John Chapter 10 Discussion Page 4

Rob jesus was always god, he who new know sin became sin for us

that in him we may have the righteous of god, jesus was conceived

of the holy spirit therefore he did not have a sinners birth , the holy

spirit inpregnated mary to have a sinless untainted blood spotless

lord jesus christ , jesus chrsit was always god maifested justifed

in the spirit preached unto gentiles believed on in the world and received

up into glory. 1st tim3-16. john 1 in the beginning was the word and the word

was with god and the word was god. colossians 2-9 in him dwelleth all the fullness

of the godhead bodily. jesus is god and always was god from the beginning of creation

hell awaits the sinner denying his deity, i can give countless more scriptures the virgin

born son of god. jesus chrsit is lord king of kings and lord of lords.

Rob, just to accept that "Jesus was Born of God" would be fine for all of us, except for the fact that we still have to deal with the other Scriptures that also expand on this. Are we then interpreting those 'other Scriptures' incorrectly, or maybe they shouldn't even be there, is what we're suggesting? And how do you deal with them? How do you interpret them. If I focus only on Jesus' Birth as a fresh creation of God, albeit from a special, holy Seed, I still have to, as an extensive Bible reader & believer, deal with these other Scriptures. If I choose not to do so, then I would be living in a bubble of my own doing. If I want to understand a teaching from the Word, I endeavour to consider all Scriptures pertaining to it & then establish its meaning (of course, the proper "dividing of the Scriptures" is essential). I don't come the other way: first decide what a doctrine or teaching should mean & then find the Scriptures to support my belief. To me, this leads to error & then often, to multiple errors.

The classic one is on God's election of mankind to salvation. As you know, there are some views on this, all supposedly based on Scripture. The bottom line is, what basis does God use to grant salvation to one person & not another. Should we all then adopt the hyper-Calvinistic approach & leave the matter with God & not preach the Gospel since the one elected to salvation will come to Him regardless of any effort from us? Or is there another answer when we search the Scriptures? There may be nothing conclusive to be found, but a determination is made based on what we learn, & so the Gospel is still preached so that all men (both elected or not) may hear & decide. God does not tell us that in His foreknowledge He makes his determination & we may never conclusively say it is so, except we might use what Peter concludes in 1 Peter 1:2. Now, is that sufficient for us to rest our understanding on, or do we disregard it since it did not come from the "Mouth of God"?

Chris the very simple explanation for the Godliness Of Christ is ; he was Born of God . Yes God is infinite and he comes from God by Birth . So he has qualities that came from God that no

Man ever had . You must except Gods witness. And not add to it . If we do not hear the word of God correctly we are open to a sea of interpretations , yet only one truth is all the there ever will be . Gods .

There is a famine in the land and it's the hearing of the word of God . So many false interpretations is what I see .

Dark days indeed we are in .

I thank God very much the the Word is open to me , we only get it by obeying what we know , or the light starts going out .

Rob, I doubt if any one would disagree with you about the Sonship of Jesus & even how He sometimes referred to Himself, as the Son of man. And you are well aware of where we differ in this matter by the Scriptures we've cited.

The essential point is that, in the volume of Scriptures you quote to support the idea that Jesus was a specially created Being by God & not coming out of the Essence of God to be a man, what do you, as a student of God's Word, do with the other Scriptures as we have given you, to show otherwise?

I knew someone, not a believer but an ardent reader of the Bible. He knew & believed that God was a God of Love but just could not understand why false writings were put into the Bible showing God sending Israel out to the Promised Land to utterly kill every living thing there. He just could not reconcile God 'instigating & encouraging murder'. So he carefully proceeded to rip out those 'erroneous' pages from the Bible so that his further reading of it would be in line to his understanding of the Doctrine of God. I'm certainly not suggesting that you have done as such - I think much better things of you - but your reservation to explain away these Scriptures we bring to you to show the Divinity of Christ, both pre & post incarnation, is notable.

You can certainly keep on writing that Jesus is only God's Son revealed on Earth & nothing before this, but one would have to wonder what you are doing to those other Scriptures that show otherwise. Do you re-interpret them, avoid them, obliterate them, etc.? In love & concern, we long to learn from where you get your ideas from - & I'm assuming that you're not a JW (as I would approach this discussion differently). If your ideas come from reading the Word, the same one we all read from, then what happens to the other Scriptures that also give us an added view of the pre-incarnate existence of Christ? This is unavoidable - we are constrained to deal with them as the Word of God.

Jesus was BORN OF GOD . And was also a man .

First of His kind ever.

BORN OF GOD . Able do and things and know things that no other man could ever do with such authority.

Why ? Because God was with him .

He never claimed to be or say IAM God . He said that the father whom he prayed to was greater ....

Simple to me but the spirit of error keeps people in the dark , because they can not see the truth of Gods word .

Satan blinds the minds of men and does he ever .

If you seek me with your whole heart then you will find me , God said to those in days gone by , but it still holds true for today .

Rob, I'm not sure which version of the Bible you use but have a read of John 10:32-38 again, just to clarify what blasphemy is & what Jesus was accused of being.

And when you get to verse 36, consider, "of whom (Jesus) the Father hath sanctified & SENT into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?" So, if one needs to be a stickler on the definition of Son of God as being a Son from birth only & not 'out of God's Being', another can then correctly say that Jesus was SENT into the world; why should Jesus use the word 'sent' as if He came from somewhere to go somewhere? Wouldn't it be more correct then to say, 'The Father hath specially created me to be born at Bethlehem & gave me a special ministry & finally to given my life for the world'?

And while we're examining the Scriptures, what about John 8:56-58? Abraham rejoicing to see "his day"! Are you so mad to say that you've seen Abraham? the Jews retorted. "Even before Abraham existed, I AM". Again, notice Jesus' choice of words to describe Himself.

And Colossians 1:15-17? "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him". That whole passage cited, is speaking of Jesus, not God.

Do even these few portions of Scripture cause us to think that we have here, Someone Who is more than a separate creation born into the world to fulfil God's Plans. Someone who was involved in the creation of all things, visible & invisible, One existing before Abraham & One even sent by God from somewhere to somewhere (the World)? I know that you are well aware of these Scriptures, but I remain perplexed as to how some other interpretation can be given other than understood as read.

Jesus said he is the Son OF God and was accused of Blasphemy for saying that .

Jesus never said I AM GOD you people can not enter into just what the Son of God means ! Are you really that blind ?

Jesus was Born OF God . He had unique wisdom , relationship and power from God that no man ever had , John the Baptist the greatest of all prophets stated he was not worthy to loose his shoes .

Many said that the things Jesus did proved that God was with him !

So true how do you miss this ?

They never said oh He is GOD and Jesus never said that either, nor anywhere in the Bible .

Why even God never said this Jesus is me when God spoke at his baptism, So if Jesus really is GOD then the voice from heaven lied .

Do you not see how crazy this claim is that Jesus is part of a Godhead ?

These are just a few examples of so many more that could be said .

God bless you Frank, Creation even in destruction by wild fire, new life will come forward if God wills.

Enjoy Gods creations and some say there is no God.

Dear Andy, What I have very recently written is my testimony.

My love to you reaches St John's and Halifax and surrounding farm lands to this very hour. Songs are being sung, widows are being visited, love is being shared in hospitals, and grain is likely now in harvest.

Carleton

Jesus froght suffer and died for our sins. Came down from heaven knowingly, too teach and preach about why he was here. When it come to the truth, people say tell it to me straight; but ready don't want to here. That's what Jesus did for the short time he was he on earth. He died for our sins so that we, all humanity would have a right to the tree of life. Tell everyone too repent and pray. In reference to John 10.

Jesus provides divine operating assets for life with God.Genuine believers receive freedom from guilt and the misery of the effects of sin. They also receive divine operating assets to live for the Lord day by day. The way of all divine fellowship and communion is through Christ. John 10:7, John 10:10.

Excellent point! Jesus often embodied the fulfillment of scripture before their eyes, that they (and we) are without excuse.

There can be no sin near God. As Jesus and the Father are one, in that moment a separation had to occur. Jesus TOOK ON, ALL sin. That sin had to be separated from God. The English translation for the word 'enkataleipo' (Greek) is abandoned or left behind. That sin had to be abandoned and left behind. Jesus, the man of flesh who took on the sin, was left behind. Jesus in resurrection of Spirit was not abandoned.

Comment only: Jesus experienced the pain of being separated from His Father.

If we were more sensitive we would feel that too when we sin knowing full well that we are doing it.

A conscience that feels no pain is seared. just like a strip steak you throw on a burning hot skillet.

Jesus suffered through pain of separation for every human mentioned in John 3:16. All humanity: from Genesis to Revelation.

If. as Jesus revealed as a truth in the bible, also known as the GOOD BOOK, that "I AND MY FATHER ARE ONE" - John 10:30 - why would Jesus, as the only begotten Son of God, while crucified and dying on cross cry out loud: "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAST THOU FORSAKEN ME?" Matt. 27:46

Poch Suzara

The 144,000 refers to 12,000 people from each of the 12 tribes of Israel. Not literal Israel but spiritual Israel.

They are virgins/undefiled.

Revelations 7

Revelations 14

Hope that helps!

They are the Israelites (didn't believe Jesus Christ) before the rapture. After that when they see Anti-christ they will be warned and accepted Jesus Christ.

I thought that when the end comes only 144,000 people will go to Heaven. than some woman brought it to my attention that 144,000 are Virgins. is this correct and where is this in the Bible

John 10:30" I and the father are one" How then can people say that Jesus and God is different?

Open your heart! Don't put limits on wisdom or knowledge nor should we limit the simple teachings of the Savior. We, including Jesus, are all spirit children of God the Farther. He is our brother of whom, given the agency to choose, is now reveling in His Devine inheritance! We all are capable by birth right to inherit Kingdom's beyond our comprehension. The Atonement, the beautiful gift of repentance, and our own choices and honored covenants, will determine the degree of glory, We choose our own inheritance, by works recorded in the Lambs Book is Life. The scripture is plain! Believe! James 1:5 will help.

Every time I ever judged anyone; said it, thought it, sneered, smirked, mumbled, the Holy Spirit reeled me in. I finally got cured. He even made me watch The Shack movie 28 times! I got blissfully delivered.
There is too much judging going on in here. We could be learning the FRUITS of the Holy Spirit. Believe me that unrighteous judgment grieves Him. If you don't feel that, then your conscience may be seared like a strip steak.
These 5 scriptures say don't Judge. Repent. Write them down. Matthew 7:1, Luke 6;37, John 7:24, I Corinthians 4: 3-5. BE MERCIFUL
Now check this one out: Ezekiel 2:21

God is going to personally deal with Israel. Pray. Stop accusing. WWJD God bless you.

That Promise that God made to Abraham was about Christ being multiplied as the stars of heaven is about the seed of Christ the WORD th NEW COVENANT THE BOOK THAT HAS TO BE OPENED.Note then the woman goes into child birth simply b/c of the seeds of the sower the contents of the book th words of life.And to whom the word came it made them Gods.we see this so clearly when Jesus breath on them and they received the H.G. WHICH IS GOD.This cannot be refuted that whom th WORD came it made them GODS his breath was his word his seed. The H.G fell on them that heard his WORDS his seed.Ya gotta realize that GOD SWORE BY HIS OWN SELF WHEN HE MADE TH PROMISE.Thus Christ will propagate God in Humanity

the thief "satan" comes to kill and destroy he does not care about the sheep, In Christ we know His voice, we seek Him daily to make our paths straight, He did no blasphemy , He was speaking to the Jews back then referring to the laws, that spoke of His coming and they believed Him not, He would have spoken Blasphemy if he had called them gods because of their pride they denied him. Christ and only Christ could lay down his life for us all, He lay down His life not because He had to, He did it because He loves us, He is our bridegroom, we are His bride, let that Love sink in when you think your alone, He is there, He will never leave you nor forsake you, Just like a husband should be. Peace

When we are bornagain of that heavenly seed we birth a new innerman which is the H.G. which is the very substance of God thats the man that cannot fallaway the H.G. I will turn my hand to the lil ones that Promise Child that has to be born in us via that good seed th word. BUT our old man is made white at repentence but he answers to the dog that returns to his vomit and the sow that returns to her mud Paul said sin revived and i died, thats the old man that returns to sin. We are involved in a warfare.SATAN SOWS a tare in us making us sin when we wd not,its not i that do it but sin that dwells in my members O wretched man that i am etc but there is no condemnation to them in CHRIST JESUS.

more than 1 shepherd kept flocks as herds.The porter is the one that controlled the gate, that kept all the herds when they were not in the field.The shepherd comes for His sheep.New sheep can get caught in the middle when its time to leave the herd, and miss leaving with there shepherd.After this happens a few times,the wise sheep learn, they will not get caught without Him. So far now,the shepherd is called the door. It is very important that you know that He is the door. Don't get lost in the herd?Imagine what it would be like getting lost in the darkness of the herd without your shepherd! Christ is the door. Remember the parable of the 10 virgins? LUKE 21:28 2/12/2020

He's not saying we are gods.. he's asking in a sarcastic way..

As if how we would say "Who died and made you boss?

Addressed to Michael Hicks.Michael the very fact that you are worried about your salvation speaks volumes that God is moving on your heart. Jesus spoke of that 1 sheep that went astray saying he wd leave the 99 and go out and find that 1 sheep that went astray and my father and that gave them me is greater then all and no man can pluck them out of my Fathers hand. GBU MICHAEL

John 10:10: The thief cometh not, but to steal, and to kill, and to destroy I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. The abundant life is a term used to refer to Christian teachings of the Fulness of life. It is not an organization, movement, or a unique doctrine, but the name applied to the teachings and expectations of the groups, and people who follow the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ. He only possesses, and will impart to us His abundant life.

Jesus was quoting Isiaih who first said "ye are gods". We are all pieces of God and came out of God the first time we came to earth. I saw that in Christian Contemplation and Meditation which has been part of Christianity from the very beginning. Martin Luther practiced it and highly recommended it. Many saints, if not all, have practiced it as well as Catholics, Jewish Kabbalists and mystics.