Bible Discussion Thread

Question I have. When king David led Israel's army to defeat all enemies, clear the land of inhabitants so Israel could live in the land promised by God, can we say David's motive was love and obedience or anger and vengeance? Also, when Jesus cleared the temple of money changers and vendors was His motive love and obedience or anger?

Rick, rather than analyse the two scenarios you gave, we could look at the human emotions & responses that we give to external influences. We often categorize such emotions as being good or evil; that we should cleave to the one & avoid the other. But is that the correct way to consider them?

Often such emotions & resulting responses are not necessarily bad or evil in themselves: they're dependent on the reason for it & the manner in which it is given. Even Love: we often see that as a good emotion to have & the highest form of expression to another. But Love could also be carnal & not for the other's benefit but maybe because of self-centredness. Or, Honesty: 'honesty is the best policy' is the adage, but one wouldn't share all the good & bad of a person when an enquiry is made - one could then be accused of being judgemental or biased. Obedience: a good trait, but should we then obey the Devil or one who's leading us into error?

You mentioned Anger. Anger is also one that can be good or bad. We have to ask: 'for what reason are we found with anger in our hearts?' Are we angry because our sins/weaknesses have been exposed or are we angry because God's Name is defamed or someone has been treated badly or unfairly? And then comes Vengeance (as you asked): this is one emotion/action that falls into the 'bad' category. Vengeance can never be good as it requires one to commit a wrong to try & correct a (supposed) wrong. "Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord." Romans 12:19. This is one emotion/action that we have to withdraw from as only God can deal properly with the perpetrator of the wrong.

So David's emotion of Obedience & Anger would be justified, if his only desire was obedience to God & having the same emotion as God had towards idolators or the enemy. And Jesus' venting of Love or Anger too, can be seen for His Love for the Father, being in one Mind with Him, & angered at the abuse of the Temple of worship & prayer - yet He loved the people.

Amen. Thank you Chris.

Sometimes it helps to use the word SEARCH box. Search wrath, anger, backbiting. You get the whole panorama on the word and it's use in a sentence.

Romans 13:4

For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Romans

Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.

2 Corinthians 12:20

For I fear, lest, when I come, I shall not find you such as I would, and that I shall be found unto you such as ye would not: lest there be debates, envyings, wraths, strifes, backbitings, whisperings, swellings, tumults:

Galatians 5:20

Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

Ephesians 2:3

Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Ephesians 4:26

Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:

Ephesians 4:31

Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: