All Discussion PAGE 2413

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So a life in Christ is not a "try, see if you like it, then accept or reject Christ" type of association - that is merely religion, whereby one can choose to find a belief system or philosophy that fits in with our beliefs. Christianity - pure Christianity from the Bible speaks of a complete inward change that then pursues the things of God in spite of personal conflicts & challenges along the way. So Claudia, please don't give up on Christ - in spite of your past & even distresses of the present, Christ is your (& our) only Hope for this life & that which is to come. As Jesus is ready to forgive us completely,without partiality or condemnation, it is my hope & prayer that you will find both this Love of Christ in your heart & life & also the love & full acceptance of your friend.

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I hope the responses you've received so far have been useful & I thank you for yours to me giving further detail to the most recent 'outburst'. Of course, not hearing your friend's side of this sad account, I can only discern from what you have shared here. Your friend appears to be somewhat 'highly strung' in her changing moods & rhetoric. As others have shared or intimated, Christians may be a forgiven people but certainly God has still to do a lot more work in us. I'm only sad that you're not seeing a better example of Christ-likeness & by your forgiving her & God's Work in her, she may be able to see herself more clearly.

We have a relative (a lady about your age) who is gay, though never suffering childhood abuse as you have. Her story sounds similar to yours, in that she once was quite a vibrant Christian, but was 'put off' by the attitudes & hypocrisies she saw in her family & Christians generally & felt better served to follow her sexual orientation & indeed go right over to the other side & pursue the Hindu philosophy. She is now quite an active Hindu & turned completely away from anything of Christ. Of course, I can't comment on your 're-birth' experience, as it's something personal between God & yourself, but I do know that if we are born again, then it's a complete spiritual change (not physical) done by God for all time. If one such as yourself should also then have to 'fit in' your sexual orientation in that Work of God, then God certainly will speak, guide & counsel you about it. It will be a struggle, as there are struggles in each of us who may have been given over to behaviour that is inconsistent with God's requirements, but we pursue godliness to please the One Who has brought light into our once dark souls.

Was Moses literally judging them? Or was it more like confession at a church?

Just so everyone knows, this is a Bible website where people can come and read it, discuss it, and those who choose to follow its teachings are called Christians who follow Jesus Christ as a role model.

If someone comes to a Bible site and publicly posts that they disagree with its teachings or think the Bible is wrong for this or that reason, then that can be offensive and judgmental to the many who respect its teachings. One must question the true motives of someone coming to a Bible website who then tries to discredit the Bible.

The Bible says the act of homosexuality is a sin. That isn't an opinion. That is what the Bible says in its text in several places: Link - is someone a Bible follower or a Bible-denier? Is someone a Christ follower (Christian) or a Christ denier?

So, the act is morally wrong and a sin. Just because someone has desires for something doesn't mean he must act on it. People regularly have all kinds of desires for sin, because sin is made attractive. Satan loves to dangle sin in front of our faces, but that doesn't mean we must engage in that sin. People also make a logical fallacy of identifying oneself as this or that, as if that somehow justifies sin. No, identifying oneself as a certain label doesn't make sin ok. i.e. I'm a robber, so robbing others is ok. I'm a player, so having affairs is ok, etc. on and on. It's all the same old, tired tricks that satan plays over and over, but they keep working to deceive people.

God calls everyone to be loving. Love people, despite their flaws. Loving doesn't mean to condone sin and it doesn't mean an excuse to commit sin, however. That's a logical fallacy, false assumption and a deception from satan. Sin is sin. God will judge our actions. Sometimes people pretend to be a victim for being called out on sin. Sometimes that feeling is actually guilt from deep-down knowing what one is doing is morally wrong and evil in God's eyes. The Bible is very clear on this subject and it will not be watered down to make someone feel better about their own sin.

Claudia don't get me wrong sin is sin but something to keep in mind sin is broken fellowship with God which all people commit, the challenge is if you want the deliverance and to experience His love and power and healing then it has to be done His way. Its like trying to build a house for someone without looking at their blueprint ain't gonna happen, also the more you do for God the more he will do for you its just the way it works. You wouldn't give a totally disobedient child great rewards or responsibility same with God people want Him to work their way and trust me we all make that mistake because we don't fully trust and obey.

Thank you for your response, Bendigo

I did learn of those things you mentioned. I was a Born-Again Christian in my 20's.

Ironically, some of the rest of your response is why I am no longer a Christian.

But I certainly agree that my friend and I are going in different directions and perhaps nothing I can do can change that, and perhaps I should move on and leave her in Greater Hands.

God is King right now. You will know Him and His Son before this virus is over. The world will end all of a sudden. Where will you be? The Light of God will Brighten the Darkness that is playing mind games with the world's way of people. Watch..Be Ready...

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But anyway, I do believe in God, and I can and indeed have prayed for her. I want to forgive, and that is my intention, but I have not gotten there yet. I have not spoken to her since October because I do think that she did feel guilty, and rather than disavow, or at least take time to mull it over, she blamed me, and later doubled down when I tried to reach out a little. I don't relish being treated like that again. It's a shame, because I love and miss her. But I can't stomach this part of her.

But anyway, Andrew, I thank you for your thought-provoking and kind response to me.

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Thank you for your reply, Andrew, I actually replied some of what I wanted to say to you, to Chris.

I used to actually be Born Again. But that was not a good fit for me, for many reasons, including my sexual orientation, and a long history of abuse with my stepfather. Nonetheless, I am very familiar with Christianity, and did study the Bible in my 20's when I identified as Born Again. This was the 80's and many Christians I had experience with were very offensive to me as a gay woman, a real turnoff.

I still struggle with the amount of animus that is directed at gay people by some people who identify as Christians. I understand that Christianity considers homosexuality as a sin. And I recognize that to Christians all sin is sin. But it is hard for me to look at it that way. To me, it is strange. Two consenting adults loving one another is "bad", but it is OK for some to rationalize slavery. My friend said to me, "Well, Claudia, do you know that back in the day, black people had slaves? Do you know black people sold one another into slavery? At one time or another, all races have had it bad (!). Are you aware of Morgan Freeman's views on racism?" Now, back in the day, my friend made homophobic statements such as "Homosexuality is a gross sin in the eyes of God and AIDS is the punishment.". That statement was circa 1986. She has disavowed her homophobia and apologized for saying those kind of things to me, and we did quite well for five years. But the above racist/apologist statements are things she said to me this fall, after the summer of BLM protests. When I read them, I just ask myself what the point was of her disavowing the homophobia, when it doesn't seem like she learned anything from it? And when I told her how much her racist/apologist statements offended me, she apologized, but when I pointed out those same statements would offend POC, she not only didn't apologize, she doubled down on them!

Fred Adam and eve were not innocent they both believed and acted on the serpent lie. and spiritually lost their connection with God also all the authority that Adam had was handed over to Satan Read luke 4:5-7 it's says it was handed to him that's how cataclysmic the fall of Genisis was which is why The Devil is called God of this world. God by his only begotten son not only delivered us from the power of darkness but also spiritually now we are in the body of Christ i.e. Saints eventually to be going to our Father who delivered us in perfect bodies for all eternity.

My take on Psalm 121very powerful David is actually telling is enemies about is GOD and how powerful he's so David is saying because of my obedient to GOD and is command, when I pray

to the GOD who made the HEAVEN and the EARTH he will be a watchman for you, whatever you do. he will not let you, to be a shame, you will not fail he will not let your foot be weak

and assuring them that he's a GOD that do not slumber he do not sleep he watches over is

children's he's the GOD of the Day and the GOD of the night no harm will come near you

when you go out and you come in this's a promise he made. if GOD made a promise he will surely keep it. remember when JESUS said in Matthew I will never leave you nor for sake you he will be with you to the very end that's a promise. and he's still with us saints of GOD.

Rebecca, may the Spirit grace you with his understanding.

Most things in God's word have to be discerned by applying multiple scriptures and all applied against:

1 John 2:27 But the anointing (Holy Ghost in you) which ye have received (by grace) of him (Holy Ghost) abideth in you, and you NEED NOT THAT ANY MAN TEACH YOU; but as the same anointing (the Holy Ghost) teacheth you ALL things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it (the Holy Ghost) hath taught you, ye shall abide (become one) in him (the Holy Ghost).

Ephesians 4:21 If so be that ye have HEARD him (the Holy Ghost), and have been taught by him (the Holy Ghost), as the truth is in Jesus (THE WORD OF GOD).

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by HEARING, and HEARING by the WORD OF GOD (studying, meditating).

The scriptures were written by men under the influence of the Holy Ghost.

Revelation 19:10 .... for the testimony (words) of Jesus (THE WORD) is the spirit of prophecy.

2 Peter 1:21 For prophecy came.....as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

Now to your question, what does it mean to blaspheme the Holy Ghost. Since the WORD (truth) was written by the Holy Ghost, you blaspheme when you call his WORD a lie. Example:

1 Timothy 2:3-4 For this is GOOD AND ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Saviour; who WILL HAVE all men to be saved, and come to the KNOWLEDGE of the truth.

Matthew 6:10 Thy kingdom come, thy WILL BE DONE in earth, as it (HIS WILL) is in heaven.

1 Timothy 4:10-11 .....who is the SAVIOUR OF ALL MEN, specially those that BELIEVE.

(vs) 11 These things COMMAND AND TEACH.

Psalm 22:27 ALL the ends of the world shall REMEMBER and TURN unto the LORD: and ALL KINDREDS OF THE NATIONS SHALL WORSHIP BEFORE THEE.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when ALL THINGS shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him (Father) that put ALL THINGS under him (Son) that GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL.

WE all blaspheme on our journey to TRUTH just REPENT and TURN to the new found TRUTH.

Continuation of my comments

english standard version = changed contradicts truth

john 1-3 english standard version (esv) 1 in the beginning was the word, and the word was with god, and the word was god. 2 he was in the beginning with god. 3 all things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.

what are the consequences of following false teachers, according to our god/lord jesus?

here is what our lord jesus is saying in the bible

is there danger in rejecting the "trinity doctine"?

the bible has no record whatsoever of any danger rejecting the trinity doctrine. however, the danger lies in "accepting & believing it, because it blasphemes god!

our names will be taken away from the "book of life" believers going to heaven, eternal life with god.

we, you & i go to hell to burn forever

following false teachers - accepting & believing what they preach as the truth & doing it or practicing it - you blasphemed god.



here is what god is saying

revelation 22:18 context 18for i testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, if any man shall add unto these things, god shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19and if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, god shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

deuteronomy 4:2 2ye shall not add unto the word which i command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the lord your god which i command you.

Continuation of my comments

JUSTIFICATION OF GOD'S USED OF PLURAL PRONOUNS "US & OUR" = HE IS SURROUNDED BY CHERUBIMS AS MESSENGERS

Ezekiel 10:19 Context 19And the cherubims lifted up their wings, and mounted up from the earth in my sight: when they went out, the wheels also were beside them, and every one stood at the door of the east gate of the LORD'S house; and the glory of the God of Israel was over them above. 20This is the living creature that I saw under the God of Israel by the river of Chebar; and I knew that they were the cherubims. 21Every one had four faces apiece, and every one four wings; and the likeness of the hands of a man was under their wings.

1.TAKES AWAY FROM = preposition "by"

2.ADDS = preposition "through" and replaced preposition "by"

3.PURPOSE OF THIS CHANGE = justifies there is a Triune God or Trinity (God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit)

4.CHANGE CONTRADICTS THE TRUTH = there is no biblical truth to support the Trinity in the Bible

5.NULLIFIES = these subtle changes nullify the written word of God or truth in the Bible - BLASPHEMES GOD = AN UNPARDONABLE SIN

THIS IS THE TRUTH - TRUE GOSPEL OF GOD

KING JAMES VERSION BIBLE = MOST ACCURATE VERSION

John 1:1-3 KJV 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2The same was in the beginning with God. 3All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

THIS IS WHAT THE FALSE TEACHERS HAD DONE TO JUSTIFY THEIR TRINITY DOCTRINE - 3 persons in 1 God, (God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit)

NEW KING JAMES VERSION = CHANGED - CONTRADICTS TRUTH

John 1:1-3 NKJV 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was in the beginning with God. 3All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

WHAT THEY DID IS BLASPHEMED GOD - AN UNFORGIVEABLE SIN. BY USING FLOWERY WORDS, THEY DECEIVED THEIR FOLLOWERS.

THIS IS THE SMALL CHANGE THAT CHANGED, NULLIFIES THE TRUTH, CHECK YOUR BIBLE. FROM NOW ON, GOD HAS WARNED YOU AND I. CHANGE OR REMAIN DISOBEDIENT TO GOD.

Definition of words or prepositions:

"through" = (KJV Dictionary) by means of, by the agency of. (Mirriam Webster Dictionary) by way of, by means of, by virtue of.

"by" = (KJV Dictionary) as an adverb, by denotes a noun (JESUS) is understood performed the actions.

HERE ARE BIBLE VERSES AS PROOFS

Genesis 1:4 Context 1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.26And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

TO SUPPORT THE EXISTENCE OF THE TRINITY

1.False Teachers claimed this statement of God proved it using plural pronouns (us & our): Verse 26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:"

2.TRUTH EXPOSED "False Teachers" CLAIM = notice used of singular pronoun (he & his)= Verse 27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

JUSTIFICATION OF GOD'S USED OF PLURAL PRONOUNS "US & OUR" = HE IS SURROUNDED BY CHERUBIMS AS MESSENGERS

Ezekiel 10:19 Context 19And the cherubims lifted up their wings, and mounted up from the earth in my sight: when they went out, the wheels also were beside them, and every one stood at the door of the east gate of the LORD'S house; and the glory of the God of Israel was over them above. 20This is the living creature that I saw under the God of Israel by the river of Chebar; and I knew that they were the cherubims. 21Every one had four faces apiece, and every one four wings; and the likeness of the hands of a man was under their wings.

1.TAKES AWAY FROM = preposition "by"

2.ADDS = prepo

Mark 12 :41-44

I am looking for the best way to learn haw to put on the whole armor of God without going through the whole Bible.what pieces of armor and what do they signify shield helmet and the rest

The best thing you can do for yourself and your friend is to learn of Jesus Christ and accept his free gift of salvation and eternal life. He shed his blood and died on the cross for your sins, was buried and then arose from the dead to redeem all of us sinners from death and an eternity in Hell.

Otherwise you and your friend are traveling in entirely different directions and really have nothing significant in common. She is accepted of God because of Jesus regardless what you publicly charge her with here.

Alex I don't think you are familiar with the term replacement theology, maybe you are mistaking it for covenant theology, Replacement theology is a term given to covenant theologist for believing the church has taken over the promises to Israel, and don't believe in a literal kingdom. some say that Israel was never given the promises they allegorise the scripture. Replacement theology is a name that they don't like to be called. but the term has nothing to do with salvation as you attempt to associate it with, There is no Replacement in God's plan of Redemption, it was the same for Adam and Eve as it is for us today. However you can't tie yourself to their theology either because they don't believe we're going to be God's as you have said, The Holyspirit is Christ grand son as you has said, by the way which makes him our nephew, you also said Jesse is a part of the Davidic kingdom desperately trying to form a type of trinity, they wouldn't agree. they use the Israel of God similar in the way you do but they say the Israel of God exists today, you say its the baby Holy Ghost witch we will give birth to in the future, now you do seem to point out some types and allegorical differences in scripture like "flesh, 1st Adam", /"Christ 2nd Adam" " flesh and the spirit " law and grace, Rebecca Hagi" Esau Jacob. Now these scriptures can be useful when you are studying ellection and the 2 natures we possess as Paul does in Romans 6,7,and 8, but you misuse these word and scripture push a belief system that dont hold the truth. not trying to affend you but your doctrine is dangerous for newly Christians.

Again its not a case of agree or disagree confessing Romans 10:9+10 and believing in your heart gets you born again spiritually we are perfect in Gods eyes now until any christian renews His mind and determines to make Gods Will his will and do it he will continue to walk according to the flesh Romans Chapter 8 1-13 to mortify or dsetroy works of the flesh this requires putting on Gods Word and acting accordingly. Also something to consider there are sins intentional and ones unintentional when Jesus Christ confronted a lot of religious leaders the evil was in their eyes they were perfect and they were the most corrupt, but most of the commend people understood they weren't worthy and they are the ones that got healed some he said go and sin no more ie don't intensionally, we all sin the question is is it done with evil intent or habit patterns of our old man nature. Any born again believer can do something and thinks its right but in the eyes of God be dead wrong, that doesn't make the person evil perhaps uneducated or unlearned. Thats why Judge not I don't know your background or experiences in life but i,ve been through some that I thought the true God was working wasn't the case but I learned just because you experience something that doesn't make it necessarily something the true God is doing. I take thoughts line them up with Gods word and unless it Glorifies god blesses me and others I don't take action. Just some food for thought.

Thank you for your comments, Rick!

It is hard, because we live in a homophobic society, and there is a tendency for some Christians to be very condemning of gay people, which makes it difficult to separate the feelings of those Christians from the God they serve, and therefore, hard to feel that love you allude to. But I'm going to pray to God that He send me that love that I can feel. Thank you again, Rick!

Thank you for responding, Chris.

This all happened in October, and I have not spoken to her since, except once. My friend lost her mother at a young age, so she has been friendly with my mother, which I have not interfered with. My mother sent her some writings of mine via email, I felt, trying to reconcile us. I wrote my friend and apologized for my mother doing this. As my friend had accused me of being controlling, I didn't want her to feel that either my mother or I were in any way trying to manipulate her. She responded more warmly than I expected and said she was no longer upset with me, so I apologized for getting upset during our discussion, and patiently clarified a few things, trying to open the way for future dialogue, and she reiterated that I had been controlling and abusive in our previous discussion. Since I did not believe I had been, indeed believe that I had bent over backwards to patiently explain and entreat, I was offended and fed up and walked away. But it hurts alot...

Yes, I am aware of Christ's role in Christianity. I was once born again. Unfortunately, Christianity did not fit well with me, partly due to the abuse I mentioned in my original post. But I do thank the folks who have responded here, because I have not felt judged, and that is good. Thanks again, Chris!

Thank you, Suzanne. This all happened in October, and I did decide to break off the friendship, because I did try to patiently explain, and not only was she not receptive, but she accused me of being mean, etc. My mother still speaks to her upon occasion. I am quite sad and extremely disappointed over the whole thing. But anyway, I thank you very much for taking the time to respond to me, and hope you are blessed!

Dear Angela,

You will probably have a variety of perspectives in tithing. In short, not everyone agrees about tithing, and I personally think having a heart and willingness to help others is the takeaway. I don't think it's the amount, or even necessarily money, but time. For example, if a drug dealer asks me for money, should I tithe to him? What if instead I used my time and gift of encouragement- which of the two is what Jesus would do? Now, which in these 2 situations is best to help: a widow who is in a desperate situation and is evicted from her apartment and needs help, or give money to a local megachurch who just spent $1 million upgrading their stage for laser lights, fog machine, and are paying a performing arts company to do painting and acrobatics during a service once a week. Which would please the Lord more?

I personally believe our time and labor is just as valuable as money and is a valid way of helping others. I see only weak support for tithing in the Bible. There is stronger support for keeping the Sabbath and eating kosher foods than tithing and somehow many pastors won't preach that, but some will take time to almost guilt-trip Christians to give to their church- when maybe their own irresponsible spending and poor money management is the original problem- not people giving more to fund a building with AC/heating, repairs, taxes, etc that's vacant 95% of the time, when in the same area could be a dozen more churches also vacant 95% of the week. So, instead of sharing resources, or meeting in houses like they did in early Christianity, all this overhead burden is placed on people and instead of giving to actual people in need, they give to maintain a building that's unused and virtually useless most of the time. I think this is wrong. So, I personally do not give to a general church fund, because I feel funds are misappropriated. I feel so much better buying McDonalds gift cards and giving them to homeless. I would never go into debt to tithe.

Why was Jeremiah heart broken

where was Moses buried?

I love the Lord. He change my life and I'm grateful.

Alex comments about the Israel of God in Christ Jesus there is no more JEW OR GENTILE simply b/c he did away with both Jew and Gentile and made of the TWAIN ONE NEW MAN which is the H.G. our new innerman which is the H.G. THE CHILD OF PROMISE, THE ISRAEL OF GOD. neither circumcision nor uncircumcision but a new creature which is the H.G that is new to us simply b/c he is BORN in us, but in that he was with God b/f the world was he is old, thus its the H.G that was preordained b/f the world WAS ,We are just a joint heir with the H.G. .Ya gotta realize that we all were BORN by the will of some man, but that Christ that has to be Born in us can only be born by the WILL OF GOD ( THE SEED OF THE SOWER ). The CHILD of promise which is the Israel of God . When the scrip. says he took of the twain ( jew and gentile ) and made one newman which is the H.G. our new innerman , that new creature, thats Replacement Theology . I don't use the numbering system hardly at all simply b/c Jesus nor the disciples used any kind of numbering system. we lift up our tool on the bible when we use the numbering system defiling it. Mans carnal mind is his tool . Remember uzza lifted up his hand on the ark when the ozzen stumbled and God slew him there. Vain is the help of man.

I cant seem to find the answer to my question about ... Should I get my debts paid off first with lesser tithing or pay my 10% +, and make my payoffs take longer ?

The Lord is a spiritual being why do fleshly thing sacrificed atone us not spiritual thing .

What does the fat do