Bible Discussion Thread

 
  • Ingrid Li on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    So there is a tree of wisdom and a tree of life but when man and woman wanted to partake they were told: NONONO, this is NOT for you!

    Not my idea of a loving god!
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Also Ingrid Li, please refer to God with upper case G, it shows honor. God bless you
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    To Ingrid Li,

    Notice God did not mentioned to Adam the tree of life until after Adam ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. And no, it was not the tree of wisdom. Wisdom is achieved through knowing good and evil, and understanding is to know the difference.

    You can more understanding this if you realize that Adam and Eve were both void of understanding which can only be achieved by knowing that the opposite of good is evil. Did you know that there are good and evil spirits? And that God created them both? You can find this in ISAIAH 45:7. God is the creator of both things seen and unseen. He, God created evil. He did so for a purpose, to give us knowledge and understanding so we can be wise to know God. I can go on forever on this, but I don't want to bore you or anyone else, so I'll stop here. God bless you
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Ingred,

    Where is the tree of wisdom written about in The Scriptures?

    God gave Adam ONE commandment. "And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." Gen 2:16-17

    From this point in time until now, we are faced with this fundamental question, "Will I CHOOSE to believe God?"

    Our natural inclination is to ACT as if we do NOT believe God. And this is exactly what happened. God wants people who will believe Him, no matter what! Adam failed the test and the rest of The Bible contains examples of a few people believing God and God's Mercy and Grace being extended to those who believe, because we ALL believe imperfectly.

    "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."Joh 3:16-18

    "For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life." Rom 5:10
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Hi SKIP VOUHGT,

    I want to just add a little comment here. The Adam and Eve story was not a test. Notice God did not mentioned the tree of life until Adam ate the fruit. In a test, one has to have knowledge of a subject in order to be tested on it. The subject here is death. There is no way Adam could have had full knowledge of death because he was just 3 days old. At this time Adam, Eve and the animals only know to obey God's command "not to eat," the fruit of that tree, and they all were in full compliance.

    Now in chapter 3 we are introduced to a third character, the serpent, who I like to call "the teacher." When God created the evil spirit, it choose the serpent to go into. So it was the evil spirit in the serpent that was talking with Adam and Eve to do the act of sin. I have so much more to comment on this but I'll just conclude by saying, God creates everything for a purpose. The tree was for the purpose of giving the knowledge of evil then sin and finally the knowledge of death. So what happened in the garden of Eden was exactly what was supposed to be. There is a saying "IF THERE IS A POSSIBLE FOR SOMETHING TO GO WRONG, IT WILL GO WRONG." God bless you
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Vince,

    You asserted, "There is no way Adam could have had full knowledge of death because he was just 3 days old."

    You cannot support this absurd allegation. Adam had 1) observed ALL the animals God had created and then he 2) named EACH animal according to the observations he had made.

    I Believe this was most likely YEARS after his creation. He would have seen carnivorous animals, seen death both natural death and death by attack. When God said to him, in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die, Adam knew what that meant after he spent time with God's creation.

    This was a test. Didn't matter if Adam knew of the Tree of Life. He had ONE prohibition that he failed to keep over a relatively short period of time. So they both disregarded God's instructions and the world plunged into chaos.

    But God already had a plan to save mankind.
  • Sacha - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Yes Skip ,this is something that whenever i think about it my mind is genuinely boggled ! God knows and has always know everything about everyone ,when i really think about exactly what that means for me for you for everyone from everlasting to everlasting its awesome ! God is awesome ! God has already or is in the process of putting everyone exactly where they need to be to fulfill His purpose ,why do i ever worry about anything ?
  • Keeping Our Eyes On GodFree Will - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    We have need to always remember that God created us with free will.

    There is Gods perfect will towards us; and then there is our human will. As long as we seek the perfect will of God (according to the Word of God), our lives are pleasant and full of peace.

    When our eyes and ears stray over to the "voice of this world", is when we get out of step with the Perfect Will of God. We're told to keep our eyes on Him. Only read prophesy in the Bible.

    There are so many voices in the world right now that are demanding attention and allegiance to their causes. That's how we are able to perceive that Gods End time purpose is advancing.

    There's a scripture that says, "Awake Sleeper.."

    The only way to know what is advancing is to study faithfully, Gods Word. Do the things the Lord says to do, to be ready for the next planet-wide event (Caught Up in the Clouds).

    Some people try to downplay that reality. Don't be led astray. Read the parable Jesus taught about the TEN VIRGINS. Oil is the joy of the Spirit and Lanterns are the Light of Revelation given to us by Christ. No matter the spins people teach on scripture: you know yourself what it says and means for us today.

    Never be afraid to speak up and warn some folk that have heard something different.

    Jesus said to Be Looking For Him. Our hope keeps our view upward, like an eagle: instead of pointed at the dirt like prairie chickens. They don't see the Chicken hawk that is about to make a lunch out of them.

    The way world governments and world politics are leaning, linking up, taking away our freedoms; forcing us to pay taxes for their ridiculous programs; is a thermometer to keep your eye on. Don't be fooled. Be ready to go WITH JESUS.

    Don't trust national news. Branch out: Epoch Times, Jerusalem Post. Check stories against scripture. Don't be lied to by media groups.

    Be wise.

    Mishael
  • Carleton - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Guess its reproof day! Good for the soul.

    Thanks again, Carleton
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Thanks Skip Vought for responding.

    I'm glad you admit that your statement is your belief and really it is. I like to keep my postings shot so as not to bore the reader/s.

    Can you please look again and see that God told Adam to name the animals so as to put him to sleep in order to remove Adam's rib to make Eve. Also, the Bible states that everything, including Adam and Eve, were created in six (6) days. It was 6 evenings and mornings to show a 24 hour period.

    God said "IT IS NOT GOOD FOR THE MAN TO BE ALONE." So Adam was never alone for a whole day. The whole story shows that God arranged the whole thing to go exactly the way it went. Where was God when the whole conversation between Eve and the serpent was taking place?

    I'll wait for your answer in your next post so we can share our understanding of this very important topic in which there are so many misunderstandings. Please reply. God bless you
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Vince,

    "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground." Gen 2:4-5

    If there were just 3 days, why would the text state, "and there was not a man to till the ground." Sometimes its weeks before I get out into my garden to till the ground. Why would it be of significance if no one was there for 3 days?

    Furthermore, after observing and naming the animals, that includes observing that all the animals had mates, male and female and observing what the mating process resulted in, it was then that Adam realized that there had not been a mate in all of creation for him. It was after this process that God fashions Eve from Adam's rib. And Adam's response was, "This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man," where "is now" is has the sense of "now, finally, at last" after all this time observing and naming the animals, I have found a mate. God said "IT IS NOT GOOD FOR THE MAN TO BE ALONE," because it was a significant period of time that he had been alone!

    I agree that God planned the whole thing before the foundation of the world. He had cast out Lucifer, and those who agreed with him, to earth and then put man right in Lucifer's crosshairs. The Godhead had already planned redemption for Adam and his race.

    Signs of a Gracious Loving God, to redeem enemies of God. That answers the original question.
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Hello SKIP,

    I see you have looked again but you are still missing the point. What you have posted started from verse 4, but to really get the full essence of the script, is to start from verse one and especially vs. 2 where it says, "and on the seventh day God ended HIS work." Then below, the Bible describes the process of creation including mankind.

    So after the seventh day was expired, this is now the 8th day when the serpent was introduced and started its work of teaching the opposite of good. I'm asking you again as I asked you in the first post, where was God when this was taking place? Could Adam and Eve see God? It's very important to me if you will answer these 2 questions before we continue so I can evaluate who I'm posting to.

    Remember SKIP, we are just learning together.
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Vince,

    "where was God when this was taking place?"

    That's like asking, "Where is the number five?" God does not have a location unless He lowers Himself to take on human form in His creation of space, time and matter, which He did when walking with Adam in the cool of the day. Most likely this was the pre-incarnate Christ.

    "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."Joh 1:18

    "So after the seventh day was expired, this is now the 8th day"

    You've make a significant assumption that the seventh day was a 24 hour day, just as the first six.

    1) No evening and morning.

    2) "There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief." Heb 4:9-11

    Just as God ceased His work of creation on day 7, when we enter His rest, it too is unceasing. We are in the seventh day until Christ returns.

    3) Although God has ceased His work of creation, He has been WORKING until the return of Christ.

    "But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work."Joh 5:17

    "I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work."Joh 9:4

    BTW, I agree with you (and have an active post on this) that His plan, before the foundation of the world, was for Lucifer to confront Adam and that Adam would rebel and that God Himself would become a man in order to redeem mankind but not the fallen angels.
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    SKIP,

    Correct you are, God was right there because He's everywhere all the time. So back to my commentary. Now we have the entire world being created and a garden with God, 2 people, lots of fruit trees, lots of animals and a particularly, subtle animal, the serpent. The tree in question is the "tree of THE knowledge of good and evil." No mention or knowledge of the tree of life yet. It was mentioned after they sinned (why after?).

    The garden represents a classroom. The teacher is being represented by the serpent. The students are mankind and the entire creation. In a study program, we generally have questions, answers and demonstrations. The first question of all time is, "DID GOD SAY." This was posed by the serpent to both Adam and Eve and then followed with an answer by Eve. This question should have been answered by Adam, that's why God said to Adam, "BECAUSE THOU HAST HEARKENED UNTO THE VOICE OF THY WIFE," (Gen.3:17). The information about the tree was given to Adam and not Eve.

    Eve's answer had an addition to what God said. She said we should not touch the tree, not true. Their job is to take care of the garden, including that tree. It's a lot more I could say on this point, but I want to keep it short and get to the point. Notice vs. 6, and when the woman saw that the tree was good for food; what's going on here? What's happening here is the serpent is demonstrating to them that there is no deadly substance in the fruit to cause death. We all learn much more and much faster when we can see a demonstration of the subject at hand than by being lectured on the subject. This is why the serpent is called more subtle. It's being possessed by the evil spirit that God created for this very purpose.

    I noticed in your post that you mentioned free will. Yes we all have free will in everything except salvation. God decides and already choose all who will share eternal life with Him. Just think, if God don't know that information, then He is not all knowing. If also,
  • Carleton - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Hello Skip, My next comment for the subject at hand. In the garden, Adam was at rest. Even though the possibility of eating of the forbidden fruit in the knowledge of good and evil existed and that the garden had present the crafty serpent that seemed to only have the power of suggestion and no other power, free choice reigned. Rest was there, peace and goodness was there and it was good.

    Thanks again, Carleton
  • Carleton - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Also only a comment. The seventh day, a day of rest for God's man, remained until Adam was judged and removed from the garden. Jesus fulfilled the seventh day as a new Adam and again restored rest in this day.
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    To CARLETON,

    Amazing, Carleton, I could not have stated any better. God bless you
  • Carleton - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    God Bless you Vince. The Lord is faithful to answer our needs together.
  • Carleton - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Continued comment: Though the first Adam lost the comfort of the rest of the seventh day, God did not. However when Jesus left Heaven to come as God in Man, the second Adam he left behind that rest (estate) until His resurrection after Calvary.
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Again Carleton, I agree.
  • Darren Croft - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    Vincent,

    Go ahead and tell us your thoughts here. I can't extract specific answers from the text.

    Maybe you can explain the dichotomy of the devil who shows up in the garden, Genesis 3, from the "morning star" that weakened the nations, Isaiah 14:12-15 and aspired to rise to heaven, from the one kicked out of heaven, Revelation 12:7-9.

    I need semblance to draw a rational conclusion on what's happening with satan's tenure. Is this the nature of inequity, allowing the spirit of satan to continually spoil life?

    Jesus calls the devil "the God of this world", 2 Corinthians 4:4. Does the devil's spirit reside on earth where he works his loom, or does he do so from heaven, or both? Has he already been kicked out of heaven, and Rev 12:7-9 is purely symbolic?

    Today we face the same problems Adam and Eve faced in the garden, nothing has changed. I have a feeling you can shed light on this.
  • Vince - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    DARREN,

    The comment I'm about to make here is going to be a shock as it was a shock for me too when it was revealed to me after years of careful studying and praying.

    Here goes.

    In Genesis ch.1, we have GOD. Ch.2 gives us ADAM and EVE which happens to be the only 2 people God ever created (that's another topic). In ch.3, we now have a 4th character, the serpent. Keep in mind that God is putting all His 3 created characters together in a location of His creation, THE GARDEN OF EDEN..

    In this garden God said to Adam, "THE TREE OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL," and "YOU SHALL SURELY DIE." Now look In the book of ISAIAH 55:11, God said, "NO WORD SHALL LEAVE MY MOUTH AND RETURN VOID." The words EVIL and DIE left HIS mouth, and we can see today that those words has been with us from then till now and will be to the end.

    The point I'm making is, God created the world good and He puts in it His parameters for learning and understanding. Are you understanding me so far? I don't like to do long posts so I'll stop here for now, plus I have to be at work. So answer if you understand so for and later we will continue. God bless you
  • Darren Croft - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    The fall of mankind originated from Adam and Eve disobeying God.

    As such, God set the precedence for man to be mortal, and die.

    Isaiah 55:11 supports God's character and statutes, but I don't need that to understand what happened between God, Adam & Eve, or the serpent. I take God by his Word.

    This holds true for everything God utters.

    God often says "I the LORD have spoken it: it shall come to pass, and I will do it..." Ezekiel 24:14

    What of satan's dwellings as listed above?
  • Mishael - In Reply on Genesis 3 - 3 years ago
    I'm just makin a comment ok?

    God is spirit. The Holy Spirit is spirit. Jesus had not been born of woman yet. (Pre-incarnate)

    His name is The WORD.

    John 1:1-5, 2 Timothy 3:16

    Hope this helps.



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