How vocal should Christians be in condemning abortion? Is it wrong to support and vote for leaders who promote abortion? What can Christians to do be a light to the world on this issue?
What I don't understand about the pro-death argument is how a Christian can justify the mass-murder of babies when there's clear Bible verses that an unborn baby is sacred and made in God's image.
My only guess as to this position is thinking of special cases of rape or incest. But adoption is still the best alternative in any case if a mother doesn't want to be one. Barren moms and dads can pay thousands of dollars and wait many years to adopt, because other moms would rather kill their baby than let he/she have a loving adoptive family to raised in.
It doesn't make sense how it's illegal to kill an unborn animal like an eagle egg or many other animals or harming plants too, but it's legal to kill an unborn human and the government will even help you pay for it. Does that make sense to anyone?
It definitely makes NO sense to me- *abstinence* aught to be taught to our youth in public schools and instead of having a gay "pride" club to confuse the young teenagers about their own perceived sexuality...and giving away free condoms like a perceived license to fornicate and commit adultery. What these young people don't understand until later on in life is that sinning against your own body has consequences, it's so sad. May God lead these young people onto the straight and narrow path that leads to eternal life with JESUS, instead of the wide path that many walk on which ultimately leadeth to destruction..
No matter what, I know God is Good, and his will will be done on earth as in heaven in Jesus name.
regarding abortion--I too--am against it--but I have friends whose views are totally different--just yesterday, my neighbor & I were discussing this--she said she was for abortion--she knew two young girls whose lives would have ben ruined if they had not had an abortion. I questioned her--I said--how do you know that? So many times we let our emotions rule against God's Word. I just hit 70--and I have watched the racial injustice increase--the lifestyles decrease--it seems like we are on a watered down path--anything goes--as long as it feels right to you.
Cathy (& Karcelia) you're both so right. When the foundation is weak & not in prepared soil, the building will crack & collapse.
Most without the love of God in their hearts, have as their foundation the welfare & happiness of the mother rather than the embryo or unborn child. Why? The embryo is only that, an embryo - even though there may be life there, it is still something less than human, they say. The welfare of the mother is more important as her usefulness is greater to her family & society.
Those who love the Lord & know His Will, regard every human life in every stage of its development, as special & precious & to destroy that life is murder & so the destroyer stands before the God Who gave life & a life's Plan to that child. In our quest to enjoy life in both intimate & non-intimate environments, we pay little heed to the outcomes of our thoughts & actions. And so the verse seems most applicable: "every man did that which was right in his own eyes" ( Judges 17:6). It was no longer what God required of them & us but what we deem as correct & warranted based on our desires - and as you said, this folly is increasing in greater measure in the world around us.
To abort a child prior to 20-22 weeks as acceptable, is still murder. Will any government propose that it should be when both sperm & ovum unite is when life is created? Unfortunately, most don't accept that life commences before that point, even though it is clearly seen in the laboratory. Is the embryo then likened to an ant which we could step on & extinguish, giving it little further thought? How will mankind stand before God in that day? What excuse will he give or can he give? God's Righteousness will blow open the inherent wickedness deep within his heart & manifest all that has been covered over for the sake of happiness & expediency.
I am also in my seventies, and I agree with you. People are twisting the words in the Bible to make them mean what they wish them to mean. I have lived through some tough times, but I have never seen evil coming against families and good people in general as what is happening now. My mother always taught us that we are to pray without ceasing, and we surely need to do so.
When I was 12 yrs old, we heard of girls that got pregnant out of wedlock; and either went to a relatives house to have the child and let it be adopted.
Or, women went to un-wed mothers homes to give birth and release the baby to be adopted.
Enter the 60's and free, unrestrained sexual sin. It was like living amongst rabbits on LSD. Grandparents had to raise their grandchildren.
A decade later, abortion was legalized and the unwed mothers homes disappeared.
Homosexuals came out of the closet
Another decade, AIDS appeared and was declared a pandemic by the CDC, but didn't do anything about it.
Following decade lesbians decided to live reckless and large too.
2000's, they all want to be families with children.
Now, they all demand to live married and force society to accept their standards in public schools.
I've seen all this happen. Christians need to hang out in their state legislatures and scream for CHOICE to put their children in Christian schools!!
We have to live here until Jesus comes to get us. It's up to us to protect our rights too. I'm even favorable to home schooling.
Our kids can grow up more intelligent because they will not be slammed in their emotional life with the loose morals of an evil generation that has Declared WAR on children (all ages).
Now the sex traffickers are kidnapping Christian children and teens. How many will just disappear on Halloween this weekend? Will we even see those stories on evening news?
We are to GO YE to the world in our cities; our neighborhoods. Take the gospel to them. Don't let the world preach "their gospel of death, despair and sexual depravity, into our homes.
We have to teach the Bible to our kids age 3 and up. There is no reason to let them watch secular tv as a babysitter! Drop Netflix and get PureFlix !!!
Stop Compromising! Half Christian and half ?? We spend big bucks on MEDIA. It's the gospel of SATAN. Why are we so weak?
The days of statesmen leaders are long gone: you know the days way back in political history, when a few men governed by their consciences, in the fear of God & instilling righteousness in society. Nowadays, political muscle & job security take precedence over doing what is right & so governments give support to the majority voice & just enough bait to the minority to keep them happy. In my mind, any imbecile could do that work - it doesn't take any skill to work with the numbers. But it would take one of character (both as an individual & party) to go against the tide of people's demands & act upon proper moral & ethical values & for the general good of all: those still in the womb & in the world. But the fact is that such a party would never get in, as the evil one has his say & sway in the hearts of the unregenerate & degenerate.
Yet, even with such a bleak outlook for the future, we know that God will still have His final Word & that even through our wonder & despondency, He still uses such governments to fulfil His Plans. 2 Kings 14:26-27 reminds us that even with wicked Jeroboam, God could use him to bring Israel out of her bitter affliction - that all things are possible with God. We should pray for those in government ( 1 Timothy 2:1-3) & be as those who that stand in the gap, interceding for them who have not God's love & power in their lives ( Ezekiel 22:30).
To Chris: I have been reading discussion on here for about 3 months. I have always looked for your comments as they are so insightful and biblical! Are you a pastor? And what part of the country do you live in? I know you will just pass my comments of praise for you to our Father! Blessings Galatians 2 : 20
Hi Ronald, thank you for your comment & when I saw your quote, Galatians 2:20, I remembered that that was my key verse when sharing my testimony at a Nazarene Church while serving with a Christian Mission in Dewsbury, U.K. So that came as a precious reminder & one to reflect upon. And you're quite right, I think most of us contributing on this Site, won't take personal credit for what we share, as we write what we understand from God's Holy Word & being led of His Spirit. I realize that others could say the same, yet interpret the Word quite differently, which of course gives different points of view for others to consider. However, we come, I trust, with a real sense of brotherly unity in diversity because of our 'common' faith. We could never claim to be the repository of Truth, but to declare what the Word says with the Light we've received.
No, I'm not a pastor - just a lowly child of the King, ever amazed as to "why, unworthy as I am, (God) claimed me for His own". (From the hymn, "I know not why God's wondrous Grace"). I live in Perth, Australia, having experienced a mighty conviction & moving of the Spirit in October 1979 whilst in my quarters in the Air Force in Canberra. My life of unbridled sin was brought before me, receiving a special piercing visit by God's Spirit that brought me to my knees in tears. And in a moment those tears turned to joy as His confirmation & peace filled me, so if anyone should've entered the room, I would have been deemed a ripe candidate for urgent psychological help.
I have shared many Bible studies over the years, particularly during my time in Pakistan & India, but now am retired in Perth, the city my family moved to from India 54 years ago. Anyway, that's a quick brief to give you some background but to also acknowledge the great value of the many others who also share here, of what the Lord has revealed to them in their studies in the Word.
Just Live your conscience, and participate in our Country's process to make those views public and Heard.
I was confronted today by a 20yr old telling me, a 60++ yr old, that she had just voted the first time. Then she sorta ranted about how all the 20 somethings we're casting ballots to replace what we have. Whoopee. I think some of that "hate" is directed against Godly people too. I told her I was a Christian and believed in issues; not solidarity.
I just listened, sadly. These are the same people who will take Antichrists Mark, to prove they will not be controlled by God anymore.
Parents, do explain how the system works. We pick the leader who follows Gods principals.... in a perfect world.
Last night I looked up cultures who sacrifice children, and it's a sad sad thing to know Moloch still lives in hearts.
Your questions do come at a very appropriate time, particularly as we see so much of what God's Word speaking of sins & wrongs we commit, being treated as normal, acceptable behaviour in society. And yes, wherever possible Christians should speak out against abortion, homosexuality, easy pardon for criminals (being let out into society to inflict more pain & death on innocent people), and many more.
If the world doesn't hear our objections to these wicked acts of men, then they will have nothing to alert them or deter them from their wicked course. Most likely our stand will 'fall on deaf ears', but as the prophets of old had to declare God's warnings, so should we make His Word & Will known wherever & whenever we can. See Ezekiel 3:17-21 for the heavy burden that was upon Ezekiel to warn the people & the consequences that came to him if he did not do so. Some use placards on streets or in front of abortion clinics, or through articles in media or advertisements, or just in conversation when the subject comes up. Our witness for righteousness must be clear even if it means that our words are considered as foolish & against society's wishes. Our words, lives & actions will never resemble the world's, nor should they ever come close - we are children of God & not of the World.
Yes, it would be wrong to vote for leaders who support abortion, homosexuality, & a host of other evils, but one has to decide whether the fitness of that leader or the party he/she represents is also worthy of your vote. This is a very difficult decision to make especially for believers, especially in light of the upcoming U.S. elections, with some Christians refusing to vote on those grounds or even opting to support a Christian party, even these often don't fall in line with God's requirements, especially in this area of abortion.
I hope you get some other useful thoughts on this important subject.
It is very wrong to abortion a baby. This means that you are telling God, "God, I don't want this precious child you have allowed to give me. No thanks." The Bible says that children are a blessing and gift from God. I would encourage every parent who thinks of doing abortion to NOT do it. You will not only regret it, but it will forever change your life. Don't do it.
My only guess as to this position is thinking of special cases of rape or incest. But adoption is still the best alternative in any case if a mother doesn't want to be one. Barren moms and dads can pay thousands of dollars and wait many years to adopt, because other moms would rather kill their baby than let he/she have a loving adoptive family to raised in.
It doesn't make sense how it's illegal to kill an unborn animal like an eagle egg or many other animals or harming plants too, but it's legal to kill an unborn human and the government will even help you pay for it. Does that make sense to anyone?
No matter what, I know God is Good, and his will will be done on earth as in heaven in Jesus name.
Most without the love of God in their hearts, have as their foundation the welfare & happiness of the mother rather than the embryo or unborn child. Why? The embryo is only that, an embryo - even though there may be life there, it is still something less than human, they say. The welfare of the mother is more important as her usefulness is greater to her family & society.
Those who love the Lord & know His Will, regard every human life in every stage of its development, as special & precious & to destroy that life is murder & so the destroyer stands before the God Who gave life & a life's Plan to that child. In our quest to enjoy life in both intimate & non-intimate environments, we pay little heed to the outcomes of our thoughts & actions. And so the verse seems most applicable: "every man did that which was right in his own eyes" ( Judges 17:6). It was no longer what God required of them & us but what we deem as correct & warranted based on our desires - and as you said, this folly is increasing in greater measure in the world around us.
To abort a child prior to 20-22 weeks as acceptable, is still murder. Will any government propose that it should be when both sperm & ovum unite is when life is created? Unfortunately, most don't accept that life commences before that point, even though it is clearly seen in the laboratory. Is the embryo then likened to an ant which we could step on & extinguish, giving it little further thought? How will mankind stand before God in that day? What excuse will he give or can he give? God's Righteousness will blow open the inherent wickedness deep within his heart & manifest all that has been covered over for the sake of happiness & expediency.
Or, women went to un-wed mothers homes to give birth and release the baby to be adopted.
Enter the 60's and free, unrestrained sexual sin. It was like living amongst rabbits on LSD. Grandparents had to raise their grandchildren.
A decade later, abortion was legalized and the unwed mothers homes disappeared.
Homosexuals came out of the closet
Another decade, AIDS appeared and was declared a pandemic by the CDC, but didn't do anything about it.
Following decade lesbians decided to live reckless and large too.
2000's, they all want to be families with children.
Now, they all demand to live married and force society to accept their standards in public schools.
I've seen all this happen. Christians need to hang out in their state legislatures and scream for CHOICE to put their children in Christian schools!!
We have to live here until Jesus comes to get us. It's up to us to protect our rights too. I'm even favorable to home schooling.
Our kids can grow up more intelligent because they will not be slammed in their emotional life with the loose morals of an evil generation that has Declared WAR on children (all ages).
Now the sex traffickers are kidnapping Christian children and teens. How many will just disappear on Halloween this weekend? Will we even see those stories on evening news?
We are to GO YE to the world in our cities; our neighborhoods. Take the gospel to them. Don't let the world preach "their gospel of death, despair and sexual depravity, into our homes.
We have to teach the Bible to our kids age 3 and up. There is no reason to let them watch secular tv as a babysitter! Drop Netflix and get PureFlix !!!
Stop Compromising! Half Christian and half ?? We spend big bucks on MEDIA. It's the gospel of SATAN. Why are we so weak?
Be strong. Get wisdom. Be fearless.
Yet, even with such a bleak outlook for the future, we know that God will still have His final Word & that even through our wonder & despondency, He still uses such governments to fulfil His Plans. 2 Kings 14:26-27 reminds us that even with wicked Jeroboam, God could use him to bring Israel out of her bitter affliction - that all things are possible with God. We should pray for those in government ( 1 Timothy 2:1-3) & be as those who that stand in the gap, interceding for them who have not God's love & power in their lives ( Ezekiel 22:30).
No, I'm not a pastor - just a lowly child of the King, ever amazed as to "why, unworthy as I am, (God) claimed me for His own". (From the hymn, "I know not why God's wondrous Grace"). I live in Perth, Australia, having experienced a mighty conviction & moving of the Spirit in October 1979 whilst in my quarters in the Air Force in Canberra. My life of unbridled sin was brought before me, receiving a special piercing visit by God's Spirit that brought me to my knees in tears. And in a moment those tears turned to joy as His confirmation & peace filled me, so if anyone should've entered the room, I would have been deemed a ripe candidate for urgent psychological help.
I have shared many Bible studies over the years, particularly during my time in Pakistan & India, but now am retired in Perth, the city my family moved to from India 54 years ago. Anyway, that's a quick brief to give you some background but to also acknowledge the great value of the many others who also share here, of what the Lord has revealed to them in their studies in the Word.
I was confronted today by a 20yr old telling me, a 60++ yr old, that she had just voted the first time. Then she sorta ranted about how all the 20 somethings we're casting ballots to replace what we have. Whoopee. I think some of that "hate" is directed against Godly people too. I told her I was a Christian and believed in issues; not solidarity.
I just listened, sadly. These are the same people who will take Antichrists Mark, to prove they will not be controlled by God anymore.
Parents, do explain how the system works. We pick the leader who follows Gods principals.... in a perfect world.
Last night I looked up cultures who sacrifice children, and it's a sad sad thing to know Moloch still lives in hearts.
If the world doesn't hear our objections to these wicked acts of men, then they will have nothing to alert them or deter them from their wicked course. Most likely our stand will 'fall on deaf ears', but as the prophets of old had to declare God's warnings, so should we make His Word & Will known wherever & whenever we can. See Ezekiel 3:17-21 for the heavy burden that was upon Ezekiel to warn the people & the consequences that came to him if he did not do so. Some use placards on streets or in front of abortion clinics, or through articles in media or advertisements, or just in conversation when the subject comes up. Our witness for righteousness must be clear even if it means that our words are considered as foolish & against society's wishes. Our words, lives & actions will never resemble the world's, nor should they ever come close - we are children of God & not of the World.
Yes, it would be wrong to vote for leaders who support abortion, homosexuality, & a host of other evils, but one has to decide whether the fitness of that leader or the party he/she represents is also worthy of your vote. This is a very difficult decision to make especially for believers, especially in light of the upcoming U.S. elections, with some Christians refusing to vote on those grounds or even opting to support a Christian party, even these often don't fall in line with God's requirements, especially in this area of abortion.
I hope you get some other useful thoughts on this important subject.
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