Genesis Chapter 21 Discussion

Ishmael the son of Abraham :

Genesis 25:13-18, 1Chronicles 1:29-31,

Genesis 16:10-12, Genesis 16:15, Genesis 17:20-21, Genesis 25:8-10,

Genesis 28:9, Genesis 36:3,

Ishmael the son of Nethaniah

2Kings 25:23,25, Jeremiah 40:8,14,15,16, Jeremiah 41:1-18,

Ishmael the son of Azel

1Chronicles 8:38, 1Chronicles 9:44,

Ishmael the son of Jehohanan

2Chronicles 23:1,

Ishmael the son of Pashur,

Ezra 10:22,

1Timothy 1:4,

Who are the present day descendants of Ishmael?.

continued: Abraham trusted God to provide for Hagar and Ishmael or he would have given her more food and water. God did provide for them in the wilderness, allowing Hagar to find find the spring/well of water. God was with them and brought them to a place in the wilderness to live. Ishmael grew up there and became proficient with the bow and arrow. This helped him provide for his mother and himself in an harsh environment.

It says that Ismael was blessed because he was a seed of Abraham. God promised to both Abraham and Hagar, Ishmael's parents, that he would become a great nation. And he did. Hagar must have taken him to Egypt to get a wife according to the text. The people who came from Ishmael and the Egyptian wife are the Arabs, part Hebrew and part Egyptian.

It says that God was with Ishmael. He looked after him. Hagar must have had some faith in the God of Abraham. She was blessed with at least two positive direct interactions with God. I don't see anything in her from the text that would warrant disliking her. She and Ishmael were just not the the bloodline of promise.

The tribes of Israel were scattered throughout the world from the exile in Assyria. It is very likely that many migrated north eastward and north westward from Assyria and mixed with the populations of Europe, Russia, and eastward. Some may have migrated southwesterly and southeasterly. Therefore it is likely that many people across the world have Abraham's bloodline in them. Many in the world do not. But in Christ it is no longer about the bloodline of Abraham; rather it is the about the spiritual bloodline of Christ through faith in Him that we inherit the promise of God. Any of Ishmael's descendants can have the promises of God through Christ if they believe. Any Jew or Israelite can have the promises of God through Christ. Any descendant of Ham or Japheth can have the promises of God through Christ. God's promises are for everyone who believes in Jesus and heirs of God.

It is raining today again. Some people get down dur to rain and gray skies. For me, I try to remember God's promise with Noah and his covenant rainbow. Also,, I recall Hosea 10:12 where it says, "Sow for yourself in righteousness; reap inn mercy. Break up your fallow ground, for it is time to seek the Lord 'til He comes and rains righteousness upon you."

I feel the rain on my head and know that Christ's righteousness is raining down on me, since He came!

Having read this chapter and the comments I see so much to be hopeful in the text. Abraham and Sarah knew that God had given them a specific time for Sarah to conceive. They were hopeful for God to fulfill his promise, and He did. They were hopeful throughout the pregnancy that the babe would be born safely, and he was. Sarah mentioned that those who hear of her son's birth will laugh with her. There was much joy in Abraham's camp! Abraham circumcised Isaac on the 8th day as God had commanded.

The next part speaks of a celebration of Isaac's weaning from breastfeeding. He was probably between 2 and 5 years old at this time since it was common for children to be breastfed this long in those times and even in many cultures today. This ensured that the child always had an instant supply of nutrition in environments that can be harsh.

Ismael was a teen ager at this time. We are not told how he mocked Isaac, perhaps provoking or teasing Isaac in an unkind way. With the age difference, Ishmael should have known better. This upset Sarah enough to want Ishmael and Hagar sent away into the wilderness, not wanting Ishmael to receive any of Isaac's promised inheritance. So maybe he was taunting Isaac about about being born first and of his father's favor. Abraham loved Ishmael and the thought of sending him away was a difficult decision to make. God intervened and told Abraham to go against his heart feelings and do as Sarah had said. He provided Hagar and Ishmael with some sustenance and sent them out into the wilderness.

Who was Abraham and Sarah's father? Did not incest exist during that time?

how old is issaac?

Names of our father god

Page 2.

Can we then resurrect that 'dead' sin nature? Does it even still exist? Sadly, until we get to Heaven, our sin nature will always remain in us, but the victory lies in how we deal with it & how we deal with Satan who appeals to that nature. Can we resurrect that nature? Every time we listen to Satan, we are resurrecting that nature. Every time we listen to God, we are keeping that nature 'in death' & living in the Spirit. And this was the struggle that was with Paul as he wanted to live in the Spirit, but Satan kept attacking him in his old nature.

So, Joan, the struggle will always continue while we're here on Earth, but Christ gives us the victory. What can you do? You have already pleaded with God for release from your bondage - God hears your cries. Has He put anything else on your heart? I don't know your story, but the Spirit of God is there for you to give it all to Him & to give you victory. If your mind is afflicted, then set your mind on wholesome, spiritual things that are found in God's Word. If it is a lust for something, then turn away from that temptation or remove it from your view altogether & turn to God in prayer & in His Word. When you resist Satan, he will flee ( James 4:7) because He knows that you are calling upon the Power of God against him. This is not just theoretical, but very practical as we stand against the wiles of the devil. Talk to the Lord often, wherever you are & in whatever you're doing & when Satan is near to tempt you, run to the Lord Who is listening for your call. And remember, your stand against the enemy can only be done in the Spirit's Power & not in your own strength.

Joan, Romans 7 is one of those very personal, intimate revelations Paul gave of his life: his battle between the spirit & the flesh. He could have easily avoided mentioning his struggle & given his readers the impression that he was a great follower of Christ, enjoying daily victory over every sin. But, being led of the Spirit, he had to confess that his apostleship, his meeting with Christ & even his vision of the glory of Heaven, were not enough to raise him to any greater position than we are at today. In fact, he said that he was "given a thorn in the flesh" ( 2 Cor 12:7) to keep him humble so those privileges wouldn't 'go to his head'.

So in Romans 7, Paul speaks of his battle in the spirit. He longed to please God in every area of his life, but evil (i.e. the working of the body of sin) was always present with him. And so he struggled, but he found that through all this, that only Jesus Christ could help & deliver him. How so? Two ways: by virtue of Christ's death, Paul & all who believe on Jesus, have their sins dealt with at the Cross. In other words, Satan can no more accuse us before God. And secondly, through Jesus alone, could Paul & us find victory over the flesh. Even though Satan will always niggle at us to make us sin, Christ gives us the power to withstand Satan & the appeals of the flesh. In fact, Paul speaks in Gal 2:20 that he is now crucified with Christ & in Rom 6:6, he tells us that our 'old man' (our old nature) was crucified at the Cross. And if that is the case, we are to reckon ourselves dead to sin & now alive to God through Jesus ( Rom 6:11). (onto Page 2.)

Joan, Romans 7 is one of those very personal, intimate revelations Paul gave of his life: his battle between the spirit & the flesh. He could have easily avoided mentioning his struggle & given his readers the impression that he was a great follower of Christ, enjoying daily victory over every sin. But, being led of the Spirit, he had to confess that his apostleship, his meeting with Christ & even his vision of the glory of Heaven, were not enough to raise him to any greater position than we are at today. In fact, he said that he was "given a thorn in the flesh" ( 2 Cor 12:7) to keep him humble so those privileges wouldn't 'go to his head'.

So in Romans 7, Paul speaks of his battle in the spirit. He longed to please God in every area of his life, but evil (i.e. the working of the body of sin) was always present with him. And so he struggled, but he found that through all this, that only Jesus Christ could help & deliver him. How so? Two ways: by virtue of Christ's death, Paul & all who believe on Jesus, have their sins dealt with at the Cross. In other words, Satan can no more accuse us before God. And secondly, through Jesus alone, could Paul & us find victory over the flesh. Even though Satan will always niggle at us to make us sin, Christ gives us the power to withstand Satan & the appeals of the flesh. In fact, Paul speaks in Gal 2:20 that he is now crucified with Christ & in Rom 6:6, he tells us that our 'old man' (our old nature) was crucified at the Cross. And if that is the case, we are to reckon ourselves dead to sin & now alive to God through Jesus ( Rom 6:11). (onto Page 2).

When Paul talked about doing the things he didn't want to and not doing the things he wanted to

He said oh wretched man that I am. Who can set me free? Then thanked for Jesus, the one that can. I have prayed daily for this and ponder and wonder why i am still in bondage knowing it is not His will.

J Dixon I would be careful in what you claim about Ishmael since he is a son of Abraham.

in Genesis 21:18 Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation. The Lord himself said he would make of him a great nation. There are around 200 - 300 million Arabs in the world and looks like the Lord kept his promise to Ishmael.

There is less than 15 million Jews in the world per the Jewish almanac. So who is blessed of the Lord and a great nation? Looks to me that the Lord kept his promise to Ishmael. I am no fan of Islam and know it is a false theology as is Judaism that also rejects the Lord Jesus as messiah or Christ.

1 Corinthians 16:22 - If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema (CURSED) Maranatha.

DO JEWS LOVE JESUS OR ARE THEY CURSED? Just curious is all.

It is true the the Arabic nation came from Ishmael but neither he or Hagar were terrorists . Hagar was the property of Sarah and had no free will, she obeyed her owner. Ishmael was a boy teasing as boys do . God had mercy on them because of this . The Arabic nation may not have existed but for the actions of Abraham and Sarah. This story is a warning to Christians the importance of waiting on God

Up to that point, what other sons did Abraham have?

Muslims are a cult and not of God at all. They even reject his name and his son and the holy ghost. They follow a pedophile who did nothing but spew hate. The punishment of Hagar and Ishmael was more than just and very much too lenient.

Verse 2-Jehovah God’s Word came true exactly as He said. Nothing is beyond God’s power.

I have read over again and have had another thought to this. The Promise to Abraham and to his seed was that through Christ they would inherit the world; "..and in thee shall all Nations of the earth be blessed." As Hagar was the property of Sarah, so then was the son that Hagar bore to Abraham. It pronounced that in Isaac would the seed be called; and so Abraham sent away all his other sons.

Jean; about Sarah giving her maid to her husband; it was evidently understood that if a bondwoman bore children of her master, then the children would be her master's, and not hers. So by those standards Hagar's son was by tradition and law of the land Sarah's son; because she owned the maid servant, and whatever she had was the property of her mistress and master. I'm glad we don't do that today!

Jean (cont.); You wrote, "..a Muslim asked me to justify what took place in Genesis 21." The keyword is Just! What was just about despising her mistress? What was just about mocking Isaac? What is just about arrogantly rejoicing over someone else's unhappiness and trial, and hatefully mocking at their joys? The LORD said that Ishmael would be a mongrel and a terror to everyone and it sure is true!

JEAN read Gal. 4 KJV SEVERAL TIMES The complete chapter and you will know exactly how to answer your Muslim friend.

Jean (cont.); As far as Sarah's treatment of her maid-servant; Hagar behaved wickedly toward her Mistress in despising her and mocking her. I don't feel a bit sorry for wicked women with UGLY mocking mouths against their BETTERS; and the fact that she was pregnant was why the Angel was sent to tell her to go back and submit to her Mistress. When they have children that are the same; GOOD RIDDANCE!

Jean; Tell your friend, first of all about Hagar: that in ancient times it was normal and acceptable to have household servants; either hired or owned; for many practical reasons. It didn't necessarily imply oppression or cruelty as it would today. Many times it was because someone had nothing to pay his debt but with his life in service to the one he owed. Maybe Pharaoh gave her to Sarah? Gen. 12

Today a Muslim asked me to justify what took place in Genesis 21.
1. Sarah offering the maidservant to her husband.
2. And later throwing Hagar out when she was pregnant and then again after Ishmael was born.
Please help me to answer this Muslim friend.

End of Day 7 of Reading the Bible in a Year. God shows mercy to Hagar as she is run off by by Sarah. God is fulfilling part of His promise to Abraham concerning the number and importance of Abraham's "seed" but the culmination and exaltation of the promise will be fulfilled through Isaac.

God word is unchangeable, what ever he promised he will do .Isaac was born to Abraham and Sarah at the appointed time God stand by his word to perform it . although Sarah try to help God by using her maid God still gave the promise of the covenant child.Thank God for his mercy that he didn't destroy Abemlech's house hold for Abraham saying Sarah is his sister but God made a way of escap

We know that whatsoever GOD does is ALWAYS well done, HE never makes mistakes. GOD had a plan "To have a nation for Himself through Abraham" in ch 17:1-8 GOD came to Abraham and made him a promise, v.19. Even though we make mistakes, GOD will not change HIS plan for HIS glory... Abraham laughed as well 17:17... we just accept the will of GOD, understand it or not. May HE bless us, we need it.

When Sara tells Abraha to send Hagar and her son away,it was very grieving for Abraham but he was obedient to thLord and he trusted Him also and did as the Lord told him. Sounds harsh, but the Lord knows everything even the future. Even though Sara didn't trust the Lord or in conceiving a child and gave her maid to Abraham, the Lord honoured her request. Does this make sense in my last sentence?

A hope differed weakens the heart, but a fulfilled desire is the tree of life.

in the modern knowledge the child produce vitamin K in five to seven days, to circumcize must be eight days to prevent hemorrage. bible written 3600 years ago, no human being knows it 3000 yrs ago. comes from superior to man, somebody powerful and mighty.

If God gives you covenant a.ka a promise he will do it. He is a God that shall not lie when wejjump the gun and do it our way sin will be your face and then you have to remove it and people can be hurt by it