Discuss Romans 8 Page 31

Thank you for your wishes, Steven. I'll still be around reading all the comments - just may not be able to contribute to new enquiries. But there are good men on here, including yourself, giving great thoughts & answers. Every blessing.

Enjoy your vacation Chris. We're going to mis your teaching while you are away. God bless you.

Why is Psalm 107 called Book V ? And are there any books within the book of Psalms?

How old was Saul when he became King

Brother Richard, Thank you for those verses. So it appears that those with the Gift of Tongues can choose to pray using that Gift (i.e. pray in an unlearned language) or can pray in a known language. But if he wanted to pray specifically about some situation, he would need to use a known language or else he won't know what he is asking (unless he has it interpreted).

So my eventual question to brother Michael would have been: can a person, baptised & filled with the Spirit, still pray in a known language seeing that when he prays he must needs use that Gift of praying in Tongues? Or, another way of putting it: would he no longer be praying in the Spirit if he chose to use a known/learned language? And if this is the case, then how could those who only pray in a known language (like you & me), be accused of not praying in the Spirit?

Maybe, it all boils down to whether a believer falls into that 'group' of people who spoke in Tongues when they first believed rather than a question of what language is used in prayer. I never seem to learn how all this works with those who not only have this Gift but insist that all believers must also have it. It seems the Word says one thing but a large body of believers interpret the matter differently.

Just to let you know, I'm away on holidays presently for three weeks, so will be contributing very little, if at all, on this Site. Every blessing.

My good brother Chris,

As I was reading today and came across these verses I thought of you and about understanding our prayers to the Lord.

( 1 Corinthians 14:14-15

14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Hope all is well. God Bless.

Thanks Skip and S Spencer for your efforts on my behalf ,i did know that v was the 6th letter because of psalm 119 but my friend was saying something about v and w being interchangable but i didnt quite get what he was saying ,thanks anyway ,i appreciate you both .

Michael . The smallest of all three me"s

is in my youngest memories..

In the green pastures i will forever find her there ...

Beside the still waters she plays without a care...

By her tiny right hand God led her to this place...

He let her little body fall

And set a choice all Gods children face...

No words were spoken by her Heavenly Father that fleshy ears would hear...

Her soul was gathered in God's love that innocently was without fear...

He gave her the choice of to live or to die..

She chose to live and she told her Heavenly Father why..

She knew by death ... here she would remain..

In the presence of God's love .. no words can explain..

She answered

"" i would like to live so i can play""

God restored her soul. By his gift of life. ...is the very breath she breathed..

Where she had fallen as dead upon the grass ..

Her first death has come to pass...

God opened her eyes

She was able to see...

There was no veil to divide....

God opened her ears to hear.. upon her heart he wrote his law for her life she would abide..

He planted a seed and its hidden in her heart...

Such a gift found in the words she sews....

In Gods love she continues to grow..

this is part of a book of remembrance written and preserved as a testimony of the living God . It was written by living hands to share the love of God.

Hi Sacha.

I don't know a thing about ancient Hebrew, but I looked this up for you

The letter Vav is the sixth letter in the Hebrew alphabet. Through the ancient Phoenician language, the letter Vav actually became the modern letter "F" used in the English and Latin alphabets.

Vav is the sixth letter of the Hebrew alphabet. Looks like a tent peg.

If you Googled "Hebrew alphabet" there's a Wikopedia article that shows the appropriate European equivalent and there's no W. There are, however 2 V sounding characters, one of which is Vav and Vav does have a W equivalence in some respects, for whatever that may mean.

Hello Chris

Who can pray better on our behalf then the Holy Spirit ..God is a spirit thats all i know ..and when i pray in tongues i know i am in the presence of God and all things possible to God ...

What i have learnt on here is this ...( people not christians telling God what they know and not willing to learn what God has asked us to do ... )

God set out a precept in his word that God inspired men to write so we could learn of God and what he wanted us to do...through the Holy Spirit who would guide us in all truth ...

What more can i say when in the... Book oF Jude tells us to pray always in the Holy Ghost building up our most Holy Faith praying in the Holy Ghost and in

1CORINTHIANS: 14v 14 says .. When i pray in and unknown tongue my Spirit prayeth ...

I thank God he asked me if i was willing to learn of him stepped into his understanding of the Gospel not what i was taught and have seen many miracles in my life where i should be dead ...

Example of one ...

i own a black SS ute called a Brock special Limited edition with a 5.7 chevy V8 in it ...I use to drive in the country area hitting large pot holes and corrugated roads not knowing in doing so it had caused the bracket to fracture that holds the steering arm on to the point is was coming off .one day my friend said to me never drive faster then your angel and to slow down and that i am not to go back into the country for work ... those words saved my life ...the following day my steering rack fell off the K frame of the car that holds the steering arm on ....

I have a question ,does any one on this site know anything about the ancient hebrew alphabet ,a friend of mine told me that in the ancient hebrew the letter w was the sixth letter of the alphabet ,if this is true it would put a very powerfull slant on Revelation ch 13 ,anyone know anything about this ? If its true or not ? Thanks .

Thank you Michael. Well, if God gave me the Gift of other Tongues, I would still feel inadequate in my prayer life, as, there are so many things to pray for: for family members, friends, the Church, the world, our governments, etc., etc. I would be torn if I couldn't pray in English for these things but only speak to God in a language I don't understand. How would I even know what I'm asking God for on behalf of these things, if I don't know what I'm saying? Or maybe, I shouldn't be praying for these things & just assume that everything is covered by using an unlearned language.

1 Corinthians 14:39 does say "forbid not to speak with tongues", but does that mean that everybody has that gift, or does it mean that if you have that gift, then you should use it for God's Glory? Whereas, 1 Corinthians 12:30: "Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?", seems to show us that Paul recognized that not all Spirit-filled believers, spoke in Tongues, nor can they heal, interpret, etc. There appears a contradiction of Paul's message, if one is to believe that both Scriptures mean the same thing.

Spiritual Adult

98% of born again Christians never become spiritual adults

Growing up Spiritually does not happen automatically. Spiritual growth only comes from studying the Scriptures until Christ be formed in you. Galatians 4:19 "My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,"

2 Timothy 2:15 "Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

Lets take a look at second timothy chapter three, verses sixteen and seventeen. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." "THAT THE MAN OF GOD MAY BE PERFECT" ANOTHER WORD FOR "PERFECT" IS "MATURE" As you study, you grow in to an Adult Christian, Peter said "As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:" A new born Christian baby can do just about anything that an unsaved person can do; so we all need to grow up.

Christians please don't be afraid to stand for The King , The Saviour, The King over all Galaxies. Mandela took a stand but he did not die, but went on to end Aparthied. Sometimes one must die to live again. Christ took the sting out of death. Nothing to fear now. Peace Like a River was the message I got from a friend who passed on to the Lord's Side. Cast out Fear and walk in faith. You believe the Sun will rise again but it's not up to you that it does. So relax and stop the fear.

Hello Don

I replied to you on another posting but it was not placed up on here for you because i wrote to all on the heading or any one to view truth is always hidden when it comes down to making people accountable.....what has amazed me here is no one knows their bible according to the power of God and what it means to have have the fullness of God...

The Holy Ghost is a Spirit and he is the intercessor who prays on our behalf in the unknown tongue everyone finds hard to accept because they cannot understand what the Holy Spirit prays on our behalf neither do i because the Bible tells us it peays for us about things we do or have done to bring change to grow in faith all i know is when i have pray i feel alot of Joy and peace and i feel right with God and feel full of spiritual Power..

John chapter 3 says it all and the scripture is not taught right about it pastors telling people you acn receive the Holy Spirit without speaking in tongues it like saysing you can drive a car with out fuel or these days an electric car without power....

Moses face shone from DIVINE PRESENCE. We must never be cowards to any affliction on this Earth. That Presence says EVERYTHING.

Hello Don i wrote a reply to you ans all who have joined in the conversation it has not been put up

We need the Real GALAXY Children of God to speak up at the table. God is not limited and nothing stands in the way if His Divine Authority. Man has his own interest but the Children of God must act in the interest of God.

This is for all...

I am sadden as Jesus would be and God the father to see people explain away what God says we can build up our most Holy Faith before God the father being prepared spiritually to be with him...praying in the Holy Ghost

You have all talked about love charity not understanding the real fullness of God by the Holy Spirit if you all did you would know that the fulness of God that the unknown tongue we pray in is the Holy Spirit praying on behalf of you or us to God the Father the intercessor that gives us hope..

God said he has not given us the Spirit of Fear but of Power Love and sound mind....Fulness Of God..

To tell people its not necessary makes you answerable to God for blasphemy denying the and preaching the gospel unfaithfully..

You have all said what i say not what Jesus said the experience we would have that God The Father would give the Holy Spirit to those who would obey him to enter into the Kingdom of God.

A man called Nicodemus asked Jesus John C3 what he must do to to be saved..

The mighty rushing wind referrers to the infilling of the Holy Spirit ..the sound referrers to a voice given to indenitify you can speak in a spiritual tongue to God .....

The gift of tongues never involves gibberish sounds or chanting. A person that receives the gift of tongues will speak in a recognizable, known language that that person did not know and previously could not understand. Examples are given to us in Acts 2 4-8 God bless

Hello Chris...

1 ) To answer your first question i only pray in tongues and find i am put in the presence of God when i do

an amazing experience to be in God presence on your knees.



2 ) Book of Jude verse 20 says....( answer to 1 Corinthians 28 to 30)

But ye, beloved, building up your most Holy Faith. praying in the Holy

Ghost, ( and the reason why we pray in tongues )

1 CORINTHIANS14 verse 39 says ...

Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak in

tongues...







2 ) 1 CORINTHIANS 20 to 30 ...

Thank you Michael for your two replies, but you haven't answered my questions:

1. when you pray, do you use the Gift of Tongues (speaking in an unlearned language) or do you pray in a known language?

2. how do you understand 1 Corinthians 12:28-30, & specifically in relation to Tongues?

Hi Marilyn

John 8:32 says ..And ye shall know the truth , and the truth shall make you free.......

Whats happening today i see people reading and buying books of other peoples experiences

and believing more what people write about rather then just read the bible and share the experience in company

of the saints in fellowship ...and in order people share what God has done for them ..In Jesus name

Christians are not reading the Bible their reading what Pastors are writing and then compare what he or she has said with the Bible....believing more what the Pastor has written ......

I have had christians say but the Pastor said this and the believe the Pators book over the bible and others people experience ....

Hello Chris

WHen i wrote about healing Jesus layed hands on the sick to heal them and on the dead to raise them back to life

and the blind man and the leper etc ...

The Bible is not written to the understanding of natural man even though many claim they understand it if they did we would all agree with the Word of God proving God right only everyone wants to be right ....

I use scripture makes what people write accountable to God with what they reply and say ....To change or add to the gospel means you add the plagues of the bible to your life and takes you out of the book of life ...Thats why i wrote i agree with whats written that Jesus said we should do to be saved ...

My 1 Favourite scriptures is what Jesus said .... John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and i know them, and they follow me

Hello chris ...

many today past and present have been told you can receive the holy without speaking in tongues

and many believe you can because its what they have been told not experienced ... like the people who fall backwards they call it being slayed in the spirit ) bible says the enemies of god fell backwards .....

1 corinthians 14 v 2 to me says it all ..no one seems to have read what it says ...

it says : for he that speaketh in and unknown speakth not unto men, but god: for no man understandeth him, howbeit in the spirit speaketh mysteries....

1 corinthians 14 v 14 says ...for if i pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfriutful

regarding the fullness of god i relate it to buying a new car if you do not have the key given to you cannot drive off with the car , at the turn of the key opens the power from the battery to start the car

jesus was the fullness of god nothing less at the time of need he used the apporiate gift ..that was required ..like healing - if someone was sick he prayed for them ..if someone had died he raised them back to life etc

Hello Kristina,

In my experiences and perception, along with Scripture, you are correct. As of coarse He is our Lord and Eternal King. What started from a very personal experience with the Lord I was led to this answer in the Bible about Jesus being our brother. As when we are born again of the Spirit we are also children of God and joint-heirs with Christ. Romans 8:15-17. Some Scriptures about Jesus being our brother. These are for you:

Matthew 12:50

Romans 8:29

John 6:38

John 20:17

( 1 Corinthians 9:5

Hebrews 2:11

Hebrews 2:17

I hope that helps. God Bless.

I believe it is more logical to explain the Holy Spirit this way.

God is the source of all truth.

God could not reach man from heaven so he sent Jesus with the truth. God's truth for all people.

Jesus is the truth made flesh.

The truth Jesus brings is the same as the truth of God the Father. But Jesus himself cannot speak the truth to every person on earth.

The Holy Spirit is the truth.

"And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness" ( Acts 4:31).

The reason they could speak the truth (the word of God) with boldness after they were filled with the Holy Ghost is because they were filled with the truth--the Holy Spirit is truth.

Richard in Christ, God bless you.

"Speaking in tongues is a special subject but this is what I found in my bible"

I Corinthians 14: 2-4, (kjv)

2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.

4 He that speaketh in an unkown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

Proverbs 4:7 (kjv)

Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

My personal testimony,

The saint that have the gift to prophesy hopefully there is someone in church have the gift of interpretation. Or the Saint could bring an interpreter with them.

May God bless the reading and edifying of the word of God. Amen

Michael, I've been following this thread, & as Richard has said, "it seems to be going nowhere". If may also ask you a personal question: when you pray, do you only use the Gift of other Tongues (an unlearned language) that you believe you have received, or do you also pray in another (learned) language?

And one more question: I think you believe that every person who says he is born again & received the Holy Spirit, must show first evidence of speaking in other tongues - correct me if I'm wrong please. And if so, then all the believers in the Book of Acts & in the early Church (from Pentecost onwards) must have spoken in tongues as first evidence. Then why should the Apostle Paul ask, "And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?"

He clearly shows that in the Church, just as not everyone can claim to be an apostle or teacher or miracle worker, so to, not all have the gift of Tongues, of healing, or of interpretation. If you believe you have received the Gift, then use it for the Glory of God & for building up of His Church, just as we who have not received it, use our other gifts for those purposes. If what you have been taught instructs you that everyone in the Church must have the gift of Tongues, then there is abundant proof of the many mightily used of God in both prayer & ministry to others, that have never received that Gift but are doing their work in the Love & Power of the Spirit. Does this not tell us something: that maybe the evidence of the Spirit within is not just in Tongues, but in many other ways that God chooses to use His children for His Glory?