Bible Discussion Thread

my pastor says not all can baptize

is this for real? i know folks that have baptized their children ! when they could understand salvation . although the command was given to the apostles in matt. ?? jim d.

With all respect to your Pastor, the Bible reveals to us many things about water baptism that is not generally practised by the Church today. For various reasons, mainly for convenience & expediency, we do things differently now. For example, rarely does a sinner get saved & is then baptised soon afterwards - sometimes it can be weeks, months or years. The baptism is generally done within the confines of a Church building, whereas the object of it is for the personal & public testimony to others (outsiders) that this person who has left all is now identifying with Christ alone. The sinner who is saved is also asked to sit in for several sessions of Bible study & counselling to ensure he is ready of baptism (when did this happen in the Scriptures?). And as you've written, baptism seems to be done by pastors or elders, when another person (maybe by the one who has led or been witness to the sinner's salvation experience) can & should be the baptizer.

Maybe, your Pastor might believe in a special authority or power given to those appointed as Church leaders, to administer this ordinance or that only such an appointment can truly determine the reality of the baptizee's faith. Yet, in the days of the early Church, there was no such requirement: people got saved by hearing the Gospel & soon afterwards were baptized as an extension of that salvation experience. Though it is true that the apostles, because of the newness of the Church, did baptize folk & later, the leaders of the Church also did so as instructed by the apostles, but the Word never indicates that to baptize someone is only the responsibility of pastors. Nevertheless, please don't think ill of this servant of the Lord - we are not called to judge but to esteem one another in love & to learn from the Word under his direction.

So Chris I hear you say we are saved and then get baptized mark 16 tells us he that believes and is baptized shall be saved not vice versa!

That's correct Sir. Our salvation is dependent on our faith in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross & nothing else attached to it. When we repent of our sins & God forgives, we are born again of His Spirit (i.e. baptized by the Spirit) through His indwelling & given a new start, new life & new power to live for Jesus. Subsequent to that mighty event, the believer begins his journey with an inward & outward testimony via water baptism.

When Jesus spoke those words in Mark 16:16, He spoke of the future salvation experience of those who come to Him via the Cross. If we want to associate water baptism as a requirement for salvation, two problems occur:

1. any act, even baptism, cannot contribute to a salvation by faith, or else salvation doesn't come through faith alone but with a fusion of both. So the person who says he believes & is then told that he has to be baptised to be saved, is immediately made to believe that an extra requirement is necessary to effect salvation. Then the question: what else am I required to do? Am I truly a Christian - supposing I've neglected to do something else? Jesus was simply stating that salvation requires belief (faith) only - baptism then as a natural immediate response. "But he that does not believe is damned": could we have a person who has been baptised & yet not truly 'believing'? Sure can. I know of a few, baptised, evidently spoke in 'tongues', etc. & now having rejected the Lord - no saving faith - no salvation, in spite of baptism & more.

2. what happens when one cannot be baptized: whether due to old age, serious illness, insufficient time between saving faith & baptism (i.e death has occurred), teaching of the Church or even a great passing of time from first believing. If baptism as well is necessary for salvation, then none of the above would have any hope of forgiveness & eternal life and could there be many living full victorious Christian lives who have never been baptised & are actually deceived & lost?