All Discussion PAGE 1035

Hello, All mature Christians should be familiar enough with the scriptures to see familiar symbols as expressed in Daniel and Revelation and let God unveil Jesus Christ in them. Often some scriptures may not be in chronological order especially of a vision and may even require some understanding of history, as you mentioned of the destruction of Jerusalem.

the lord says to my lord god said to man in authority

Romans 13 is a good chapter for this... part 2

Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers - This is a very strong saying, and most solemnly introduced; and we must consider the apostle as speaking, not from his own private judgment, or teaching a doctrine of present expediency, but declaring the mind of God on a subject of the utmost importance to the peace of the world; a doctrine which does not exclusively belong to any class of people, order of the community, or official situations, but to every soul; and, on the principles which the apostle lays down, to every soul in all possible varieties of situation, and on all occasions. And what is this solemn doctrine? It is this: Let every soul be subject to the higher powers. Let every man be obedient to the civil government under which the providence of God has cast his lot.

For there is no power but of God - As God is the origin of power, and the supreme Governor of the universe, he delegates authority to whomsoever he will; and though in many cases the governor himself may not be of God, yet civil government is of him; for without this there could be no society, no security, no private property; all would be confusion and anarchy, and the habitable world would soon be depopulated. kind of like we see today....

Romans 13 is a good chapter for this

Subjection to civil governors inculcated, from the consideration that civil government is according to the ordinance of God; and that those who resist the lawfully constituted authorities shall receive condemnation, Ro 13:1, Ro 13:2. And those who are obedient shall receive praise, Ro 13:3. The character of a lawful civil governor, Ro 13:4. The necessity of subjection, Ro 13:5. The propriety of paying lawful tribute, Ro 13:6, Ro 13:7. Christians should love one another, Ro 13:8-10. The necessity of immediate conversion to God proved from the shortness and uncertainty of time, Ro 13:11, Ro 13:12. How the Gentiles should walk so as to please God, and put on Christ Jesus in order to their salvation, Ro 13:13, Ro 13:14.

That seven Angels are here meant, and not the Holy Spirit, is most evident from the place, the number, and the tradition. Those who imagine the Holy Ghost to be intended suppose the number seven is used to denote his manifold gifts and graces. That these seven spirits are angels, see Re 3:1; 4:5; and particularly Re 5:6, where they are called the seven spirits of God Sent Forth into All the Earth.

Asking And allowing GOD to do his Will place me a this awesome position to trust In the Holy Spirit to dwell in man's heart to humble their heart and give when instructions are given as a vessel of the power of GOD!!!!!

If we take the words as referring to Jesus Christ, then they must be understood as pointing out the time of his humiliation, as in Heb 2:9; and the little lower, in both verses, must mean for a short time, or a little while, as is very properly inserted among our marginal readings. Adam was originally made higher than the angels, but by sin he is now brought low, and subjected to death; for the angelic nature is not mortal. Thus, taking the words in their common acceptation, man in his present state may be said to be lessened below the angels. Jesus Christ, as the eternal Logos, or God with God, could not die, therefore a body was prepared for him; and thus , for a short while, he was made lower than the angels, that he might be capable of suffering death. And indeed the whole of the passage suits him better than it does any of the children of men, or than even Adam himself in a state of innocence; for it is only under the feet of Jesus that all things are put in subjection, and it was in consequence of his humiliation that he had a name above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth, Php 2:9-11. Therefore he must be infinitely higher than the angels, for they, as well as all the things in heaven, bow in subjection to him.

Thou crownedst him with glory and honor - This was strictly true of Adam in his state of innocence, for he was set over all things in this lower world; all sheep and oxen, the beasts of the field, the fowl of the air, the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passeth over the paths of the seas, Ps 8:7, Ps 8:8. So far all this perfectly applies to Adam; but it is evident the apostle takes all in a much higher sense, that of universal dominion; and hence he says, he left nothing that is not put under him. These verses, collated with the above passage from the Epistle to the Philippians, mutually illustrate each other. And the crowning Christ with

The value of fellowship , has served as a platform to help me mature into the believer that I am . I'm seeking the unselfish abundance of love and blessings that GOD have for me , can we agree in Jesus name thanks

501c3 church's are not allowed to honestly interpret Revelations as being about the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. there only allowed to interpret it as unfulfilled prophecy of end times and Israel futurism

Roy,

Revelation 1:4 says from the seven Spirits which are before His, that is, God's throne;

There are two schools of thought on this. Please know that the number seven doesn't necessarily mean there are seven Spirits.

In the Bible, seven represents completeness, perfection.

The Jews take it as a Hebraism. RASHI, one of the greatest Jewish scholars uses Isaiah 11:1-2 to show that what John is using is a Hebraism to denote the seven fold Spirit of God. It means the Spirit of God is complete and perfect.

But what specifically is he making reference to?

In Revelation 4:5, we see the same thing when we study what the throne is like in heaven.

It says and out of the throne proceed lightnings, and thunderings, and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

In Revelation Chapter 5, the chapter where we see this scroll with seven seals on it, which is the title deed to the earth, and the call goes out who is worthy to take the scroll and loosen the seals thereof.

And no one was found worthy in heaven. And John began to weep. And he was told don't weep, the Lamb of God is worthy.

And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent forth into all the earth.

The seven eyes of Christ are the seven Spirits. So it represents completeness, perfection.

But its application is to the Lord's seeing. You see, he's talking about the all-encompassing Spirit who sees all things, and knows all things. That's the way the Jews understood it.

The scripture reference is Zechariah 4:10 which talks about these seven eyes, meaning that God sees perfectly and completely all things. And so John is using a Hebraism here.

Hope this helps!

part 2

In the day of visitation - I believe this refers to the time when God should come to execute judgment on the disobedient Jews, in the destruction of their civil polity, and the subversion of their temple and city. God did at that time put a remarkable difference between the Jews and the Christians: all the former were either destroyed or carried into slavery; not one of the latter: nor did they deserve it; for not one of them had joined in the sedition against the Roman government. That the day of visitation means a time in which punishment should be inflicted, is plain from Isa 10:3 : And what will ye do in the Day of Visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from afar? To whom will ye flee for help? And where will ye leave your glory? Some think that by the phrase in this place is meant the time in which they should be brought before the heathen magistrates, who, after an impartial examination, should find them innocent, and declare them as such; by which God would be glorified, the work appearing to be his own. Others think that it signifies the time in which God should make them the offer of mercy by Jesus Christ. The words, however, may refer to the time in which the Christians should be called to suffer for the testimony of Christ; the heathens, seeing them bear their sufferings with unconquerable patience, were constrained to confess that God was with them; and not a few, from being spectators of their sufferings, became converts to Christianity,

1 peter 2:12

Having your conversation honest - Living in such a manner among the Gentiles, in whose country ye sojourn, as becomes the Gospel which ye profess.

That whereas they speak against you as evil doers - In all the heathen countries, in the first age of the Church, the Christians and the Jews were confounded together; and as the latter mere everywhere exceedingly troublesome and seditious, the Christians shared in their blame, and suffered no small measure of obloquy and persecution on this very account. It was doubly necessary, therefore, that the Christians should be exceedingly cautious; and that their conduct should prove that, although many of them were of the same nation, yet they who had embraced Christianity differed widely in their spirit and conduct from those, whether Jews or Gentiles, who had not received the faith of Christ.

Hi Butch , at some point on our lives I think most of us have had our doubts , often they come into our head when we are feeling a bit stressed or insecure or vulnerable . Please don't get too worried about it , you know the Truth so you have nothing to fear , when this world starts to fray my nerves a bit , that's when I read my Bible a bit more often than normal , say a few more prayers than usual and try to make a bit more time to be alone with my Heavenly Father . Also , try to think if there is something going on around you that might be making you feel a bit irritated or vulnerable . Be not soon shaken Butch , God loves you very much .

Your comment...i love this web s

Joh 1:1 (KJV) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Joh 1:14 (KJV) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

1Jo 5:7 (KJV) For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

If you read a bit further on you will see that Eve does not become Adams 'subordinate ' until Genesis Ch 3 V 16 . I hope you are not offended by me , a 'subordinate' answering this question for you .

This psalm was written by David, as the title shows, and which is confirmed by our Lord Jesus Christ, Mt 22:43 and by the Apostle Peter, Ac 2:34

The Lord said unto my Lord, The Targum is,

"the Lord said in his Word.''

Galatinus5 says the true Targum of Jonathan has it,

"the Lord said to his Word;''

and produces an authority for it. These are the words of Jehovah the Father to his Son the Messiah; the "Adon", or Lord, spoken of in Isa 6:1, the one Lord Jesus, and only Potentate; the Lord of all, the Lord of David, and of every believer; not by right of creation only, as of all mankind; but by redemption, having bought them; and by right of marriage, having espoused them; and by their own consent, they owning him to be their Lord. The words said to him by Jehovah, as follow, were said in his mind, in his eternal purpose and decree; which he, lying in his bosom, was privy, when he foreordained him to be the Redeemer; and in the council and covenant of peace, when he promised him this glory as the reward of his sufferings; and in the prophecies of the Old Testament, which speak as of the sufferings of Christ, so of the glory that should follow; and when the fact was done, when, after his death, resurrection, ascension, and entrance into heaven, he was placed, as follows:

Sit thou at my right hand;

correction: that was to say I'm not cherry picking. someone sent me those words. No need to continue going back and forth over this. the moral of the story is..any & everyone that excepts Christ in their heart is going to heaven. baptism or not. The ppl that except Him just before dying, God forbid they wait that long, have just as much right to heaven as you or I. yet not being able to get baptized before breathing their last breath doesn't mean they will not go to heaven. They're in Gods hands and He will not deny them if they ask Jesus in their heart. In fact, "Jesus", just might be the only word they have time for and beings God knows their heart He will do the rest. AND that WILL be enough for Him. My thanks to everyone that has responded to my beliefs. It shows that you care about the bible and want the best for others. God will bless y'all as we learn His word together. Were 2 or more gather in HIs name.!

men want to be saved, but God is the one who does the saving.

your lord is the son of God, jesus the mediator speaking to his lord God.God the creator....

BRO ANDREW

Hello Everyone,

Just wanted to wish all of the Lord's children a Happy 4th of July.

We live in a great country and we all should be proud to do so. We should be grateful to the Patriots and founding Fathers that fought against Great Britain for 8 years to garner our independence. Our history is an amazing story of Democracy and freedom for all men and women. Don't stop praying. God bless you all.

Actually the term "separation of church and state" does not exist in the U.S. Constitution or Bill of Rights. The first Amendment protect the free exercise of religion for all people in the U.S.. The recent Supreme Court decision concerning the football coach from Bremerton, WA. is a good example of correct viewing of the First Amendment concerning free exercise of religion and the government not infringing nor prohibiting this right to free exercise. This amendment also includes that the government will not establish a specific religion such as is in the U.K. or Sweden. This means that the government cannot make it law that citizens need to adhere to a specific religion and pay the government to support this established religion.

Hmm

What chapter in 2 Peter are you referring to?

Texsis, your teachings was not held by the early church historically. Water baptism was the norm. Jesus said to go into ALL nations making disciples and baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Can't get any plainer than that from the mouth of our Lord who is TRUTH. No where in the New Testament does it say that Jesus' instructions to baptize in water was only for the Jews and that His instructions were changed or superseded by the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Be careful of who you say is "cherry picking" verses to support one's point of view.

Hello, Richard. It seems that we perhaps have similar points of view here, but coming from differing angles. I was just out of college when Reagan was elected. He set the stage for some real positive steps for democracy. I remember when the Berlin wall came down. What a wonderful event that was for the world, but especially for east and west Germans. I remember when Poland revolted against communism with the Solidarity movement and succeeded in wresting control away from the U.S.S.R. Soon many other eastern bloc countries were able to break away from the U.S.S.R. until finally the U.S.S.R. was broken up and we now have the various countries around the Black and Caspian Sea that are independent along with some along the outer western part of Russia. I remember when interest rates were up to 16% and there were long lines for gas as it was being rationed during the Carter administration. Those were hard times and it took two administrations of Reagan to undo the damage Carter's policies did to the U.S. citizenry. I remember growing up when one income was sufficient for the average family. You could be a butcher, milkman, postal deliverer, etc. and supply what was needed for your family. "Common decency" was a real thing in communities and provided much safety for children growing up. But I realize this wasn't true for all communities. I have witnessed the steady deterioration of the nuclear family and alienation of neighbors in neighborhoods that once were close knit and watchful for ALL that lived there.

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All of these events made me one who was very politically aware of how our country was being governed and to remain vigilant about standing up and speaking up about things that would help, not harm our country.

Paul had a calling to be an evangelist and apostle. He knew full well what he was to do. Some of us have callings to serve in the ministry, others in the military, others in the government and most of are to fulfill our duties as citizens.

i think its Gods choice to make.....a little humanity could go a long way if its only given selflessly and positively having no auterior motives.REMAIN BLESS

Brother Andrew!!!

Jesus speaking of baptism was to the Jews at that time. Yet once He was resurrected we are baptized with the spirit by the grace of God. Not cherry picking, study the bible as He says to and you too will know the TRUTH soon enough. For this reason exactly why God sent His son to die for us. people still believe the old ways and not follow Christ BDBR (Birth for He was born of a virgin, Death for He died for our sins, Burial to carry our sins to the depths and His Resurrection for our justification. Which justification means "Just if I'd" never sinned. So if your not believing this you are saying God made a mistake. God doesn't make mistakes my friend.

Humbly I request, what happened to the separation of Church and State?

Richard my brother in Christ, all humans are a product of their belife system. As within so without. Although I don't agree with you, I do know that God had mercy on Saul who had persecuted Christians before he came into a new understanding. I pray that God will be merciful with you as he was with Saul. I will now leave this discussion to go and pray for all of us. Remember this, the United States is one nation under GOD. Man is not God! Let us start there before we make a power grab.

Wait a minute. God had promised Abraham an inheritance and yet he played this game with his wife again in Genesis 20 because he was fearful of the foreign leaders taking his wife and killing him. He had the promise of an heir and yet still was more afraid of men in that case; and God summarily dealt with the king both times preventing them from touching his wife. There is no proof in either case that the kings planned to kill Abraham if he told them the truth. He would rather that they would unknowingly sin rather than brazenly taking his wife; which of course rendered righteous indignation on their part for setting them up in that way.

Obviously with the case of John the Baptist we see how leaders can attempt illegitimate relations and marry them. As to whether it was a custom in Abraham's time; I suppose since it came to mind in Abraham's mind it wasn't unheard of. It is hard to tell from the account what Abraham was accomplishing or how long Sarai was staying with the royalty. It would appear that he was trading; or doing some sort of work to obtain food for himself; but is unclear why he separated from Sarai in the first place. It certainly wasn't a stellar moment in his life but used for his chastisement and our instruction.

Nice to hear from you again. Not sure what is disagreed upon-I don't have any real problem with your response. I was listening to a program about Reagan's life last night. What was confidential until recently was his personal action to let out a group of Pentacostal believers who were detained in Russia in the 80's. He also personally visited an apartment where Jews were being mistreated; as well as a stopover to discuss with refugees his vision of the future. As to his own confused doctrinal stance; I am aware issues exist. My point is taking a personal approach is helpful; as he did with Gorbachev (even though he still spoke out against evils). You would probably agree that it is the REASON we are standing for our freedoms that is more important than going out and supporting a "humanitarian" concept. It is always secondary; as it was with Paul to the Gospel being preached. Thus; there was a convenient season to rejoice in being beaten in jail and worship/sing to Christ and he was miraculously delivered; and there was the time he used the Roman citizenship as a playing card. Again; in that case he was probably looking at the importance of being free to continue his ministry and perhaps the other person imprisoned with him and his welfare as well. It is much like his talk to the Corinthians about his suffering in his rather sarcastic commentary-it was necessary for their edification and growth to understand his apostolic ministry. It wasn't mentioned to other churches; and again his main concern and what he spent day and night weeping and praying for was for the state of the churches and the doctrines therein. When his incarceration was used as a vehicle to save those on the ship and minister to the Cretians; as well as travel elsewhere under house arrest it benefited the gospel. The church should make all efforts to be a safe haven for single moms; and others in need so government can be trimmed back to original parameters of law and order.