Bible Discussion Thread

I would be interested in you opinion concerning verses 17-25.This was well after the Jerusalem council Acts 15 and Galations 2 when the Jewish Council gave Paul and Barnabas their blessing to continue to preach the Gospel of Grace to the Gentiles (with some Jewish exceptions.) With this uproar while Paul was explaining to James how his Gospel of Grace was succeeding in Gentiles being saved, it seems that many Jews were not convinced that he was preaching their Gospel of believing and keeping the Law of Moses.

Some of The so called legalist/Elders were of the opinion that the myriad of gentiles should not be received as Paul was receiving them,,, they were against it.

They were of the opinion that a gentile could not go past the porch of Solomon, but to remember what God did to Ptere in the 10th chapter? it's been discussed here on the site where God asked Peter (3) times to eat of the unclean animals but they weren't unclean nor were they animals, they were gentiles/common whereby God told him to not call them common or unlcean for when they receive the Jesus they are a child of God.

Verse 20 chapter 21 reads incorrectly, it should read, "You see brother how many myriads there are AMONG the Jews having believed, and all the zealous one for the law are." (it's a mixed crowd)

Verse 21 They have been informed now about you that apostasy you teach from Moses, these among the gentiles all jews telling them not to circumcise them the children, nor in the customs to walk.

(This would be a lie, a spin job, they have been misinformed, no apostasy taught,,,Paul's 3 fold ministry was to the gentiles, not to the jews,,, Paul was teaching to gentiles "only" that they did not have to circumcise, nor walk in Jewish customs)

Sounds hypocritical to me of them/some elders being against the gentiles receiving God, but must walk in their customs.

Hello Frank, I do not think that the Jewish believers necessarily preached a different Gospel than that of Paul's. The Gospel of Jesus is the same for everyone. He is not "divided". But legalism was evident among some believers, probably both Jewish and Gentile, as some Jewish Christians were legalistic about the Law, but some Gentiles were legalistic about things like: foods sacrificed to idols (Jews would not partake of such foods as Jews); eating of meat or refraining from it altogether, being married or staying celibate. Even today, there are sects of Christians who follow legalistic practices. Each one of us probably have one or more things we refuse to participate in due to it appearing lead one into sin. Paul spoke to all of these things, not advocating antinomianism (all things are o.k. even what God has called sin), but saying that we are to live holy and godly lives and to not cause anyone to stumble due to our liberty in Christ. We are to do what our faith allows us to do and not offend out conscience.

I do think that Paul's Gospel was the same as that of the apostles, for Jesus had taught them what they needed to preach before He ascended into heaven. But He did ask them to wait until the Holy Spirit came upon them to witness to the Gospel. The Holy Spirit did not give them the Gospel message, Jesus did. But the Holy Spirit gave them power to do signs and miracles, courage and boldness to preach the Gospel and face martyrdom, and consolation and assurance of them being in Christ and secure in Him.

The ONE TRUE Gospel was preached for a few years before Paul was even converted. And, although Paul was called to primarily take the Gospel into the Gentile world, he did preach to Jews and the other other apostles and disciples preached also to Gentiles (Phillip, Peter as two examples from Acts).

I think that as believers we truly need to believe what Paul said as there no longer being Jew nor Gentile in Christ, yea, we are all one people in Him.

Hey GiGi,

I agree the gospel that the apostles taught was the same as did Paul. What Peter stood up and said in Acts 2 is the same with one difference, they had not yet been told to carry it to the Gentiles. They were still under the command to go only to the lost sheep of Israel, Matt. 10:5-7.

My understanding, you may disagree with but may want to check out, that there was a prophecy that was not fulfilled. The saying to the Jew first and also to the Gentile. The time had not come to cut off the branch. The Church started all Jews/house of Israel.

Many places this prophecy at the end time but my studies show me it has been fulfilled, Jesus during the first 3.5 years and Jesus through His apostles during the last 3.5 years. It is Daniel 9:27, the apostles could not go to the Gentiles until the last 3.5 years of the 70th week of the prophecy was fulfilled, confirming the covenant to Daniel's people, (the house of Israel). I know you may say you don't agree but check it out.

Stephen was killed and when he was killed Acts 7:54-60, in vs 57 they stopped their ears (total rejection of Jesus) and drove out of Jerusalem all the believers in Jesus except the apostles. Saul/Paul was instructed by Jesus to go to the Gentiles, in Acts 9, Peter had his dream, in Acts 10, and the confirming the covenant with the house of Israel was fulfilled.

We see in Acts the transition that the apostles went through, like Acts 15. The gospel was the same, but the apostles had not been told it is for the Gentiles also, it took time to accept Jew and Gentile has been made in Jesus one new man, Eph. 2:15.

I hope this makes sense, love you.

God bless,

RLW

Hello Ronald,

My only comment will be to refer to Acts 1:7-8. Jesus told the apostles to be His witnesses in Jerusalem, in Judea (both Jews), in Samaria (non Jews) and to the ends of the earth (Gentiles). So, yes, Jesus did tell them that the Gospel was for the Gentiles, too.

I love the Words of our Lord. He is Truth and His Words are certainly true.

Hey GiGi,

I also love the Word of God, in Acts 1, the former treatise referring to Luke's gospel, "all Jesus began to do and teach". In vs. 2 after Jesus ascended, He gave commandments through the Holy Spirit. At that time, they were still looking for the Messiah to set up the kingdom and free them from Rome, vs. 6 "Lord wilt thou at this time restore the kingdom to Israel".

In vs. 7 and 8, Jesus told them it was not for them to know the times or seasons and after the Holy Spirit came, they would receive power and guidance. They were told they would be witnesses unto the uttermost part of the world, but they were not told when, the Holy Spirit would tell them when and whereas we see throughout the New Testament.

They stayed in Jerusalem, it was not until after Stephen's death by the same council that put Jesus to death, stopped their ears, their rejection of the Messiah was complete. Not until then did the Holy Spirit direct them to preach Jesus to Samaria. It was Philip, not the apostle but the evangelist, one of the 7, Acts 6:5 went into Samaria and was the first to preach Jesus. When the apostles who were still in Jerusalem heard, Peter and John went to see, Acts 8. Acts 9 Paul and Acts 10 Peter's dream.

We see how the Holy Spirit led Peter; Peter even said it was unlawful for a Jew to keep company with one of another nation, but God through the Holy Spirit showed him that God is no respecter of persons. My understanding is at this time the 70-week prophecy given to Daniel that was determined upon Daniel's people and the holy city was fulfilled,

You do not have to reply, I did not intend to create a debate, I just thought you may like to study it. I know many places the 70th week at the end times but what if it has been fulfilled?

God bless,

RLW

Hello Ronald,

I am not wishing to debate either. Thank you for your input.

I read last night in Acts 15:6-11. Peter says that God had chosen him to preach to the Gospel to the Gentiles so that they would believe. He went on to say that God gave the Gentiles the Holy Spirit just as He had done for them in Jerusalem. So, apparently, Peter was preaching the Gospel to Gentiles before he knew Paul.

My point is that it is wise to avoid hard and fast views concerning how the Gospel spread nor when the church began because I think that God is the only One who truly knows what He did in those days, as He builds the church and chosen whom will preach the Gospel and where.

We have the book of Acts an the writings of Paul, Peter, John, James, and Jude to reveal some information about the church in the 1st century A.D. But this is not a running history that includes the work of all the other apostles, nor the others of the 120 who were in the room at Pentecost. if we did, we would know better how things transpired. Since Scripture does not include a full account of the workings of the church at this time, perhaps we can be satisfied that the Word of God concerning the Gospel of Jesus was spread throughout the known world during that century by Jesus' apostles and disciples as well as from Believer to those in their sphere of influence. That is the important matter, in my opinion. When the apostles became apostles or began their work or when the church truly began are somewhat peripheral matters to me. But since there is this discussion on these topics, we can share what the Scriptures say about this to one another and share what we learned from them.

I appreciate your instruction to me. It helps me.

Frank Bush. Something to keep in mind Paul spent 3 years in Arabia because

his own head was blown away by what happened. He was in the desert receiving

Revealed knowledge of what was accomplished and completed and given with

the new birth. Think about this he's known for murdering any followers of Christ

Then shows up a changed man walking via the spirit and showing signs miracles and wonders. When he witnessed the hypocrisy in action of the Judean believers

That was a serious confrontation because who are you Paul to show or teach or

Tell us how to walk. Paul's gospel was to establish what Christ called him to do,

And he was always fighting legalistic division between the law works and grace

Fulfilling by the spirit walking in agapeo or perfect love. Against such there is no

Law hence the law is fulfilled. But that is only accomplished by walking in the

Spirit. There were many still zealous for the law to the point of resisting the truth

Of Christ. This is spoken of many times throughout the church Epistles and

James and Peter and Hebrews.