Bible Discussion Thread

Revelation 20: 13-15

13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Do people that were in hell still have a chance of being in the book of life?

I understand that those who have rejected Christ now or died not having heard the Gospel are consigned to hell. And there is no second chance for anybody. Hebrews 9:27, "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgement". The decision we make in this life is the one & only opportunity we all have. It's a message many don't want to hear - but if we don't tell them, we have sealed their fate.

This is a reply on Chris's comment about judgment & hell. But I'm going to comment on it in a series of questions that I believe many bible believing Christians should think and pray on.

1) How much does God love people?

2) Where did Jesus Spirit go during the three days His body was in the earth?

3) Consider this: 1 Peter 3:18-20 NKJV "For Christ also suffer once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared..."

4) Who were these spirits Jesus preached to and freed?

Finally, I'll ask again, how much does God love people? I encourage everyone to think on this, and converse with the Holy Spirit.

Thank you Robynn for your comments/questions & if I may respond.

1. Indeed, God's Love for all mankind is so immense & unfathomable that He continued to engage with us even when everything about us warranted our complete extermination. But that Love persisted as we read in Romans 5:8; 2 Peter 3:9.

2, 3, 4. 1 Peter 3:18-20. The focus in this passage is on 'the Spirit'. The same Spirit that brought Jesus back alive from the dead was also by the same means (i.e. the Spirit) that Jesus went to the spirits held in prison.

Now, this is the only passage we have on this visit by Jesus, though there are references to spirits in chains ( Jude 6; Revelation 20:1-3). And I realize that many Christians attempt to place the event in 1 Peter 3, to Jesus' visit at the time of His death. It could well be but we cannot be certain of this as we are simply given very limited detail. And in the context of Peter's writing, this visit was not his focus. All we know is that Jesus did visit at some point & specifically to those who were disobedient in the days of Noah; when that took place is not revealed.

And "how much does God love people?" As mentioned, His Love knows no bounds. But His pure Love equates to His pure Justice. And if we think that God's Love must also allow for sinners, whether they've come under the sound of the Gospel or not, to have a second chance to hear, repent & receive, then what is the point of preaching the Gospel now, why did the apostles & myriads of other faithful saints suffer brutally & horrible deaths, if there was a second opportunity for lost souls? "Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation." - no second chances, no purgatory.

Thanks Chris for your reply. I agree with you on what the scriptures state. I was not implying that there is in fact a purgatory or a second chance. No sir, the Bible does not state that. My comment was more along the line of deep thinking of things that make you go hmmm...in an effort to stir up the spiritual mind of our Christian family. That is why I advised to seek the Holy Spirit's input on the matter. I would never teach people will have a second chance at repentance if they reject the gospel here. Again, as you stated, there are things we are just uncertain about.

I may have been out of line for making my statement on a public forum, I apologize. Please charge it to my head and not my heart.

Thanks for the clarification, Robynn. My last comment pertained to yours: "Who were these spirits Jesus preached to and freed?" I took this to mean that those spirits imprisoned had the Gospel preached to them & subsequently freed (whether by virtue of the message given them or the need for their response to it). I don't believe either took place. We generally assume that the Gospel was preached, but could it be something else? That is, the event may not have happened at Christ's death but at another occasion? That it wasn't the Gospel that came to them, but another announcement &/or pronouncement? That the caged spirits might still be in chains after Christ's Word to them?

My fear is that so often we ascribe an understanding & teaching to a passage that gives us very little detail to properly form a correct understanding, whether we've heard a sermon or read a book about it. If something isn't clear, then it does take quite an effort to just leave the matter & say, "We just don't know".

And no apology needed. You have every right to share your thoughts so that those who read them may also contemplate, assess & respond if necessary. Thank you for what you shared & the Lord bless you.

does that mean that we do not have a second chance at forgivness

If you had experienced conversion and received the life-changing gift of the Holy Ghost, would you need a second chance?

"I once was, but now I am." There is no 30 day "Free Trial" period.

I am putting together a study on Matthew 5-7, the Sermon on the Mount. As I did a cut and paste I removed the verse numbers and am in the process of adding an outline to the text. Chapter numbers are retained.

The addition of verse numbers has had a negative effect on learning the teachings of Jesus we are missing much when we are presenting a verse.

I don't believe God will condemn anyone to hell who has not heard about Jesus, who has not had the opportunity to choose

Pat, if I may direct you to Romans 2:12-16:

"For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."

Here we see the Apostle Paul's teaching on those who have sinned "in the Law" (i.e. the Jews who were given God's Law to abide by & to judge themselves as those who failed in keeping the Law perfectly), and those who 'perish' (note: not 'sinned', since sin is effected, accountable & punishable by God by the giving of a Law, Romans 3:20) without having received the Law.

So to the Jew who remains under the burden of the Law & not in receipt of God's Grace in Christ, they will be judged by the Law, & they will fail, for none could ever keep the Law perfectly ( Galatians 2:21b:"for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.").To the Gentile (non-Jew) who in days past never received or even heard of God's Laws & therefore never subject to its conditions, Paul says that these may not have the written Law in stone/parchment, but by nature perform the Law as written upon their hearts; it's now their conscience that accuses them of doing wrong or excuses their sins, that God sees & thus judges. Certainly not like getting God's Commands directly, but when both Jew & Gentile have to stand before God, the judgement meted to them will be based on the Law whether given directly or written in their hearts/consciences.

And that's why the Gospel is so important: it is salvation to all.

Thank you for your response. I agree, the Jews that chose to reject our Savior have condemned themselves

Luke being a medical doctor described a great divide. The way I interpret this, those that accepted Christ are on one side of this divide with Christ in Heaven and those that rejected him are on the other side waiting judgment along with those that have never heard waiting on their opportunity to hear and either accept or reject him. Remember when Christ was crucified he went to where those that hadn't heard about the plan of salvation, because it hadn't happened yet and they were still under the law and he witnessed to them giving them the opportunity to accept or reject salvation. I don't believe anyone gets a second chance but I do believe the Gospel teaches all will have the opportunity to accept or reject Salvation. God Bless !