Revelation
King James Version (KJV)
Discuss Revelation 12 Page 8
Viewing page: 8 of 69
< Previous Discussion Page Next Discussion Page >
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17
Do you have a Bible comment or question?
Posting comments is currently unavailable due to high demand on the server.
Please check back in an hour or more. Thank you for your patience!
And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
This verse refers to Herod the Great who was broken by disease.
Revelation 12:4
And in his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
Herod attempted to try to stop the ascension of the Prince of princes to the throne in earth, and the dragon tried to prevent the ascension The Prince of princes to the Throne in Heaven.
John 6:63 ....the words that I speak unto you, THEY ARE SPIRIT
1 Corinthians 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto to you SPIRITUAL, but as unto CARNAL ....
Galatians 3:28 ....there is neither male or female, for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Ephesians 5:32 This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the CHURCH.
Christ is the husband, we are the WOMAN (spiritually speaking), we are the Church (spiritually speaking). We are to KEEP SILENT before our husband and to keep SILENT in the CHURCH.
1 John 2:27 But the anointing which you (the woman) have received of him (your husband) abideth in you (the woman), and you (the woman) need not that any man teach you (the woman): but as the same anointing (your husband) teacheth you (the woman) all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it (your husband) hath taught you (the woman), ye (the woman) shall abide in him (your husband) (and you shall become one flesh).
1 Timothy 2:14 And Adam (Christ, spiritually speaking) was not deceived, but the WOMAN (the CHURCH, spiritually speaking) bring deceived was in the transgression.
1 Timothy 2:15 Notwithstanding she (the woman, the church) shall be saved in childbearing ....
Revelation 12:2 And she (the woman, the church) being with CHILD cried, travailing in birth, and pained to BE DELIVERED.
You commented, God is perfect he cannot produce something not perfect that's where I think in between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 the rebellion in heaven could have happened and lucifer came down and screwed things with the other angels that rebelled.
I thought God, through Jesus, created ALL THINGS. Since he created lucifer and lucifer sinned, then lucifer wasn't created perfect. This is what other verses say:
Romans 8:20 Because the creature (creation) ITSELF was made subject to VANITY, NOT WILLINGLY ..
Romans 9:21 Hath the potter not power over the clay, or the SAME LUMP to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour.
God' word says he did not make everything perfect in the beginning, BUT he through the REBIRTH of everyone by SPIRIT will make ALL THINGS PERFECT. IN HIS appointed time; eternity has a lot of time.
Maybe Revelations account of Satan falling from heaven represents something different and at another time.
Revelation 1:3 ...for the TIME IS AT HAND
Doesn't seen those words would apply to something that occurred back in Genesis.
Revelation 1:1 ....An SIGNIFIED it ...
Sounds like Revelation represents; through WORD SYMBOLS, things that mean something other than
what a dictionary would define them as.
Matthew 12:38 But if I CAST OUT devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God (Christ in you) is come unto you.
Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven... (maybe heaven SIGNIFIES something)
Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was CAST OUT (of heaven)..
Jesus said he cast Satan out of YOU
Revelation said out of heaven. Could heaven SIGNIFY YOU.
Revelation 21:1 And I saw a NEW HEAVEN (where CHRIST IN YOU, dwells). SIGNIFIED.
Food for thought, the Spirit reveals.
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1 John 2:22
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confessenot that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a Deceiver and an antichrist.
Names of Satan
23. Dragon
Satan is called the dragon.
And the great dragon was cast down, the old serpent, he that is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world; he was cast down to the earth, and his angels were cast down with him ( Revelation 12:9).
The term dragon is associated with those who oppose God.
24. Old Serpent
He is also known as the old serpent.
And the great dragon was cast down, the old serpent, he that is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world; he was cast down to the earth, and his angels were cast down with him ( Revelation 12:9).
This reminds us of the Garden of Eden when Satan came to Adam and Eve in the form of a serpent. It speaks of his cunning.
25. Deceiver Of The Whole World
This fallen angel deceives the unbelieving world.
And the great dragon was cast down, the old serpent, he that is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world; he was cast down to the earth, and his angels were cast down with him ( Revelation 12:9).
Deception is what this being is all about - he is the master deceiver.
26. Accuser Of God's People
God's people are constantly accused by this evil
Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, proclaiming, "Now have come the salvation and the power and the king
The believe the Woman is Israel, If you take it from verse 5 it says she brought forth a Man Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. That's the Lord Jesus Christ. The church didn't come along and birth Christ. Christ came along to build his Church.
Revelation 12:4-6. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
AND SHE BROUGHT FORTH A MAN CHILD, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
Also in verse 1 You see a description of her that parallels with her in Genesis 37 when Joseph dreamed. Jacob interpreted the dream by the sum, moon, and stars mentioned.
Revelation 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman CLOTHED WITH THE SUN, AND THE MOON UNDER HER FEET, AND UPON HER HEAD A CROWN OF TWELVE STARS:
Genesis 37:9-10. And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, THE SUN AND THE MOON AND THE ELEVEN STARS MADE OBEISANCE TO ME.
And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, WHAT IS THIS DREAM THAT THOU HAST DREAMED? SHALL I AND THY MOTHER AND THY BRETHREN indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?
God bless.
but they will work with the two witnesses against the red Dragon to help the
Church of the Lord- Revelation 12:v.16-in a moment of terrible persecution.
By the way, red Dragon is the NEW NAME OF THE OLD SERPENT in this current time of Apocalypse, also called the Devil and SATAN- Revelation 12:v.9.
May CHRIST IS US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.
Luke 17:21 ....Behold, the kingdom of God is WITHIN YOU.
Matthew 12:28 But if I (Christ) cast out DEVILS by the SPIRIT OF GOD, then the kingdom of God has come unto you.
Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was CAST OUT ....
Revelation 11:15 ...The kingdoms of this world (Satan in us) are become the kingdoms of God (CHRIST IN US), and his Christ; and he shall reign (IN US) for ever and ever.
Colossians 1:27 ...This mystery...CHRIST IN YOU...
GARDEN OF GOD
Song of Solomon 5:1 I (Christ) am come unto my GARDEN...
Isaiah 58:11 ...and thou shall be like a watered GARDEN....
Isaiah 61:11 ...and as the GARDEN causeth the things that are sown it to spring forth; so the Lord WILL CAUSE righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.
Ezekiel 36:35 And they shall say, This land (kingdom of God) that was DESOLATE is become like the GARDEN OF EDEN ...
Genesis 2:9 ...And the TREE OF LIFE also in the midst of the GARDEN, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
Isaiah 51:3 For the Lord shall comfort Zion (His chosen): he will comfort all her waste places: and he WILL MAKE her wilderness like EDEN, and her deserts like the GARDEN OF THE LORD: joy and gladness shall be found therein, thanksgiving, and the voice of melody.
Genesis 3:8 ..the Lord God walking in the GARDEN..
Ezekiel 31:8 The cedars in the GARDEN OF GOD could not hide him: the fir trees were not like his boughs, and the chestnut trees were not like his branches: nor any tree in the GARDEN OF GOD were like unto him (Christ) in his beauty.
WE ARE THE GARDEN OF GOD....CHRIST IN US...
Does Revelation 20:8 have a relationship with Jeremiah 15:8?
Revelation 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as THE SANDS OF THE SEA.
Jeremiah 15:7-8 And I will fan them with a fan in the gates of the land; I will bereave them of children, I will destroy my people, since they return not from their ways.
8 Their widows are increased to me above THE SANDS OF THE SEAS: I have brought upon them against the mother of the young men a spoiler at noonday: I have caused him to fall upon it suddenly, and terrors upon the city.
These two prophets are referencing the SAME LITERAL battle known as WWIII where the heavens rejoice our demise.
Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Actually Michael Judges and makes WAR- Revelation 12:v.7 &16:v.13-16. After the battle or ending the battle, Michael will lay hold on the Dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and will bind him a thousand years, and will cast him into the bottomless pit, he will shut him up and will set a seal upon him, that the Devil deceives the nations no more. This is wonderful. Rev.20:v.1-3.
But how could Michael stand up and make war - Revelation 12:v.7- and Judging, if he not born first, just as Jesus and John the Baptist were born? Impossible of course. You see, it's very difficult in the midst of so much confusion to speak of the true revelation that God's Word brings unto us. Who is going to believe the true revelation that is within everyone's reach, living in this spiritual hostile environment full of speculation, and presumption, and conjectures, and apostasies, and cunningly devised fables, and so on?
This end-of-days moment and end of the second covenant, is very complicated unto us to understand and preaching what will really happen because the earth is infested with tares. Michael will lay hold on the Dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and will bind him a thousand years, and will cast him into the bottomless pit, he will shut him up and will set a seal upon him, that the Devil DECEIVES THE NATIONS NO MORE. This is wonderful. Rev.20:v.1-3.
Greetings in Christ JESUS,
Thank you for your reply
OK, no debate, but the Truth matters.
Although some things you commented, according to your theory, are doubtful and need of confirmation, remember that Revelation 12:v.17, and 12:v.12, and 9:11, and 11:7, and 17:8, that you mentioned in your post, all them are linked to what our Lord JESUS said in Revelation 1:v.1:
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ,
which God gave unto Him,
to shew unto His servants things which must shortly COME to PASS;(future exclusively)
and He sent and signified it by His angel
unto His servant John:
Please, I do not want to cause or start a debate because similar has been taught for many years, this is just to point out a few things you may look at in your study.
The seven years come from Daniel 9:27, if that prophecy has been fulfilled what does that change?
In Revelation 12:17 the original text, the dragon (Satan) is standing on the sands of the sea after he is cast down permanently to earth with no more access to heaven. Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. Does that change the scene? Peaceful it will not be.
In Revelation mainly there are Satan, the beast, and a false prophet. From long ago there were angels that left their estate and were locked in chains of darkness in the bottomless pit. We are told in ( Revelation 9:11) the king of the bottomless pit is in Hebrew Abaddon, in Greek Apollyon both meaning destruction the same meaning as perdition like son of.
In Revelation the beast comes from the bottomless pit, ( Revelation 11:7) ( Revelation 17:8) With this in mind, do these verses imply this beast being a man?
The word sea can symbolize peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues, it can also refer to the Mediterranean Sea, also the abyss, and the bottomless pit.
I hope you take this well, it is just something you may look at in your studies. If you still feel confident in your interpretation that's ok. There are things we will not know until they happen and as long as we are watching, we are ready, our faith is strong, we walk in the Spirit of truth, we stand for Jesus, and we are prepared for what we may have to face, even if it is death.
God bless,
RLW
The battle is spiritual exclusively against a devilish trinity - three unclean spirits like frogs that come out of the MOUTH of
the Dragon, and out of the MOUTH of the Beast, and out of the MOUTH of the False Prophet.
The War against these three unclean spirits is in aquatic and terrestrial environments, polluted with spirits like frogs.
What strategy should be adopted for this war to fight them?
The strategy of the main enemy in this war is known to those on the front lines. Revelation 12:v.13-17
13 And when the Dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
15 And the serpent (the Dragon*)cast out of his MOUTH water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the Dragon cast out of his MOUTH.
17 And the Dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make War with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
The testimony of Jesus Christ is the Spirit of prophecy.
* Dragon is the new name of Devil in this time of Apocalypse.
Armageddon in Hebrew tongue - Ar - Mag - Eddon. Contraction of three words: Air ( ) - Magog - Eddon (red) .
The testimony of Jesus Christ is the Spirit of prophecy.
The day that CHRIST IN YOU arrived, a living FIRE was ALSO kindled IN YOU (for our God is a consuming FIRE Hebrews 12:29).
If you have ever watched a trash pile be burned, you know it takes time. Even after the flames died down the coals stay alive under the surface. If other trash is put upon the coals the flame appears and destroys them also. CHRIST IS OUR FIRE; live in peace of this knowledge; you will become PERFECT, like him. He will DESTROY the unwanted trash in you. He knows exactly when and how. We are the POT he is the POTTER; be still and behold THE SALVATION OF GOD. Knowing the END (you will be created in the IMAGE OF GOD) CAUSES us through Christ's GRACE to ENDURE.
When CHRIST IN YOU arrived the ACCUSER was cast out.
Revelation 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is SALVATION, and strength, and the kingdom of GOD (CHRIST IN YOU), and the power of his Christ: for the ACCUSER of our brethren is CAST DOWN, which accused them before our God day and night.
Philippians 4:7 And the PEACE OF GOD, which passeth all understanding, shall KEEP your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
It seems we are not on the same page. I'm sorry my reply was not clear. I will try again but let's not be disrespectful. The thread you first replied to about the abomination of desolation was discussing teaching I do not agree with. It is called the seven years of tribulation using the last week in ( Daniel 9:27). It developed in the 17th Century, and it quickly led to an understanding that the Rapture of the Church would be an event separate from and before the second coming of Christ.
The beast does only have 42 months. It starts in Revelation 12 when Michael stands up and Satan is cast down to earth, the third woe. ( Revelation 12:7-9) Satan then gives his power, seat, and great authority to the beast. ( Revelation 13:2-8)
There is another beast with two horns, the false prophet, ( Revelation 13:11-18) he is the one that does miracles, fires from heaven, creates the image of the beast, and causes who will not worship this image to be killed, this beast causes people to take the mark of the beast all in 42 months.
This is just a small bit of information but I hope it makes sense and clears up misunderstanding. If I may and not offend, may I suggest studying the day of the Lord?
RLW
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.
Revelation 12:7
And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels (demons)
Psalms 91:11 - For he (GOD) shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee in all thy ways.
Luke 22:43 - And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.
Hebrews 1:14 - Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for THEM who shall be heirs of salvation?
Acts 27:23 - For there stood by me (Paul) this night the angel of God, whose I am, and whom I serve.
Psalms 103:20 Bless the LORD, ye his angels, that excel in strength, that do HIS commandments, hearkening unto the voice of his word.
Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
COMMENT: The Lord's Prayer is our best example! Matthew 6. This is how we ask God for what we need. The angels are sent by God. They obey God; and we are to ask God for angelic assistance.
Hebrews 1:14
Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be HEIRS of salvation?
Last but not least, Ephesians 6. The spirit world is invisible, but can manifest in various ways. This is why we are to be growing our faith on SCRIPTURE (not Hollywood).
2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this FIRST, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
This says you can't take one verse and come to truth, you have to combine verses from other parts of scripture to know the message.
I suppose you are making reference to Revelation 12 where Satan was cast from heaven. Let's put other verses with this and see if truth appears.
Matthew 12:28 But if I CAST OUT DEVILS by the Spirit of GOD, then the kingdom of God is COME UNTO YOU.
Christ is casting out Satan so he can dwell IN YOU (THE NEW HEAVEN).
Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven... Colossians 1:27 ...this MYSTERY, Christ in you....
Revelation 12:7 And there was WAR IN HEAVEN (Spirit vs. flesh) (in you) Michael (Spirit) and his angels fought against the dragon (flesh); and the dragon fought and his angels.
Revelation 12:8 And (flesh, dragon and his angels) prevailed not; neither was their (dragon and his angels) place found ANY MORE IN HEAVEN (in you where Christ dwells).
Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was CAST OUT (if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God), that old serpent (that deceived Eve), called the devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the WHOLE WORLD; he was CAST OUT....
Revelation 12:10 And I heard a loud voice (truth) saying in heaven (in you), Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of HIS CHRIST....
Luke 10:17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
Luke 10:18 And he said to them, I beheld SATAN as lightning falling from heaven (those that Satan was CAST OUT OF).
God bless!
I guess I will only give a little reply to this question from what I perceive. To begin with Lucifer it is known, I believe, that he was such a perfect angel, created by God, that he began to exult himself even to the point he wanted to be seated on God's throne. Then maybe when God put him in his place he is said to have gathered 1/3 of the angels in Heaven to follow him and make war against God. If this is correct here is a couple Scriptures of these things. Revelation 12:3-4, Revelation 12:7-9.
There is also the account of "other angels" who were banished, from Heaven, for what they did. In the Bible this account is not very detailed of the sons of God(angels) coming down and mingling with the daughters of men and making "giants" or hybrid angel/humans. Genesis 6. This was the main reason why God flooded the world with Noah and the ark etc. In the book of Enoch this story is much more detailed about what happened.
Verses of the "angels that sinned" 2 Peter 2:4-5, Jude 1:6. It is shown that even angels have free will.
As there may have been more to your question I hope what I have stated may have helped somewhat for an answer.
God Bless.
That quotation does not appear in the Bible. Jesus is very clear that we are to follow His example and none other.
As for the requirements to be a leader (pastor) in the church, we have 1 Timothy.
1Ti 3:1-7 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. (2) A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; (3) Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; (4) One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; (5) (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) (6) Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. (7) Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
A "bishop" here is a pastor.
To Him be the glory forever Amen.
Although fasting is seen as a good thing, as far as I know, there is no commandment given to Christians to do so. Matthew 6:16-18 gives us the correct understanding of fasting. The Jews were required to fast only once a year at the Day of Atonement. On the Day of Atonement they fast. But the Pharisees fasted twice a week, every Monday and Thursday. That's 104 times a year! But the requirement was to only fast once a year. The Pharisees wanted to show themselves as being "Super Spiritual."
Now, you touched on something that should be the goal of every believer, which is about the next step in one's spiritual walk. After salvation, the next step is to have our minds transformed. We are to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and we are to submit ourselves to His humbling process. You call it "rocks and weeds," and I like that. Here is something you should know. If you have received Jesus Christ (Been born of His Spirit), there is no "hard soil" to break up. That's already been far penetrated and broken up since you've received Him. (See Parable of the Sower).
However, once we are saved, the effects of sin in our past remain stuck in the cortex of our minds. We can't get away from that. So we have to submit ourselves to the Lord so He can mend us from our past and so that He can transform us and renew our minds.
Sorry if I'm getting off-topic. If you choose to fast, that is between you and the Lord. It should be done in secret. It doesn't necessarily mean to give up food for the day, even though food can be a distraction. But if you decide to fast, just put aside a time where it's just you and the Lord, clear your mind of all worldly distractions, and just focus on Christ and His word. It should be a one on one time with Him without distraction. But just so you know, there is no commandment given to believers to fast.
Your question is, what must I do?
You answered your on question in the sentence preceding you question.
I HAVE LEARNED God wants to clear out the "rocks and weeds" in my life breaking up the hard soil.
GOD IS FAITHFUL IN ALL HIS WANTS. HE will do the work. Sit still and behold the salvation (WORKS) of God.
Psalms 57:2 I will cry into God most high; unto God THAT PERFORMETH ALL THINGS FOR ME.
As to fasting in God's eyes the answer is in Isaiah 58
I have been studying on the subject of fasting. It is something I have never personally participated in nor fully comprehend. In reading Matthew 13:1-23 I have learned God wants to clear out the "rocks and weeds" in my life breaking up the hard soil. So my question is how? What must I do to take this next step in my spiritual walk? Is it structured or done during a certain month? I would appreciate any feedback, guidance, or further reading to be considered before moving forward.
Sincerely,
Stephanie
You are very welcome. Thanks for the blessing. May the Lord continue to bless you with understanding as you remain in His word!
My understanding is that the woman represents Israel, and the child is Christ. My reason for believing that the woman is Israel and the child is Christ comes from Genesis Chapter 37, the story of Joseph and his brothers, where we get the sun and the moon, and the twelve stars.
The sun and moon represented his parents, and the 12 stars represented the twelve tribes of Israel. This is referring to the nation Israel. And the Messiah was prophesied to come through Israel.
Revelation 12:5 gives us the description of the male child: It says "And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron:" That's the Messiah in Psalm Chapter 2 Verses 8 and 9. And then it goes on to say that her child was caught up unto God. That's the ascension. And to His throne!
And then Revelation 12:6 tells us that the woman (Israel/Jews) fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days, or 3-1/2 years.
Many believe that this is the rock city of Petra that is already supplied with food out in the wilderness, so that when those who are sealed by God, the 144,000 especially, they will have a place to go.