Bible Discussion Thread

Goodmorning.

Part 1

Here is something I wanted to address earlier but I had to wait until the weekend due to my busy work schedule.

Jordyn said;

"The wages of UNBELIEF is DEATH.

The Gift of BELIEF is IMMORTAL LIFE and Christ ONLY has IMMORTAL LIFE."

and then in a few more lines you said the unbelief and those who believe will receive eternal life.

SO, THEY BOTH RECEIVES THE GIFT IN HIS THEOLOGY.

Well, there is no reward for the righteous.

HE'S CALLING GOD A CORRUPT JUDGE.

Here is more blasphemy in this theology.

Here is a direct quote of what he stated. (Pay close attention to 1a!

Those who believe they DIED and were made ONE in Christ, will never die again.

1a) "Those who don't believe they DIED, and the resurrection made them ONE as the Father and Son and son are ONE will be cast into prison, the GRAVE. Revelation 20:2-3. End quote.

(Shouldn't it be those who didn't receive Christ and had their names written in the Lambs book of life will be cast into prison?)

Jordyn is saying who ever don't believe in his theology is the unsaved! I WILL COME BACK TO THAT.

1b) After God has gather all his SONS to be priest in the Kingdom, he will resurrect the unbelievers back to their flesh and blood bodies, they will be loosed out of their prison ( Revelation 20:7).

After all the dead are raised at the second resurrection the Sons of God will preach the gospel to them about the truth of the resurrection, judge them by the words of God, and give them the truth and mercy given to us, and they will DIED the second death, and also become the SONS of God. End quote.

SO ACCORDING TO HIM ALL HUMANITY WILL EVENTUALLY BE SAVED.

Recap;

From what he has mentioned in the past, according to him the devil is our flesh.

The bottomless pit mentioned in Revelation 20:2-3 is the grave.

The unbelievers/Devil will be loosed out of the grave, "resurrected" in Revelation 20:7.

I will deal with this in part 2.

See Part 2.

GiGi

I understand that people keep reporting him. And I am grateful that even despite this he returns. He truly has a patience of a saint. Instead of attacking each other maybe we ought to "examine thyself". If you do not like what he is saying then you can simply ignore him. I ignored him for a few days and meditated on the word of God. After doing so I am now beginning to understand certain things he has stated. Too many people on here hump to themselves teachers but only have itching ears. I rather be a student first before being a teacher. Thank you.

God bless you.

Hello Lee,

As I posted to Mary Jay (Earl) I have never reported him or anyone else on this forum. And I am encouraged at times by some of His posts, being that they align with Scripture. But He does teach error in these ways:

1)That we are gods

2) That everyone will be saved no matter if they believe in Jesus or not.

So, it is in these teachings that he has repeated over the years that I consider to be heretical and therefore identifying him as teaching what the Scriptures do not teach when considering the whole of Scripture.

forum.

I genuinely care for Earl and I pray for him almost daily. But I do care about the truth more-so, and also for the community gathered on this forum that true doctrine is presented and that false doctrine is refuted.

Of course, I do examine myself and my own doctrines against the Word as everyone here should do. Earl has told me more than once that I am I error. I take that seriously and take the matter to Scripture to find out if, indeed, I am in error.

Thank you for your concern and for replying to me. I sincerely appreciate what you have said to me.

Sister Gigi:

I have never said we are gods;

I QUOTED what GOD said:

Psalms 82:6

Isaiah 41:23

John 10:34

The scriptures are Christ's WORDS, not mine.

I'm sorry you don't believe what Christ says.

But Christ SAID, men would believe the words of other men, before they would believe his words, and his words WILL NOT return unto him VOID, but will accomplish that which I please.

Isaiah 55:11

God Bless YOU!

Won't be around much for a while , finding it hard work on here :) . Sending you love and best wishes in Christ .

And Mary Jay,

I am sorry you do not believe what God has said in scripture in the citations I gave you.

Is. 44:6

Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and His redeemer the LORD of Hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is NO God."

vs. 8

"Fear not, neither be afraid; have I not told thee from that time, and have declared it? Is there a God beside me? yea, there is NO God, I know not any." And God does know all things, so we cannot be gods.

Is. 45:5

"I am the LORD, and there is NONE else, there is NO God beside me..."

vs. 18

"I.... am the LORD, there is NONE else."

vs. 21

"..there is NO God else beside me; a just God and a Savior; there is NONE beside me."

Is. 46:5

"To whom will you liken me, and make my equal, and compare me, that we may be like?"

vs. 9

'Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is NO else, I am God, and there is NONE like me."

In just Isaiah, God says over and over again that there is only one God in all of creation, and HE ALONE is this sole God. There are no other gods, no other for us to call gods because other gods do not exist in reality, only in the imaginations of one's minds and in the images we create or the men we idolize, even ourselves.

Earl, you can quote the few verses that speak of men being gods, such as Ps. 82:6 and Jesus reference to this verse in John 10:34 and the reference to Moses being "as" God to Pharoah in Exodus 7:1 all you want, but the meaning of these verses is that the judges and Moses were representing God before other men, not that they are actually gods in their nature because He has made it abundantly clear that He is the ONLY God that exists.

Earl, those of us who say that the view that we are gods is heresy say so on the basis of what I have explained about the verses you quote and the verses where God says He is the ONLY God. To profess belief that men are gods is heresy. It is usurping God as the sole God of all creation. It breaks the 1st commandment.

And yet , after quoting those scriptures to Mary Jay , you still think that Jesus is God ? You can't use those scriptures to prove two opposing beliefs .

Jema,

Sorry, I posted a response but apparently posted to my response to you. You can check for it on this thread.

Here is part 2

I hope you will do the research for yourself that I have done for myself. Let me know when you have done so and we can talk more. If you do not wish to check things out for yourself, then I don't think we really have anything more to talk about on this topic.

Yes, Jema, I do believe that Jesus is God and the Father is God and the Spirit is God.

I do not have time tonight to bring the biblical verses for why I believe this. Please be patient and I will get back to you tomorrow on this topic. I have family commitment tonight. Blessings.

Brother S Spencer:

Quote my words, don't say I said something that I did not say.

I will debate with you all day long if you wish.

God Bless YOU!

Hello Jordyn, I agree that we should quote your words, and S. Spencer has done not just once but many times. Debating others here is not always the best approach, but being open for correction is always appropriate.

Proverbs 10:17 "Whoever ignores correction leads others astray." NIV

"He is in the way of life that keepeth instruction: but he that refuseth reproof erreth." KJV

Proverbs 15:32 "He that refuseth instruction despises his own soul: but he that heareth reproof getteth understanding."

Jordyn, it is not easy for any of us to her the words of one who doesn't follow our own ideas. But it is wise to read or hear them and to check our souls asking the Holy Spirit to show us if the criticism is true of us or not.

I won't speak for S. Spencer here. But I will say that your postings sound very much like those of Earl Bowman who has given the impression of having left this site only to come back 3-4 times with different screen names. So, it would be helpful to us if you will answer this question. Have you been on this forum in the past as Earl Bowman?

Please know that I pray for you and others on this site every day. I will continue to do so because, since God has brought us together on this forum, we ought to care for one another, be willing to pray for each other, be willing to listen to what others say and prayerfully respond, not to contend, challenge, or debate others, but to express ones own belief, stand firm on our own beliefs if need be, and always have a willingness to admit to oneself that we may be wrong in our views and need to eliminate certain aspects of our beliefs to align with Scripture. We should be gracious to one another, not combative, not eager to have a "come back" for what someone else posts to us.

At times, participants on this forum do cross the line and say things they ought not have said. Apologies area always in order and should be warmly accepted. Some times it is best to exit a thread for the sake of peace.

Stay cool , don't allow yourself to be baited . I don't agree with everything that you say but I am very grateful to you for keeping me sharp and focused and you have very much helped my understanding , I have learned things from you and that's what I want from this site , to learn . Thank you .

Part 2.

Galatians 1:8-9.

Jordyn said;

Those who believe they DIED and were made ONE in Christ, will never die again.

Those who don't believe they DIED, and the resurrection made them ONE as the Father and Son and son are ONE will be cast into prison, the GRAVE. "Made one in Christ" in Jordyn's opinion means you become Gods"

Is this not another Gospel?

More issues.

Jordyn claims the flesh of the unbelievers is the devil and the bottomless pit mentioned in Revelation 20:2-3 is the grave.

He also claims we are already living in the 1000 years mention in verse 5.

He claims the unbelievers/Devil will be loosed out of the grave, "resurrected" in Revelation 20:7.

After all the dead are raised at the second resurrection, "LOOSED OUT OF THE BOTTOMLESS PIT" the Sons of God "WILL PREACH THE TRUTH TO THEM ABOUT THE TRUTH OF THE RESURRECTION"

LET'S EXAMINE.

Revelation 20:7-8. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

AND SHALL GO OUT TO DECIEVE THE NATIONS which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

(Jordyn says these verses says the unbelievers will preach the truth!)

The bible says Satan will deceive the nations!

So, Jordyn says God will judge the unbelievers by the word of God and give them the truth and mercy given to us, and they will have DIED the second death, and also become the SONS of God and will enter the Kingdom. Thats what he gets out of Revelation 20:2-8.

However, Look at Revelation 22:11-15. SOME REMAIN UNJUST!

Some have right to the tree of life and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Some are seen here in verse 15. "For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

BEWARE OF WHO YOU FOLLOW! NO CHILD OF GOD WOULD DO SUCH BLASPHEMY TO THE WORD OF GOD!

Revelation 22:19.

God bless.

Brother Spencer,

Amen! False teaching must be called out, so thank you for doing so!

But you know something? No matter how false or corrupt someone's teachings are, there will always be at least one follower, and we see that here on this forum.

I think the best advice given by Jordyn was when he said "Don't believe a word I say without looking to the scriptures and asking Christ to teach you."

Well, I have taken his advice and searched the scriptures, which we are supposed to do anyways without anyone telling us to do so, and I find that the things he's saying go completely against sound biblical doctrine.

Again, thank you for exposing these things.

God bless!!!

Thanks Brother Jesse.

Sometimes we grow when we are challenged by a different opinion within the Gospel and we should examine the scriptures like the Bereans.

But when open comes along with something totally different and says you can't know God by the literal text in the Bible and all men teachings is false and all Churches is bad but yet you have a so called revelation that you insist on teaching, that should be a red flag.

God bless

I agree Bro. S. Spencer. And as many of us have been sharing on these pages for several years, we have almost become accustomed/immuned to varied & strange teachings that somehow seem to fit within the parameters of this Site's rules. I may not be as bold as you in exposing falsehoods, but have always wondered how and where such interpretations of Scripture emanate from.

Of course, we know that we can all be subject to various inputs, whether from the pulpit, media, Bible colleges, study helps, etc., & these all influence us greatly in how we must read the Bible & in what we must believe. But in my musings, I think one of the biggest culprits is simply, 'what we really WANT TO BELIEVE, regardless of how the Bible is directing us'. And examples of this I find are in the Deity of Christ, the relationship of the Old & New Covenants, eternal Judgement/Hell, faith & works, etc. So, if someone definitely believes that there cannot possibly be an eternal suffering judgement because a loving merciful God would never allow it, then one is forced to read all the Scriptures accordingly, reading some/avoiding others, or even altering the meaning of passages. We even had one person writing here, a long while back now, who admitted that he never considered the Apostle Paul's writings because they didn't hold true to the teachings of Jesus. So, the option to pick & choose Scripture that suits our beliefs is always there, & no amount of bibilical dialogue/exchanges will ever convince the other.

And so you might notice that I fail to correspond with certain folk - not because of an unloving caring attitude towards them, but simply because that what they present against what I believe the Bible teaches, are far too remote for any meaningful discussion. A recent apt case in point is Psalm 82 & John 10:33-36. Unless one takes the trouble to learn what is being said & as given in Hebrew, the basis for us becoming gods then seems justified. Error breeds Error. GBU.

Oops, Brother Chris.

I meant The unfortunate thing about this type of hyper way of interpreting "All" scripture (spiritualizing or Allegorically) can cause confusion when one run across a portion of scripture that is actually an allegory or a type.

God bless and God night Brother.

Thanks brother. I understood what you meant in your first response to me.

Amen Brother Chris.

The unfortunate thing about this type of hyper way of interpreting scripture ( spiritualizing or Allegorically) "All" the scripture can cause confusion when one run across a portion of scripture that is an allegory or a type.

This extreme way of interpreting scripture can get in the way of deeper meaning and growth.

This is also why there is so much division in the Church concerning Israel and the Church and end time prophecy.

I believe this is very sinister especially when you see someone ask for prayer and this false teacher offer them a confusing message instead.

Some of these tares is obvious and for the most part I don't engage with them unless I see someone that is beginning in their growth and take hold of this false deceiver for help.

This is not like a disagreement on the Trinity or whether there's a hell or not but a completely restructure of doctrine.

Thanks and God bless you brother.

Absolutely right, S. Spencer.

Brother Spencer,

I concur!

So right on, S. Spencer.

Thanks for addressing these heresies espoused by "Jordyn", a new screen name of one we have known by other names on here, I believe.

Thank you Gigi.

God bless you.

BrotherS Spencer:

HOW were you saved?

WHAT were you saved from?

WHEN were you saved?

God BLESS YOU!

John 3:16 says what people are saved from.

Jordyn

I have asked this question elsewhere but not sure whether you will see it.

Am I right to believe that I was married to the law but when Christ was crucified I was crucified with him (made dead) so that I can be divorced from the law and married to Christ? Is this what you were trying to explain to me?

Please clarify and clean up my understanding.

Thank you for your time

God bless.

Lee the follower:

yes, we were first married to the law: written in stones.

that was our school teacher.

we learned from our schoolmaster: that that law leads to death.

christ came and changed the law, from death to life by the life of the spirit indwelling us.

all creation (sinful flesh) died on the cross of christ.

only the body of christ arose, by the spirit of life, a new cretion, one flesh, one body.

2 timothy 1:1 ... according to the promise of life, which is christ jesus ....

john 17:22 and the glory thou gavest me, i have given them, that they may be one, even as we are one.

all by the works of christ's cross.

god bless you!

Jordyn

As a side note I want to apologise that you are having to go through this amount of trouble for trying to edify your brothers. God did say that the people will kill thinking they are doing the work of God. I wish some people would "examine thyself" to make sure that they hold to sound doctrine before reporting people under false pretenses. Thank you for helping me lift this heavy burden from me.

God bless you.

Lee the Follower:

Isaiah 45:9 Woe unto him that striveth with his maker! Let the potsherds strive with the potsherds of the earth ....

Ezekiel 38:21 And I will call for a sword (the word of God) against him (the WORD) throughout all my mountains (peoples): saith the LORD: every man's sword (word) shall be against his brother(s) (word).

Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a PERFECT MAN, unto the measure and the stature and FULLNESS of Christ:

God's plan is for us to strive against each other, Joseph's brother DID NOT like the word their brother Joseph spoken, and sold him into slavery.

But look what Joseph said, by the spirit of Christ:

Genesis 50:20 But as for you, ye thought EVIL against me, but God meant it unto GOOD, to SAVE much people alive.

Just walk in the truth of the WORD, his ways are not our ways.

God Bless YOU!

Jordyn,

I appreciate the length you are going to get the gospel out. Here is what I believe. I believe that the only way into heaven is through faith in Jesus Christ. If anyone thinks that they have to have works to accompany their faith then I believe they do not have the right faith. Jesus will tell them "Depart from me, workers of iniquity." If we do not put our full faith in what Christ did for us on the cross then "Christ is dead in vain". Anyone who think they have to keep the commandments are still married to Moses and Jesus cannot partake in their adultery. After reading the book of John I have come to believe the WORK Jesus did justifies me, not my own works which "are as filthy rags".

Glory to God for you have given me greater understanding. God bless you.

Lee the Follower:

You are not being called out to go to heaven.

You are being called out to be a priest and judge in the Kingdom of God.

The Old kingdom of Israel under Moses was just a shadow of the New KINGDOM under Christ, and his priesthood.

The meek shall INHERIT the EARTH.

God Bless YOU!

Mary Jay, Earl, Jordyn, ELB,

Why do you keep changing your screen name?

Sister Gigi:

I explained this to you two names ago.

When you and Brother S Spencer, Brother Jesse, and Brother Chris start going between yourselves saying I am a false teacher, someone complains to administration and they stop me from posting.

If you believe I am teaching incorrectly, just prove it to me by the scriptures, I have repented of my beliefs 100's of times.

God's word says we all start out being deceived, so we must constantly repent of our false beliefs as light is shined into darkness.

God's words cannot contradict themselves, so when we run up against scriptures the contradict other scriptures we hold true, we have to revisit our beliefs and aline them with God's words.

This is a race we cannot lose, but we can take the long way, and not cross till the second resurrection.

God Bless YOU!

Dear Earl,

A temporary account limitation may be imposed for not meeting the Comment Guidelines if someone is unresponsive to our emails.

Someone with an account-related issue may utilize the Contact Us link at the bottom of the page. Rule 10 is applicable in your situation, and we have been attempting to get in touch with you for several months. Kindly reach out to us through the contact form to resolve.

May God bless you,

KJBO Admin

PS: Differing perspectives and beliefs are welcome (rule 1 and 2), but all commenters must follow the rules.

OK Earl, Thanks for explaining.

As for me I have never reported you to admin nor advocated for you to be prevented from posting.

I do think that your continued insistence that we are gods and have equal power and authority as Jesus is heretical.

All authority and power were given Jesus after His resurrection, reclaiming the power and authority He had with the Father prior to His incarnation. Mt. 28:28; 2Ch. 20:6; Rev. 4:11; 5:12; 19:1; 1:6

As Adam says, there is only one God; there will never ever be any other God than the God revealed in Scripture as the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit-one God over all.

Earl, my suggestion to you is that when you come on this site under a knew name you identify yourself as Earl somewhere in your post. That way we can know for sure that we are conversing with you.

If admin continues to prevent you from posting, then perhaps that is because they, too, determine that your beliefs that you have posted again and again are seriously heretical and damaging to believers.

I do not believe that Jesus is God . Am I a heretic ? Should I be banned from this site ? What about others who do not believe that Jesus is God ? Should they also be banned ? To us , people who do not believe that Jesus is God , the belief that he is , is heretical . Are we calling for every one who believes that Jesus is God to be banned from this site ? There really are millions of people , Christians , who do not believe that Jesus is God , I'm not making that up , it's true . We don't get many of them on this site and the reason , to me , is obvious . They don't want any part in a site that is full of people who believe something that they think is absolutely not true . I do not call for any one , who doesn't believe the same things as me , to be banned . If a post offends me I just stop reading it . It's that easy . It's not my place to judge others , that position is filled by God . I do not put myself in God's place . People who believe that Jesus is God often say that it's their duty to ' call out ' heresies but don't seem to get that they themselves believe something that millions of others might consider a heresy . Intolerance is the word I'm looking for I think . If I am able to tolerate things on here that I find heretical , why can't others do the same ? I'm just as convinced about my beliefs as others are about theirs .

Jema, now I have a minute.

I refer you to the post I sent here below that show why I believe that Jesus is God. Are you willing to believe what John says here in chapter 1? the Word (the Son) is God and became flesh (Jesus). He never ceased to be God while in the flesh. He added a human nature to His divine nature in order to live the perfect human life for us and be our sacrifice.

I will write more tomorrow with Scriptures.

Hello Jema,

Getting back to you.

I do believe that there is only One God , as the Scriptures I gave state. But I also believe that Scriptures reveal that God exists as three distinct Persons. Not three Gods who are independent of one another nor of differing natures or substances. No! All Persons share the same divine nature and essence that is what God is. The Persons inter-dwell each other, as Jesus speaks in Jn. 10:30, 14:10-11; 16-17; 23; 13:31-32.

Anyone who believes in Jesus believes also in the Father, John12:44 and he who receives Jesus receives the Father. And he that sees Jesus sees the Father- Jn.12:45. 14:9. Whoever knows Jesus knows the Father- Jn.14:7. He that hates Jesus hates the Father, Jn. 15:23; All that the Father has is Jesus', too, and the Spirit receive from Jesus what the Father and Son possess, Jn. 16:14-15. The Father's glory is shared with Jesus- Jn. 17:5; Jesus came out from within the Father- Jn. 17:8; 16:28.

We are to honor Jesus as we honor the Father-in the same way, as our God - Jn.5:23.

I have spent the past two days studying what the Scriptures say about the deity of Jesus and about the Persons of the Godhead and find that Scriptures does teach that Jesus is God just as the Father is God and the Spirit is God AND that there is only one God.

This is what the doctrine of the Trinity teaches. Only One God in essence and nature, but three distinct Persons indwelling one another in unity.

Jema, I can tell that you think this belief is incongruous. I think it is true, yet a mystery we cannot fathom fully but can believe because the Word teaches it to be so.

Instead of me going on and on citing dozens of Scriptures that show that prove these doctrines are true, I suggest that you do as I have done. Search the Scriptures. There are many websites you can go to also on these topics to find the Scriptures that people cite to support the doctrine of the deity of Jesus and the Triunity of God.

see pt. 3

Jesus taught in parables and object lessons to make things easy to understand. Marriage is the object lesson for the trinity question.

The marriage of two people becoming onetwo people united in purpose plan and action. The marriage of two people who will act as one unit but the married couple are two different beings.

This is an object lesson given to us by God to help us understand the trinity. Three separate beings united as one in purpose, plan, and action.

It's really very simple and not complicated at all.

Hello Jema,

Since it seems you responded to my post I will respond to you. I have never reported anyone on this site or advocated for anyone to be banned. If the administration determines that someone should not be allowed to post then that is their prerogative.

The veracity of whether Jesus is God or not is not a matter of how many people believe it is true or not. Biblical truth is not determined democratically by consensus of the majority or minority. True doctrine is determined by what Scripture says to be true.

Even though billions of Christians believe Jesus is God does not make it true.

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God, and the Word was God....'

John 1:14

"And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us , full of grace and truth; we beheld his glory, as of the ONLY Son of the Father."

John 10:30 Jesus says,

"I and the Father are one"

Just in these few verses we have Scripture stating that Jesus is God and is that the Father and Son are one together, though distinct persons.

Later on in John 14:16-17, Jesus says that He will ask the Father to send the Spirit. Thus naming EACH Person in the One God.

I think that true doctrine is important and beneficial to believers and that false doctrine is corrupting to a believer. That is why I speak out concerinng doctrine that is opposed to revealed truth in Scripture, especially doctrine concerning the identity, character, nature and work of our Savior.

Jema, I respect that you do wish to ignore or pass over postings that do not agree with your viewpoint.

And I respect that you prefer to speak what you believe without having others speak in disagreement of what you state as your beliefs.

This is a discussion forum, primarily, and not simply a place for people to post their beliefs without expecting a response. But each of us engage on this forum as we see fit as we prayerfully consider what others post and seek the Lord's guidance in how or if we respond to a posting.