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2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
I noticed some comments posted that sound like they are only a breath away from denying the Lord. God's Word and 2 Peter 2:1 is for them. Luke 12:5. 1 Timothy 6:12.
Some sound upset that God demands obedience, and some feel entitled to do what they want as if there's no ramifications. John 14:21, John 14:15, James 1:22, Proverbs 16:18.
I agree. The gift that is so freely talked about by those who want to "keep their lives" and still recieve salvation are plainly missguided. You simply can't keep your life, and recieve salvation. It is one or the other!
The gift is really a "favor from God" with the hope that the reciever will accept it - and walk with Christ. If the reciever does not walk with Christ - they do not recieve the gift of salvation.
If we are truly - Born Again - there will be a change in us, and we will want to try to live a Christ like life!
Paul states the following which is very clear:
Hebrews 10:26
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"
Galatians 6:7
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
A Christ like person will strive to be sin free, and will produce good fruit/works.
James 2:22
"Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?"
So many christians todaybelieve wrongly they are going to heaven no matter what. This is wrong! Here is Paul himself instructing us how to achieve our own salvation:
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
Why would Paul instruct us in the above verse, if all believer's are going to heaven anyway?
There are "no free tickets". People need to read the bible and believe what it says.
Bro Dan Your second statement is absolutely non biblical and unscriptural, Gods Gift is given by confessing Romans 10:9+10 and grace free gift by believing its not let me give them something and see what they do. That is taking scripture and saying this is what I think God was thinking or doing. Gods motivation was pure love not a game to see what they would do, they being us were lost. Salvation is not based on works of the flesh, hence Gift. Believe what you please I'll stick with Ir Is Written! Let God be True In All His Works And Ways.
Over the years, various biblical scholars and language experts disagree on the interpretation as a gift or favor. (You can easily research this subject.)
I believe God's promise as "a favor" simply because we are instructed by Jesus and all of the apostles including Paul, throughout the scriptures to follow Christ, repent from sin, be baptized, and follow God's 10 commandments, to produce good fruit/works.
Brother Rick, you state you will stick with the scriptures, then you will agree we must take some action too - to receive our salvation!
Here again is apostle Paul "King of Faith" speaking that "we must work out our own salvation with fear and trembling". This takes Action on our part! There are many more verses throughout the bible instructing us "to take action" if we wish to receive our salvation.
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
So, we must "work out our own salvation", there is no FREE TICKET!
If we are Born Again, we must experience a change! Our old selves should die, and we will live differently, by making a conscience effort to follow God's 10 Commandments and refrain from living sinful lives.
Based on the scriptures, the act of "just believing" does not accomplish salvation. The easiest way to fail, is to say "I can just believe" and continue to live my sinful life and I will receive my salvation. Many people believe this false doctrine and I would suggest they read this scripture below, and think about where their own salvation stands today!
Matthew 7:14
"Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."
Bro Dan When I was born again because of no understanding literally I still practiced things not convenient out of ignorance, its not that I didn't believe I didn't know over time as I understood and stopped those actions by my believing actions I didn't spiritually change I changed in habit pattern then God worked greater in my life hence the rewards, but if some one receives the gift and over time decides not to change then no blessings or rewards but he's not going to loose what God spiritually Gave him. God gave it because we needed it that was what paul was fighting in the epistles with people thinking Gods gonna ignore there unbelief not the case what you sew is what you reap, therefore if you sew spiritual you reap spiritual and if you sew carnal you reap carnal. Its your loss but God did everything he could do.
We are in agreement with the promise of the gift/favor that God gave us, it is "THE WAY" for us to have salvation. I believe based on the scripture that if we except the gift/favor, our current worldly life should die, and we will live a "New Life" as a Christ follower. Following Christ we will become obedient, and in doing so follow God's Commandments, and produce good fruits and good works.
If we just say "we believe", and then continue to live our current worldly sinful lives, we will not receive salvation, this based entirely on my reading/understanding of the bible scripture.
Jesus Christ/God is consistent throughout the bible that we must become obedient. He is consistent in the OT, NT, and even after he died on the cross he is consistent with instructing us to be obedient if we want our salvation. Here is Jesus (40-50 years after his death) revealing to apostle John in Revelation, what he will expect from each of us if we hope to enter into the city/heaven.
Revelation 22:12-14
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
In summary, Jesus is telling us that we will be rewarded for our works, and if we want to enter into salvation we will do his commandments. So, Jesus is the Judge, telling us what he will want from us to enter Salvation! He is not saying "all we have to do is believe". Jesus is always consistent, and we must be obedient - according to Jesus.
Jesus words last forever:
Matthew 24:35
"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."
As Christians, if we are sincere about achieving salvation - are we to just disregard all of this scripture spoken by Jesus?
Dan I appreciate our discussions my heart is never to tear down built to build up so if i don't communicate something clearly don't hesitate to say what do you mean, I deal with some physical stuff that's a real treat.[prayer appreciated], that being said I'm thankful for your communication. witth agapeo.
Dan Look scripturally we were given spiritually life by Grace which is divine unmerited favor we didn't work for it. I'm not calling it eternal security, that's not written, in the old testament David the King committed adultery, and murder , and after that God said he was still a man after his own Heart.
That's the key did He still believe in His heart absolutely, but because of pride being king he thought he could have any woman in the kingdom, but God said no dice.
That's why he said in psalms take not thy Holy Spirit from me because back in the old testament it was upon men or women not I repeat not in them. You could lose it by disobeying, King Saul lost it when He when he didn't do what Samuel the man of God told Him and then Lied, his heart was not right.
We now have spirit by free gift in us we are sons and daughters spiritual by rebirth not upon but in, in Gods eyes spiritually we are perfect, not in the flesh in the spirit.
Now the war or the choice renew the mind because when we are born again we don't immediately think Godly thoughts or walk 24/7 on the word in fact we who are born again will never walk 24/7 perfectly spiritually until the return because corruption our bodies our minds included by believing and discipline to doing the word we'll get better and better but we will not be totally perfect until resurrected
Jesus Christ Himself said some will reap 30, 60 ,100 fold thats the individuals ability to change and walk which is our work. As far as Gods Job we are complete in Him. Something else understanding God and sin don't mix and yet Adam and Eve both Sinned but who did God blame for the cause of the sin, the adversary but they had to pay and so do we in our flesh. Hence what you sew is what you reap I will discuss scripture never with foot down whats the profit.
I have profited from our discussions here regarding our salvation. Many others read our posts on KJVO, and as we write these posts I believe that God is here with us encouraging all of us to share in the food and drink in this banquet.
Matthew 18:20
"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."
Hi Dan With everything we think we know the feast or banquet of eternity to me will be beyond anything the senses mind can appreciate. We will be totally complete in all categories! Thanks for the fellowship!
Bro Dan That just confirms my point, when a person is born again they choose to go Gods Way his word his condition which requires a change in heart and mind by the spirit not just believe. [L would really be thankful when people would not change or try to read into what I plainly state ]hence the individual needs to work his walk. Never said or implied free ticket by the way in Romans its called free Gift! that being said if you give a gift to a relative unconditionally out of love and they decide to not use it later on do you say I want it back, remember God gave it because we need it not because we earned it, now getting the inheritance is an entirely different discussion. The first century church fell apart because too many people were abusing there freedom in Christ and went back to walking by the flesh, and judging each other by the flesh that's why Paul says in the epistle to Timothy know this that all Asia has turned from Him and He was Called to be the Apostle to the Gentiles. These people chose to walk by the flesh and invent different belief systems based on the five senses, the one body in Christ has never been correct since.
Regarding the word "Gift" verses "Favor" as mentioned in an earlier post, these terms have been interchanged and argued by the biblical scholars and are related to the various language translations. If it is as you say simply a gift, all that believe - will go to Heaven. Not wanting to beat a dead horse, but the devil and his demons believe - are they going to heaven? We both know the answer, so it requires more than just believing, and this is talked about by Jesus and his apostles throughout the NT.
I'm glad that we do agree that "just believing" is not "a free ticket to salvation". So then, it also takes obedience, so we can't just say "we believe" and continue to live our old lives (live in sin), we are Born Again - to live new lives, and we must struggle as Paul states in various scripture. Many do not believe Paul when he states the following scripture:
Hebrews 10:26
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"
Galatians 6:7
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
So if you believe Apostle Paul, we will need to participate in our own salvation! It is not just "a Gift" that we receive - no matter what we do. Many people today pick and choose some of Pauls scripture that will approve their current lifestyle, but they will ignore Pauls additional scripture - if it does not help to confirm their lifestyle. When they hear all of the "feel good preachers" telling them they can keep their current worldly lifestyle and still receive salvation - they jump right on board that train!!!!
All of the scripture tells us we "must believe" and "be obedient" to receive our salvation.
All three (3) books were written/directed at the newly established Christian Churches.
James wrote his book to Jewish believers to help encourage them to endure and live bold Christian lives, and is a book about practical Christian living that reflects a genuine faith that can transform their lives.
The book of Philippians, was written by Paul to the city of Philippi in eastern Macedonia which is now part of modern-day Greece.
The book of Galatians, written by Paul, and it is believed that the Apostle Paul coined the term Galatia to denote an expansive Roman province, referring to the general composition of churches he had established across the southern part of the Roman province of Galatia.
Bro Dan Galatians 1:2 To the brethren in churches of Galatia, Philippians 1:1 To the saints in christ jesus, James To the twelve tribes scattered abroad My Brethren. That's what I read.
I noticed some comments posted that sound like they are only a breath away from denying the Lord. God's Word and 2 Peter 2:1 is for them. Luke 12:5. 1 Timothy 6:12.
Some sound upset that God demands obedience, and some feel entitled to do what they want as if there's no ramifications. John 14:21, John 14:15, James 1:22, Proverbs 16:18.
I agree. The gift that is so freely talked about by those who want to "keep their lives" and still recieve salvation are plainly missguided. You simply can't keep your life, and recieve salvation. It is one or the other!
The gift is really a "favor from God" with the hope that the reciever will accept it - and walk with Christ. If the reciever does not walk with Christ - they do not recieve the gift of salvation.
If we are truly - Born Again - there will be a change in us, and we will want to try to live a Christ like life!
Paul states the following which is very clear:
Hebrews 10:26
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"
Galatians 6:7
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
A Christ like person will strive to be sin free, and will produce good fruit/works.
James 2:22
"Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?"
So many christians todaybelieve wrongly they are going to heaven no matter what. This is wrong! Here is Paul himself instructing us how to achieve our own salvation:
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
Why would Paul instruct us in the above verse, if all believer's are going to heaven anyway?
There are "no free tickets". People need to read the bible and believe what it says.
God Bless
Over the years, various biblical scholars and language experts disagree on the interpretation as a gift or favor. (You can easily research this subject.)
I believe God's promise as "a favor" simply because we are instructed by Jesus and all of the apostles including Paul, throughout the scriptures to follow Christ, repent from sin, be baptized, and follow God's 10 commandments, to produce good fruit/works.
Brother Rick, you state you will stick with the scriptures, then you will agree we must take some action too - to receive our salvation!
Here again is apostle Paul "King of Faith" speaking that "we must work out our own salvation with fear and trembling". This takes Action on our part! There are many more verses throughout the bible instructing us "to take action" if we wish to receive our salvation.
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
So, we must "work out our own salvation", there is no FREE TICKET!
If we are Born Again, we must experience a change! Our old selves should die, and we will live differently, by making a conscience effort to follow God's 10 Commandments and refrain from living sinful lives.
Based on the scriptures, the act of "just believing" does not accomplish salvation. The easiest way to fail, is to say "I can just believe" and continue to live my sinful life and I will receive my salvation. Many people believe this false doctrine and I would suggest they read this scripture below, and think about where their own salvation stands today!
Matthew 7:14
"Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."
Happy Sabbath Day, and God Bless.
We are in agreement with the promise of the gift/favor that God gave us, it is "THE WAY" for us to have salvation. I believe based on the scripture that if we except the gift/favor, our current worldly life should die, and we will live a "New Life" as a Christ follower. Following Christ we will become obedient, and in doing so follow God's Commandments, and produce good fruits and good works.
If we just say "we believe", and then continue to live our current worldly sinful lives, we will not receive salvation, this based entirely on my reading/understanding of the bible scripture.
Jesus Christ/God is consistent throughout the bible that we must become obedient. He is consistent in the OT, NT, and even after he died on the cross he is consistent with instructing us to be obedient if we want our salvation. Here is Jesus (40-50 years after his death) revealing to apostle John in Revelation, what he will expect from each of us if we hope to enter into the city/heaven.
Revelation 22:12-14
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
In summary, Jesus is telling us that we will be rewarded for our works, and if we want to enter into salvation we will do his commandments. So, Jesus is the Judge, telling us what he will want from us to enter Salvation! He is not saying "all we have to do is believe". Jesus is always consistent, and we must be obedient - according to Jesus.
Jesus words last forever:
Matthew 24:35
"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."
As Christians, if we are sincere about achieving salvation - are we to just disregard all of this scripture spoken by Jesus?
God Bless.
That's the key did He still believe in His heart absolutely, but because of pride being king he thought he could have any woman in the kingdom, but God said no dice.
That's why he said in psalms take not thy Holy Spirit from me because back in the old testament it was upon men or women not I repeat not in them. You could lose it by disobeying, King Saul lost it when He when he didn't do what Samuel the man of God told Him and then Lied, his heart was not right.
We now have spirit by free gift in us we are sons and daughters spiritual by rebirth not upon but in, in Gods eyes spiritually we are perfect, not in the flesh in the spirit.
Now the war or the choice renew the mind because when we are born again we don't immediately think Godly thoughts or walk 24/7 on the word in fact we who are born again will never walk 24/7 perfectly spiritually until the return because corruption our bodies our minds included by believing and discipline to doing the word we'll get better and better but we will not be totally perfect until resurrected
Jesus Christ Himself said some will reap 30, 60 ,100 fold thats the individuals ability to change and walk which is our work. As far as Gods Job we are complete in Him. Something else understanding God and sin don't mix and yet Adam and Eve both Sinned but who did God blame for the cause of the sin, the adversary but they had to pay and so do we in our flesh. Hence what you sew is what you reap I will discuss scripture never with foot down whats the profit.
I have profited from our discussions here regarding our salvation. Many others read our posts on KJVO, and as we write these posts I believe that God is here with us encouraging all of us to share in the food and drink in this banquet.
Matthew 18:20
"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."
God Bless.
Regarding the word "Gift" verses "Favor" as mentioned in an earlier post, these terms have been interchanged and argued by the biblical scholars and are related to the various language translations. If it is as you say simply a gift, all that believe - will go to Heaven. Not wanting to beat a dead horse, but the devil and his demons believe - are they going to heaven? We both know the answer, so it requires more than just believing, and this is talked about by Jesus and his apostles throughout the NT.
I'm glad that we do agree that "just believing" is not "a free ticket to salvation". So then, it also takes obedience, so we can't just say "we believe" and continue to live our old lives (live in sin), we are Born Again - to live new lives, and we must struggle as Paul states in various scripture. Many do not believe Paul when he states the following scripture:
Hebrews 10:26
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"
Galatians 6:7
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
Philippians 2:12
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."
So if you believe Apostle Paul, we will need to participate in our own salvation! It is not just "a Gift" that we receive - no matter what we do. Many people today pick and choose some of Pauls scripture that will approve their current lifestyle, but they will ignore Pauls additional scripture - if it does not help to confirm their lifestyle. When they hear all of the "feel good preachers" telling them they can keep their current worldly lifestyle and still receive salvation - they jump right on board that train!!!!
All of the scripture tells us we "must believe" and "be obedient" to receive our salvation.
Happy Sabbath Day and God Bless.
All three (3) books were written/directed at the newly established Christian Churches.
James wrote his book to Jewish believers to help encourage them to endure and live bold Christian lives, and is a book about practical Christian living that reflects a genuine faith that can transform their lives.
The book of Philippians, was written by Paul to the city of Philippi in eastern Macedonia which is now part of modern-day Greece.
The book of Galatians, written by Paul, and it is believed that the Apostle Paul coined the term Galatia to denote an expansive Roman province, referring to the general composition of churches he had established across the southern part of the Roman province of Galatia.
God Bless.
So let's close the loop. James and Paul were talking to the new Christians/Church, which includes us today.
God Bless
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