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Warning: session_start(): Failed to read session data: files (path: /var/lib/lsphp/session/lsphp80) in /home/kjv.site/public_html/Discussion-Thread/index.php on line 2 BIBLE DISCUSSION THREAD 213261
I cannot understand how the rapture cd be physical....When God and his Kingdom is spiritual....And Rev 11:15..The angel said the kingdoms of this world have become the Kingdoms of our Lord and his Christ....And he shall reign for ever and ever...Thus the Kingdom of heaven will be with in us right here on this earth.....The H.G. is the Kingdom....Remember Jesus said thy kingdom come thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven....But Heaven is in the spiritual realm....The Kingdom of God is not in meat or drink but in joy and peace in the H.G....Which is spirit....Meeting him in the air is just prophetic of meeting him in the spirit...On the day of Pentecost they met him in the air which was that mighty rushing wind....Which was the H.G....Jesus just uses air and wind as symbolic language for the H.G. ....But he was talking bout the spirit..We meet him in the spirit which is that gift of the H.G....Which is that Child of PROMISE that has to be born in us....Thats y he is saying that which is BORN, BORN of the spirit tis spirit the H.G. Our new heart and new spirit our new innerman A BABY...unless you receive the Kingdom of God as a lil Child...A baby Christ...That which is BORN of the spirit is spirit the H.G...A spiritual infant that cannot speak of himself for a season....Which is the manchild that is gonna rule all nations....But he has to be BORN in us via the seed of the sower the bridegroom's seed thus a baby Christ...The Son of Man...Mankinds fruit unto God... Romans 7:4...The word BORN implies a living being is gonna be born in us..Which is spirit...the Kingdom is a HIM...Seek ye 1st the Kingdom of God and HIS Righteousness.
This is how Jesus describes the Rapture....Unless you receive the KINGDOM OF GOD as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in...The KiNGDOM of God has to come as a child...A spiritual Birth...Thats y the new birth is so important...and thats y he has to know us.. The Child the kingdom cannot come unless he KNOWS us ..The good seed.
Some of these comments might be just trolling aimed to provoke a reaction out of people. I hope that is not the intent here.
The rapture is clearly physical because the Bible describes it physically.
"Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." 1 Thessalonians 4:17 KJV
"Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left." Luke 17:35 KJV
These are specific physical examples.
Likewise, Jesus dying on the cross physically happened. If anyone claims that didn't actually happen but was only a spiritual or metaphor then that would be a lie and anyone spreading lies will have to face and explain that before God on judgment day.
Adam, Norcal is lex N. as the wording used are the same as when he went under Alex N. When I asked Norcal if he was Alex and why he changed his screen name, cricket.
Ruby Lea has been on here for a month or so. Someone thinks this might be Earl Bowman, but maybe not.
One Eighty has been on here for a few months.
So, I don't think any of these are trolls. But I do think that their beliefs are out of sync with sound hermeneutics of Biblical interpretation. There is overspiritualization of almost every Scripture by Alex and Ruby. Also, Alex posts the same "sermon" in almost every post about God multiplying Himself in us and a new Holy Ghost child is conceived and born in us (which is gross error)
One eighty's beliefs reflect classic dualism, monism, and new age beliefs mixed in with some Christian ideas. But he seems sincere and willing to engage in good dialogue.
But there may be others who are trolls. Please feel free to identify them when you sense that one is posting. It is a good thing to know. WE can be prayerful about how to respond to them. Who knows, maybe some will truly be converted.
Hi GiGi, those are astute observations and very possible. Whatever the case, I genuinely look forward to someday meeting everyone we've interacted with on this forum in heaven, including you. It's mind blowing to even think about what that might be like.
In the Hebrew scriptures, there is NO UPPER case letters, all the places god occurs; it occurs as god, lower case, even referring to god the father, I am not being sneaky, the translators added the capital letters, they are the sneaky ones.
The word says you and I died on the cross with Christ, Did you PHYSICALLY see your death happen?
I Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are ALIVE ----You were MADE ALIVE by Christ resurrection ---- an REMAIN (to never see death) shall be caught up (raptured) together with them (that were caught up before you) in the clouds (the cloud is a symbol of God's presence) to meet the Lord in the air (his omnipresence), so shall be every be with the Lord ( in his omnipresence).
Luke 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together ---they could have been working together for years; and each died, maybe at different times, scripture does't say, ONE was translated in the presence of God because she believed God's words ---- and the other LEFT ---she died not believing God's word and went to the grave to await the second resurrection.
The only thing you PHYSICALLY SAW was they were both buried, you didn't see which was take and the other left.
How many funerals have you been to, were they taken or left? only God knows.
The chosen are RAPTURED at the time they depart there bodies of DUST.
Isaiah 27:12 ....and I will gather you ONE by ONE, O ye children of (the promised) Israel.
Do you believe this is a metaphor or do you actually believe you were physically crucified with Christ around 2,000 years ago.
John 15:5 says Jesus is the vine and "ye are the branches." Do you believe you are actually just a branch? And do you believe Jesus is literally a vine and nothing else?
If those are the metaphors they obviously are, why do you assume ye are gods is not a metaphor in Psalms 82:6? Isn't that cherry picking something to suit your chosen narrative? In the same sentence it also says ye are children, so if this was honestly applied you would then be a literal child? Otherwise its just cherry picking the gods metaphor which could be considered intellectually dishonest. Are Gods children? Do you really believe there's more than one God, despite what so many other scriptures say?
Even the same author of Psalms only 4 chapters later says there's only one God in Psalm 86:10 "thou art God alone". Do you believe this verse just as much the other one you like? How about all the other verses that clearly say there's only one God like 1 Corinthians 8:6, 2 Samuel 7:22, Deuteronomy 4:39, 1 Chronicles 17:20. Why would someone ignore all these but only focus on believing a metaphor in half of one verse is not one instead?
Shouldn't we be using discernment and reading the Bible with an open heart to what God is teaching us rather than the other way around? Just like kings and rulers are called lords (lowercase to show context), gods does not mean God. Anyone who cherry picks and claims they are a god is really deceived and this comes from satan. Satan loves deceiving people in this way and it has his signature all over it. God bless.
The word says we were crucified with Christ and we were resurrected with Christ.
Yes, I believe I died on that cross 2000 years ago, before I was even born, I was raised a new creation 2000 years ago, that why works has nothing to do with salvation.
There is ONLY of God, and FATHER of all other gods, his children.
Is not Christ a SON, a child of God the father.
If we died with Christ and were resurrected with Christ, then we are also SONS OF GOD, just like Christ, since Christ is a god, by inheritance we are a god.
Ephesians 4:6 .... ONE GOD ....and Father of ALL ... above ALL .... through ALL ....and IN YOU ALL .....
If God is IN ALL, then all are gods
Why is this so hard to believe, these are God's WORDS.
I consider what you are saying is on the the right track, not that I'm the authority on truth, or that you need my or anyone's approval. Yet, I would consider going deeper into what you are touching on regarding, "When God and His Kingdom is spiritual."
With the focus on "spiritual", or spirit, in John 4:24 we have the statement, "God is Spirit". Therefore, He is not flesh. John 3:6 says, "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." Therefore, He did not create flesh. John 6:63 states, "It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing. Therefore, it is the spirit which is life, rendering the flesh as NOTHING.
God creates in His Own Likeness. Is it not reasonable that if God is Spirit, and perfect and eternal, which I'm certain all Christians agree, how can we arrive at the unreasonable conclusion that He creates flesh or that anything He creates is something other than perfect and eternal? It is reasonable also to conclude that if something is created perfect, and then becomes imperfect, for whatever REASON, including sin, then it could not have been created perfect in its original creation.
The word "reason" is often used in the Bible; commonly as a noun. In Isaiah 1:18 it is used as verb. Is it is not then reasonable to conclude that God created our mind to use REASON to understand what is obvious? The "devil is afraid of the obvious that arrives through reasonable thinking, since obviousness is the essential characteristic of reality, or truth. The rest i.e. anything pertaining to the flesh, profiteth nothing, does not matter, counts for nothing.
Perhaps all of our conceived and perceived problems arise from what should be considered the "root of all evil", is the authority problem. Is our Author the Creator of Spirit which creates eternal spirit and life? Or is our author flesh that made flesh which is not eternal? Can't be both.
Is Christ not a BODY of Flesh and Bone; and the SPIRIT of his Father the LIFE of HIS BODY, the results of HIS resurrection BY the Spirit of HIS Father?
He was resurrected BACK to what he was from the BEGINNING, he LAID DOWN that GLORY he had with the Father, to become sinful flesh and destroy the WORKS of the Devil.
Christ ascended into the CLOUDS as a MAN, but, he was back to being GLORIFIED, so he was ONCE: OMNIPRESENT.
He can reside IN MAN as TRUTH and LIFE; or he can appear in THE FLESH in a LOCKED ROOM.
He can appear as FIRE in a BUSH.
He can appear as a CLOUD over and in the Tent of the tabernacle.
He can appear as column of fire on one side and total darkness on the opposite side.
We have to be BORN of Spirit, and that which is BORN of Spirit is Spirit, because ONLY Spirit is LIFE; BUT God has seen fit to CREATE a BODY for that Spirit to LIVE IN, and he called that BODY his Son Jesus Christ.
By the WORK'S of Christ resurrection we are a NEW CREATION, we have become THE BODY of Christ, he is the LIFE IN US, we are his BODY as HE is the BODY of the FATHER.
When he has subdued ALL CREATION under HIMSELF, he will turn the kingdom back to the Father who gave it to him, and ALL will be a BODY with the LIFE of the FATHER: Just like Christ.
God will be ALL in ALL.
Ephesians 4:4 .... ONE BODY (Christ) ..... ONE SPIRIT (God: LIFE and TRUTH) .......
Ephesians 4:6 ...... ONE GOD ..... FATHER of ALL .... above ALL ....through ALL ....in you ALL ....
Do not be like the preterists, who do not believe in God and his report but turn to themselves and the truth to fables. God has declared the beginning of the end and the end of this age (that is the new beginning; with the new heaven and the new earth). This shall be an everlasting kingdom, and nothing shall enter into it that defiles it. And there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor pain, for these former things are passed away. "And he said to me: "It is done! I am Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give freely from the fountain of the water of life. He that overcometh shall inherit all things, and I will be his God, and he shall be my son." - [ Revelation 21:6-7]
And this is true because it has been given to us in these last days according to the testimony of the holy angels and John, but it is his word that is faithful and true.
Expect no less, for truthfully the kingdom of heaven is not yet established here on the earth. Romans 14:17 by definition; God's kingdom is spiritual; Righteousness, joy, peace in the Holy Spirit, not mead and drink.
Luke 17:20-21; "And when he was asked by the scribes and the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, saying, "The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor shall they say, Look here or look there! for behold, the kingdom of God is within you." (We cannot see it but is within us now; as we already know).
Appart from this, The kingdom of heaven is physical. Be it on earth or in heaven.
John the Baptist always preached; "The kingdom of heaven is near!" Jesus also said that the Jews should repent, because the kingdom of heaven is near and was, for Jesus himself had come down, in so manner that they might know the times and the seasons and so that they would seek to know him.
We are the exactness of Christ, and the kingdom is VERY PHYSICAL; just not the physical that the eye of flesh can see.
We are still with CHILD until we depart this body (the RAPTURE, gathered one by one).
Then we PUT ON CHRIST; not only immortal LIFE, but also an omnipresent BODY.
Luke 20:36 Neither can they (the new creation) DIED ANYMORE: for they are EQUAL unto the ANGELS (omnipresent); and are the CHILDren of GOD, being the CHILDren of the Resurrection.
THE MAN Jesus Christ ....is the BODY of the of the HOLY GHOST ...... OMNIPRESENT ....He is THE ANGEL .... we don't give up our body, we just exchange the MORTAL for the IMMORTAL (the RAPTURE).
Ephesians 4:4 ....ONE BODY ...... ONE SPIRIT .....
John 17:22 And the glory that thou GAVEST ME, I have GIVEN to THEM (the new CHILD), that they may be ONE even as we are ONE.
John 1:51 ....hereafter (the resurrection) you shall see (not with the physical eye) heaven open (the BODY of man) and the angels ascending and descending of the Son of man (the new creation)---- CHRIST IN YOU ----
Isaiah 60:22 And a little one (Christ) shall BECOME a THOUSAND, a small one (Christ) a STRONG NATION (Israel).
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This is how Jesus describes the Rapture....Unless you receive the KINGDOM OF GOD as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in...The KiNGDOM of God has to come as a child...A spiritual Birth...Thats y the new birth is so important...and thats y he has to know us.. The Child the kingdom cannot come unless he KNOWS us ..The good seed.
The rapture is clearly physical because the Bible describes it physically.
"Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." 1 Thessalonians 4:17 KJV
"Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left." Luke 17:35 KJV
These are specific physical examples.
Likewise, Jesus dying on the cross physically happened. If anyone claims that didn't actually happen but was only a spiritual or metaphor then that would be a lie and anyone spreading lies will have to face and explain that before God on judgment day.
Ruby Lea has been on here for a month or so. Someone thinks this might be Earl Bowman, but maybe not.
One Eighty has been on here for a few months.
So, I don't think any of these are trolls. But I do think that their beliefs are out of sync with sound hermeneutics of Biblical interpretation. There is overspiritualization of almost every Scripture by Alex and Ruby. Also, Alex posts the same "sermon" in almost every post about God multiplying Himself in us and a new Holy Ghost child is conceived and born in us (which is gross error)
One eighty's beliefs reflect classic dualism, monism, and new age beliefs mixed in with some Christian ideas. But he seems sincere and willing to engage in good dialogue.
But there may be others who are trolls. Please feel free to identify them when you sense that one is posting. It is a good thing to know. WE can be prayerful about how to respond to them. Who knows, maybe some will truly be converted.
I seldom ever say anything without quoting scripture.
I am more than happy to have you show where that scripture is not true, but use scripture not what man says.
You don't believe Psalms 82:6 ye are Gods ..
You believe Christ is God; ONE with the Father, and the Father is God, one with Christ.
John 17:21 That they all may be ONE; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they may be ONE even as we are ONE IN US ....
Colossians 1:27 ....Christ in you ....
Why if the father and son are ONE and they are God, would not you believe we are God if we are the same ONE IN THEM.
Why don't you believe these scriptures, because they don't fit the teaching of MAN, that's why.
Whose right: MAN or God's WORD?
Rebut with scripture.
God Bless YOU!
In the Hebrew scriptures, there is NO UPPER case letters, all the places god occurs; it occurs as god, lower case, even referring to god the father, I am not being sneaky, the translators added the capital letters, they are the sneaky ones.
God Bless YOU!
The word says you and I died on the cross with Christ, Did you PHYSICALLY see your death happen?
I Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are ALIVE ----You were MADE ALIVE by Christ resurrection ---- an REMAIN (to never see death) shall be caught up (raptured) together with them (that were caught up before you) in the clouds (the cloud is a symbol of God's presence) to meet the Lord in the air (his omnipresence), so shall be every be with the Lord ( in his omnipresence).
Luke 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together ---they could have been working together for years; and each died, maybe at different times, scripture does't say, ONE was translated in the presence of God because she believed God's words ---- and the other LEFT ---she died not believing God's word and went to the grave to await the second resurrection.
The only thing you PHYSICALLY SAW was they were both buried, you didn't see which was take and the other left.
How many funerals have you been to, were they taken or left? only God knows.
The chosen are RAPTURED at the time they depart there bodies of DUST.
Isaiah 27:12 ....and I will gather you ONE by ONE, O ye children of (the promised) Israel.
God BLESS YOU!
No, I definitely didn't die on the cross with Jesus physically, did you?
"The word says you and I died on the cross with Christ"
Please share the scripture you have in mind. There are metaphors in the Bible, but not everything in the Bible is a metaphor.
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ .....
We were all crucified with Christ.
Ephesians 2:6 And hath raised us up together (with Christ) .....
We were all raised up with Christ.
Isaiah 28:19 ....together with my dead body shall they arise ...
God bless YOU!
Do you believe this is a metaphor or do you actually believe you were physically crucified with Christ around 2,000 years ago.
John 15:5 says Jesus is the vine and "ye are the branches." Do you believe you are actually just a branch? And do you believe Jesus is literally a vine and nothing else?
If those are the metaphors they obviously are, why do you assume ye are gods is not a metaphor in Psalms 82:6? Isn't that cherry picking something to suit your chosen narrative? In the same sentence it also says ye are children, so if this was honestly applied you would then be a literal child? Otherwise its just cherry picking the gods metaphor which could be considered intellectually dishonest. Are Gods children? Do you really believe there's more than one God, despite what so many other scriptures say?
Even the same author of Psalms only 4 chapters later says there's only one God in Psalm 86:10 "thou art God alone". Do you believe this verse just as much the other one you like? How about all the other verses that clearly say there's only one God like 1 Corinthians 8:6, 2 Samuel 7:22, Deuteronomy 4:39, 1 Chronicles 17:20. Why would someone ignore all these but only focus on believing a metaphor in half of one verse is not one instead?
Shouldn't we be using discernment and reading the Bible with an open heart to what God is teaching us rather than the other way around? Just like kings and rulers are called lords (lowercase to show context), gods does not mean God. Anyone who cherry picks and claims they are a god is really deceived and this comes from satan. Satan loves deceiving people in this way and it has his signature all over it. God bless.
What do you believe the KINGDOM of God is, and how do you have a part in that that kingdom, and what is your part in that kingdom?
The word says we were crucified with Christ and we were resurrected with Christ.
Yes, I believe I died on that cross 2000 years ago, before I was even born, I was raised a new creation 2000 years ago, that why works has nothing to do with salvation.
It's a GIFT, BY THE GRACE OF GOD.
God Bless YOU!
There is ONLY of God, and FATHER of all other gods, his children.
Is not Christ a SON, a child of God the father.
If we died with Christ and were resurrected with Christ, then we are also SONS OF GOD, just like Christ, since Christ is a god, by inheritance we are a god.
Ephesians 4:6 .... ONE GOD ....and Father of ALL ... above ALL .... through ALL ....and IN YOU ALL .....
If God is IN ALL, then all are gods
Why is this so hard to believe, these are God's WORDS.
God Bless YOU!
I consider what you are saying is on the the right track, not that I'm the authority on truth, or that you need my or anyone's approval. Yet, I would consider going deeper into what you are touching on regarding, "When God and His Kingdom is spiritual."
With the focus on "spiritual", or spirit, in John 4:24 we have the statement, "God is Spirit". Therefore, He is not flesh. John 3:6 says, "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." Therefore, He did not create flesh. John 6:63 states, "It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing. Therefore, it is the spirit which is life, rendering the flesh as NOTHING.
God creates in His Own Likeness. Is it not reasonable that if God is Spirit, and perfect and eternal, which I'm certain all Christians agree, how can we arrive at the unreasonable conclusion that He creates flesh or that anything He creates is something other than perfect and eternal? It is reasonable also to conclude that if something is created perfect, and then becomes imperfect, for whatever REASON, including sin, then it could not have been created perfect in its original creation.
The word "reason" is often used in the Bible; commonly as a noun. In Isaiah 1:18 it is used as verb. Is it is not then reasonable to conclude that God created our mind to use REASON to understand what is obvious? The "devil is afraid of the obvious that arrives through reasonable thinking, since obviousness is the essential characteristic of reality, or truth. The rest i.e. anything pertaining to the flesh, profiteth nothing, does not matter, counts for nothing.
Perhaps all of our conceived and perceived problems arise from what should be considered the "root of all evil", is the authority problem. Is our Author the Creator of Spirit which creates eternal spirit and life? Or is our author flesh that made flesh which is not eternal? Can't be both.
God Is
Peace
Is Christ not a BODY of Flesh and Bone; and the SPIRIT of his Father the LIFE of HIS BODY, the results of HIS resurrection BY the Spirit of HIS Father?
He was resurrected BACK to what he was from the BEGINNING, he LAID DOWN that GLORY he had with the Father, to become sinful flesh and destroy the WORKS of the Devil.
Christ ascended into the CLOUDS as a MAN, but, he was back to being GLORIFIED, so he was ONCE: OMNIPRESENT.
He can reside IN MAN as TRUTH and LIFE; or he can appear in THE FLESH in a LOCKED ROOM.
He can appear as FIRE in a BUSH.
He can appear as a CLOUD over and in the Tent of the tabernacle.
He can appear as column of fire on one side and total darkness on the opposite side.
We have to be BORN of Spirit, and that which is BORN of Spirit is Spirit, because ONLY Spirit is LIFE; BUT God has seen fit to CREATE a BODY for that Spirit to LIVE IN, and he called that BODY his Son Jesus Christ.
By the WORK'S of Christ resurrection we are a NEW CREATION, we have become THE BODY of Christ, he is the LIFE IN US, we are his BODY as HE is the BODY of the FATHER.
When he has subdued ALL CREATION under HIMSELF, he will turn the kingdom back to the Father who gave it to him, and ALL will be a BODY with the LIFE of the FATHER: Just like Christ.
God will be ALL in ALL.
Ephesians 4:4 .... ONE BODY (Christ) ..... ONE SPIRIT (God: LIFE and TRUTH) .......
Ephesians 4:6 ...... ONE GOD ..... FATHER of ALL .... above ALL ....through ALL ....in you ALL ....
God bless you!
And this is true because it has been given to us in these last days according to the testimony of the holy angels and John, but it is his word that is faithful and true.
Expect no less, for truthfully the kingdom of heaven is not yet established here on the earth. Romans 14:17 by definition; God's kingdom is spiritual; Righteousness, joy, peace in the Holy Spirit, not mead and drink.
Luke 17:20-21; "And when he was asked by the scribes and the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, saying, "The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor shall they say, Look here or look there! for behold, the kingdom of God is within you." (We cannot see it but is within us now; as we already know).
Appart from this, The kingdom of heaven is physical. Be it on earth or in heaven.
John the Baptist always preached; "The kingdom of heaven is near!" Jesus also said that the Jews should repent, because the kingdom of heaven is near and was, for Jesus himself had come down, in so manner that they might know the times and the seasons and so that they would seek to know him.
We are the exactness of Christ, and the kingdom is VERY PHYSICAL; just not the physical that the eye of flesh can see.
We are still with CHILD until we depart this body (the RAPTURE, gathered one by one).
Then we PUT ON CHRIST; not only immortal LIFE, but also an omnipresent BODY.
Luke 20:36 Neither can they (the new creation) DIED ANYMORE: for they are EQUAL unto the ANGELS (omnipresent); and are the CHILDren of GOD, being the CHILDren of the Resurrection.
THE MAN Jesus Christ ....is the BODY of the of the HOLY GHOST ...... OMNIPRESENT ....He is THE ANGEL .... we don't give up our body, we just exchange the MORTAL for the IMMORTAL (the RAPTURE).
Ephesians 4:4 ....ONE BODY ...... ONE SPIRIT .....
John 17:22 And the glory that thou GAVEST ME, I have GIVEN to THEM (the new CHILD), that they may be ONE even as we are ONE.
John 1:51 ....hereafter (the resurrection) you shall see (not with the physical eye) heaven open (the BODY of man) and the angels ascending and descending of the Son of man (the new creation)---- CHRIST IN YOU ----
Isaiah 60:22 And a little one (Christ) shall BECOME a THOUSAND, a small one (Christ) a STRONG NATION (Israel).
God Bless YOU!
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