Discuss Romans 5 Page 13

Charles,

Paul, who you claim, preaches a different gospel than the apostles, made it a practice to preach in synagogues in the cities he enters.

"And it came to pass in Iconium, that they went both together into the synagogue of the Jews, and so spake, that a great multitude both of the JEWS and also of the GREEKS believed." Act 14:1

"And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the JEWS and the GREEKS." Act 18:4

"And this continued by the space of two years; so that all they which dwelt in Asia heard the word of the Lord Jesus, both JEWS and GREEKS." Act 19:10

"Testifying both to the JEWS, and also to the GREEKS, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ." Act 20:21

Neither Jew nor Greek...

"There is neither JEW nor GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Gal 3:28

"Where there is neither GREEK nor JEW, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all." Col 3:11

"There is ONE body, and ONE Spirit, even as ye are called in ONE hope of your calling; ONE Lord, ONE faith, ONE baptism, ONE God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all." Eph 4:4-6

Sorry, there's ONE Gospel:

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach ANY OTHER GOSPEL unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Gal 1:8

I strongly doubt that Paul believed that Peter et al were ACCURSED.

If you read carefully, the death, burial and resurrection ARE in the apostles teaching. I think the difference is in signs and wonders and in emphasis on OT fulfillment. Jesus needed Paul, with a PhD in The Gospel.

Appreciate your fervor and Biblical integrity, Charles. I FONDLY remember lunchtime debates I've had with other brothers who believed The Gospel but differed in other areas. Iron sharpen iron. Thank our Lord for His unfathomable mercy and grace!

I agree, all had to believe, but the Jews had to believe John 20:31 "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." and the Gentiles had to believe 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 "For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

But you'll have to agree nothing beats Bible study for having fun!

Yes, it's hard to come up with the exact dates; point is: Paul received the Gospel direct from Jesus, and told the 12 Disciples some years later, at least 14 years, for the Jerusalem meeting where he told them about the Gospel that he preached to the Gentiles. They all preach the death, burial, and the resurrection; but Paul preached something extra; "How that Christ died for our sins" none of the rest ever preached that until later when they wrote their books.

Oops. At the end of my post I meant Galatians 1:18 not 13. About the Greek word used for "see".

Hello Charles,

Just to expand on the year "around 55 AD" when Paul writing the epistle to Corinth. Also you stating that the time between the Death of Jesus and His appearing to Paul on the road to Damascus being 8-9 years or 36-37 AD. I have never heard of that number. So you have learned the death of Jesus to be around 25-26 AD? I have learned that the Lord appeared to Paul sometime around 2-3 years after His death.

As also hearing lectures from Dr Gary Habermas who expands on this timeline. Which agree with several other sites of the chronological studies of that time. As I'll just leave a simple timeline and some verses of "around" times. As no one knows the exact year of the death of Jesus Christ I will be using the year 30 AD as most like to use.

30 AD Death of Jesus Christ.

32-33 AD The Lord appeared to Paul on the road to Damascus Acts 9:1-20.

35-36 AD After three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter Galatians 1:18.

49-50 AD Then 14 years after I went up again to Jerusalem Galatians 2:1.

50-51 AD Paul arrives at Corinth

51-52 AD Paul was in Corinth 1.5 years and brought before Gallieo Acts 18:11-12.

54-55 AD Paul is in Ephesus, staying there 2-3 years, which is where some believe he wrote the epistle to Corinth.

As there was a first letter, or "previous letter", written to Corinth, from Paul, which is no longer extant. Paul noting he wrote them and epistle previously in ( 1 Corinthians 5:9.

With all of these dates I'm sure they can be moved around a little as all being "about". Things we know of are the reign of Gallio to be of 51-52 AD. Which has been inscribed in stone.

Skip also did quote ( 1 Corinthians 11:23. Stating that Paul did "receive of the Lord that which I also delivered unto you". Which I'm sure Skip knows. In Galatians 1:13 the word "see" is the Greek word G2477. Meaning "to find out, learn by inquiry" or "to gain knowledge of by visiting".

Just to give some friendly information. God Bless.

I believe there is only one way, one Gospel but preached in many different ways:

When Paul says according to the Scriptures, "OLD TESTAMENT"

We see THE PROMISE TO ABRAHAM-

Galatians 3:8-9. And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. ( Jews and Gentiles)

HERE IS JOHN THE BAPTIST PLAYING A ROLE IN THE DISTRIBUTION OF THE GOSPEL.

John 1:29. The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the LAMB OF GOD, which taketh away the sin of the ""WORLD."" (Jews and Gentiles)

THOSE LAMB SACRIFICES IN THE OLD TESTAMENT SPOKE OF CHRIST DEATH FOR THE WHOLE WORLD.

NOTICE PETER PUTTING NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TEACHING TO JEWS AND GENTILES HERE IN ACTS. pay attention to the highlighted sentences.

Acts 15:7-11. And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;

"""AND PUT NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN US AND THEM,""" purifying their hearts by faith.

Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ """WE SHALL BE SAVED, EVEN AS THEY."""

When the Apostles was baptizing "ritually" putting all believers (Jews and Gentiles) in one body speaks of Identifying us with his DEATH AND RESURRECTION.

They all preached the cross and resurrection in different ways throughout the scriptures. But the same narrow way.

Charles,

I'm going to have to look into this deeper. You have provoked my thinking to do a more careful search of The Scriptures.

Paul says it best: 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Skip Vought, You said this: Paul, writing the the church at Corinth in about 55, records how he had DELIVERED to them what he had RECEIVED: received many years earlier when he had visited Peter and James in Jerusalem some 3 years after his Damascus Road conversion.

Paul disagrees with you, Read this: Galatians 1:11-12 "But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. 12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ." Jesus gave Paul the exact word of the Gospel that he preached to the Gentiles.

The amount of time between the death of Jesus, and His subsequent appearance to Paul would be 8 or 9 years around 36 or 37A.D.). so Paul would have been in his early 30's when Jesus appeared to him, and he became a Christian.

Galatians 1:18-19 "Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days. 19 But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother." Galatians 2:1-2 "Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also. 2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain." So, 8 years plus 3 years plus 14 years, would be 25 year after the resurrection of Jesus that Paul had the big Bible conference in Jerusalem with all the Apostles when he told the other Apostles of the Gospel that he was preaching to the Gentiles. The 12 Apostles had been preaching a different Gospel for 25 years. They never preached "how that Christ died for sins" Not once. Although the Gospel that the 12 Apostles preached to the Jews are found in about a half-a-dozen scriptures, they are basically all the same. John's Gospel is perhaps the clearest and best one. John 20:31 "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

JUST BELIEVE VERSE 3 AND 4, AND YOU ARE SAVED THE SECOND YOU BELIEVE IT.

My point is, there are two different Gospels; one for the Jews, and one for the Gentiles. John 1:11-12 "He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:", John 20:31 "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name."

Acts 2:38 "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.", Romans 10:9-13 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.", and 1 John 5:13 "These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.". Those five Gospels are basically the same Gospel for the Jews. The twelve Disciples were commanded by Jesus, NOT to go to the Gentiles in Matthew chapter ten. The one exception was Peter was given the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven, (not the Kingdom of God) for the kingdom of God was taken from the Jews, and given to the Gentiles in Matthew Chapter 21:43. The reason the Jews had to admit that Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God, was because "He came unto his own, and his own received him not. " But as many Jews, that received him were saved; and about 3,000 were saved at Pentecost. Paul's Gospel is Different

Clarence,

What sweet questions!

To be saved is to be reconciled to God. In our present state, we are at enmity with God. God is perfect and God is just, we are sinners and fallen. But God devised a way for us to be brought back into a relationship with Him:

Romans 5:9-10: 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

You are saved by acknowledging your sin and its penalty:

All have sinned: Romans 3:23: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God

The Penalty for sin is death: Romans 6:23: For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Acknowledging that Jesus Christ died to pay for your sins.

Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Repenting for your sins: Luke 13:3: I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. - That is a promise.

Just tell God that you are a sinner, in need of salvation...and that you believe Jesus Christ died for you and that you want to repent of your sins and that you want Him to save you.

I will be praying for you Clarence! Dear Lord, please grant Clarence the clarity needed to come to you. Thank you that he is searching Lord, and thank you for giving Him the courage to ask these questions. I pray that he will be saved Lord, and that he will be able to rejoice in that salvation. In Jesus' name...Amen.

Hello Clarence. Ephesians 2:8 . Being saved is an act of faith , believing that Jesus is Gods son, that he lived a sinless life and died on the cross to pay the penalty for our sin and rose again the third day and ascended into Heaven! You except these truths from the Bible , and your sins will be forgiven , and you will be filled with the Holy Spirit, you will become a new creature ,and will one day live in Heaven for all eternity! John 12:1-2.

What does it mean to be saved?

How are you saved?

How do I show that I believe?

"That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." Rom 10:9-10

Paul, writing the the church at Corinth in about 55, records how he had DELIVERED to them what he had RECEIVED: received many years earlier when he had visited Peter and James in Jerusalem some 3 years after his Damascus Road conversion.

"Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days. But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother." Gal 1:18-19

There and then, it is believed, that when this creed was RECEIVED by Paul (DELIVERED and RECEIVED are words used to convey teaching):

That Christ died for our sins

According to the scriptures;

And that he was buried,

And that he rose again the third day

According to the scriptures:

And that he was seen of Cephas,

Then of the twelve:

After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

After that, he was seen of James;

Then of all the apostles.

Paul used similar language earlier in 1 Cor:

"For I have RECEIVED of the Lord that which also I DELIVERED unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:" 1Co 11:23

And he repeats words that The Lord said.

So it is very likely that early Christians repeated this creed months after The Resurrection as an encapsulation of The Gospel. See Gary Habermas, Liberty U for more.

What you said was very good; I wish I had said that. but you might want to add how to be saved in detail. If you believe Paul's Gospel to the Gentile during the Age of Grace, which is : For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: You are born again the second you believe it.

Teresa,

You stated, "I believe in God and Jesus"

That is commendable but, ironically, look at what James tells us:

"Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble." Jas 2:19

"and try to live right."

And that is also something you ought to do but look at what Paul tells us:

"For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness." Rom 4:3-5

We are ALL sinners:

"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" Rom 3:23

We are ALL under God's condemnation unless we believe ON/IN Jesus:

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth IN HIM should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth ON HIM is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed IN the name of the only begotten Son of God."Joh 3:16-18

So what's the difference between believing THAT there is a God or believing IN God? One is just acknowledging that there is a God. Believing IN God is putting your trust in God. The Scripture tells us that God love us so much that He, God The Father, sent His Son, Jesus, God in the flesh, to earth in order to die in our place, to take the punishment for our sins.

"For He (God) hath made Him (Jesus) to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God IN Him." 2Co 5:21

You really ought to find a good church that teaches The Bible. We need to assemble with other believers. None of us are perfect. You're not and I'm not. So don't swallow the lie that there are hypocrites at church, so you shouldn't go!

read 1st Corinthians Chapter 15 verses 1 through 4. If you believe verse three and four, you will be born again, the second you believe it. This is the verses: 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

1 Corinthians 15:1-4

"[1] Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; [2] By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. [3] For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; [4] And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: "

The Lord Jesus Christ can help you (repent:change your mind on what you thought before), and give you strength through any trouble.

Romans 5:1-4

"[1] Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: [2] By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. [3] And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; [4] And patience, experience; and experience, hope: "

Harold Denley,

"what does the word circumcision mean i dont understand what it talking about?"

Genesis 17:9-13, The rite was a sign of the covenant between God and the children of Abraham. In Romans 3 Paul is stating that while there was an advantage of God revealing himself through the children of Israel, it was not a guarantee of their being right with him in their hearts and truely having faith. Romans 4:8-14 is where Paul reminds us that Abraham was promised blessing and God continues to be faithful to that promise, because his true heirs live by faith also, not in the letter of laws and rites.

i rcumcisiin Romaans 3 what does the word circumcision mean i dont understand what it talking about?

Romans 3:10

"As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:"

Romans 5:12

"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:"

The scripture simply states that every one born after the similitude of Adam is subject to the same disobedience, And in like manner everyone that is truly born again of the water and the spirit is given the Grace to take part in the obedience of Christ. How shall we escape if we neglect so great Salvation.

I think the most pertinent portion of Scripture on this matter, is found in 2 Corinthians 5:17-20. Others are: Colossians 1:20-22; Romans 5:10.

I see that you understand its meaning, by what you've written. And that is, through the offering up & sacrifice of His Son, God no longer charges us with our past sins, but has accepted us in through the merits of Christ alone. And the enmity that existed between us, is now gone, having been taken away, thereby bringing our hearts & spirits into a real & vital relationship with the Father. So we can joyfully say, that we have been reconciled to God through His Son, having those sins that condemned us, taken away so that God may now accept us by the peace that the Cross brings to both God & man. So one of the fruits of the Gospel, would be the reconciling of the sinner to a Holy God.

While the promise referenced was directed to Jeremiah, we as believers benefit from the same loving kindness of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ:

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. ( Romans 5:8-10)

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. ( Romans 8:28-29)

What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us? He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things? ( Romans 8:31-32)

Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time: Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you. ( 1 Peter 5:6-7)

Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord, According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. ( 2 Peter 1:2-4)

Often we see the phrase of : "of the glory of God" as in Romans 5:2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God." To me, it could mean the time to be with my Lord in Heaven home? The final stop?

Beatrice,

"Why is the shedding of blood need for the taking away sin"

Because the principle established in Eden was a life for life. "the wages of sin is death" Romans 6:23. "for the life of all flesh is the blood thereof" Leviticus 17:14, God has instructed us that blood is sacrosanct, that is, it has meaning beyond function.

Sinful Adam and Eve covered themselves with a lesser species of creation, as did sinful Satan. By the grace of God, he gave them a temporary acceptable covering, reflecting to Adam and Eve that his justice will be

done. "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin" Romans 5:12. In Eden it was God who demonstrated death for Adam and Eve and established the meaning of a blood sacrifice. The works of man has

no standing in God's performance of absolute justice.

Romans 1:18-26. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; HERE'S WHERE THEY IGNORED GODS GLORY IN HIS CREATION AND WORSHIPED IDOLS, AND "GOD" GAVE THEM OVER TO HOMO SEXUALITY.

(((so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things))).

Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: WE SIN BECAUSE WE INHERITED ADAMS FLESHLY NATURE.

Romans 5:19. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

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Thank you for your comments Steven, on this important subject. If I may add some thoughts here:

a. "They don't view the ten commandments as our schoolmaster to show us our short comings, and a need for a savior but rather they're instructions to salvation". Indeed, some do look at salvation in this way, but I think generally, Christians who have been taught properly, don't see that obedience to the Commandments are necessary for salvation, rather, that after being saved, they revert back to it, or fuse it with saving faith, believing God requires to almost use it like a checklist to be on track & to please Him. See how much of an issue Sabbath-keeping is with some. But as you indicated, all that does is bring us back into bondage to the Law.

b. "Did Jesus struggle to resist sin as we do?" This may be difficult to answer but I rather believe that at his temptation with Satan ( Matthew 4:1-11) & very likely throughout His earthly ministry, Satan would have continued to come at Him: and this was to force sin upon Him so a sin nature may be born in Him. I say this, as we see that the first Adam was born without a sin nature, but he failed to resist Satan, & he inherited a nature given to sin & death eventually followed. So when we read that "as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned" ( Romans 5:12), the fact we too die is proof of the sin nature being transmitted, rather than the import of any specific sins of Adam.

c. "we were transgressors before the commandments, and when the commandments came we died because we became sin." I tend to make a clear demarcation between those given the Law & those who haven't received it. Certainly, we are privileged to have the Bible so we can learn more fully of God's requirements, but if we're not Jews, how are the Laws, then & now, applicable to Gentiles?

Fornication is not the deciding sin which makes one a sinner or not. All whom you have mentioned, except Jesus, committed sin because they, like us, were born into sin. Romans 5:12: "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned". Not only has sin (specifically, the sin nature) been imputed to all coming into the world, but the fact that we all die (both physically & spiritually) confirms the fact that we are in the process of dying from the moment of our birth. The only reason that Jesus died physically was because He took on humanity & placed Himself in the easy reach of evil men, for the purpose of becoming man's only Way to Eternal Life.

I have yet to meet a family who was able to raise children from birth to adulthood, having not committed sin. We don't need a "Christianity that will teach all people how to not fall", we need to be more vibrant & vigilant in sharing the Gospel to all that they may not fall into the pit of Hell.

And 1 Corinthians 10:8 speaks about the 23,000 who 'DIED', not fell into sin. These were not 'upright' people at all - they were downright sinners altogether & were so judged.