Discuss Romans 6 Page 15

I think the word 'end' here is similar to the word fulfill. Paul wrote Romans and is not saying it's ok to sin. We're saved by grace, but this is provided we are a Christian following Christ. Notice what Paul writes in the next chapter: Romans 11:19-23 "...if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." To me this is similar to Paul saying Romans 6:1. Warning against people who want to abuse the gift. Also similar to Hebrews 10:26. Romans 7 and James 2 explain this. Paul struggles with sin as he says in Romans 7:15 and is trying hard to obey and avoid sin. Rom 7:12 Paul says the law is holy, just and good. God bless...

Jesus never cancelled the 10 commandments. He upheld them. He died for us because we can not truly obey the commandments without failing. That does not mean that then sinning is to be ok. Never. Romans 6:1. "What then, shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means!

Generally, Christians have argued against Hypnosis because:

1. It isn't reliable

2. There is a fear it might be associated with spiritual mysteries that make us vulnerable

3. It weakens your spiritual defenses and allows an external force to control your mind

However, done in the proper clinical setting, by a trained Psychiatrist, it becomes another tool in the arsenal of medical treatments. I wonder if there is just a lot of superstition associated with it. But as Christians, I don't think we have to be afraid of it. There are many mind altering drugs we have to take for various ailments, but when done right, in a controlled medical setting, they should be safe. That is not to say we should just take anything and everything someone prescribes. But from my perspective, Hypnosis has its place in medical science.

Stephanie, I'll start this off with some thoughts. I would say that using Hypnosis is a sin even though not specifically mentioned in the Bible. Through it, a believer leaves himself open to more problems leading to sin, being no longer subject to clear, rational thinking & obliged to obey whatever is suggested.

Hypnosis, as you know, is a science to place a person's mind into a state of subjugation, whether done by another or oneself. It effectively alters the critical thinking of a (vulnerable & willing) person to one of obedience regardless of the wishes of that person. It seems to have some benefit in helping those with lingering medical problems. However, the question is, as Christians are we permitted to let our normal critical/decision making minds become open to external commands that would otherwise be rejected by us? Or, in computer terminology, should we allow a downloaded file not be subject to a firewall and an anti-virus examination?

Scriptures that come to mind: Phil 4:7; 2 Tim 1:7; 1 Pet 1:13, all speak about having sound, Christ-honouring minds that engage in a mental/spiritual warfare to keep them under subjection from outside forces. In fact 2 Cor 4:4 says "the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not". We can get the sense here, that their minds were veiled, or even affected/hypnotized, so that they can't ever perceive that they're believing a lie. I realize that I'm adding 'hypnosis' here, but I can see how this can be applied to the response of those so affected.

So, it comes down to: Who has control over our minds/our lives? The Bible says that we must at all times be in control over it, even to the avoiding of substances that would diminish that control or even allowing external forces (people or demons) to gain control over us. When we use the Holy Spirit's Power in our lives, then we should never allow another to take it over nor allow hypnosis to become a play thing as is often done these days.

Albert, I will assume that you are a Christian who is still caught up in this habit. Any habit that controls us means that Christ is not the One to completely indwell us, fill us & control us by His Spirit. Romans 6:16 speaks about being slaves in other ways, but this Truth can be applied to anything that we are servants (subject) to in our bodies: "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?" & 1 Corinthians 6:12: "All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any."; & this tells us that there are many things we can do (i.e. that the Bible doesn't clearly forbid us to do), but those things (e.g. smoking, etc.) are not the proper thing to do (e.g. becoming captive to it, for health reasons, etc.).

Yet, even though the Scriptures are clear as to what we should do, we know that only God, by His Spirit, can give us the strength to gain victory. The apostle Paul said that he could do all things through Christ, Who gave Him the strength ( Phil 4:13); i.e. he looked to Him & called upon Him whenever he couldn't do something in his own strength. It is that continual reliance upon the Lord & particularly being on guard when that urge comes to have a smoke. In the '70s, I was gripped by cigarettes as well. But after I was saved, my friend (a non-Christian) & I decided to give up. God had led me (or, us) to a 'herbal cigarette' that gave us the sense of smoking but without the nicotine/tar: in other words, it wasn't habit forming & in fact, helped me to eventually drop the habit in short while. My friend went back to smoking, but God gave me the strength to press on & I've never looked back.

So Albert, don't lose heart; God can help you as you look to Him each day for this habit & also check out the market for something to assist you to get release from this.

Could we open Hypnosis up for discussion. Why is Hypnosis a sin? I have just been called to the ministry. Could we keep our answers as clear and simple as possible. Thanks so much and God Bless You.

we are baptized into Christ (not by water) but by the Spirit the moment we believe!

1 corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Ephesians 1:12-14 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Part 2:

The second observation is your quote:

How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"

Impossible, the Spirit could never allow for such an attitude or interpretation;

The first part is a scripture Romans 6:2, but your 2nd sentence is not in the Bible. It does not say that after Romans 6:2 and I don't believe a Christian sinning is impossible. Even Paul admits to sin and all Christians sin, so to claim Christians can't sin seems inconsistent with the Bible. Here are a few examples:

-Much of Jesus's teachings were to his existing followers, including many warnings to not go astray and to 'do things'. If all his Christian followers were already saved then why would Jesus ask them to keep doing things? Why change at all? Why even preach the gospel? Why have a Bible? Why try? I have never heard anyone who believes OSAS have a clear answer for this. If Christians don't need to avoid sin because they're saved regardless why would anything in the Bible even matter? It does matter, because the Bible clearly says obeying God is important. If you don't obey then you don't love Jesus and aren't following Jesus much.

-Most of Jesus's parables were about how most people will go to hell and how to avoid it. Jesus called people to put forth effort, to change, to take action. If taking action wasn't important or even related to salvation then why would Jesus keep saying it was like in Matthew 7:21? This verse would have to be reinterpreted, discredited, or thrown out to believe that obeying God is bad. Is God likely to say that obeying him is bad or is satan more likely to say that?

-Judas was a Christian and he betrayed Jesus and died a horrible death and likely went to hell.

-People are given freewill. We're not robots. The Bible already says all sin. Anyone claiming Christians can't sin is claiming we don't have freewill. Hebrews 10:26.

Hello Trevor,

I greet you in name Our Lord Jesus Christ. Hope you're well.

I am a new Christian, I gave my life to Our Lord nearly 2 years ago and it's been the best thing I have ever done. I've had joy and peace in my life since then.

I was baptised many years ago, but because of my immaturity I went back to sin.

The answer to your question " how to get closer to The Messiah " First of all the bible says " For whoever shall call in the name of the Lord shall be saved" Rom 10:13

Believe, that God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, Jesus Christ, the Messiah, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Then you have to be baptised.

Acts 2:38 Peter said, Repent, and be baptised in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of our sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

A few more scriptures for you to look at:

Ephesians 2:8-9

2 Timothy 2:15

1 John 1:9

Romans 6:23

1 John 5:13

Mark 16:16

Romans 10:9-10

Hope these scriptures will help and give you a good start to getting closer to Jesus Christ our Saviour.

God Bless you, and I will pray Trevor that you will get the wisdom & knowledge for God's Words.

Does ether bible talk about eating shellfish.

Hello Deason,

I think the sin we repent of is the sin nature we are born with. It's not just the sin of unbelief, but all sin that we must repent of. I do think the demons both know of Jesus and know who He is. They know and believe He is the Savior of the world, they just won't submit to Him. They also know about His second coming. So they believe. The demons in Matthew Chapter 8 knew Him. They gave a perfect confession of who Jesus is. So yes, I would say they know Him.

I am just curious, have you received Christ, and have you been born of His Spirit? If so, that would be good enough for me, and I would say praise the Lord for that!

Yes Jesse, the devils know of Jesus Christ but not know Him. Just like many people "know of" Jesus Christ today but never believe in Him. In the context of James, James says that they, the religious people, know that there is one God and they do well but that knowledge is not enough for salvation. Even the pope recognize, confess that He is the Son of God but will suffer the condemnation of His wrath unless he repents. My friend, the only sin that needs to be repented of for salvation is the sin of unbelief. Aloha

Deason, I would have to say that the devils, more accurately translated demons, they do believe in Jesus. They know exactly who He is. In Matthew 8:28-34 when Jesus healed the two demonics, notice the confession of the demons: They said what do we have to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? Art thou come hither to torment us before the time.

They know who Jesus is. They recognize Him, and they confess who He is, Thou Son of God.

Also, you say you don't need to believe the whole bible to be saved. I agree. You don't have to believe any of the bible to be saved. The bible does not save you, Jesus Christ does. A person can still be saved without any knowledge of the bible. What sins are you referring to that a person does not need to repent of?

Hi Deason, it appears that Jesus and the Bible disagrees with that belief. Previously cited scriptures among others are proof- you still didn't address those. Jesus directly said you need to repent and He said you need to obey Him. It sounds like you're trying to disagree with Jesus. No one is going to win an argument against Jesus. May God bless you.

Hello again Deason. It looks like we have a different understanding of the salvation process. Scripture tells me that the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost/Spirit of God/and Spirit of Christ are all the same Spirit. You say that when we are saved, the Spirit of God quickens in us, gives us life, teaches us the truth, seals us, etc. To that, I say amen!

You then say without the Holy Ghost you cannot receive Christ. How does that work? If you have the Holy Ghost, who has sealed you, wouldn't you have Christ also? It's His Spirit. Are you saying that receiving Christ comes after salvation?

When we receive Christ, He gives us His Spirit/Holy Ghost. Would you say that a man can believe the truth of the everlasting gospel, but still refuse to surrender their life to Christ? I would say yes. The person who refuses to surrender their life to Christ will never be saved, no matter what truth they believe. Belief is important, but if it doesn't cause us to surrender to Christ, there is no salvation.

Aloha Adam, first, the devils don't believe in Jesus, they believe that there is one God. Believing that there is one God won't save anyone. Believing the gospel of Jesus Christ will save you. To obey Jesus Christ is to believe His words and His promise. He said, "He who believes has everlasting life". Every word that He teaches on salvation is based on faith. James talks about works because he is not God, James cannot look into a mans heart and see faith but God can. For a man to prove to another man that he is saved he must show works. But before God his works is filthy. You don't need to believe the whole bible to be saved, you don't need to repent of all your sins either. Aloha

Hi Deason, the reason I think that believing in Jesus isn't enough is that the Bible already says that believing isn't enough. Even satan and demons know the truth and believe in Jesus, so do you think they're saved? James 2:19, if obedience wasn't important, then why did Jesus say it was? He said you don't love Jesus if you don't obey Him. So, for those who disobey Jesus, do you think it's likely that you go to heaven and be rewarded as much as those who spent their life in service and obedience to Him? Romans 2:6 Satan wants to deceive Christians into believing you don't have to be obedient because he's trying to get more people to go to hell. James 2:26. And what about the many verses saying to repent and confess of your sin? Matthew 4:17 If it wasn't necessary then why did Jesus say it was? If obedience wasn't necessary, why would Jesus say it was? The real question is does someone fully believe the Bible and do they truly believe Jesus? Matthew 7:22

We are saved by faith not of works. Yes, if we believe the truth then the good fruit will be good works. I just want to make it clear that any mans work for salvation is worthless because Christ came to do the works of God. He did it perfectly and He finished it. Now, all men who believe the gospel of Jesus Christ are counted righteous not by the deeds of the law but by faith. God is looking down on this planet with 7 billion souls living here, He is looking in the heart of men and will He find faith? Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God. The only way men can have faith is by men proclaiming the gospel of Jesus Christ. Aloha

Aloha Jesse, thanks for responding. Yes, the devils believe there's a God but they will perish, the same with men. Believing in God won't save you, believing in the gospel of Jesus Christ will. Yes belief and faith alone can't save anyone if it is not based on the truth. But any man that believes the truth of the everlasting gospel is saved. When we are saved, the Spirit of God quickens in us, gives us life, teaches us the truth, seals us, etc. Without the Holy Ghost you can not receive Christ, He is the One that will bring you to the cross and reveal Who the Son of God is. Just like Christ, you cannot come to the Father except through the Son. It is Jesus Christ Who brings us to the Father.

If you love Jesus, obey His commandments. John 14:15 If you don't obey His commandments then you don't love Jesus. If you don't love and follow Jesus you won't be with Him in heaven for eternity. It's pretty simple. You were given the freewill to choose and many will not chose the narrow path, but will believe satan's deception that it's ok to do evil, that you don't need to try or make effort to do anything good, etc. Matthew 7:22-23

Deason, I agree that a Christian is someone who has been born again of God's Spirit, or Holy Ghost, and believing the gospel is also important. But wouldn't you agree that belief in itself is not enough to save a person, that they have to receive Christ in order to be saved? James 2:19 says that even the demons believe. But their belief does not save them.

I am not trying to discredit anything you are saying, and I agree with everything you said for the most part. I just didn't see any mention about receiving Christ. You are spot on about eternal life, and about people who claim to be Christians but have never been born again. I think you just described the people Adam is referring to in his post, the ones who claim to be followers, but then later denounce the whole thing. I don't think those people were ever saved to begin with. 1 John 2:19 describes the people Adam is referring to. Those people were never saved, even though they were "followers," proving John's point!

Deason K. ( James 2:26) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. ( James 2:17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. ( James 2:18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Read James 2:19-24..I am not trying to work my way to heaven, by my faith I will have good works, faith and works go hand in hand, if you have one without the other than it is not complete..That's why Matthew 7:20 says By their fruits ye shall know them. May God bless you.

We are saved by grace through faith, and justified by faith. Your works are dead if your working for eternal salvation. The moment you believed the gospel of Jesus Christ is the moment you inherited everlasting life. You have been made a new creation, not of your will but of the will and power of the Spirit of God. If there is anything you must repent of, it is your unbelief of the promise of everlasting life through the Lord Jesus Christ.

A Christian is someone who is born again by the power of the Holy Ghost. To be born again you must believe the gospel of Jesus Christ, that He died for your sins, He was buried, and He rose on the third day. By believing the gospel God gives you everlasting life. If you have everlasting life how can you die? Your flesh will die because of sin but your soul and spirit are saved because of the righteousness of faith in Christ. Now there are a lot of people who call themselves "christians" but are not born again. Do you know for sure that if you were to die today, you will go to heaven?

Mr.Bodi, You will see the word "sanctification" in the scripture, and there is nothing wrong with your memory. In the process of sanctification, there is a cleansing process taking place in you. Romans 6:5+6, teach you what is happening to your body. Every time you read the scripture ,the holy spirit is directing you into truth and is teaching you what is most needful. read the parables that Christ teaches.Christ will use nature to describe himself and who He is.The gospel are the first 4 books and the most needful.There is nothing wrong with your memory.Understand that you have been born into sin, and your flesh is opposed to anything that is of God, including His words. always eyes on HIM!

The good news of the Gospel is that God so loved the world that he sent his one and only son for whosoever believe would not perish, but would have eternal life ( John 3:16). We are called to have faith (believe) that our savior, Jesus Christ, came to take on all the punishment of our sin and drank the whole cup of the wrath of God and was crucified in our place, was separated from God, so that we would not have to be. He died an undeserving death (for he was perfect so the grave could not hold him), so that we wouldn't have to die an eternal death separated from God. We can only be justified (cleansed) by faith alone through Christ alone. Salvation is a gift from a loving God.

In regards to "dust you are and to dust you shall return, ( Gen 3:19)" the Bible is talking about physical death. It isn't referencing spiritual death. We can see through passages like Psalm 30:3, Psalm 55:15, or even more direct verses like Revelation 21:8, Mathew 25:46, 2 Thessalonians 1:9, that there is a spiritual second death where people are sent down to the realm of the dead. All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God ( Rom 3:23), the gospel news is that sin was defeated through the death of Christ on the cross which reconciles that he both a loving God, and a HOLY God. If the sin's punishment (eternal separation from God) did not exist, then God could not be called Holy.

Hi David,

>Why do I need to be forgiven? For what?!

Have you ever made a mistake in your life and broke one of the 10 commandments? Have you ever once lied, stolen, dishonored your parents, coveted something, committed adultery, etc? If so, you've violated moral law and the punishment for sinning against God is death ( Romans 6:23). Have you ever violated the laws of your city, state, county and had to appear before a judge? Did you accuse the judge of being wrong for punishing you, or did you realize maybe you were the one wrong? What if the judge found you guilty, but instead of you getting the punishment he took it himself for you? That's what Jesus did for you.

Thank you for your prayers and please keep them up it helps to know that others struggle with the same thing I am it gives me hope.
Respectfully
rich

Abel-The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life Romans 6:23. All of the incidents you have mentioned are consequences of the actions of those you mentioned. Why did God send a flood to destroy the whole earth? Genesis 6:5-7, why did God destroy Sodom and Gomorrah? Genesis 13:13 The men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the Lord. If you look up the story of each incident you will find that the people were not obedient to God therefore the Lord had them destroyed as to not continue spreading sin, this is no different today, the earth will be destroyed at the second coming because we humans are not obeying Gods law.