John Chapter 17 Discussion Page 3

As Christians we believe in the Trinity, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Ghost, which is impossible to understand with our finite minds,

I believe one needs to read the first chapter of John (where he calls Jesus the Word) and also 1 John chapters 4 and 5 we may have a better understanding of the Trinity

John 1:1

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

1 John 5:5

"Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?"

1 John 5:7

"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."

1 John 5:8

"And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one."

God the father almighty alone , gave Jesus his lordship and highest position that is still in subjection the Father , yet Jesus is lord and king above all others . So Jesus is First in The fathers house . But the Father is still Lord over Jesus .

It's the father Son relationship.

So simple yet men can't get it , it seems .

Yes over 40 times Jesus is called the Son of God .

So simple a child can understand .

A child or first Son is first in his fathers house is equal and has all privileges. But he is the Son not the father .

Case closed .

Paul also said let this mind be in you as it was in Christ so you claim to be God ?

In God and receiving the benefits is one thing , Actually Being God is quite another .

Even the devils know there is one God , this is elementary stuff .

Hello Bob,

What would you say about these Scriptures:

1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Philippians 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God.

A couple other translations of Philippians 2:6 Although he was in the form of God and equal with God, he did not take advantage of this equality.

who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God,

In God's own form existed he, and shared with God equality, deemed nothing needed grasping.

As the KJV is the best translation from the Greek. Most others hack it up.

God Bless.

Is there anything in the King James bible about politics or dems and rep

You are correct, that there was no requirement for Jesus to be baptized, whether required by Jewish Law or for any need of repentance. As Jesus said, that this act of His was to "fulfil all righteousness, for both of them" ( Matthew 3:15).

By this statement of Jesus, I understand that Jesus identified with John the Baptist, in his specific calling as a prophet & ministry of being the "voice in the wilderness, crying, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight." This gave a Divine & public testimony to John, as much as it was confusing to him that rather he should be the baptizee.

Also, this occasion was for the inauguration of Jesus' Ministry, where the Godhead (the Trinity) was involved in the affirmation of the ministry & the empowerment to do so. So we find that the Father gave His Approval (verse 17) & the Spirit came specifically upon Him in a public 'testimony' manner (verse 16), thereby giving the Divine Declaration that this is indeed the Holy One from God, Who through His Sacrifice will accomplish much more than John could ever do, even to the 'spiritual' baptizing with the "Holy Ghost & with fire"; Who will also be their Judge, "thoroughly purge(ing) his floor, and gather(ing) his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire." (vv 11,12).

So, we see that this was not the usual baptism that John was giving to others: sinners demonstrating their sinful condition & need for cleansing. This was done to accomplish & publicly testify to Jesus' higher Calling: you can call it 'Jesus' inauguration service', just as those in the early Church were commended to service & even today, as the elders of a Fellowship lay hands upon & commend those going out to serve the Lord in full-time service.

To fulfil the Law. Our LORD kept all commandments. JESUS is the way. We follow in the way. We Follow JESUS. because He was baptised in Water...so must we be baptised in water for the remission of sin . Love and Peace be with you always

What was the purpose of Christ's baptism? I know Jesus said it was to

fulfill righteousness, but I still don't understand since John's baptized unto repentance. Jesus was sinless with no need for repentance. Thank you.

Well at least you recognize that the Lord God almighty gave Jesus these authorities etc . That's good .

I for one never except error .

That's like excepting another's sin .

The proof is all in the scriptures. But I think many sleep while reading them . They strain at an obscure verse and neglect the theme of Scriptures.

That's the best you can do ?

Keep reading I will pray for you !

Hello Bob,

That is correct. I don't have a problem with people saying Jesus is God.

If you do then that's your issue. As my post was only to make peace. I do not call Jesus Christ the Father. Lots of other people do though so it's them you quarrel with I guess. I say the Father is in Jesus Christ and He in the Father. Just as our Lord states in John 14:10.

Yes the Father has authority over all. But you seem to put Jesus Christ on our level? God our Father has given all His authority to His Son Jesus Christ. He has all the power of the Father. You said to someone else "I agree that Jesus and the Father are One". How you interpret that is up to you.

Jesus Christ is the exact representation of the Father. As in Hebrews 1:2-3. God our Father is Spirit not human.

Yes I also would say Jesus Christ is at the right hand of the Father. I would also say the Father has given Him a throne also. Matthew 28:18, Matthew 25:31, Revelation 3:21

A couple verses showing the Oneness of God and Christ. Revelation 5:13, Revelation 22:1, Revelation 22:3

God Bless you.

Hebrews 1 V 8 KJV The Scripture says unto the Son thy Throne O GOD is Forever and ever and a sceotre of righteousness is the sceptre is THY KINGDOM , THIS IS PLAINLY CALLING CHRIST GOD THE SON, When ya say that Christ is not God the son you are in essence saying that GOD NEVA HAD AN ABSOLUTE SON, how sick is that ? Jesus had to be God the son simply b/c mans blood cd neva atone for the sins of the world, He only took on flesh and blood to die for the sins of the world then here comes these devils making all these derogatory remarks about his deity they don't realize that if he were not God his body and blood wd be no atonement for the sins of the world,mans blood cd neva atone as jesus said outa of the hearts of man proceeds all manner of evil. Thats y John was preaching behold the lamb of God that taketh away the sins of the world . Then there is that hidden facet to the cross which is multiplication of very God in humanity via the seed of Christ , He said smite the shephard ( his death ) then the sheep will be scattered then I will turn my hand to the little ones which are the babes and sucklings that are baby Christs that are gonna a be born in US via his seed, which are the Children of PROMISE THE LITTLE ONES . Whosover receiveth one such Child in my name receiveth ME. see the multiplication via his seed the living words of God the Promise CHILDREN OUR NEW BIRTH ETC. Our fruit unto God. His CHILDREN ARE GODS THAT ARE GONNA BE BORN IN US WHICH ARE SPIRITS THE ISRAEL OF GOD. REMEMBER TO WHOM THE WORD CAME HIS SEED IT MADE THEM GODS. And the scriptures cannot be broken our lord said. Even in the natural when a seed dies it multiplies . Thus Gods plural,Remember God almighty swore by his very self when he made that promise of Christ being multiplied as the stars of heaven Thats y JESUS said to whom the WORD came it made them GODS PLURAL That are GONA BE BORN IN US. He does not multiply after the human kind simply b/c his seed is the living word seed the of God.GB

There is not a single verse that says Jesus is God the Son , that's backwards for the Son of God . There may be some things lost in translation over the years, but the clear and theme of the entire scripture is Jesus is Gods Son sent by God to save the world , or Savior .

There is only one Lord God that sits on the throne , and it may shock some to find it's not Jesus sitting on the throne , ask your self why not , then who is on the throne ? The Same lord that has always been on the Throne , and Jesus is his FIRST Son is at his right hand . But Jesus is not sitting on the throne the Father is on the throne . According to James there is one God even the devils know this !

It was God the Father that Commanded everything to multiply after its Kind ( seed ).No exceptions and that's how we know without a doubt Jesus is Truly God the Son simply b/c Jesus multiplies REPRODUCES after his KIND via his Seed the LIVING WORD WHICH IS THE VERY SEED OF GOD . To whom the WORD ( HIS SEED ) came it made them Gods And the scriptures cannot be broken. When he breathe on them that was his WORD which is his SEED that propagates after Gods kind , thats y he said receive ye the H.G. which is Spirit exactly like God is Spirit, And the H.G. fell on them that heard his WORDS which is spirit saying my WORDS are spirit and life, ONLY GOD CD MULTIPLY AFTER THE GOD KIND BUT WE SEE THAT CHRIST CD MULTiPLY AFTER The GOD KIND saying that which is born of the spirit is spirit which is our new innerman the h.g. that new heart and new spirit which is Christ being formed in via his seed the Word which is the multiplciation of Christ the H.G. Remember that was the great Promise is will multiply thy seed as the stars of heaven thats y the sower will go forth and sow his precious seed in humanity when the book is opened which is the new covenant a woman in travail and birth pains , This can only be done by the WORDS of JESUS the seeds of the sower that are gona be sown in our hearts, The woman and her Children are the direct result of the sower and his seed That will fulfill that Promise of multiplication making Christ to be as the stars of heaven in multitude,Remember it was God himself that made that great Promise when he swore by himself ,Thus you ppl that gag at 3 are gonna be sick when ya see that Christ/God is gonna be multiplied as the stars of Heaven, That Great PROMISE. After the woman gives birth John says Now is come salvation and the KINGDOM of our God and the power of his Christ the Children of Promise that will come via his Seed the words of the BOOK.Ya gotta realize that Christ is an Absolute Son, Have fun counting the Stars j.w.'s See the GOD KIND .GBU

You said that you have no problem with people that say Jesus is God !

I do because Jesus is of God a huge difference. If Jesus is God then He is God on the Throne not at the right hand of God on the throne as I speak .

Jesus is the Son of God .

A Son obeys his father !

The father always has authority over all his sons while in his house . God rules everywhere so We all including Jesus are in Gods domain .

If your son at home did his own will and ignored you , he would not be well pleasing to you .

Jesus always acknowledges the father and obedience to him .

And you will never find in the scriptures that Jesus is God . But will find over 40 times Jesus is the Son of God even by Gods own witness . I stick with the word of God . So clear it is !

Praise be to Jesus he goes to the father and will come again !

My brothers, Bob and Mild Bill

This truly is something that seems to greatly divide the body of Christ. Some people like to say "Jesus is God" and some like to say "Jesus is only the Son of God and not equal to the Father". I guess me posting this is to bring peace between us and not argue over things which, through picking different verses, can be deemed different ways. Jesus Christ is the only beloved Son of God. Born of a virgin conceived by the Holy Ghost. I'm sure we all agree on that. Jesus Christ is a man as to no other man to have ever walked this earth. Filled with the Holy Spirit of His Father. Doing miracles no one had ever experienced before in all of time. Truly God was in Him.

I am not taking one side or the other in this. I have no problem with people saying "Jesus Christ is God". Or people saying "He is the Son of God". He is, was, and always shall be. Jesus Christ is the only way unto the Father and is One with the Father. Everything has been given to Him by His Father. He is our King and Lord. God our Father want's us to honor the Son even as we honor the Father. John 5:19-23

May the Lord bring peace among us who are with Jesus Christ. We do not need division. The enemy wants us divided. I pray we may come together in peaceful conversation about things not of this world as they are from above. As none of us knows everything. Through the Holy Spirit I pray bring us together my Father. Teach us in your great knowledge and glory in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

John 14.28

Ye have how I said unto you , I go away and come again unto you . If you loved me ye would rejoice , because I said , I GO UNTO THE FATHER : FOR MY FATHER IS GREATER THAN I .

John 13 v16

Verily verily , I say unto you the servant is not greater than his lord : neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him .

John 13 v 20

A few verses of so many . Jesus is OF God and Truly God with us because he is born of God . But Jesus is servant to his father . Not equal in that way .

Jesus was sent by the father . And Jesus did as the father instructed him . If Jesus was equal to the father he never would have needed the fathers help in any way . And would just act independently of the father . But Jesus was servant to the father . God on the throne has no counselling from anyone . But does his own will .

I agree that Jesus and the father are one ! Because he is Born of God . The son of God .

Jesus said my father is greater than I , so you err !

Jesus prayed to the father because the father was greater than he , so you err !

Bob, you err.

"I and my Father are one.(equal)" John 10:30 This is the case scripture makes for the equality of the persons of God, you err.

The Jews understood the claims of Jesus,"because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God." John 10:33 Bob, you diminish God because he does not fit your sin tainted logic, and that is tragic.

Here we can see that Jesus is totally acknowledging that God is his father and all things he has was giving him from the father . Even the fathers word was given to him .

Yes Jesus is from God the father , but not equal to the father , because he received from the father all things .

Case closed . Jesus is the Son of God .

John 17:9 Jesus prays "not for the world", yet we sing upon His birth Joy To The World. Why do we do that? Maybe we should sing Joy To God's Chosen.

Learn to read it your self , there are so many commentary prophets that talk lots but do not understand much avoid them , spare your self . Ask God to teach you he can .

Read the gospels , try to hear what God is saying

I want to learn more about the bible

I love this chapter !

John 17

To those that have understanding it's very clear !

John 17:15 "I pray not that THOU shouldest take them out of the world, but that THOU shouldest keep them from the evil"

Note: in 2020 we should not become fearful or overwhelmed by this dreadful hour that is upon mankind, because JESUS (see John 17:15) has prayed for us, thereby GOD shall keep us, so we do not have to know or understand how GOD will keep us, but through FAITH we can be assured this PRAYER OF JESUS for us SHALL be answered by GOD.

John 17:20 neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

Note: this whole PRAYER OF JESUS is both directly & indirectly concern with SALVATION for all mankind, thereby blessed them and us that believed on JESUS according John 3:16-21, thereby our name is written in The BOOK of LIFE ( Revelation 20:15).

John 17 shows that the unity of God the father with Jesus does not mean that they are the same person. That false doctrine is one of many labeled trinity belief. God the father, son, and the Holy Ghost are separate persons. They are one IN TRUTH, CHARACTER, PURITY, AND LOVE. As Christ prayed for, true believers shall share in this unity in eternity with God and each other.

God loves with infinite love. Jesus is not worried about Himself or His disciples. This hate works for eternal blessings. It's

Nessacary for us to share in the love of the Trinity.

God's love and justice satisfied:

Romans 5:5-11

And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

I'm not a Calvinist .

But God sure is eternal not living in the past .

Christ died for All ! If they believe it or not he is still lord of all , he paid for all with his blood . Every knee shall bow to him in the future and acknowledge him as Lord . Praise God .