From what you've express in your open statement, it seems your understanding comes from a searching of collective consciences in their studying of the Scriptures, from the conceiving of one's own brain from the letter.
Friend.. please bear with me,
There's a surer Way, & that is to choose the better part Luke 10:39Luke 10:42
The Spirit who inspired the Scriptures, is alone the Opener of them, freely giving us their true import. 1Cor 2:13,14
For this He was sent John 16:7, John 16:13
His words are a certainty, a infallible foundation that we can bottom on or trust in.
I wasn't giving my opinion of these Scriptures, referencing Jesus own words with His disciples on the question they ask of Him, Matt 24:3 quoting His words several times in His disclosure to them, for in Him is Psalms 36:9
You've stated; "We also see things that have not yet been fulfilled" in a sense, yes, in a sense, no,
I'll explain; Jesus plainly states, 24:34 its clear He's referring to these end time events in a "present tense", many time to His disciples, They were fulfilled in them, & to all in their generation & every generation since, & will be fulfilled in the generations to come until Rev 11:15
"you don't know why I would bring up this matter, as it pertains to our discussion. When in Truth, it reaches to the very heart of it.
Going to the letter, in Hebrew or Greek etc; as you quoted & spoke from, comes from the traditions & teaching of man, the wisdom that's from below, earthy, which makes Mark 7:13, which sprang up in the Apostasy. Isa 55:8,9;
Whereas coming to the Spirit, our Teacher; The Word Rom 10:8; that comes Rom 10:17; within us, produces the fruit, the Word intended Isa 55;11; Isa 14:27;
Bringing this part of the conversation to a conclusion, by giving "the cause & effect of the learning from the letter, verses being taught by God Himself.
1Cor 2:10 which is freely & lavishly given unto us in Christ. Col 2:2,3; Proverbs 8:14;
You said; you don't subscribe to this type of application of sanctification ; citing verses with the word meaning; its plain to me that your faith is coming from books, & not our Teacher; who is Hebrews 12:2. Your trying to understand spiritual things by carnal means, Thus this faith you have is 2Timothy 3:7 Meaning; it will never bring one to the experiential knowledge of God; in Spirit & in Truth. Matt 11:27; For God is a Spirit & only by His Spirit is He manifested & known.
Jeremiah 31:33,34; New Covenant, he's prophesying, not that he partook of it, 1Peter 1:10; & yet he was cleansed & holy under the gospel of his dispensation 2 Peter 1:21; as many were Luke 1:5,6;
Again; what God requires of us, is to walk upright in the knowledge that He has given us.
Thank you for your kind apology, no offense taken, just a misunderstanding. Believe me, in this slow progressive work of sanctification, I've have had many misunderstanding & faltering, receiving His reproofs & admonishments, I've learnt Daniel 4:37; I love the way He gets to me. He always "hit the nail on the head" so to speak,& why? Daniel 2:22, Psalms 36:9;
you have experience Him in Spirit, Chris (in the car)
Verse 1 is admittedly a trickly passage the way it is written; sounding like the transgression of the wicked is speaking to a godly man (David) and stating that there is no fear of God before his eyes. Having seen commentaries on this subject not finding satisfactory cross references; it would seem it is stating that within my (David's) heart is testifying that the state of transgression of the wicked is due to their lack of fear of God. The next several verses talk about self gratiation (flattery-verse 2); verbal caustic language (v. 3); and plotting in his bed what he will do next (verse 4). There is a sober warning of those who become reprobate as verse 3 where apparently there was some wise or good standard for those individual(s) previously. Conversations and words seem to be a major red flag there.
Securing the mercy of God is largely indicated by the TRUST mentioned in verse 7. David asks for the "foot of pride" and "hand of the wicked" to "remove me". The concern probably is those who will cause us to find an excuse to fall away. The doom of the wicked once again is sealed in verse 12.
We do well to heed to the admonitions in James as to not letting there be a root of bitterness in us. (also see Hebrews 12:15). The love of money is the root of all evil ( 1 Tim. 6:10). We are wise to be cautious not to be ensnared by those things which plunge men into perdition which is in the verse immediately before ( 1 Tim. 6:9). We need to watch the tongue and control it as James admonishes as well ( James 3:1-12).
Certainly, many politiicians and partisans have no fear of God before their eyes. Many do not even claim to believe. But for those that do, and knowingly acquit the obviously guilty, the bowls of God's wrath are being filled up, and the fires of hell are burning hot for them.
Jesus warned people about hell far more than He talked about heaven. But if people can set aside their pride and greed, there is an opportunity to repent.
GOD is good: John 3:16,17, 2Peter 3:9, Psalms 22:24, Psalms 111:4, Psalms 139, Matthew 9:36, Psalms 86:15, Matthew 14:14, Read Matthew, Mark, Luke & John. 1John 4:19,
Matthew 25:31-46, 2Kings 13:23, Jeremiah 12:15, Revelation 21,
Hi Cathleen Lovell, This is a common question. We know there will be animals in heaven, but we don't know if they will be created in heaven or if they will actually be the animals who lived on the earth with us.
Manuel marques Teixeira on Psalms 36 - 3 years ago
It's writen ... And the sin is that THE LIGHT came into the world, but they prefered darkness ... I'm THE LIGHT, THE WAY and THE TRUTH... If you don't believe that " I am", your sin remains ... verily verily, I say unto you, before Abraham existed, I AM! Jesus said; no one knows The Father, but The Son, and no one knows The son, but only that one unto whom The Father wants to reveal Him and Whosoever sees Me, sees The Father. Why (then) do you ask me, show us The father?. The good thief at the cross, asked Jesus;" Lord, remember of me, when You wil return in Your Kingdom". He just asked by faith on THE FAITH of JESUS THE LORD!
To The name of Jesus be The Glory, The Honor and The Power, for ever! men! Because He is THE GOD Almighty, with The Father and The Holy Ghost. THE only one that is GOOD!
not sure but would this help just happening to be reading this last night.
Ecclesiastes 3:18 "I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts."
Ecclesiastes 3:19 "For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. " Ecclesiastes 3:20 "All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again. " Ecclesiastes 3:21 "Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?"
Hi Richard, Hope that brought you a smile, but you're right, scripture don't have much to say on it, How did you like the knats and mosquitoes? Lol. I heard one guy on here mention hammer head sharks. Lol.
Hopefully you know I have not the answer to your question nor do I believe anyone else does. Saying how they go to heaven if by the blood of Christ? Well animals don't have sin, as humans do, so I believe they are on a different scale than us. Of coarse this is just my opinion. I agree our concern should most definitely be for other souls of people rather than bugs.
Still, I believe animals are a beautiful creation of our Father and carry His finger print. Seeing butterflies, dogs, birds flying and singing would be beautiful in Heaven. To me. But as said I guess there is only one way to find out the truth. It is all up to God.
Revelation 5:13 - And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, [be] unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
As this verse states every "creature" which is in Heaven. Could it merely mean just Angels with humans? Or animals also? God knows and one day we will too my brother.
Hi Richard, My question is if animals go to heaven, how many? all? pigs and rats too? reptiles and insects too? people have them as pets as well. How do they get to heaven by the blood of Christ? I know that sounds silly but it's a thought because it seems most people will fall short, I think our concern should be for those who are lost, not mosquitoes and knats. smiles.
Thank you dear Richard for your thoughts on this. Indeed, there are some things that we may never know on this side of Heaven so being dogmatic over such issues would be unwarranted. I think it really comes down to one's understanding of a whole range of materiel before us & how we bring it together to make sense.
With the Book of Revelation, it is the one Book that is filled with imagery & symbolism, so I can see how some things may be taken literally or symbolically, whether justifiably or not. With the matter of the horses, or the beast rising from the sea, or even the sword coming out from the Saviour's mouth, my understanding is that these are all imagery given to John to depict future events that were kept obscure to him to some extent.
Anyway, we will just have to agree to disagree on this matter along with the shape of the Earth belief, & base our acceptance of & love for each other on things that are more precious & abiding. Every blessing Richard.
As you know we can all have different views on things of the Eternal realm or Heaven. My belief is there are animals in Heaven but of coarse the only ones who know for sure are not here, in earth, anymore.
One verse from the Bible that may point to this is Revelation 19:11. When our Lord comes down from Heaven riding on a white horse.
Of coarse not to dispute anything with you my brother. Just thought I would note that verse.
You will get different views on this, whether pets (or, even animals in general) go to Heaven or not. There's no Scripture to support either view - it just comes down to an opinion based on one's understanding of God's creation & His Plan for all it. Also, one can be so enamoured with one's pet, that the thought is, 'surely God can't deny such a loving faithful animal a place in Heaven'. Maybe this is just wishful thinking.
If we looked at any Scripture which reveals the beings & activity in Heaven (then & now), all we see is God's Presence & the Heavenly Host which comprise the living beings around Him. And then in the Book of the Revelation we see more, as in the Elders & those saints robed in white. We never see animals (or, their souls) in Heaven, nor do we read about them as having any part in a resurrection, to which only humans who accountable to God, have.
And then we could try to understand the purpose of the creation of plants & animals. Again, views may be many on this, but I just see all these as God's Plan to beautify the Earth (for His Sake & ours) with the things & creatures that will enjoy life & point man's heart back to his Creator. Of course, both plants & animals serve as sacrifice & food for our existence as well. So, in short, my view is that animals are not in Heaven, only those who have been created for Heaven & those appointed to salvation & eternal life.
I will actually respond further Jay, as I wasn't referring to your Eccl 12:7 reference. I was referring to: "Comparably, the life-force returns to where it came from-God. ( Job 34:14, 15; Psalms 36:9). This does not mean that the life-force actually travels to heaven. Rather, it means that for someone who dies, the time of future life rests with God."
So what are you referring to when you write: "the life-force (man's spirit, which you explained earlier), doesn't travel to heaven - it means the time of future life rests with God"? I'm confused as to what you are trying to say here. Where does man's spirit go upon his death, if at all? I can't see any misrepresentation of your comments on my part - just reading as given & requiring further clarification, if you so desire. Thank you.
This is not true! Only God knows your true heart. You are still a sinner even if you are saved. You are not God and therefore you can fall from grace. But your salvation is set and held in Gods hands eternally. Paul says we all fall short of the glory of God. You can have a person whom follows all the rules but without the acknowledgement of Christ as Lord and Saviour you will not see the Father. Read Romans
No one comes to the father but through me! Jesus. Once you except Christ into your heart you are Justified by his death. Then the road to learning with the Holy spirit is sanctification. You are saved from your sins past present and future period. All will far short of the Glory of God but once saved The Father (God Head) puts his hands over you and that's the end of it, you are his child! Can you still sin, yes if you dont listen to the Holy spirit. Jesus said to guard our minds. Jesus said this be cause he understood past present and future and knew we would struggle will sin in our minds. But a true Christian in true faith and relationship with Christ knows he can fall from grace. And this is why we are having this conversation so that we reinforce Gods words. If you do not have on the full armored of God how can you be perfect? You cant because most of us know we are saved because we have on the helmet of salvation but we are running around naked without the other parts of the armor that make us whole. Evan as we are saved we sin and those who say they are true Christains without sin, are not saved at all. To walk in Jesus's footsteps is to have relationship with God but to be him is impossible. Remember Jesus said we are little Gods with a small G. Dont doubt your salvation because you are not perfect or may fall from grace (sin), but instead doubt your imperfection cant get better to be more like Jesus. GOD BLESS! Jesus came to save us by dying on the cross, so that we may be saved from the raptor of certain death. Our job is to sow and grow the crops through the Gospel, dont worry about the benefits, give the Glory to God, for that is what we will be judged for, not for our sins. So give the Glory to God in everything you do. From the time you get up till the time your lie down and know that he knows your needs, and He The Father loves you greatly. Love in your hearts!
a. "How can one be lost if Jesus saves him? If Jesus saves (i.e. saved by having faith in Jesus' sacrificial work on the Cross & subsequently indwelt by the Holy Spirit), then no one, whether oneself, another, the Devil, can 'un-save' you. The problem arises when we see a believer, hear his testimony & see his new life, & we deem him a saved/born again person. But do we really know what happened in that encounter with the Spirit of God? Was there contrition for sin, true repentance, & a re-birth experience? We can never know, nor are we given such licence to do so - that is God's department. We are just to accept each other, love each other & encourage each other in our faith. So, the true believer cannot be lost & the test is his continual hatred of anything that smells of sin, his struggle against it as well as a great desire to please God & live for Him. If he wants to & relishes sin, then "by their fruits ye shall know them" ( Mt 7:20).
b. "Once ur saved aren't u saved eternally?" Yes we are because God's Spirit has done the saving & not man. Sometimes, the Gospel preacher can get so excited & proactive in sharing the Gospel, he won't stop until he gets a confession of sin & prayer of repentance from the unbeliever. We are to preach & persuade from the Scriptures & leave it to the Spirit to take over. So many of those are then convinced that they are now born again & end up derelicts in faith & their final end made worse than the beginning. The Scripture I often use in support is in 1 John 5:13: "These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that YE MAY KNOW that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." We can know now - Today - that the salvation Christ has given us is real & the promise of eternal life is our possession now. There are many religions, including the RCs & Muslims, that have to wait for God's final judgement to know their destiny - Jesus makes it certain for us.
Salvation is not given until people are judged and that doesn't happen until after Jesus comes. People assume they're saved as if they now can enjoy sin as much as they want with no consequence despite verses like Romans 14:12. Secondly, some people falsely assume they no longer have freewill to sin after becoming a Christian, despite all the other verses saying you can sin. Paul was a Christian and deeply struggled with his 'flesh' tempting him to sin and wrote about that in depth. There is no evidence that says your freewill to sin is stripped away. Even angels in heaven could sin, such as satan, so of course a Christian still has the ability to sin, but is supposed to actually try hard to have self control and NOT SIN. People try hard to blame others and to avoid accountability for their own actions, but no, no one forces them to sin, but themselves and their own bad choices. Those who believe Christians cannot sin are basically calling Jesus a liar. Jesus spent so much time warning his followers (Christians) to avoid sin, and shared many parables, and kept challenging them. John 14:15, Hebrews 10:26, Matthew 12:31-32. The once saved- always saved belief is a very predictable argument, but is debunked by the Bible itself if someone were to read it carefully and pray to God and ask for the heart to know the truth. Satan loves to deceive Christians into believing they have a get out of jail free card that entitles them to live in the world and enjoy unlimited sin with no consequence and of course that has the devil's signature all over it.
Some believe you can lose your salvation. Others believe you can't. Did Jesus lie when He said that those that believe in me shall not die but have everlasting life? No. If a person keeps sinning after they are saved, They was not true when the y said they accepted Christ. Satan is not strong enough to take your salvation from you.
It means return to your first love when you First met Jesus. The scripture is in Revelation 2:4
Just compare your life today to those first days when you asked Jesus to come in your heart. You read your Bible. You asked the Holy Spirit to help you understand what you have read. He's your Teacher, and the Spirit of Jesus; your Comforter; your Convictor when you make mistakes, your Helper. He's here for you, now.
Pray this prayer to return to your first Love:
Lord, after what I've read today, I don't want to allow any spirit of compromise in my life! I now understand that the doctrine of the Nicolaitans is compromise with the world. Lord, I don't want to live with one foot in the church and another foot in the world. I want to break free completely from the world and its influence so I can give myself completely to Your cause! I want to be holy, to live in a way that pleases You, and to experience Your power in my life. Today I am renewing my commitment to You all over again! I turn from the world, and I am running to You!
I pray this in Jesus' Name!
Attend a full Gospel Church that teaches the same Gospel of Jesus Christ that you read in your Bible. Anything preached to you from a pulpit should be verified BY YOU in your Bible. Not a SOFT on sin Church. Revelation speaks of the Doctrine of the "Nicolaitans." Google that word. We need to know what it means (compromise).
Prophesy from the Bible teaches us in last days: the Falling Away of the Church; also Apostacy in the Church.
The temptation is to fall away and Follow the world, instead of Jesus Christ. The pull for us to do that is powerful. Who is the Tempter? Satan!
If you will study these things and not be a seeker of quick, easy, painless Christian belief, you will know more than most people.
Nicolaitans are domineering; hard on obedience and light on sin. Don't fall into that trap. JESUS said he HATED the doctrine of them.
God created heaven and earth, by speaking it into existence. God knows all and sees everything.gog is naturally trusting because in all we do to please ourselves; we constantly forget about God until we need him. God is a jealous God,he constantly tells us through old prophets for him people to tear down the idols that man had made. God is real, he truly cares about all of his beings that he made in the image of himself. Thank you Lord for given us your very best, our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. Who came down from heaven as a living sacrifice, fought, suffer and died for us. Took the sting out of death, gave us a chance at the tree of life.salvation.
We should constantly daily recite this prayer to God "Lead me to that secret place in you oh Lord, where nothing shall disturb my peace of mind!" I desire to faithfully and truly trust in You to work out every problem and situation that I am confronted with!! Amen!! P.S. Reference scriptures Psalms 91:1, Psalms 17:8, Psalms 36:7, Psalms 124:7
Hi Ronald
From what you've express in your open statement, it seems your understanding comes from a searching of collective consciences in their studying of the Scriptures, from the conceiving of one's own brain from the letter.
Friend.. please bear with me,
There's a surer Way, & that is to choose the better part Luke 10:39 Luke 10:42
The Spirit who inspired the Scriptures, is alone the Opener of them, freely giving us their true import. 1Cor 2:13,14
For this He was sent John 16:7, John 16:13
His words are a certainty, a infallible foundation that we can bottom on or trust in.
I wasn't giving my opinion of these Scriptures, referencing Jesus own words with His disciples on the question they ask of Him, Matt 24:3 quoting His words several times in His disclosure to them, for in Him is Psalms 36:9
You've stated; "We also see things that have not yet been fulfilled" in a sense, yes, in a sense, no,
I'll explain; Jesus plainly states, 24:34 its clear He's referring to these end time events in a "present tense", many time to His disciples, They were fulfilled in them, & to all in their generation & every generation since, & will be fulfilled in the generations to come until Rev 11:15
"you don't know why I would bring up this matter, as it pertains to our discussion. When in Truth, it reaches to the very heart of it.
Going to the letter, in Hebrew or Greek etc; as you quoted & spoke from, comes from the traditions & teaching of man, the wisdom that's from below, earthy, which makes Mark 7:13, which sprang up in the Apostasy. Isa 55:8,9;
Whereas coming to the Spirit, our Teacher; The Word Rom 10:8; that comes Rom 10:17; within us, produces the fruit, the Word intended Isa 55;11; Isa 14:27;
Bringing this part of the conversation to a conclusion, by giving "the cause & effect of the learning from the letter, verses being taught by God Himself.
1Cor 2:10 which is freely & lavishly given unto us in Christ. Col 2:2,3; Proverbs 8:14;
You said; you don't subscribe to this type of application of sanctification ; citing verses with the word meaning; its plain to me that your faith is coming from books, & not our Teacher; who is Hebrews 12:2. Your trying to understand spiritual things by carnal means, Thus this faith you have is 2Timothy 3:7 Meaning; it will never bring one to the experiential knowledge of God; in Spirit & in Truth. Matt 11:27; For God is a Spirit & only by His Spirit is He manifested & known.
Jeremiah 31:33,34; New Covenant, he's prophesying, not that he partook of it, 1Peter 1:10; & yet he was cleansed & holy under the gospel of his dispensation 2 Peter 1:21; as many were Luke 1:5,6;
Again; what God requires of us, is to walk upright in the knowledge that He has given us.
Thank you for your kind apology, no offense taken, just a misunderstanding. Believe me, in this slow progressive work of sanctification, I've have had many misunderstanding & faltering, receiving His reproofs & admonishments, I've learnt Daniel 4:37; I love the way He gets to me. He always "hit the nail on the head" so to speak,& why? Daniel 2:22, Psalms 36:9;
you have experience Him in Spirit, Chris (in the car)
in Love & Truth
Frankie J
Verse 1 is admittedly a trickly passage the way it is written; sounding like the transgression of the wicked is speaking to a godly man (David) and stating that there is no fear of God before his eyes. Having seen commentaries on this subject not finding satisfactory cross references; it would seem it is stating that within my (David's) heart is testifying that the state of transgression of the wicked is due to their lack of fear of God. The next several verses talk about self gratiation (flattery-verse 2); verbal caustic language (v. 3); and plotting in his bed what he will do next (verse 4). There is a sober warning of those who become reprobate as verse 3 where apparently there was some wise or good standard for those individual(s) previously. Conversations and words seem to be a major red flag there.
Securing the mercy of God is largely indicated by the TRUST mentioned in verse 7. David asks for the "foot of pride" and "hand of the wicked" to "remove me". The concern probably is those who will cause us to find an excuse to fall away. The doom of the wicked once again is sealed in verse 12.
We do well to heed to the admonitions in James as to not letting there be a root of bitterness in us. (also see Hebrews 12:15). The love of money is the root of all evil ( 1 Tim. 6:10). We are wise to be cautious not to be ensnared by those things which plunge men into perdition which is in the verse immediately before ( 1 Tim. 6:9). We need to watch the tongue and control it as James admonishes as well ( James 3:1-12).
Jesus warned people about hell far more than He talked about heaven. But if people can set aside their pride and greed, there is an opportunity to repent.
GOD is good: John 3:16,17, 2Peter 3:9, Psalms 22:24, Psalms 111:4, Psalms 139, Matthew 9:36, Psalms 86:15, Matthew 14:14, Read Matthew, Mark, Luke & John. 1John 4:19,
Matthew 25:31-46, 2Kings 13:23, Jeremiah 12:15, Revelation 21,
Genesis 45:4,5,7, 1Corinthians 4:5,
Great: Job 40,-41, Psalms 147:5, Psalms 95:3, Jeremiah 10:6, Psalms 36:6, Psalms 50:6,
Hopefully these are useful as you ponder GOD's goodness & greatness
* Psalms 20:7, Psalms 31:19, Psalms 34:22, Psalms 36:7, Psalms 37:40,
Psalms 40:4, Psalms 118:8,9, Micah 7:5,
Hopefully these are helpful
I'm not sure if there's any scripture supporting animals in heaven, It does mention animals being in the Millennium.
Perhaps someone can show us.
God bless.
To The name of Jesus be The Glory, The Honor and The Power, for ever! men! Because He is THE GOD Almighty, with The Father and The Holy Ghost. THE only one that is GOOD!
Ecclesiastes 3:18 "I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts."
Ecclesiastes 3:19 "For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. " Ecclesiastes 3:20 "All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again. " Ecclesiastes 3:21 "Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?"
Hopefully you know I have not the answer to your question nor do I believe anyone else does. Saying how they go to heaven if by the blood of Christ? Well animals don't have sin, as humans do, so I believe they are on a different scale than us. Of coarse this is just my opinion. I agree our concern should most definitely be for other souls of people rather than bugs.
Still, I believe animals are a beautiful creation of our Father and carry His finger print. Seeing butterflies, dogs, birds flying and singing would be beautiful in Heaven. To me. But as said I guess there is only one way to find out the truth. It is all up to God.
Revelation 5:13 - And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, [be] unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
As this verse states every "creature" which is in Heaven. Could it merely mean just Angels with humans? Or animals also? God knows and one day we will too my brother.
God Bless.
With the Book of Revelation, it is the one Book that is filled with imagery & symbolism, so I can see how some things may be taken literally or symbolically, whether justifiably or not. With the matter of the horses, or the beast rising from the sea, or even the sword coming out from the Saviour's mouth, my understanding is that these are all imagery given to John to depict future events that were kept obscure to him to some extent.
Anyway, we will just have to agree to disagree on this matter along with the shape of the Earth belief, & base our acceptance of & love for each other on things that are more precious & abiding. Every blessing Richard.
As you know we can all have different views on things of the Eternal realm or Heaven. My belief is there are animals in Heaven but of coarse the only ones who know for sure are not here, in earth, anymore.
One verse from the Bible that may point to this is Revelation 19:11. When our Lord comes down from Heaven riding on a white horse.
Of coarse not to dispute anything with you my brother. Just thought I would note that verse.
God Bless you Chris.
If we looked at any Scripture which reveals the beings & activity in Heaven (then & now), all we see is God's Presence & the Heavenly Host which comprise the living beings around Him. And then in the Book of the Revelation we see more, as in the Elders & those saints robed in white. We never see animals (or, their souls) in Heaven, nor do we read about them as having any part in a resurrection, to which only humans who accountable to God, have.
And then we could try to understand the purpose of the creation of plants & animals. Again, views may be many on this, but I just see all these as God's Plan to beautify the Earth (for His Sake & ours) with the things & creatures that will enjoy life & point man's heart back to his Creator. Of course, both plants & animals serve as sacrifice & food for our existence as well. So, in short, my view is that animals are not in Heaven, only those who have been created for Heaven & those appointed to salvation & eternal life.
So what are you referring to when you write: "the life-force (man's spirit, which you explained earlier), doesn't travel to heaven - it means the time of future life rests with God"? I'm confused as to what you are trying to say here. Where does man's spirit go upon his death, if at all? I can't see any misrepresentation of your comments on my part - just reading as given & requiring further clarification, if you so desire. Thank you.
a. "How can one be lost if Jesus saves him? If Jesus saves (i.e. saved by having faith in Jesus' sacrificial work on the Cross & subsequently indwelt by the Holy Spirit), then no one, whether oneself, another, the Devil, can 'un-save' you. The problem arises when we see a believer, hear his testimony & see his new life, & we deem him a saved/born again person. But do we really know what happened in that encounter with the Spirit of God? Was there contrition for sin, true repentance, & a re-birth experience? We can never know, nor are we given such licence to do so - that is God's department. We are just to accept each other, love each other & encourage each other in our faith. So, the true believer cannot be lost & the test is his continual hatred of anything that smells of sin, his struggle against it as well as a great desire to please God & live for Him. If he wants to & relishes sin, then "by their fruits ye shall know them" ( Mt 7:20).
b. "Once ur saved aren't u saved eternally?" Yes we are because God's Spirit has done the saving & not man. Sometimes, the Gospel preacher can get so excited & proactive in sharing the Gospel, he won't stop until he gets a confession of sin & prayer of repentance from the unbeliever. We are to preach & persuade from the Scriptures & leave it to the Spirit to take over. So many of those are then convinced that they are now born again & end up derelicts in faith & their final end made worse than the beginning. The Scripture I often use in support is in 1 John 5:13: "These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that YE MAY KNOW that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." We can know now - Today - that the salvation Christ has given us is real & the promise of eternal life is our possession now. There are many religions, including the RCs & Muslims, that have to wait for God's final judgement to know their destiny - Jesus makes it certain for us.
Just compare your life today to those first days when you asked Jesus to come in your heart. You read your Bible. You asked the Holy Spirit to help you understand what you have read. He's your Teacher, and the Spirit of Jesus; your Comforter; your Convictor when you make mistakes, your Helper. He's here for you, now.
Pray this prayer to return to your first Love:
Lord, after what I've read today, I don't want to allow any spirit of compromise in my life! I now understand that the doctrine of the Nicolaitans is compromise with the world. Lord, I don't want to live with one foot in the church and another foot in the world. I want to break free completely from the world and its influence so I can give myself completely to Your cause! I want to be holy, to live in a way that pleases You, and to experience Your power in my life. Today I am renewing my commitment to You all over again! I turn from the world, and I am running to You!
I pray this in Jesus' Name!
Attend a full Gospel Church that teaches the same Gospel of Jesus Christ that you read in your Bible. Anything preached to you from a pulpit should be verified BY YOU in your Bible. Not a SOFT on sin Church. Revelation speaks of the Doctrine of the "Nicolaitans." Google that word. We need to know what it means (compromise).
Prophesy from the Bible teaches us in last days: the Falling Away of the Church; also Apostacy in the Church.
The temptation is to fall away and Follow the world, instead of Jesus Christ. The pull for us to do that is powerful. Who is the Tempter? Satan!
If you will study these things and not be a seeker of quick, easy, painless Christian belief, you will know more than most people.
Nicolaitans are domineering; hard on obedience and light on sin. Don't fall into that trap. JESUS said he HATED the doctrine of them.
Follow what Jesus says in the Bible.
Mishael
Once ur saves aren't u saved eternally
Or can somebody urself or another make u lose ur salvation? And at what point can u ?
LOVE