idolaters. Phineas was given a covenant of peace and everlasting priesthood because by slaying the man and the woman he made atonement for the people. This was a shadow of Jesus, our High Priest, only the way of atonement is reversed; instead of slaying the guilty party as Phinehas did, Jesus, the sinless one was slain to make atonement and take away the wrath of God on sinners. This covenant with Phineas (and the house of Levi) was rescinded as Malachi 2:1-9 because of the corruption of the priesthood by the Levites. Jesus is the only SINLESS one who was zealous for God and made atonement. (vs. 13)
Both the name of the Israelite and the Midianite woman were named in this chapter. Perhaps they are so pointed out because maybe the Israelite thought that He could worship YHWH in the same manner as the Moabites worshipped Baal. God hated this severely. The Israelite was the prince (son) of the chief of the tribe of Simeon. The Midianite woman was the daughter of the head over the people of Midian, of a chief house of the Midianites. Both were people of prominence. They may have been involved at the first of this adultery/idolatry and led others to follow. They were bold and brazen in their outward display of such debauchery. So, God made a them an example before the people by stirring Phinehas to slay them both at once.
God knew all along what Balak and Balaam would try to do to the Israelites and how Israelites would break His covenant. Nothing came as a surprise to God. He cannot be fooled. He also cannot go back on His word once declared. God brought punishment upon Israel by telling Moses to hang all of the leaders (heads) of the tribes publicly so that all of the Israelites would see how YHWH punished them for not leading a resistance to the advances of the Moabites and/or participated in the sexual immorality and idolatry with the Moabite women. Also, Moses instructed the judges of Israel to slay every man that participated in these incidents, having joined themselves to Baal through their acts of worship which included sexual forms of worship.
Israel was to be joined to YHWH, as a woman is joined to her husband. Just as fidelity in marriage is expected, so did YHWH expect Israel to refuse to worship any idol/false god. They were not to be joined to YHWH in covenant and also joined to any idol/false god through worshipping these, especially in sexual ways. Baal was the god of fertility, so this immorality was to entice Baal to bring fruitfulness of the womb and fields for the people. These feasts/sacrifices/orgies were celebrated out in the open before the idol set up in the groves of trees or on the mountain tops. 24,000 Israelite men were slain that day, either by the Moses, judges, or the plague that God sent into the camp.
Many Israelites seemed to be remorseful and came before the door of the tent of meeting weeping before the LORD.
One Israelite rashly brought a Midianite woman (apparently the Midianites were traveling among the Moabites at the time, since they were nomadic) before these people, flaunting her before the tent of meeting in the site of Moses and Phineas, son of Eleazar..
Phineas went after the two and thrust a spear through the man and woman in one thrust, killing them both. ...cont.
In this chapter, the Israelites are camping near an Acacia Grove. Such groves were often used by pagans to worship Baal and Asherah. They were still in the land of Moab east of the Jordan River and Jericho. Balaam had taken leave of Balak at this time. Israel did not know what Balak and Balaam were plotting. Because Balaam knew that God would not go back on His word and curse Israel whom He had blessed, he came up with a new way to bring harm to the nation of Israel. Revelation 2:12-17 speaks of Balaam's involvement in the incidents in this chapter of Numbers, saying that Balaam instructed Balak to have the women invite the Israelite men to their idol feasts and to entice them into sexual and spiritual immorality by participating in sexual immorality associated with the worship of Baal. Soon, the men were also bowing down to Baal.
This incident in Numbers 25 is where Israel was introduced into Baal worship. YHWH was full of anger at this immorality and idolatry from the very people He blessed and set apart for Himself in a covenant relationship. The men so easily broke this covenant. And by breaking it, the curses of this broken covenant came upon Israel from the hand of YHWH. So, Balaam was successful in devising a way for Israel to be cursed, not that God changed His mind or His blessing to a curse, but by the people bringing upon themselves the curses that were a part of the covenantal agreement they made with YHWH at Sinai.
So, Balaam's scheme worked, but he did not get to enjoy his success for long. He was killed in Moab when he abode among the Midianites when Isael came against Midian at God's direction. Israel slew all of the Midianite men in the area and most of the women.
In this era and area of the world, sexual immorality was a part of the way they worshipped Baal and Asherah. Apparently, Moab, descended from Lot, took to Baal worship early on. cont.
Also, read the account of the men of Sodom and Gomorrah. They were abandoned to homosexual behaviors and God destroyed them all and the cities around them.
I am wondering if you are inquiring to be able to share info with another person or if you are inquiring for yourself because you are struggling with such desires? I want to be able to pray for you or your friend with correct info.
4 And the Lord said unto Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the Lord against the sun, that the fierce anger of the Lord may be turned away from Israel.
5 And Moses said unto the judges of Israel, Slay ye every one his men that were joined unto Baalpeor.
This is a condemnation of modern churches that support wickedness such as abortion or homosexuality. God did not say "make friends with the ungodly" but, instead, 'totally condemn those that support wickedness promoted by ungodly rebels against God.'
Here's a portion of an article from Wayne Jackson.
Part 1 of ?
Gentile Accountability
That the ancient Gentile world was religiously and morally culpable before the Creator is most obvious from the testimony of both Old and New Testaments. In literature of the Old Testament, the idolatry of the pagans is condemned repeatedly, and judgments from God were visited upon these peoples.
(1) Gentile idolatry is condemned as sin by the prophets of God (see Exodus 20:3-5; 32:35; Numbers 25:1-9; Deuteronomy 5:7-9; 6:4, etc.). The captivity of the southern kingdom of Judah was attributed directly to the worship of the false gods of the Gentiles ( 2 Kings 22:17). For an extensive array of information on this theme, see Helmbold 2003, 697-708.
(2) Gentile immorality was exposed and rebuked by the Old Testament writers. For example, in Amos 1:3 - 2:3, the prophet denounced Damascus, Gaza, Tyre, and Edom for their brutality toward their neighbors. The Ammonites "ripped open pregnant women" in their vicious conquests, etc. See also the extensive material presentation of judgments against the heathen nations contemporary with the prophet Jeremiah (chapters 46-51).
(3) In his epistle to the Christians in Rome, Paul describes the religious-moral conditions of the Roman world.
Romans 1:24-27.
From these facts, therefore, one may conclude: (1) Sin is a transgression of divine law ( 1 John 3:4); conversely, where there is no law, there is no sin ( Romans 4:15). (2) But the Gentiles were indicted as sinners. (3) Consequently, they were amenable to a law, and they had violated that law. That their actions were designated as sin likewise implies that they were under divine law.
Hello Amy. In 1 Corinthians chapter 10 & particularly verses 1 to 12, Paul is warning the Corinthians about their behaviour, using the examples set before them in the Scriptures about God's view on sin & punishment. As the children of Israel suffered under God's Hand in the wilderness, or as they were about to be wiped out at the foot of Mt. Sinai (except for the pleading of Moses to God), or when they committed whoredoms & sacrificed to idols in Moab, & also complained & murmured against God & Moses in the wilderness, all these accounts were reminders to the Church about their bad behaviour.
So, the people mentioned in 1 Corinthians 10:8 were the children of Israel who practised fornication & idolatry under the influence of the gentile pagans ( Numbers 25:1-9). The 23 thousand as quoted by Paul, was actually 24 thousand (in Numbers) as Numbers records the extra thousand killed by the judges (verse 5). The 23 thousand died of the plague that God sent (verses 3 & 6: the weeping of repentance & for the plague that they were suffering).
Therefore, Paul's message & warnings were not about Christians suffering under the Law (for the OT Law has no application to believers in Christ), but about setting examples that we are to learn from as God still doesn't overlook sin because of Calvary. Christ's Sacrifice made atonement for our sins (to satisfy God's Holy requirements & be the basis to forgive sin & to grant us forgiveness & purge our evil consciences), but is never a licence to sin. The Corinthians still had elements of licentious behaviour, as was the society & city they lived in, & Paul had to be very stern with them. And the example to them at the Lord's Table becomes relevant to them & us: 1 Corinthians 11:30, "For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep"; when we wilfully sin, we can expect warning & punishment. Sometimes (not always), our sicknesses & intimely deaths may be God's message to the Church that all is not well. Every blessing.
That's from Numbers Chapter 25 Verses 1 and 9. The Moabites sent out the women to seduce the Israelites to cause them to sin. And when they sinned, 23,000 were slain.
It's interesting because if you look at Numbers 25:9, it says twenty-four thousand died in the plague, but in 1 Corinthians 10:8, Paul says twenty-three thousand. If you have access to some commentaries, there are some explanations on the number difference. The two I looked at, (Barnes and Clarke) were interesting.
Anyway, where it says "as some of them committed" in 1 Corinthians 10:8, it is referring to those people in Numbers chapter 25 who were involved in Baal worship.
In 1 Corinthians chapter 10, if you start at Verse 6, Paul is saying that if we study about how God dealt with the children of Israel through their physical circumstances, we can gain a spiritual example for us. It says to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Literally in the Greek text, it's not a verb. It's actually a noun, "To the intent that we should not become lusters of evil things as they also lusted."
And then Paul lists four things that are characteristics of the lusters: Do not be an idolater, do not commit fornication, do not tempt Christ, and do not murmur. Now that last one is interesting. That's the word complain. And since none of us ever do any of that, we don't have to worry about it, right?
Neither murmur as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed by the destroyer. That phrase "the destroyer" at the end of Verse 10 is the same word for the angel of death that passed over Egypt and killed the firstborn of the Egyptians. So he says don't complain!
You see, every time we complain about anything, we're saying that God's will and what he's doing is wrong. He's in charge of everything. So I'm complaining against Him because that's the way He has it. We have to be careful!
You're correct - my Bible too gives the word as "fell". But why I say that 'fell' means 'died' is because of the longer account of this tragedy in Numbers 25:1-9. You will see it there. Of course, from your reading you will also notice the difference in the number who 'died': in Numbers it is given as 24,000, whereas Paul indicates 23,000. In case you raise this matter with me, this 'discrepancy' has been explained by the fact that in Numbers, the total number of people killed is given (i.e. 23,000 killed by the plague & the other 1,000 killed by Phinehas). But if you need another option to this: the number killed may have been somewhere between 23,000 & 24,000, in which case Paul uses the former & in Numbers, the latter is given. I think this last option deals with the 'discrepancy' better.
So, they were certainly not "upright before they fell" - they were 'downright bad folk' whom God severely dealt with.
To each his own. But, for Mr. Hernandes' sake when I sure hope when "your sons and daughters will prophesy" comes into play the women aren't given anything to say that he might need to listen to.
Christ Magnified Glorifying Jesus on Numbers 25 - 6 years ago
End of day 33 of Bible in a Year Reading. Challenging reading. God is Holy and expects His people to be Holy as He is. Holy Spirit is our powerful person as believers. Present day believers have accepted many ungodly and wicked acts and things into our lives. Without Holy Spirit guiding us we are powerless to even see how far from God we have become. Sin was all around Phinehas addressed it.
Kevin; I don't listen to "Christian Radio," and I can't say that I agree with women teaching. The things I see from this Chapter are about the treachery of the enemy; (who knows how to seduce those who are willing to be seduced); the disaster and destruction of the Lord's Church because of disobedience and rebellion which is the root of fornication and idolatry; and the imperative of a pure heart.
I'm listening to Christian radio and the woman there is speaking of this chapter. Her interpretation is simply that "Sin must be dealt with." What do you think? Is this an accurate assessment?
With respect to all who are called and separated unto the LORD to be His; it seems like everyone knows what is our strength with God, and what makes us unclean, unholy and unfit for His Presence; EXCEPT THE CHRISTIAN! The devil knew, the king of Moab knew, and Balaam knew, that idols and fornication would corrupt Israel and put them in a weakened condition, and God would withdraw His protection.
The children of Israel were warned by God not to get themselves entangled with the strangers around them. They saw what happened when others were disobedient. Why were they bent on provoking God who took such good care of them over and over again. Phinehas was right to do what he did.
Verse 8: Phineas tolerated no rivalry toward Jehovah God and he took swift action to make sure that the camp of Israel stayed clean. God blessed Phineas for his swift action he took and for not being permissive.
Yes, I dearly LOVE Phineas!! In his zeal he was a 'remnant' of truth among the Israelite sinners. He had kept the TRUTH of the Word of God hid in his heart, Ps. 119:11 - "Thy Word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee." And because of that God blessed him above anyone else. And He still does that today - for His TRUTH.
I think we should all think about what we watch,listen to,the way we speak,the way we address things,for if we don't then the spirit will not be with us,we will be no different then anyone else, we are his peculiar children,because we go against what everyone else is caught up in doing,I am guilty of it myself,I have cried many nights because I strayed from God,got caught up,hes been there 4 me:).
I may be wrong on this, but - the Israelite man brought the Midianitish woman into the tent; the tabernacle was a tent and most, not all, of Israel was into Baal worship so the tabernacle was 'nothing' to them anymore ..... ? That's how I've been reading it. Because of the ZEAL of Phinehas, I don't think this had happened before. This was just too much for him.
Lets get Zealous for God Church- 11 Phinehas, the son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron the priest, hath turned my wrath away from the children of Israel, while he was zealous for my sake among them, that I consumed not the children of Israel in my jealousy. 12 Wherefore say, Behold, I give unto him my covenant of peace: 13 And he shall have it, and his seed after him, even the covenant of an everlasting priesthood because he was zealous for his God, and made an atonement for the children of Israel.
"Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body."
However, my point was that the effects of sin on a person that manifest in a person's life vary. It seems that sexual sin and idolatry do more harm to the community of believers than many other sins, such as in this instance. The draw of such enticement easily pervaded the camp of the Israelites, not taking very long to bring 24,000 men into such sin in a short period of time. This is what i was emphasizing.
YHWH tells Moses to lead the nation against the Midianites and smite them because of the way they vexed Israel with their wiles and beguilement.
At first, it seems to say the women were Moabites, but here it says they were Midianites. Perhaps it was women from both peoples.
The account of this battle is in Numbers 31.
There are many lessons from this chapter.
The foremost one to me is that we need to be sure we are worshipping the LORD rightly and to never think that we can worship both Him and any other idol and expect to be blessed and spared from punishment. God is jealous for His own honor and for His bride, the Church.
The second lesson for me is how it seems that sexual immorality and idolatry are very serious sins, and especially so when done together as was done in this chapter. We must have God's view on moral sexual expression and not adopt the mores of the popular culture. Our culture today accepts every form of sexual expression as permissible. Even in the church, many are not bothered by people co-habiting prior to marriage with an active sexual relationship. Many are not fazed by the rampant divorce and remarriage in the church, the breaking of the one flesh union and covenant of marriage so readily and the unashamed remarrying after a divorce.
Third lesson is for us to value our commitment to the covenant we have with God, realize the cost of attaining it to our Lord and the giving of the benefits of this covenant to us who believe despite our sinfulness. We must commit to staying within the parameters of this covenant and not seek to covenant with anyone else but God.
The fourth is that God is not mocked. What we sow, we reap. So, we should sow to that which is lasting, given unto eternal life rather than sowing evil and reaping unto death and judgment. We cannot run with the world and have peace with God. Jesus is our peace and we have peace when we abide in Him.
Cont.
It seems that these two were engaging in sexual immorality either in his own tent or within the tent of meeting. The text is unclear concerning this. It says that Phinehas having observed this from among the congregation makes me think it was an open act before where Moses and Phineas (the high priest) were seated. Phinehas is said t have rose up from his place. This action by Phinehas caused YHWH to stop the plague that was taking the lives of so many men in the camp.
YHWH commended Phinehas to Moses for his zeal for the honor of YHWH and for putting and end to these two flagrant idolaters. Phineas was given a covenant of peace and everlasting priesthood because by slaying the man and the woman he made atonement for the people. This was a shadow of Jesus, our High Priest, only the way of atonement is reversed; instead of slaying the guilty party as Phinehas did, Jesus, the sinless one was slain to make atonement and take away the wrath of God on sinners. This covenant with Phineas (and the house of Levi) was rescinded as Malachi 2:1-9 because of the corruption of the priesthood by the Levites. Jesus is the only SINLESS one who was zealous for God and made atonement. (vs. 13)
Both the name of the Israelite and the Midianite woman were named in this chapter. Perhaps they are so pointed out because maybe the Israelite thought that He could worship YHWH in the same manner as the Moabites worshipped Baal. God hated this severely. The Israelite was the prince (son) of the chief of the tribe of Simeon. The Midianite woman was the daughter of the head over the people of Midian, of a chief house of the Midianites. Both were people of prominence. They may have been involved at the first of this adultery/idolatry and led others to follow. They were bold and brazen in their outward display of such debauchery. So, God made a them an example before the people by stirring Phinehas to slay them both at once.
...cont.
God knew all along what Balak and Balaam would try to do to the Israelites and how Israelites would break His covenant. Nothing came as a surprise to God. He cannot be fooled. He also cannot go back on His word once declared. God brought punishment upon Israel by telling Moses to hang all of the leaders (heads) of the tribes publicly so that all of the Israelites would see how YHWH punished them for not leading a resistance to the advances of the Moabites and/or participated in the sexual immorality and idolatry with the Moabite women. Also, Moses instructed the judges of Israel to slay every man that participated in these incidents, having joined themselves to Baal through their acts of worship which included sexual forms of worship.
Israel was to be joined to YHWH, as a woman is joined to her husband. Just as fidelity in marriage is expected, so did YHWH expect Israel to refuse to worship any idol/false god. They were not to be joined to YHWH in covenant and also joined to any idol/false god through worshipping these, especially in sexual ways. Baal was the god of fertility, so this immorality was to entice Baal to bring fruitfulness of the womb and fields for the people. These feasts/sacrifices/orgies were celebrated out in the open before the idol set up in the groves of trees or on the mountain tops. 24,000 Israelite men were slain that day, either by the Moses, judges, or the plague that God sent into the camp.
Many Israelites seemed to be remorseful and came before the door of the tent of meeting weeping before the LORD.
One Israelite rashly brought a Midianite woman (apparently the Midianites were traveling among the Moabites at the time, since they were nomadic) before these people, flaunting her before the tent of meeting in the site of Moses and Phineas, son of Eleazar..
Phineas went after the two and thrust a spear through the man and woman in one thrust, killing them both. ...cont.
In this chapter, the Israelites are camping near an Acacia Grove. Such groves were often used by pagans to worship Baal and Asherah. They were still in the land of Moab east of the Jordan River and Jericho. Balaam had taken leave of Balak at this time. Israel did not know what Balak and Balaam were plotting. Because Balaam knew that God would not go back on His word and curse Israel whom He had blessed, he came up with a new way to bring harm to the nation of Israel. Revelation 2:12-17 speaks of Balaam's involvement in the incidents in this chapter of Numbers, saying that Balaam instructed Balak to have the women invite the Israelite men to their idol feasts and to entice them into sexual and spiritual immorality by participating in sexual immorality associated with the worship of Baal. Soon, the men were also bowing down to Baal.
This incident in Numbers 25 is where Israel was introduced into Baal worship. YHWH was full of anger at this immorality and idolatry from the very people He blessed and set apart for Himself in a covenant relationship. The men so easily broke this covenant. And by breaking it, the curses of this broken covenant came upon Israel from the hand of YHWH. So, Balaam was successful in devising a way for Israel to be cursed, not that God changed His mind or His blessing to a curse, but by the people bringing upon themselves the curses that were a part of the covenantal agreement they made with YHWH at Sinai.
So, Balaam's scheme worked, but he did not get to enjoy his success for long. He was killed in Moab when he abode among the Midianites when Isael came against Midian at God's direction. Israel slew all of the Midianite men in the area and most of the women.
In this era and area of the world, sexual immorality was a part of the way they worshipped Baal and Asherah. Apparently, Moab, descended from Lot, took to Baal worship early on. cont.
Gal.5:19
Matt. 15:19
Numbers 25:1
Lev, 18:22
Also, read the account of the men of Sodom and Gomorrah. They were abandoned to homosexual behaviors and God destroyed them all and the cities around them.
I am wondering if you are inquiring to be able to share info with another person or if you are inquiring for yourself because you are struggling with such desires? I want to be able to pray for you or your friend with correct info.
4 And the Lord said unto Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the Lord against the sun, that the fierce anger of the Lord may be turned away from Israel.
5 And Moses said unto the judges of Israel, Slay ye every one his men that were joined unto Baalpeor.
This is a condemnation of modern churches that support wickedness such as abortion or homosexuality. God did not say "make friends with the ungodly" but, instead, 'totally condemn those that support wickedness promoted by ungodly rebels against God.'
That is a great question!!
Here's a portion of an article from Wayne Jackson.
Part 1 of ?
Gentile Accountability
That the ancient Gentile world was religiously and morally culpable before the Creator is most obvious from the testimony of both Old and New Testaments. In literature of the Old Testament, the idolatry of the pagans is condemned repeatedly, and judgments from God were visited upon these peoples.
(1) Gentile idolatry is condemned as sin by the prophets of God (see Exodus 20:3-5; 32:35; Numbers 25:1-9; Deuteronomy 5:7-9; 6:4, etc.). The captivity of the southern kingdom of Judah was attributed directly to the worship of the false gods of the Gentiles ( 2 Kings 22:17). For an extensive array of information on this theme, see Helmbold 2003, 697-708.
(2) Gentile immorality was exposed and rebuked by the Old Testament writers. For example, in Amos 1:3 - 2:3, the prophet denounced Damascus, Gaza, Tyre, and Edom for their brutality toward their neighbors. The Ammonites "ripped open pregnant women" in their vicious conquests, etc. See also the extensive material presentation of judgments against the heathen nations contemporary with the prophet Jeremiah (chapters 46-51).
(3) In his epistle to the Christians in Rome, Paul describes the religious-moral conditions of the Roman world.
Romans 1:24-27.
From these facts, therefore, one may conclude: (1) Sin is a transgression of divine law ( 1 John 3:4); conversely, where there is no law, there is no sin ( Romans 4:15). (2) But the Gentiles were indicted as sinners. (3) Consequently, they were amenable to a law, and they had violated that law. That their actions were designated as sin likewise implies that they were under divine law.
See part 2.
So, the people mentioned in 1 Corinthians 10:8 were the children of Israel who practised fornication & idolatry under the influence of the gentile pagans ( Numbers 25:1-9). The 23 thousand as quoted by Paul, was actually 24 thousand (in Numbers) as Numbers records the extra thousand killed by the judges (verse 5). The 23 thousand died of the plague that God sent (verses 3 & 6: the weeping of repentance & for the plague that they were suffering).
Therefore, Paul's message & warnings were not about Christians suffering under the Law (for the OT Law has no application to believers in Christ), but about setting examples that we are to learn from as God still doesn't overlook sin because of Calvary. Christ's Sacrifice made atonement for our sins (to satisfy God's Holy requirements & be the basis to forgive sin & to grant us forgiveness & purge our evil consciences), but is never a licence to sin. The Corinthians still had elements of licentious behaviour, as was the society & city they lived in, & Paul had to be very stern with them. And the example to them at the Lord's Table becomes relevant to them & us: 1 Corinthians 11:30, "For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep"; when we wilfully sin, we can expect warning & punishment. Sometimes (not always), our sicknesses & intimely deaths may be God's message to the Church that all is not well. Every blessing.
That's from Numbers Chapter 25 Verses 1 and 9. The Moabites sent out the women to seduce the Israelites to cause them to sin. And when they sinned, 23,000 were slain.
It's interesting because if you look at Numbers 25:9, it says twenty-four thousand died in the plague, but in 1 Corinthians 10:8, Paul says twenty-three thousand. If you have access to some commentaries, there are some explanations on the number difference. The two I looked at, (Barnes and Clarke) were interesting.
Anyway, where it says "as some of them committed" in 1 Corinthians 10:8, it is referring to those people in Numbers chapter 25 who were involved in Baal worship.
In 1 Corinthians chapter 10, if you start at Verse 6, Paul is saying that if we study about how God dealt with the children of Israel through their physical circumstances, we can gain a spiritual example for us. It says to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. Literally in the Greek text, it's not a verb. It's actually a noun, "To the intent that we should not become lusters of evil things as they also lusted."
And then Paul lists four things that are characteristics of the lusters: Do not be an idolater, do not commit fornication, do not tempt Christ, and do not murmur. Now that last one is interesting. That's the word complain. And since none of us ever do any of that, we don't have to worry about it, right?
Neither murmur as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed by the destroyer. That phrase "the destroyer" at the end of Verse 10 is the same word for the angel of death that passed over Egypt and killed the firstborn of the Egyptians. So he says don't complain!
You see, every time we complain about anything, we're saying that God's will and what he's doing is wrong. He's in charge of everything. So I'm complaining against Him because that's the way He has it. We have to be careful!
Hope this helps you some!
So, they were certainly not "upright before they fell" - they were 'downright bad folk' whom God severely dealt with.
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