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How do you understand John 11:25-26?
"Jesus said unto her, "I am the Resurrection, and the light: he who believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live.
And whoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"
I'm reading your comment:"If we reject Jesus as our savior there is no salvation. When we die in our sin and unrepentants, our soul is separated from him, and cast into Hell. This is the 2nd Death." True! And, I would like to comment on this topic.
The second death follows the judgement scene. Jesus, the mediator, shows the resurrected unsaved dead all their life from the books of record. (Angels follow us around recording all deeds.) And, then the unrepentant sinner bows to the LORD. He never repents. Yet , he will bow to the LORD. And, then, God by the sword of his mouth ( by his words that he speaks) the wicked will die forever. Cease to exist. No eternal life of suffering.
Eternal life is the reward ONLY to us who are saved.
Why would the LORD punish for ETERNITY a sinner that lived for only 70 years? Or 20 years? That makes zero sense. Our God is one of love, logic, order, reason.
Carleton
Part 1.
As promised, I'm returning to our discussion that I had to exit due to a lot going on during the week.
Just to recap what initiated this discussion allow me to back track a little.
A few days ago, you responded to me concerning a post I made.
Here's that Post.
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, PREACHED UNTO THE GENTILES, BELIEVED ON IN THE WORLD, RECEIVED UP INTO GLORY. 1 Timothy 3:16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Timothy 3:16.
When "ALL" scripture is Allegorized or interpreted mystically it is NOT able to be profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.
There is the difference.
One is just so happened to be correct.
Christ sheep does not leave the back door open for the wolves to come in because they hate the sheep fold.
End Post.
The first part of that post ( 1 Timothy 3:16) was in relation to a question asked. "Why we do preach the deity of Christ, "though it offends some. "Because it happens to be true!
The second part of that post ( 2 Timothy 3:16.) I mentioned to explain why and what method we use when we reprove, correct or instruct. "We use scripture as it is written without Allegorizing it or interpreting it mystically so it can be put on a spindle so it can be purposely taken out of context.
The third part of the Post is saying, just because one hates the Trinity doctrine it shouldn't cause a true believer to side and promote a false teacher/wolf and a Doctrine they don't believe in. Such as, "believers and unbelievers alike will become gods. Noone by the Spirirt of Christ would do such a thing.
See Part 2 concerning your response and a Holy kiss.
Part 1
If I may add a few points to this subject, I know we have different understandings on this and I hope you will not be offended, these are questions I have asked myself. What does Scripture support, our soul is an immortal entity that consciously lives on after the death of the body or does it sleep in the grave until the resurrection? Is the definition of death a separation of the soul from the body or is it the end of life, a permanent cessation, and the grave is our home until we are resurrected?
John 3:15-16 Without the belief in Jesus we will perish the Greek word apollumi means destroy utterly, to put out of the way entirely, abolish as in Psalms 37:10 Psalms 92:7 Proverbs 10:28-29 Job 20:4-7 Malachi 4:1-3 2 Peter 2:12.
Matthew 10:28 we are to fear the one who can destroy the body and the soul in hell, the Greek word for destroy is apollumi same as perish, a permanent/absolute destruction. Hell, the Greek word is geenna the fire and smoke that goes up and burns forever that never goes out is a reference to the lake of fire. Job 17:13 the Hebrew word sheol is the same word translated as hell. Job 17:16 the word pit is the same Hebrew word.
Our first death is sleep, Psalms 13:3 Daniel 12:2 Acts 13:36 1 Cor. 15:51. If all souls are immortal which means they have eternal life, the question must be asked, what is the gift of eternal life we see in John 3:15 John 6:54 Romans 6:23 Titus 1:2 1 John 2:25 Jude 1:21? If our soul is immortal, why do we have to put immortality on as said in 1 Corinthians 15:51-58?
See part 2
Part 2
My understanding is everyone will face judgment there is the first resurrection in Rev. 20 and the white throne judgment of all who have lived excluding those in the first resurrection who have already received their glorified bodies and judged, Rev. 20:4 and have been reigning with Jesus for a thousand years.
The second resurrection and judgment is called the second death, in this judgment, all who are not found in the Book of Life are cast into the lake of fire and they will perish, this punishment based on their works is everlasting to be no more, not an eternal conscious torment. We are given an example in Jude 1:7 of how the wicked will perish, the same way Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed in the eternal fire for eternity never to be again.
Just a little of how I understand it, I know you know the Greek words' meaning better than I do, thank you.
God bless,
RLW
This comment is in reply to what happens to the condemned soul.
See on YouTube: Clash of Minds episode 178. At about 7 minutes into the lecture, Pastor Veith mentions that the condemned soul ceases to exist.
178 WUP Walter Veith & Martin Smith - Do not Worship The Beast And his Image, And Receive his Mark
Clash Of Minds
133K subscribers
Pastor Veith has dealt with this subject in previous lectures though I cannot seem to find it now.
The following quotes the New World Encyclopedia on Gehenna.
"The valley forms the southwest border of ancient Jerusalem that stretches from the foot of Mt. Zion to the Kidron Valley. It is first mentioned in Joshua 15:8. Originally it referred to a garbage dump in a deep narrow valley right outside the walls of Jerusalem where fires were kept burning to consume the refuse and keep down the stench. It is also the location where bodies of executed criminals, or individuals denied a proper burial, would be dumped. In addition, this valley was frequently not controlled by the Jewish authority within the city walls; it is traditionally held that this valley was used as a place of religious child-sacrifice to Moloch by the Canaanites outside the city (comp. Jer. 2: 23).
Like Sheol, Gehenna is sometimes translated as Hell."
Notice: "FIRES WERE KEPT BURNING TO CONSUME THE REFUSE"
The soul that sins will be burnt up and be eternal gone. Like sodom and Gomorrah. Burnt up and gone. Ashes under our feet.
This is in response to our earlier conversation. Does the condemned soul ceases to exist or does the condemned soul burn for eternity. The below verse was an example you gave of eternal burning.
"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." Matt 10:28 KJV.
This verse NOT proof of eternal burning. It IS proof that the condemned soul CEASES to exist. God destroys BOTH soul and body.
These things are caused by Satan and his demons, using sin as an entry point, and they can be passed down from one generation to another. Exodus 34:7 and Deuteronomy 5:9 "Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them; for I, the Lord thy God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate Me."
Jesus gives a condition here, "if," to mean that not everybody is set free by the Son of God, but only those who choose to let Him set them free.
"The Son sets you free": Yes, He has the Power and Authority to set us free. He does not negotiate with the devils; He commands them. He has the power to forgive our sins. Matthew 9:6 "But so that you might know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sin . . ."
"You'll be free indeed": When Jesus sets us free, we are completely free. The freedom Christ offers is complete and not half. We're delivered from the powers of darkness.
May the Lord help us be free indeed, in Jesus' name.
I have prayed for Scott and Chuck, and Jessica and your family. May God bless all today and answer our prayers in miraculous ways.
When it comes to our daily walk with God; it is helpful to have those who are more mature in the faith to guide and disciple us.
Those who have exhibited fruit in their lives through long term evidence involved in the ministry; whether leaders in the church or other acquaintances who are laypersons may not matter. Paul states "imitate me" in 1 Cor. 11:1 (easy to memorize with that identifier).
We do well to realize; without being cynical that everyone is subject to Christ and on this side of heaven capable of sin. This means we have to be careful not to put someone on a pedestal whether it be a spouse; or a Pastor. The first issue is whether we are truly desiring to emulate someone because of a personality trait or a genuine spiritual gift. The second; related to the first is if the gift has more significance either to us or the person in question as compared to the "author and finisher of our faith" Christ Himself. ( Heb. 12:2). We need to look through spiritual eyes and not always focus on who speaks the loudest or most eloquently; or makes the rules; etc. Of course we need not to obsess on someone who is physically attractive and all the related desires of the flesh that seek to undo us. Just take one look at the Christian "music industry" to see how clearly that is evident with the appearance of celebrities in all their glitz and glamour.
We need to see objectively how much of our time we spend in church activities along with the rest of our time is really helping us to do the things required of God; namely fulfilling the Great Commission; prayer and meditation on the scriptures. I have stated in previous posts that it is remarkable how much time believers tend to spend socializing when in fellowship and how little discussing answered prayers and scriptural promises fulfilled in their lives due to God's faithfulness. I am convinced this is one of Satan's best kept secrets and ties in with verses such as 2 Timothy 3:5.
Thank you for being upfront with me. I do understand where you're coming from and I will respectfully move on from this discussion.
Until I can find some place in the Bible that tells me that the soul will cease to exist and that hell is the grave, we will just have to remain in disagreement.
Unless the Lord comes for us before we die, our bodies are going to end up in a grave somewhere. I can't bring myself to believe that you or I or anyone else who belongs to the Lord will end up in hell (if hell is the grave).
I know I asked a lot of questions and I presented a lot scriptures to go with those questions. You mentioned that you don't have the time to read everything but I hope that if you ever do find the time to carefully read over those questions, perhaps you might see why I find it difficult to agree with you on this one.
Again, thank you for your openness and for being the kind and caring person that you are. I do look forward to reading more of your posts. God bless!!!
Looks like I had a couple typos.
I Meant "That is very dear of you and thank you so much.
And, "I've haven't been on the site at all until last night for a glance.
God bless.
I am sorry to hear of your friends passing. I will pray for his family and friends today. I look forward to hearing from you this weekend.
King James Version
3The eyes of theLordare in every place, beholding the evil and the good.
Psalm 37:23
King James Version
23The steps of a good man are ordered by theLord: and he delighteth in his way.
Psalm 37:4-5
King James Version
4Delight thyself also in theLord: and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart.
5Commit thy way unto theLord; trust also in him; and he shall bring it to pass.
Psalm 72:14
King James Version
14He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.
I have faith as currently as a Private Example holding faith that this will come to pass for me believing that this word must be done every second minute hour and day for me. That being a good man towards all will come back to me.
That is very dear od you and thank you so much.
I've haven't been on the at all until last night for a glance.
I've been extremely busy on the road and a friend of mine was killed in a car accident last Friday.
I will be catching up and engaging this weekend.
God bless you.
:)
In vs. 29 Moses reveals to the Israelites God's heart, "O that there was such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all of my commandments always, that it may go well with them, and with their children forever! God so desired that this nation would truly be people after His own heart, even though He knew that they would not be so.
God instructs Moses to tell the people to back into their tents, but Moses was to stay beside God and hear all that He wanted Moses to speak to the people before they enter the land of promise and possess it so that they will do all that God says to do in the land.
God speaks through Moses "Ye shall observe to do therefore as the LORD your God hath commanded you: ye shall not turn aside to the right or to the left. ye shall walk in all the ways which the LORD your God has commanded you, that you may live and that it may be well with you, and that ye may prolong your days in the land that ye shall possess."
Moses knew that he would not be entering this land. But he was faithful to tell to the people ALL that God instructed him to say and do. Moses was such a good example of selfless servanthood. He wasn't in it for himself, but for the benefit of this people God had chosen to fulfill His promises in and through. These people had already repeatedly turned away from God in the 40 years since they had traveled from Egypt and around the desert wilderness. Moses saw this happen again and again. It grieved his heart as it grieved the LORD's heart.
Now we have the Holy Spirit within us to make us know that God is with us and in us. He is the only true God and He is near, though transcendent in nature, He is near us in Presence.
I love how God had Moses speak of God's greatness, power, and mercy in these verses that re-state the commandments. He did not just give out a set of commandments, but He wanted them to remember how He worked among them to deliver them from Egypt, doing miracles and showing great power and to know that He is a merciful God, who cares about them. He is not aloof, nor is He just an inanimate force-He is a Person with attributes that tell us what He is like in His Person and in His relation to the Israelites. He is the same today. He is a Personal God-God With Us-involved in our day to day lives and working in and through us to accomplish His will and pleasure in which He brings glory to Himself in all of His ways.
Moses reminds the Israelites how God spoke at Sinai. He used His voice. He demonstrated His Presence using things He created-fire, thunder, lightning, smoke, darkness, pillar of fire and of cloud, His glory was seen in the tabernacle. But these are His" coverings", His manifestations to show His Presence to the people. It is that we cannot perceive Him unless He reveals Himself to us in some way that is compatible with our human make-up. We SEE the visual manifestations. We HEAR His Presence. We experience His power and miracles. He wrote the commandments on the tablets of stone for all to see and read.
Vs. 24 speaks of their physical experience with God's Presence and, it says, they saw that God does talk with men and that He LIVETH. He is not an inanimate force or idol that can not do these things. They were terrified that if they continued to hear God's voice they would die. They were truly afraid that this experience of God would kill them, so they beseeched Moses to draw near to God on the mountain and hear what God says. Then he would come to them and speak what God said to him. They promised to hear Moses and to do what God commanded. God knew all that they had said to Moses and each other. He knew all of their thoughts and emotions.
pt. 3
Good to hear from you again. I will certainly pray for your job and company and car repairs. Thanks for coming back on board here.
This Chapter starts out with Moses reminding the nation of the covenant God made with them and reminds them that this covenant was not made with their forefathers, but particularly with them who were living at that time, who came out of Egypt. they made with God at Sinai.
Moses speaks of how He stood between the people and God to bring to them God's word for them.
He re-states the Decalogue in Verses 6-21. God thought it very important for His people to hear these commandments at this juncture before they enter the land of promise. God did not want to go into the land, get comfortable and prosper and then forget God, neglect Him, or turn to idols. He had Moses re-state the 10 commandments a this time when they were still dependent on God for provision of their daily needs and protection.
They had the ornate tabernacle to meet with God through Moses. But they are told to worship only Him without ever making any thing that would be a representation of Him from their imaginations of what He would look like, as the pagans do with their idol figures. They needed to be reminded not to worship the tabernacle and to remember that God is Spirit and therefore, does not possess a permanent form as we would view it. He cannot be accurately represented by anything we could create. He is the creator of all things in the universe, seen or unseen, physical or spiritual. And there is nothing in all of creation that is a physical representation of Him in His essential divine nature.
Of course, Jesus is the perfect and complete image of God. His divine nature was always in Jesus and since incarnating and taking on a human nature, he continues to exist as both God and man. In heaven, we will see God when we look upon Jesus. We will worship Him as the angels do. There is no need for any representation of God in eternity because we will see God in Christ Jesus.
Colossians chapter 1 is a very powerful example of the divine nature of Jesus...cont.
May Jesus continue to bless you and protect you.
Giving, witnessing, making disciples, praying, teaching Bible, preaching, etc are works "OF" righteousness; not works "FOR" righteousness.
May we be faithful in our walk with CHRIST. November 16, 2023