Romans
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Romans 11:16-24 shows Israel as distinct from the Church: the "natural branches" are the Jews, and the "wild branches" are the Gentiles.
The "olive tree" is the collective people of God. The "natural branches" (Jews) are "cut off" the tree for unbelief, and the "wild branches" (believing Gentiles) are grafted in. This has the effect of making the Jews "jealous" and then drawing them to faith in Christ, so they might be grafted in again and receive their promised inheritance.
The natural branches are still distinct from the "wild branches," so that God's covenant with His people is literally fulfilled.
Romans 11:26-29, citing Isaiah 59:20-21 Isaiah 27:9; Jeremiah 31:33-34
Isaiah 62:11-12 "Behold, the LORD hath proclaimed unto the end of the world, Say ye to the daughter of Zion, Behold, thy salvation cometh; behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.
And they shall call them, The holy people, The redeemed of the LORD: and thou shalt be called, Sought out, A city not forsaken.
Moses' prediction of Israel's permanent restoration to the land in Deuteronomy 30:1-10.
Moses said, "THE LORD YOUR GOD WILL CIRCUMCISE YOUR HEARTS!!
SO HOW WILL "ALL ISRAEL BE SAVED?
Zechariah 8-14 , which speak of end-times Israel at Christ's return.
The key verse describing the coming to faith of the future remnant of Israel is Zechariah 12:10.
This occurs at the end of the tribulation.
Also; Zechariah 8:7-8.
Israel will be regathered from the ends of the earth ( Isaiah 11:12.
Isaiah 62:10.
Zechariah 13:8-9
Isaiah 12:1-6 is their song of deliverance.
God bless.
Part 2.
This section is not pointing fingers towards you are anyone in particular.
Deuteronomy 7:6-8 is a portion of scripture that has made an envious world hate the Jews and sadly some of the body of Christ has been compromised by this evil.
"For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.
The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:
But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt"
Verse 6 is what they take issue with. "For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, ABOVE ALL PEOPLE THAT ARE UPON THE FACE OF THE EARTH"
Some would like to have this said about them, so they render this to the Church.
However, be at ease the church was not in the world when this verse was given,
And the Church is never called people of the earth or earth dwellers.
However, If I'm wrong and God chooses them over the Church, he has the right to do so, it's his creation.
Deuteronomy 7:7-8 emphasizes God's elect! He didn't choose them for any particular reason. It is not the Church.
The Church was never redeemed out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.
Israel is part of God's plan of salvation explained in Romans 11:11-33.
I find it amazing that the same people who say you can't be saved by the law of Moses "and rightfully so"
They acknowledge scriptures like 2 Corinthians 3:6-7 Galatians 3:19-25 when defending their own imperfections but say Israel failed because they couldn't.
God bless.
It's evident today that they are still haven't accepted their Messiah and they're still without a King.
There is two stcks involved and they shall be joined and David shall be king over them. "Some say this will be literally David and others say Jesus" I believe it will be Jesus.
However we know neither is over there today. This is future.
Some say God broke those promises to Abraham because of Israel's disobedience or the promises was fulfilled at the cross.
If God was going to use Abraham to make a nation out of him, Note, (We're not talking about seed or Children, we're talking about Nation!)
The seed is Christ,
The Children is those which are of faith. and The Nation is Israel. "Our topic"
So, If God was going to use Abraham to make a Nation to make his name great amongst the nations and all those promises to Israel in the OT was "spiritually" a promise to the Church, and Israel was chosen to be the model and those promises wasn't for them why didn't God just use any other people like the Ismaelites or any other of Abraham's children descendants if they and the promises were figuratively?
There's promises of punishment if they disobey There is also promises of restoration that had nothing to do with obedience.
God's equity is in him bringing Israel back to their own Land and perform Romans 11:26.
"And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
God bless
Amen, brother, God's plan; for salvation to go to the Gentile's branches had to be broken off to make a way for us to be grafted in, Romans 11:11-33, this may be one of the reasons Jesus spoke in parables. The time may be near but once the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled, Israel will be grafted back in. God's plan is not complete until Israel is also grafted back into the people of God to share in the promises to Abraham. Whenever the Gentile's time is fulfilled, we see what comes next Revelation 19:11-21 they welcome and accept their King and the two sticks become one again and the Kingdom set up.
God bless,
RLW
Man is incapable of knowing how Holy and Just God is and we're also incapable of knowing how evil man is apart from the restrainer.
We see a picture of the evil of man in Revelation when the nations take up war against the Lord.
Also look at the evil condition of their heart here in Revelation 16:9-11 while being tormented.
Also see Psalms 2:1-12.
Romans 11:33 states. "O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
God gives life and he can take it!
The trouble with atheist is that they don't believe God gave life!
They have no understanding of deity.
See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.
For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.
If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me. Deuteronomy 32:39.
God gives and he takes away.
God bless.
The question that arises is this; since we are "grafted in" hence Jews and Gentiles are part of God's elect in this age as we see illlustrated in Romans 11. If we continue to verse 23; however we see that even Jews are grafted in once they believe in the truth about Jesus. ( Romans 11:25). We also see this principle in Luke 21:24 as well as various Old Testament scriptures about the Resurrection of all saints ( Daniel 12:13) and King David himself ruling with Christ ( Daniel 7:27 and other passages). There are those who stubbornly only consider these promises to be fulfilled in the church and say God is done with Israel. This helps to discount a millennium as something which is symbolic of the church (even though that has lasted almost 2000 years now since Pentecost). I would say that we need to draw the line if there is a display of antisemitism; for instance with a superiority complex developing because of these theories. Admittedly there is much evil among all; including those Jews who are living in unbelief when we see; for instance Tel Aviv and the abominations of those living out a lifestyle like Sodom ( Revelation 13:16-17). We also need to seek out individuals whether Jew or Gentile to preach the Good News; without partiality to anyone. Finally; there is difficulty with some in regard to sacrifices actually occurring in the Millennium; deeming them an abomination as Christ has already fulfilled all things necessary. That would depend on the purpose of these; as to commemorating God and having a ceremonial purification; for instance. Such activity would help to bring all to worship in Israel; fulfilling prophecies such as Isaiah 56:7 and Zechariah 14:17. Despite all this; I wouldn't consider this essential doctrine to break fellowship but important nonetheless to get a correct grip on the rest of scriptures to avoid what could be bigger error of essential truths.
In truth; there will be great regret undoubtably for many left behind after the Rapture. In light of Psalm 40 and verses which promise that the Jews will be provoked to jealousy ( Romans 11:14; although perhaps taken out of context) my previous post meant to show that such a shock may be necessary; to jump start the 144,000 the remnant of Jews who finally realize we were right after all. The fact is when the Restrainer is removed everyone will realize how the Lord had used His body of believers to bring some solace and order in their lives. Like it or not; things will get WAY worse then we can imagine almost overnight.
It is hard to fathom just how much believers affect all facets of society until they are removed. I need to point out that MANY who consider themselves Christians will be left behind if I am understanding scripture correctly. If not there couldn't be the "Mystery Babylon" false church that is alluded to in the beginning of Revelation and expanded in later chapters in both and economic and spiritual realm. It is pretty clear that anyone who is a true believer after the Rapture will be persecuted (as I see it beginning with the false church and later on from Antichrist himself). At that time there will be a true manifestation of signs and wonders through the two witnesses; and of course demonic imitations will commence with the False Prophet along with false christs.
It appears that the incense of the prayers of the saints mentioned in Revelation could be something that the glorified saints are involved with as it would seem that as John saw all that was happening we will also. It is certain that we will return at Armageddon as part of His army. Jesus of course does all the work; we as Psalm 91:8 indicates will only see the destruction of the wicked. It appears that we will also see those souls under the altar ( Rev. 6:10) who are petitioning God.
Be ready.
"I hope the Lord waits until my kids grow up; get married; etc."
"I hope the Lord lets me stay until (so and so) becomes a Christian"
"I'll show 'em; let me be one of the 144,000; or hang out afterwards it can't be that bad at the start..."
The facetious dialogues suggested above are more are less a compilation of several arguments BELIEVERS have given in my presence in the past when this subject came up. Let us examine them in light of the scriptures...
First point; in heaven there will be no regret as far as "missing out" on anything this earth had to offer. That is; unless we have squandered the opportunity NOW to witness and do those things which forfeited rewards in light of the admonitions of Revelation 3:11. Our children will be where their angels are already "beholding the Father in heaven continually." ( Matt. 18:10).
The second argument assumes that God is somehow derelict in His duty to bring the "fullness of the Gentiles in" ( Romans 11:25) which in truth may not occur completely at the Rapture but before the Second Coming. Nonetheless; the multitudes that come to Christ that can't be counted may never have come at least as quickly without the fiery trials the Lord designed to purge out the dross during the Tribulation. ( Revelation 7:9). We should also appreciate the fact in verses such as Psalm 40 which states "many will see and fear" (verse 3). This seems to indicate with the surrounding verses we will be raptured/resurrected from the ground; SURELY the Resurrection of the saints cannot be explained away and will be common knowledge (even if they say the UFO's abducted those raptured it's harder to explain those already deceased).
The third point is that even in the seal judgments there is a direct opening of these seals by Christ Himself with a fourth of the earth dying (at least) at that time. No one can outplan or outwit God in saving provisions for that time (see James 5:3).
In general, Christ's arrival as a suffering servant which should have been clearly understood from Isaiah 53 was largely missed even by the 12 disciples who expected a conquering king. This was to be in the future; as was made clear by the reading of the scroll when Jesus read Isaiah 61:1 and stopped before 61:2 which involves His return. Christ knew what was in the heart of men ( John 2:24-25) so He didn't need anyone to explain themselves to Him. This discernment in the Spirit is a spiritual gift; but with Christ who was God in the flesh He had the fullness of the Spirit without limit ( John 3:34).
Christ also came to forgive men's sins. This was considered blasphemy by the religious leaders who immediately tried to stone Him in John 8:59 after these claims in verse 58 as being the "I am". Clearly; the contentious crowd at His trial before the crucifixion who demanded that He be crucified and Barabbas a murderer released showed the blindness of the condition of an unregenerate human heart. Judas Iscariot recognized through worldly sorrow that Christ was a righteous man that was betrayed ( Matthew 27:4 technically an "innocent man"); but the Centurion showed saving faith ( Matthew 27:54).
These passages demonstrate the importance of recognizing Christ as God the Son; not merely a good teacher or righteous man (see Matthew 16:13-20). The hidden significance of these things is still blinding the unregenerate ( 2 Cor. 4:3-4); and the Jews have been blinded until the time of the end as we seee in Romans 11:25. It is "in part" as there are Jews who recognize Christ (called Messianic Jews by some) but until Jesus is returning according to Zechariah 12-14 the nation as a whole won't recognize Him. This is quite remarkable as the world in general knows they are hiding from Christ and God's judgment during the sixth seal. This; no doubt is because of the epicenter of Antichrist's deception there.
Part 9.
His Role
Jesus lived a sinless life by always choosing to exercise faith in God, never sinning, thus He did not deserve the curse of the law; yet took the curse upon himself and trade for humanity.
How many times have unbelievers and believers alike said, it is not fair that all of humanity would pay the price of eternal damnation because of one man's choice, Adam's decision.
Yet, the righteousness of God is seen in that Humanity is saved, with the penalty of sin paid for by one man's choice, Jesus decision to take our place.
There is both quality and justice in the trade; wherein God's righteousness is maintained, while at the same time displaying mercy and grace.
This is the reason for 1 Corinthians 15:22, which states: "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive."
And 1 Corinthians 15:45, which states:
"And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit."
The only way that God could save fallen man was by Jesus becoming our kinsman Redeemer, by both purchasing us with His blood; while at the same time killing death for the sake of His family, "humanity" (And in the second coming destroying the enemies of his people).
Jesus stated in John 5:39:
"Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
All of God's Word has one purpose, it is the glorification of God ("Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him." Isaiah 43:7), and His Son Jesus Christ ( Ephesians 1:20-22; Romans 11:36; Colossians 1:12-19).
It is Jesus that deserves preeminence in God's Word.
All of these Old Testament types and shadows ( Hebrews 8:5; 10:1; Colossians 2:17) and figures (Theologically referred to as "Expositional Constancy" meant as object lessons to paint the picture of the Messiah, so that He would be recognizable when He came.
See Pt 10
Philippians 2:12,13: is Paul reminding them, 'you have God's Salvation, now work it out (i.e. don't be slack or negligent in living the new life that Christ has purchased for you), & do so in fear & trembling - living the Christian life is a serious, disciplined matter, under the ministry of the indwelling Holy Spirit.
"Our Faith, Belief, Repentance are WORKS and a RESULT and EVIDENCE of, not REQUIREMENTS for, Salvation." There certainly must be an on-going evidence of Faith, Belief & Repentance in a believer's life, but none of the passages suggest that they cannot be requirements towards Salvation.
Part 5: Ezekiel 36:24-33. Indeed, this passage is all of God's Action: that Israel would be released primarily from Assyrian/Babylonian captivity & then ultimately "from all countries". But what happened? Have they yet received "a new heart & a new spirittaking away the stony heart of flesh? Their Messiah came, gave His Life for them & they yet remain obstinate & stony in heart. I believe this will yet happen ( Romans 11:25-27), when Israel will be saved. How will they be saved? These verses don't divulge this information, except God's Act to take away their sins.
And so we go back to what Jesus had commanded & to which the apostles obeyed, Mark 1:14,15 "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: REPENT ye, and BELIEVE the gospel."
Acts 3:19, "REPENT ye therefore, and BE CONVERTED, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord" Israel in the future, will still need to believe & accept that Jesus was indeed their Messiah; maybe all Works in your understanding, but vital if they are to receive "a new heart & a new spirit".
I'll get to your new comment now.
I know you read all the comments.
I have made several comment that says Christ is the Kingdom of God, and he is.
Christ is the high priest in the Kingdom.
He is calling out a priesthood to server under him, and during the (1000 year, ONE DAY, now 2000 years) going on NOW, we will be ministering spirit, as is Christ during this AGE.
When he has gathered all his priest, he will resurrect the dead back to their flesh and blood bodies.
Blessed are the ones who believe without seeing.
All the UNBELIEVING Thomas will LITERALLY SEE, and TOUCH the nail prints in his body, and BE ASHAMED.
We will also be given HIS BODY, and bear those scars, being crucified with him.
When the trumpet sounds an army of ONE FLESH will appear.
Seeing is believing.
ALL judgement has been given to Christ, so by his resurrection, he made his judges flesh of his flesh and bone of his bone so they could judge in truth and mercy.
Romans 9:23 That he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels if mercy, which he hath afore prepared for glory.
Romans 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy on all.
Romans 11:31 .... that through your mercy they my also obtain mercy ...
God Bless YOU!
From Adam till the present, what is the SIN that separates man from God.
UNBELIEF
Adam didn't believe God's word.
National Israel didn't believe God's word.
Promised Israel today doesn't believe God's Word.
Paul was struggling with this same sin, UNBELIEF.
Romans 11:32 For God HATH concluded THEM ALL (including Paul) in UNBELIEF, that he may have MERCY ON ALL.
Proverbs 16:6 By MERCY and TRUTH iniquity (unbelief) is PURGED.
1 Timothy 1:13 Who (Paul) was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in UNBELIEF.
Romans 11:30 For YE in times past HAVE NOT BELIEVED GOD, yet have now obtained mercy because of their UNBELIEF.
Mark 9:24 .... Lord ....help thou my UNBELIEF .......
Matthew 17:20 ...because of your UNBELIEF .....
Every SIN is CAUSED by UNBELIEF.
God Bless YOU!
Part three,
Each believer is personally responsible for living in obedience to Christ's commands. 1 Timothy 4:16. Can we come up short, Hebrews 4:1. Some of the natural branches of the house of Israel were broken off for unbelief so the people of the nations who believe and are justified are grafted in. Believers/saved can be cut off if they do not continue in his goodness/grace. Romans 11:15-24.
Much of your post I agree, it is about becoming saved and our relationship with Jesus, and if we continue to abide in Him those scriptures apply. Concerning Pentecost, Peter was pleading that they accept Jesus as their Messiah that was promised, and they killed Him, not to repent from Judaism. Peter and the disciples at this time were still observing the old law. We see years later they were still debating it in Acts 15.
1 Cor. 9:27 If we look at the wording "But I keep under my body and bring it into subjection" it is as if his body is his adversary. It is like he was beating his body whether it is said metaphorical, but to the subduing of the natural appetites of the flesh, a life of self-denial not to succumb to the sins of the flesh. The Greek adokimos translated as castaway, is the same word for reprobate, Romans 1:28 Titus 1:16. I do not think Paul is talking about rewards.
Hebrews 3:12-13 This chapter starts with "Wherefore holy brethern" These are Christians, saved, verse 6 "if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end." The writer includes himself "If We". Verses 12 and 13 are to these same people and verse 14 says "For we are made partakers of Christ" Because they are made so they are saved believers in Christ.
1 John 1:7 If is conditional a choice if you walk in the light there is fellowship, if you don't walk in the light, you are outside of the fellowship.
See part four.
"Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off."
"4 But what saith the answer of God unto him(Elias)? I(God) have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."
Verse 6 implies that God choses whom to save not due the works he did but due to His grace. This verse is often used by those who claim a predestination plan of God. BUT lets read verse 4. Those who enjoy God's grace didn't kneel before Baal. SO salvation is a result of a free will, NOT of an arbitrary election of people by God.
Well, its getting late at night here. Have a blessed night (or day).
I have in other posts described why the Rapture is going to occur. It fulfills scriptures such as Malachi 3:16 in the book of remembrance of those who OFTEN talk about the Lord and it is to reward those who patiently wait for His coming ( James 1:12 and other supporting text). My commentary also discussed how it is for the reunion of all the saints; past and present at the Lord's feet; and for us to be presented in the church as "kings and priests" who will rule and reign with Him ( Rev. 5:10). We are the armies of heaven who will eventually return with Christ in Revelation 19:14; and be accompanied by angels as well.
Psalm 40:3 shows how many shall see and fear us being lifted up from the miry clay (verses 1-2). The provoking of the Jews to jealousy ( Romans 11:14) perhaps will occur when the times of the Gentiles are full ( Romans 11:25). In any event the time of Jacob's trouble is specifically for the week of testing for seven years ( Jeremiah 30:7; Daniel 9:26-27) which is also known as Daniel's 70th week.
Let us assume for a moment that the Rapture IS going to happen before the end of this year for instance. How many are ready for His coming? How many have their garments unspotted and unwrinkled ( Eph. 5:27). I have mentioned before that whether people believe the Rapture is Pretribulation or some other later date; it is the fruit of our lives that is most important. A theoretical concept won't keep those away who are true servants of the Master; but I guarantee those who are espousing a PreTrib Rapture but whose lives are not according to His will will by and large be shocked in many cases being left behind. Whether all these people never believed inthe first place or the Rapture is a reward issue; surely a great multitude will be saved but die as martyrs in the Tribulation ( Rev. 7:9). That is the purpose for the Tribulation for God's children; along with gathering the unregenerate for destruction.
Your use of Matthew 7:14 is misinterpreted because TRUE, few will find The Way but what does finding the way have to do with Election? For Election is NOT about works (finding The Way), but Election is ALL about God Choosing! Look at Rom. Ch.11, the whole chapter. It's all about God "cutting off" His Chosen for the sake of those NOT chosen. There are two types of elect; there are those Chosen before the foundation of the world, Ephesians 1:4. And those chosen, only because His Chosen were "cut off"! Romans 11:11-12. The Jews (Hebrew) for the Gentile, the vessels of wrath for the vessels of mercy, Romans 9:21-23 and Christ for the world, Matthew 27:46. This is a Pattern, a plummet line, a way for us to "measure" the things of God.
Re: Romans 11. Here too, I understand this passage differently. True, unbelieving Jews under the Law are also "under the curse" ( Galatians 3:10,11). And if they continued to place themselves under the Law, when that Law under that Covenant no longer existed (or, had become invalid), then they were doomed & cut out of the olive tree. There were still Jews that became believers ( Romans 11:5,7: the elect (Jews) had obtained salvation, along with the Gentiles who believed (also now the elect of God) & subsequently engrafted into the tree ( Romans 11:17-21)). So I believe that those who would not believe, received 'the spirit of blindness, deafness & slumber', but only temporary (v11), hopefully to be "provoked to jealousy", seeing the Gentiles have embraced the Messiah Whom they rejected & crucified.
But if the Law only 'matured', now to be embraced under the New Covenant, then the bindings & judgements of that Law must still weigh upon those in Christ. I see that there is more to the Old Law, than just a set of holy Commandments to be obeyed. It has to be cast off so that the one in Christ can truly come under the liberty & power that the Spirit gives. So the apostle could exclaim that he was now free from the law of sin & death, embracing the Law of the life-giving Spirit. If the old Law only 'matured' into the New, the full value of the New Covenant may be understood to be diminished.
And re: "fused together", I wasn't referring to the elect being fused together, but to the Law that was given under the Old Covenant to the Law under the New Covenant. But when the elect of Israel turn to the Lord, not only will the veil be taken away ( 2 Corinthians 3:16), but we, together with them can enjoy liberty in obedience to Christ; and particularly for the Jew, I would think that the transition would truly be liberating, giving the certainty & joy that the Law denied them. And we can see the emotion of Paul in his dealing with this subject in his letters.
Part 2.
Touching on their blindness.
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, (until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.) This is their current position.
26) And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Paul opens up this chapter with this. "I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
Romans 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
Verses 27-29. For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
This is a covenant of God unto them! And it is without repentance!
He do this for his name's sake as mentioned in Ezekiel 36:23-38.
This happens in the literal Millenium Kingdom right here on earth. It's to many details to say it happens spiritually or in our hearts.
So, if we take the Millenium kingdom to be right after the 70th week of Daniel, these conditions haven't been met yet.
So, if hold to a post-trib viewpoint where all the saints is raptured up at the end of the tribulation and judgement is poured out on all the rest of the world, Who's going to populate the Millenium?
God bless you Brother.
Part 1
We are 100% in agreement that the blood of Christ is by which we are saved throughout eternity.
Israel, "through the house of Israel" will be saved by the same way they were saved on the OT.
(But not all.) So, in Romans 11:26 where it says And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, I believe it's those of the house of Israel who will except Christ finished work on the cross. Their blindness will be removed when they call on Christ in the tribulation. You see the church is never called the house of Israel.
In the OT, before the Church was formed, those who were saved, by faith they looked ahead with those ordinances pointing them to one who would come as their redeemer "Christ"
We look back at the Cross in faith for our redemption, In the Millennium kingdom those who are saved will do the same.
Those who are saved will look back at the finish work of Christ on the cross. Everything else is a memorial. sacrifices etc.
During the tribulation period Israel will be driven to call on their Messiah as prophesied in Hosea 5:15. Also in Matthew 23:39.
obviously, they seen him again, He's saying you won't behold him again as a Nation. (They will remain blinded) as mentioned in Luke 19:42.
You also see this mentioned clearly in Zechariah 13:6-9.
Peter makes mention of a future salvation for the Nation/house of Israel in Acts 15:9-11 when studying it carefully.
And James follows it up in verses 14-17.
Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
See part 2.
Israel is God's elect and so is the Church both for different purposes.
If you are saying God is not through with Israel I also hold that view.
Here's more direct set of scriptures for the "Nation" of Israel.
Ezekiel 36:22-38.
Therefore say unto the "HOUSE" of Israel,
THUS SAITH THE LORD GOD; I DO NOT THIS FOR YOUR SAKES, O HOUSE OF ISRAEL BUT FOR MINE HOLY NAME'S SAKE, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went.
AND I WILL SANCTIFY MY GREAT NAME, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; AND THE HEATHEN SHALL KNOW THAT I AM THE LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I SHALL BE SANCTIFIED IN YOU BEFORE THEIR EYES.
( God will restore the Nation Israel for his Name sake )
Vs 36:24 For I will take you from among the heathen, AND GATHER YOU OUT OF ALL COUNTRIES, and will bring you into your own land.
( God is going to gather them of ALL Countries!)
There has never been a gathering like this and this certainly not the Church! The Church never possessed a Land.
Vs 36:26-28. A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
AND YE SHALL DWELL IN THE LAND THAT I GAVE TO YOUR FATHERS; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
There's no way to spiritualize this as to say this is the Church and God is going to rule in our hearts.
And the Spirit remains absent in them today so it didn't happen at the cross.
Again! Here's Paul pointed forward looking for salvation for his Kinsman of the flesh in Romans 11:1
"I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
Conclusion;
Romans 11:25-27.
This is after the cross!
More to come at a later date
God bless.
So, verses such as John 3:16 & Galatians 3:8,9, clearly show that God's Salvation Plan did include the Gentiles ("God so loved the world" & "justify the heathen through faith"), but God's primary focus was that His people Israel would be saved by the Gospel & then Acts 13:46-48 would take place. The Jews would have first inherited salvation's blessings & be a mighty beacon to the whole world of salvation's plan, yet rather, because of their rejection, the Gospel then came to us. And so we see Paul's great yearning for his people in spite of his primary calling to preach to the Gentiles; in Romans 11:14, "If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them". That through the abundant conversion of Gentiles, even through his ministry, his own people might be provoked to jealousy/rivalry (Gk. parazeloo), that he might also save some of them. That they too might inherit eternal life when their ears & hearts are opened, not only to the Gospel, but to the power of the Gospel, just as those of the Gentiles who came under the sound of it, were convicted & believed.
It would be hard to imagine what the State of Israel would be like today had they turned to Christ (as the firstfruits) - or would they have gone down the same road as the other nations, allowing Satan to gain a foothold into their hearts & government?
And so it was, that God had not forgotten or cast away His people ( Romans 11:1), but that the Messiah would be appointed & sent by God to Israel for their salvation - and what did they do? John 1:11, "He came unto his own, and his own received him not". Jesus saw their hard stubborn hearts, yet could still weep for them ( Luke 19:41,42). And as you wrote & implied, not only did they reject Jesus, ridiculed Him & crucified Him, but the day would come when they would recognize Him.
Paul wrote in Romans 11:12,15, "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?" For now, by their rejection, the Jews have failed to know & appropriate the immeasurable Love & Grace of God for them and by their "fall & diminishing", the Gentiles have been granted salvation through the preaching of the Gospel. So, if by their casting away, the rest of the world can find reconciliation through Jesus' Sacrifice, Paul exhibits great exhilaration, that when Israel finally turns to Christ, it would be akin to a resurrection from death & corruption to a glorious new life.
And those of Israel who come to salvation, through much suffering now & particularly in the time of Great Tribulation, will also join the saved from the Gentiles ( Galatians 3:28,29). Yet there will be much rejoicing because Elect Israel is truly the "beloved for the fathers' sakes" ( Romans 11:28: Elect, for the promises made to Abraham, Isaac, & Israel). So, it was always "the Jew first", but all who are IN Christ Jesus are special & precious.
I am having a good day as well thank you. I agree again with most of all you have written. My understanding of the mystery was to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ. This included the Gentiles through faith in Jesus by the Spirit, to be fellow heirs with Israel as sons of God.
My understanding is I think with yours, when Jesus first came, the Messiah, the Son of God and started His ministry, anyone who believed in Him and heard His sayings and did them, was the beginning of the Church, but some say Pentecost.
But all who were added to the Church daily were Jews, the lost sheep of Israel until after what was said and done to Stephen, which ended the offering of the covenant to just the Jews the lost sheep of Israel and fulfilled a prophecy.
The commission was given but when was it made clear and activated, and told by God to carry it out? If the apostles understood this commission, why were they upset with Peter who preached the gospel of Christ to the Gentiles? And we have Paul at the same time for this same commission to be carried out. This is when I understand the branch was broken off and as Paul said to provoke them to jealousy, Romans 11:11.
Thanks again brother for all your comments they are taken and studied.
God bless,
RLW
And in nothing terrified by your adversaries: which is to them an evident token of perdition, but to you of salvation, and that of God. (PHillipians 1:28)."
And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the LORD your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath. ( Joshua 2:11).
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom ( Proverbs 9:10). Continuing with some ideas from my previous post; it seems that when it comes to supposed testimonies of hell; the fear of the Lord and a sense of it being His wrath as a great part of the terror is lost in accounts of suffering. The same thing makes us even more suspect with those testimonies about heaven; even Moses who knew God unlike any other man at the time ( Exodus 33:11) and spoke to Him as a friend still had fear when He appeared in all His glory ( Deut. 9:19). WE ALL SHOULD TAKE THIS ADMONITION SERIOUSLY as to fear and AWE of Him no matter how long we have been believers (sorry but I felt caps were needed here).
The assurance of salvation and the evident blessings being present on someone brings meaning to the first quote from Philippians; and the fact that we will return with Him ( Rev. 19:14) will strike fear in those whose eyes are now opened;
along with the fear of judgment to come.
The concept of our enemies also needs to be addressed along with our own enmity toward God that we now have reconciled.
Romans 11:28 shows how the unbeliving Jews were enemies in one sense; yet Paul wished that he himself could be accursed to save them ( Romans 9:3). We are to love our enemies; but not fraternize to gain reputation as the world does; for what is honorable among men is an abomination to God ( Luke 16:15 also could be "highly esteemed"). We should have no part fellowshipping with those who preach a false Gospel; and in no uncertain terms testify to the peril the unsaved is in apart from repentance.
Then the mysterious transaction of Spirit-given Faith: to believe, to receive, & then to rejoice that the Work of Salvation has been completed in us. Nothing at all of us - but all of God to bring sinners devoid of the knowledge & blessings of God, into the family of the olive tree's 'natural branches'; standing only by faith ( Romans 11:20).
And Galatians 2:16: this is Paul speaking of those 'justified by faith & not the works of the law'. This "faith of Jesus Christ" can only apply to those after Christ's death & not before, even as Peter was reprimanded for his hypocrisy in applying the ceremonial Law - applying the works of the Law to the faith of Christ. And you've stated that this is the 'Christ's Faith' ("His faithfulness in paying the full penalty for the sins of those he saves"). I think the Greek here is that it is the 'Faith from Christ', but I can't be sure; one of our Greek-speaking brothers will need to verify this as this is an important point in what you shared. In any case, only those after Jesus completed His Work on the Cross, can this Faith be seen and applied.
Romans 1:16
"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek."
They are god's chosen people whom through their fall we have obtained salvation.
Romans 11:11
"I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy."
It was god's good pleasure to do this so that we may all be saved and become one.
Galatians 3:36-29
26For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
It was his promise from the beginning.
Genesis 26:4
"And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;"
Right now things are going to well for any of the nations including Israel.
Revelations 18:1-3
1And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Keep preaching and praying because the 7 last plagues are coming soon.
We also; of course see individuals such as Nebuchadnezzar who was converted in charge of Babylon; a pagan nation as well as individuals assimilated in such as the mixed multitude in Exodus; Ruth and Rahab; and likely Naaman the Syrian not to mention for a time the population of Nineveh; at least in momentary repentance.
There was a time earlier when Jesus instructed the Disciples to only preach to the lost sheep of Israel ( Matt. 10:5-6). However; in the case of the woman praying for her daughter; the only other individual Jesus stated had great faith and also a Gentile went though a discourse in Matthew 15:26-27 and then her prayers were answered. This appears on the surface to be cruel; but Jesus was drawing her out; and this allowed His glory to be put on display and signifies to us for all time perseverance.
Acts 18:6 shows a similar pattern with Paul after he had more than worn out his welcome in preaching Christ in their midst. Now; Israel will have to wait until the Lord's return for all of the cities of Israel to be reached ( Matt. 10:23). Thus; until the "fullness of the Gentiles come in" ( Romans 11:25) Israel is blind in part.
These things are according to God's pattern; and eventually will fulfill verses such as Isaiah 56:7 when in God's Holy mount; there will be a place for prayer for all nations. Mark 11:17 shows how the Jews themselves failed in understanding their own destiny by making a marketplace in the Temple as a mockery.