Discuss Romans 9 Page 7

THE WOMAN IN REVELATION 12.

Here's a verse that is widely debated. I think we can determine by looking at the description of her, and the series of events concerning her in Ch 12 and prophecies pointing to those events in the bible. "you'll need your bibles". VS 1, the description, "She was clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of 12 stars". If we go to Genesis 37:9-10. Joseph dreams and Jacob answers this one for us. Now compare the events in prophecy to Revelation 12. VS 2, She's travailing in birth pains, Isaiah 54:1-5. Is 66:7, ( BEFORE SHE TRAVAILED, SHE BROUGHT FORTH; BEFORE HER PAIN CAME, SHE BROUGHT FORTH A MAN CHILD.) Also look at Micah 4:10, and Micah 5:2-4. Revelation 12:14 say she was given 2 wings of a eagle, a phrase the Lord uses throughout the bible concerning Israel, Exodus 19:4' Isaiah 40:27-31. Deuteronomy 32:10-11. Look at Paul concerning the Israelites in Romans 9:5, "Whose are the fathers, and whom as concerning the flesh Christ came. THE WOMAN IS ISRAEL, Not the church. The church did not exist until after the child was born died on the cross raised the third day went to the father then gave the Holy Spirit to the believers. Thank you.

Esau's Folly and Cains curse

Genesis 27:41

And Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing wherewith his father blessed him: and Esau said IN HIS HEART, The days of mourning for my father are at hand; then will I slay my brother Jacob.

Romans 9:13

As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Malachi 1:3

And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Obadiah 1:18

And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.

I was thinking about Gal. 3 v 16 KJV Now unto Abraham and his seed were the PROMISES made but he said NOT unto seeds plural,NATURAL ISRAEL But unto 1 seed which is Christ thus its Christ that is gonna be multiplied as the stars of heaven Thats y Jesus refers to the H.G as the PROMISE meaning the multiplication of God thats y God swore by his very self,when he cd sware by no greater he swore by himself,Its God that is gonna be multiplied via the WORD that good seed,Thats y Jesus is saying to whom the word came it made them GODS WHICH IS THE MULTIPLICATION OF GOD. And its impossible for GOD TO LIE. HEBREWS 6 It was God Almighty that made that Promise. Ya gotta realize that Christ sows a much greater seed then Abraham,God found fault with natural Israel simply b/c they all carried the stain and spot of Adam,David comes to mind. But David speaks of another king coming, Solomon which means comforter a fore runner of the heavenly Comforter the H.G. A GREATER then Solomon is here.All alone God had a another Israel in mind that wd come via tHE seed of CHRIST WHICH IS THE ISRAEL OF GOD,All thru the bible we read of a heavenly Jacob a heavenly Israel,that the sun nor the moon or any heat will lite on them simply b/c they are spirits the H.G .THAT WHICH IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT IS SPIRIT THATS THE H.G THE ISRAEL OF GOD that is gonna be born in US VIA HIS SEED.Thats y God told MOSES that his name was Abraham Issac and Jacob IMPLING THERE IS GONA BE AN ISRAEL OF GOD VIA HIS SEED TH WORD ETC.And Abraham implies multiplication MEANING THE FATHER HIMSELF IS GONNA BE MULTIPLIED AS THE STARS OF HEAVEN, TO WHOM THE WORD ( the seed of Christ )CAME IT MADE THEM GODS. ok lemme go .Dont forget that Abraham Issac and Jacob were father son and granson which implies multiplication a posterity, natural Israel but think of that in the spiritual realm via a heavenly seed initiating an Israel of God. The great PROMISE .A lil one shall become a 1000 and a small one a strong nation th Israel of God.

BILL TRY TO UNDERSTAND Its the seed of Christ which is the living word that is the Israel of God, which are spirits the H.G. PLURAL,God made this Promise to Jesus that his seed wd be multiplied as the stars of heaven. Abraham, Isaac and jacob were just a profile of the heavenly kingdom, Thats what abraham means exaulted Father.Its God almighty that wants a posterity.How can anybody miss this Abraham offered up his only son Issac and the result of this act of obedience was multiplication of his seed wd be as sands of the seas But Christ actually died,Gods only son was offered up to death thus that PROMISE that Christ wd be multiplied as the Stars of heaven, Thus our new birth via his seed the word That new covenant,we birth a new innerman which is the H.G. Whom Jesus refers to as the PROMISE.THUS MULTIPLICATION OF Christ will be as the stars of heaven.This cannot be refuted as God Almighty made this PROMISE of multiplication via the seed of CHRIST. Jesus even tells the Greeks that came to Jerusalem to see Jesus that unless a seed died it abides alone but if it died it will bring forth much fruit meaning multiplication, Everybody will get a seed a measure of faith to birth a baby Christ,Whosoever receiveth one such child in my name receiveth me. thats how the whole world will see Jesus via his seed that will initiates a birth of Christ in US. Smite the shephard and the sheep and the sheep will be scattered THEN I WILL TURN MY HAND TO THE LITTLE ONES,tHE BABES AND SUCKLINGS THAT ARE GONNA BE BORN IN US tHE H.G. THE CHILD OF PROMISE.Smite the shephard implies his death and resurrection,when a seed dies it multiplies, thus the children that are gonna be born in US via his seed. Thus we see multiplication via his death and resurrection. But Christ will not sire flesh and blood children his offspring are spirits as God is spirit, To whom the WORD came it made them Gods and the scriptures cannot be broken,Jesus regenerates himself via his seed, his breath, HIS WORD GBU BILL

Alex you make an outstanding point."Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:" We have religious leaders in America that Israel identifies with. It amazes me that church leaders identify with an Israel that still does not except Jesus as the Messiah. Let alone the son of God! Even Christianity!There is a movement to go to a monotheistic God. Teaching that God can exist without the Christ, therefore without the h.g.. You cannot be born again without excepting the death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ. If baptism were not necessary, Christ would have not done it. There is an unspoken evil doctrine, if you worship the Father , you don't need the Son. This doctrine comes strait from hell itself. This in essence, deletes the new testament in His blood! The new covenant is become the promise of a savior who has not yet come. Last days many shall be deceived! This new doctrine is designed to bring peace! A belief that as long as I believe in a god I will be excepted before God. It doesn't matter who god is, as long as I'm good I will be excepted by God!

My comments about Romans 9 v 7 & 8 Kjv. Natural Israel are not the absolute Children of God as they have to be bornagain of an incorruptible seed even by the words of God,Jesus told nic. a jew he had to be bornagain in order to enter the kINGDOM. Its the children of Promise that are counted for that good seed which is the H.G. That which is born of the Spirit is Spirit Jesus said meaning the H.G. The Child of PROMISE,The baptism of the H.G. and FIRE A HEAVENLY PEOPLE THAT ARE THE VERY SPIRT OF GOD THE children of PROMISE that are gonna be born in us sinners, our new innerman, our new heart and new spirit which is the very kingdom of God in humanity via his seed th word. Not all Israel is Israel its the heavenly seed the word that initiates the Israel of God,As we have borne the image of the earthy ( OUR OLD ADAMIC nature ) We must also bear BIRTH the image of the heavenly the very image of God. To whom the word came ( his seed ) it made them Gods and the scriptures cannot be broken. God is spirit and Jesus says that which is born of the spirit is spirit thus the H.G is the PROMISE Child, the multiplication of God. Everytime God refers to himself as the FATHER IMPLIES HE IS GONNA HAVE SONS,ABSOLUTE SONS LIKE Jesus was an absolute Son, not a TOKEN SON LIKE ADAM 1. Thats y God made that Promise he wants a posterity, Jesus was just his 1st born of many Brethren thus the sower and his precious seed the words of God that are spirits, The Israel of God are spirits the H.G PLURAL that is gona be born in humanity. I will multiply thy seed as the Stars of Heaven, Thus Christ is gona be a father simply b/c of his seed,They don't call him the bridegroom for nothin,He wants to propagate VERY GOD in humanity with his seed THE WORD ,The book contains the words of everlasting life the Good seeds,The new COVENANT Jesus words thus he is the Author of that book,He wrote it with his own blood. In the volume of the BOOK it is written of me i delight to do thy will O GOD. The kingdom .

It is necessary for an individual to be born again to enter God's Kingdom, it takes a gracious and miraculous act-completely on God's part-to close the gap between Him and those He calls ( John 6:44).God graciously gives life by His Spirit. Paul writes, "For He says to Moses, 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion.' So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy" ( Romans 9:15-16).

Jesus proclaimed to Nicodemus that one must be born again to enter the Kingdom of God. Since Adam and Eve, mankind has been cut off from God. The design of the Tabernacle, the Temple, and the worship system under the Old Covenant pictures God as distant and virtually unapproachable. Man in his natural condition, having a carnal mind and dead in his sin, is certainly shown as away from God. Though it is necessary for an individual to be born again to enter God's Kingdom, it takes a gracious and miraculous act-completely on God's part-to close the gap between Him and those He calls ( John 6:44).No one can arbitrarily volunteer for entry and be accepted; a person cannot cause himself to be born again. Flesh does not produce redemption. Unless one is born of the Holy Spirit, whatever one does in the flesh will not make him spiritual in the biblical sense. The Bible shows that the natural mind of man is at war against God and that it is not subject to God's law and cannot be ( Romans 8:7), expressing the harsh reality of the carnal heart of mankind.When Paul writes that the unconverted are dead in trespasses and sin, he means exactly that. Regardless of how sincere or religious they might be, such people are lifeless in terms of true spiritual life that is given by God. They are part of the old, natural creation and are spiritually lifeless unless and until-and completely at His discretion-God graciously gives life by His Spirit. Paul writes, "For He says to Moses, 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion.' So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy" ( Romans 9:15-16).

Today noticed when reading Romans 9 that there is many differences in this King James Bible that was typed in your website and also the Authorized King James Bible. A King James Bible by American Bible Society that I often read has many verses that are not capitalized and many of the names are spelled differently. I do hope the meaning in each verse does not change in meaning with the change of spelling and change of a word being capitalized in the beginning of a verse.

To CARLETON

The messages we post each are indeed according to the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him ( John 14:17). Please note the word 'cannot'.

We speak with a clear conscience towards God and toward men ( Acts 24:16), and we say the truth in Christ, we lie not, our conscience also bearing us witness in the Holy Ghost ( Romans 9:1).

The time has come when it must be said: You are a follower of an image of a false god and a false Christ and if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect ( Matthew 24:24; Mark 13:22; Gal. 4:8; 2 Cor. 11:13-15; Rev. 12:9).

The comments you post are misleading, empty and without basis or spiritual wisdom and knowledge. With great swelling words you speak of God's love, but we know you, that ye have not the love of God in you ( John 5:42). When we say we know you, it means 'spiritually'. The believers judge after the spirit of man ( John 8:15).

The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is everyone that is born of the Spirit ( John 3:8).

Only through 'True Repentance' will God be able to reveal Himself, and adopt you as His sons and daughters ( Rom. 8:15,23; 2 Cor.6:18; Gal. 4:5; Eph. 1:5; Hebr. 12:5; 1 John 3:1).

The word 'Repent' means a lot more than what people by nature have been conditioned to believe. It is the key principle of all the teachings of Jesus Christ and the axiom (basis) of the Word of God and a prerequisite and primary requirement for the salvation of mankind. It actually means the changing of spirits - to turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan unto God ( Acts 26:18).

You are of the world: therefore do you speak of the world and the world hears you ( John 4:4).

We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth and the spirit of error ( 1 John 4:6; Isaiah 8:20).

That't right. Just as not all Christians are Christians, not all Israelite's are Israelite's.

Its simple God hates.....And in this verse is specifically talking on Esau the progenitor of the "edomites" aka the Caucasian race.. another reference is Romans 9:13

Regarding John 7:38: "He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water."

The question is answered in the next verse. John 7:39: "(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)"

The illustration is of the Holy Ghost like a fountain of water gushing up from within the believer, giving all that pertains to the life more abundant, to testify to the glory of Jesus Christ.

In Genesis 16, the angel of the LORD found Hagar by a fountain of water in the wilderness which she then called Beerlahairoi (well of the Living One seeing me).

Later in Genesis 26:19 Isaac's servants digged in the valley, and found there a well of springing water (also called living water as opposed to a well that needed to be drawn from by hand).

In Exodus 17, the LORD told Moses to smite the rock so that water would flow out to quench the thirst of the complaining Israelites. This is a foreshadowing of Jesus Christ.

The LORD had a controversy with his people in Jeremiah 2:13, "For my people have committed two evils; they have forsaken me the fountain of living waters, and hewed them out cisterns, broken cisterns, that can hold no water."

What is the meaning of John chapter 7 verse 38

Romans 9:15 says God will show mercy on whom he chooses and compassion on whom he chooses. To me this means the same as He has predestined who will accept Him. How do we know if we're ones who He will allow to be saved, shown mercy & compassion?

Dianne,

In Romans 9:13 it says "As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."

Now that's a pretty serious statement to make.

The terms love and hate are what are called words of comparison. Obviously, love and hate, there is a comparison there, but the words themselves don't mean He loves them and He hates them, or He loves one more than the other. As a matter of fact, these words are found in the New Testament.

We think that was harsh but look at this. In Luke 14:26, it says "If any man come to me and hate not his father and mother, and wife and children, and brothers and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple."

Now that's pretty harsh! You have to hate your mother and your father, and wife and children, and brothers and sisters? Now I can probably pick a couple out of there that I'm glad He said that! But it makes it pretty hard. What do you have to do, go home and show your hate towards them? What's He trying to say?

The Greek word for hate, MISEO means to love less. It doesn't mean hostility. In fact, Jesus, in Matthew 10:37 says "He that loves father and mother more than me is not worthy of me, and he that loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me."

He's talking about comparisons. The comparison is that Jesus is saying you must love me so much that in comparison to everybody else, it looks like you hate them. I mean it's not even close. Jesus said there cannot be me and somebody else!

That helps explain in Exodus Chapter 20 where God says you shall have no other gods before me. Except in the Hebrew, it says you shall have no other gods except for me.

In other words, it's not putting God first, and then we have our other priorities. God says I'm your only priority. Wow! We have no obligation in the flesh. Our one and only obligation is to follow Christ.

(more to follow:)

Question arises. Being Jesus came as the second Adam, then it seems the Church would be the new Eve and the Church would possess the Godly qualities of the woman by born again members, why then do these same members seem to have their own agendas instead of the submission to the will of the second Adam, Jesus Christ?

This is for Diane tell you friend God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve

Comments about Israel them born of the Flesh or them born of the spirit. Romans 9 v 8 Flesh and blood are not the children of God Its the Children of Promise that are counted for that good seed which is the HG. OUR NEW INNERMAN that is gonna be born in Jew and Gentile a like. We all have to be bornagain of an INCORRUPTIBLE SEED Jew or gentile alike simply b/c we all carry that stain and spot of ADAM. Thats y he told Nic. a Jew he had to be bornagain. We must birth that new creature which is the H.G. The Child of Promise our new innerman which is Spirit. Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision but a new creature which is the H.G.By 1 spirit are we all baptised into the body of Christ Jew or Gentile we all have been made to drink of that 1 spirit bond or free Thus there is no more Jew or Gentile in Christ ya are all one.Under the covenant Its the H.G. that is the Child of PROMISE that is gonna be born in us via his seed the word, being bornagain of an incoruptible seed even by the word of God that new covenant that he wrote with his own blood. Under this new covenant its the H.G that is the superstar the Children of Promise That is gonna be as the stars of heaven not carnal man which is in rank with satan. Outta of the hearts of man proceeds all manner of evil he even called Peter satan simply b/c he had not been bornagain of an incorruptible seed just yet he had been water baptised but not bornagain of an incorruptible seed th words of the book th words of life that will initiate a birth of Christ in US SINNERS the Child of Promise which is the H.G. Christ in US.It was his blood that made us all clean, Even in the O.T. without the shedding of blood there was no remission of sin. The reason Jesus was water baptised is he is our sacrificial Dove that had to be washed by running water (th Jordan) but he wd have to be killed and his blood sprinkled on the living bird the Church th disciples answers to the living bird, husbands love your wives as Christ loved th Church.

John l Part 2

1 Kings 21:1 ....had a vineyard, which was in Jezreel, hard by the PALACE of Ahab KING of SAMARIA.

Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

this verse says a new covenant with both Israel AND Judah. So how can they be the same?

Hosea 1:10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.

Romans 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

Galatians 3:29. - And if ye be Christ's, then ARE ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Marie, Romans 9:10? Or, did you mean Romans 10:9?

Do you also have a supporting Scripture that the Gift of Tongues is a 'Heavenly language known only to God'? The Acts 2:4 account of Pentecost Day seems to indicate that the Tongues spoken was not Heavenly but Earthly & Paul's teaching on this in 1 Cor 14 was specifically to show that Tongues was an unknown (unlearned) language to the speaker but may be known to another present or to be used when one gifted with its Interpretation was present. Without an interpretation, the (unlearned) Tongue was not to be used however it could be used in prayer to God only, where "my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful" (v 14). This seems to me that apart from its use in prayer, the Tongue should only be used when someone who understands/interprets it is present.

I would be interested to learn what Scripture you know that can support what you've said.

Jesus spoke in John 3-8 about the water & Spirit & how it is needed to enter into the kingdom of God. After we read the gospels we then go to the book of Acts. We must obey Acts 2:38. It's for everyone. The Bible from Acts & on is for the people that came from the book of Acts; the baptized, Holy Spirit filled,saved people/churches. First obey Acts 2:38 before you can claim Romans 9:10 or any other verse I was water baptized yet I didn't receive the Holy Ghost until nearly 3 yrs later. You will speak in tongues as the sign of receiving the Holy Ghost. It's a heavenly language known into God. Also in Acts 1:8 says you will receive power once the Holy Ghost has come upon you. Its a wonderful journey. We must know our God & obey the gospel. 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 kjv is clear on these words. Amen

Isaac,

Romans 8:28 basically states that the plan of God will be done through His "elect" children.

God also utilizes Satan's children to bring about His perfect plan, look at Isaiah 10:5, 19:25, Jeremiah 42:18, etc.

The "elect" children of God concerns "predestination," look at Romans 8:29-30, 1 Corinthians 2:7, Ephesians 1:5, 11.

Predestination has to do with understanding that there are 3 earth and heaven ages spoken of in the word of God, 2 Peter 3:5-6 speaks of the 1st dispensation of time; 2 Peter 3:7 speaks of the 2nd dispensation of time; and 2 Peter 3:13 speaks of the 3rd dispensation of time.)

The 1st earth and heaven age ended due to the fall of Satan, and is recorded in Genesis 1:1-2. The earth BECAME without form and void; God did not make it that way!

The 2nd earth and heaven age came into being when the spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters and God said Let there be Light ( Genesis 1:2-3)

The 3rd earth and heaven age is what all children of God look forward to.

God "did foreknow" ( Rom 8:29) each and every one of us because we were all there in the 1st Dispensation of time.

Jeremiah was (foreordained) a prophet BEFORE he was born ( Jeremiah 1:5).

God hated Esau BEFORE he was born because Esau despised his (birth)-right and (likely) followed Satan in the 1st earth age ( Genesis 25:32-34, Malachi 1:3, Romans 9:13, Hebrews 12:16)

Be careful telling others they will go to hell if they do ____. The Bible says not to do that and says what will happen if you do. Matthew 7:1. Secondly, that's an assumption and you don't actually know how God will judge. Romans 9:15, Matthew 7:14.

Hi there, your interpretation of this is very different. You consider this chapter discouraging to your faith, but I find it encouraging. You interpret this as a 2 faced God, but I see a consistent God of love. Whose interpretation is right? Have you ever considered why you interpret this the way you do? Does everyone interpret it your way? Why or why not? What if there are other perspectives?

The loving God I know hates sin. Sin is evil and involves hate, and the opposite of evil is good done through love. To follow God is a blessing and honor. I've been hearing some Christians complain that they feel entitled to sin and do evil, that it's wrong to not allow them to do it as Christians. This is just a lie from satan who likes deceiving people.

I don't know what part of this chapter you have a stumbling block on, but I can say, that most people likely don't interpret it the way you do.

God promised Abraham he would be the Father of MANY NATIONS.

Gen 17:5 - Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of MANY many nations have I made thee.

If the "Jews" are all of Abraham, where are all these MANY "jewish nations"...?

There is only one and it was created by the antichrist United Nations and one is not many.

Either God lied (impossible) or the Jews are not all of Israel.

Where are the MANY JEWISH NATIONS of Abraham?

Judah and Israel were not the same people. God divorced Israel and not Judah. One tribe is not many

Jeremiah 3:8 - And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of DIVORCE; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.

The Lord DIVORCED ISRAEL

Israel and judah had wars and different kings as well as different capitols. Jerusalem capitol of Judah.

Samaria capitol of Israel.

2 Kings 8:16 ...Joram the son of Ahab KING of ISRAEL, Jehoshaphat being then KING of JUDAH, ...

1 Kings 21:1 ....had a vineyard, which was in Jezreel, hard by the PALACE of Ahab KING of SAMARIA.

Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

this verse says a new covenant with both Israel AND Judah. So how can they be the same?

Hosea 1:10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.

Romans 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

Galatians 3:29. - And if ye be Christ's, then ARE ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Remember jesus said it was gonna be like the days of Noah impling a coming not with observation, something that is gonna come from our insides, something sown in our hearts that is gonna initiate this 2 nd coming a rapture, a catching away,like a bride is caught away on her wedding day. Behold th kingdom of GOD IS WITH IN YOU VIA THAT GOOD SEED TH WORD. 27 times th prophets saw the world in travail and birth pains. We don't need to go anywhere we are complete in him,besides there is no oxigen high up in the clouds. Soon the rain was coming down and the ppl were drowned but this 2 nd time its not natural water but spritual water Isaiah said that knowledge shall cover the earth as the waters cover th seas a spritual flood living waters then isaiah mentions the weaned child and the sucking child then isaiah mentions a 2 nd coming, I will set my hand again a 2 nd time to recover THE REME NANT OF my ppl this IS the rapture via seed ( THE CHILDREN ) SHE BROUGHT FORTH A MAN CHILD . Thats y jesus said these things are hid from the wise and prudent ( religious folks ) but revealed unto babes his babes that are spirits, That new born babe Paul is speaking of is the H.G. that desires the sincere milk of the Word . This 2 nd time is the rapture, thats y Isaiah is saying a lil child is gonna lead them i.e a Rapture remember what jesus said unless ya receive the kingdom as a lil child you will in no wise enter there in. Ya gotta realize that this new birth ( THE H.G. ) is the Plumbline that is gonna bring the kingdom to US EVEN WITH IN US.Thats y our new birth via his Seed is so important, that Promise that christ wd be multiplied as the stars of heaven requires a seed and an intimacy, thus he has to know us.gbu

God promised Abraham he would be the Father of MANY NATIONS.

Gen 17:5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of MANY many nations have I made thee.

If the "Jews" are all of Abraham, where are all these MANY "jewish nations"...?

There is only one and it was created by the antichrist United Nations and one is not many.

Either God lied (impossible) or the Jews can be not all of Israel.

Where are the MANY JEWISH NATIONS of Abraham?

Judah and Israel were not the same people. God divorced Israel and not Judah. One tribe is not many

Jeremiah 3:8 And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of DIVORCE; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.

The Lord DIVORCED ISRAEL

Israel and judah had wars and different kings as well as different capitols. Jerusalem capitol of Judah.

Samaria capitol of Israel.

2 Kings 8:16 ...Joram the son of Ahab KING of ISRAEL, Jehoshaphat being then KING of JUDAH, ...

1 Kings 21:1 ....had a vineyard, which was in Jezreel, hard by the PALACE of Ahab KING of SAMARIA.

Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

this verse says a new covenant with both Israel AND Judah. So how can they be the same?

Hosea 1:10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.

Romans 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

Galatians 3:29. - And if ye be Christ's, then ARE ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Comments by alex about the rapture. to understand it ya must be bornagain, impling a child is gonna understand it. ya remember jesus said unless ya receive the kingdom as a lil child impling a birth. th real new birth via that heavenly seed the living the word the contents of that book in the right hand of the father that is gonna initiate a birth of christ in us. donot despise the day of small things ( the seeds of the sower that is gonna rapture us out ) in the spritual realm ) ya remember he said b/c i have spoken these words ( seeds ) sorrows have filled your hearts impling a spritual pregnancy thats when he told them of a child in their near future then he said i will see you again,the child being the h.g. as that which is born of the spirit is spirit which is th kingdom of god,unless ya receive the kingdom as a lil child impling a birth . isaiah said when he saw the kingdom coming unto us a child is born unto us a son is given he was seeing th rapture as wonderful, conselor, prince of peace ,everlasting father, and of his kingdom there shall be no end the reason this is the kingdom is simply b/c he is decribing a heavenly birth unless ya receive the kingdom as a lil child..when they argued amongest themselves who was the greatest jesus put a child in their mists prophetic of the h.g. th granson only the h.g cd be the granson simply b/c there is no other child that comes out of christ loins and its he that is the greatest the child of promise th 2 nd coming, the 1st coming was by a child christ jesus and the 2 nd coming is by another child another comforter the h.g.without a granson no israel of god,without a jacob there wd have been no natural israel.its god that wants a posterity thats y he told jesus i will multiply thy seed as the stars of heaven thus there has to be a grand children so there might be a israel of god,thats y jesus is saying that which is born of the spirit is spirit thus the multiplcation of god in us sinners via his seed. forgive typing

Alex on Romans 9 v 8 implies th real children of God are spirits , WE ARE JUST JOINT HEIRS WITH THE H.G. OUR NEW INNERMAN, We are the mother simply b/c we birth the child, th H.G. as Jesus said that which is born of the spirit is spirit, Who is my mother he asked ? them that hear th word that good seed and keeps it INITIATING A BIRTH OF CHRIST IN US. THATS Y HE CALLS HIMSELF THE SON OF MAN.When Jeremiah spoke of the new covenant, he saw all men in travail and birth pains,But Jeremiah saw a Child coming that was gonna rule all nations, he saw all men giving birth to this Child and God said this was gonna be his battle ax the child which is the H.G. Jesus said that when he the spirit of truth is come he will reprove the world of sin and judgement & RIGHTEOUSNESS.